This post has been edited by Seremban_2: Mar 30 2011, 01:14 PM

Hi dariofoo,

Not sure if the documents I signed is the letter of offer to purchase. Remember there were documets for me to sign abt the unit, some waiver stuff. and then the booking/puchase form abt buying which unit and have paid how much deposit (1st hand unit - still under construction). It does has a remark about subject to cancellation of my full return of deposit. However that's bcoz of situation I have.

This is the story: The unit I'm interested in has a prev buyer but then the agent said it has been cancelled. However it needs to wait for 14days to confirm the prev buyer no longer entitle for it. That's what the developer said too when I called to verify and now still not reach 14days (only the 1st week). So I only can wait for the 14days to come. If last min that buyer has money and paid, the unit will belong to them. This I understand. However I felt cheated bcoz the agent I dealt with was not honest - he only informed me after I paid the deposit. Bad luck for my 1st house and encounter this. Only can deal with it now. sighhhh

However back to the situation, due to above, I might plan to cancel it. That's where different agents told me different story of the cancellation fees. If indeed they going to charge for cancellation fees no matter what, then it's not worth for me to cancel now, better wait for that 14days to see prev buyer got it or it will be mine since they also will charge me if cancel (still feel unfair to pay since I'm not been told abt prev buyer up front). Besides, I have already applied for loan and pending feedback. S&P confirmed not signed bcoz of above incident and loan stuff.

Hi Dario can you pls advice.... sharing a property with my partner with loan amount 630k
Another question is I am buying the property(freehold) from a malay owner. The thing is the owner bought the property with bumi discount from the developer but my agent and lawyer told me that the property is under open title. Is there such a thing whereby u can buy with bumi discount and yet it is non bumi lot?

I am taking the same lawyer for both the SPA and loan agreement...Fee as below Thanks


ESTIMATED BILL FOR SPA
PURCHASE PRICE: 700,000.00

Legal fees
Sale and Purchase Agreement 5,350.00
Submitting CKHT 2 Form (RM200 per person/form) 400.00
Private Caveat (Entry & Withdrawal) 350.00


Add 6% Service tax 366.00

Total 6466

Disbursements
Stamping – Sale and Purchase Agreement 40.00
Stamping - Statutory Declaration 0.00
Adjudication 0.00
Land Office Fees – transfer 500.00
Land Office Fees – search 90.00
Land Office Fees – Caveat (Entry, Notice & Withdrawal)(RM380) 380.00
Land Office Fees – Application for consent (433B)(RM200) 0.00
Land Office Fees – CTC of Title (RM50) 0.00
Land Office Fees – Registration fees for consent (RM30) 0.00
Land Office Fees – Application for consent (Restriction-in-Title)(RM50) 0.00
Land Office Fees – CTC of Title (RM50) 0.00
Land Office Fees – Registration fees for consent (RM30) 0.00
Bankruptcy search (RM12 per person) 12.00
Affirmation fees for SD 24.00
Printing & Photostating, telephone, fax, postage charges 100.00
Travelling / dispatch 100.00
Miscellaneous 50.00
Stamp Duty (estimated) 15,000.00

Total 22,762.00






ESTIMATED BILL FOR Loan Agreement

Legal fees
Facilities/Loan Agreement 4,889.44
Charge 488.94
Private Caveat (Entry & Withdrawal) 350.00

Add 6% Service tax 343.70

Total 5,728.39


Disbursements
Stamping – Loan Agreement 40.00
Stamping – Charge 40.00
Stamping - Statutory Declaration 30.00
Stamping – Statutory Declaration for owner occupation 30.00
Land Office Fees – Charge 120.00
Land Office Fees – search 120.00
Land Office Fees – Caveat 380.00
Land Office Fees –Noting of PA 60.00
Land Office Fees – Letter of Consent 30.00
Affirmation fees for SD 48.00
Bankruptcy search 96.00
Purchase of Facilities Agreement & Charge Annexure 200.00
Printing & Photostating, telephone, fax, postage charges, dispatch , miscellaneous 250.00
Stamp Duty 3,175.00

Total 4,619.00

Total 10,691.09

hi dario,

thanks for the help.

I just called my lawyer (his assistant i presume), and she says that i am entitled to 30% discount according to the Bar Council something.... :stars

Then she concluded that RM4800 (initially RM6087.xx) will be the price i can get, and i negotiated further by claiming that since they are the SPA lawyer as well, some things are double charged. The weird term on general disbursement something... i objected was promised to be removed as well..

The last thing i need explanation is...the 30% discount something she mentioned.

Do you know anything about that Mr.dario?

Thanks for the help thus far~

[quote=dariofoo,Mar 30 2011, 11:22 AM]
The procedure which is talking about is called 'upstamping'. Basically the existing charge will remain, but the original loan agreement with the advalorem stamp duty which you paid earlier would be upstamped for the additional sum that is advanced by the bank via the additional loan.

The letter of offer which states the additional loan which you have executed would be annexed to the original Charge document - and stamp duty for the additional amount would have to be paid. The additional stamp duty would be endorsed on the original Charge document (which would first need to be extracted from the Land Office) and resubmitted to the Land Office.

That is essentially the procedure. The question is - can you do all that by yourself and bear the risk of same? If you can, then tell the Bank that you want to do it yourself and thus, there would be no legal fees involved as there is no need to for a law firm to be appointed in this case. Whether they allow you to do so is a different story altogether.

If you can't do it on your own, you would have to appoint a firm (most likely one of their panel law firms) to do it for you. And yes, you would have to pay scaled legal fees and ad valorem stamp duty for all of this.

Perhaps you can ask them if they can factor in the legal fees into the loan, if you feel that the burden may be a bit hard to bear at the moment. The downside of that is that essentially you are paying interest upon your legal fees as well.

With regard to some blurp about bank negara and year 2001, I've no idea la chief. You can always call up Bank Negara and/or The Bar Council for further clarification if you want.


Dear Dario , appreciate your answers.Thank You.

Then do wait and if still got problem, come back here and I shall advise you further. Good luck,mate

hbgoh57:



The legal fees are alright.

With regard to disbursements:
1. Bankruptcy search - RM96 for loan? How come? If you look at SPA disbursements, RM12 has already been billed. There is no need to do it twice.
2. Purchase of facilities agreement - make sure that it is actually RM200. Some banks charge only RM100, some RM150, and some RM200. If in doubt, casually call the bank and enquire.
3.Stamping - Statutory Declaration 30.00
Stamping – Statutory Declaration for owner occupation 30.00
* Only one copy needs to be stamped with RM10 nominal duty so it ought to be RM10 each.
4. Total disbursements for travelling, printing, misc, etc for both bills combined is RM500, which is very high. Normally when one firm is used for both SPA and loan these costs ought to be reduced. Or else, it would make no difference if you appoint another firm to do your loan doc.

Bumi discount is a separate issue from bumi lot. Bumi discount is across the board for all bumiputeras as of right, while bumi lot is as divided by the developer according to the directives by the relevant state authority. If your lawyer has done the relevant searches he can find out for certain on your behalf if it is indeed a bumi lot.

Thanks Dario. Cross finger everything goes well.

So out of curioustiy, there's no idea whether they really will charge any processing fees for the early cancellation or it depend on case basis?

Para 6 of the Solicitors' Remuneration Order 2005 (SRO) by the Bar Council which regulates the fees which lawyers can bill their clients in conveyancing matters effective Jan 1, 2006 clearly states that "there shall be no discount on fees specified in this Order"

Here you go:
 SRO_2005.pdf ( 71.22k ) Number of downloads: 16

Any right given to them to forfeit must be pursuant to the letter of offer to purchase, if any. If there's none, then they must refund in full to you.

If they give you problems, go complain to the Board - the full name, address and details are in the last few pages of this thread. Check it out. Surely they will get scared and refund it in full to you with no further questions.

Please check on the Bank Negara and 2001 thingy. I'm very curious also.

This post has been edited by dariofoo: Mar 30 2011, 05:16 PM

means the lawyer is actually playing bringing me for a ride?

anyway, its the common way of dealing with lawyers nowadays.

customers ask for discounts everytime, so they mark up the things they can while anticipate the client to negotiate

thanks sifu dario

hi new in property and in need of advise. i just got a quotation for a subsale DS at 298k. would like to know if the disbursement is alright.

Legal Fees
Towards preparing Sale & Purchase Agreement for your execution, forwarding to the other parties for their execution, attending to the stamping, forwarding to the respective parties and other legal work not specifically mentioned

[150,000 x 1% = 1,500] + [148,000 x 0.7% = 1,036] =RM2,536.00
- Form CKHT 2A RM 200.00
- Form 19B (Entry of caveat) RM 200.00
- Form 19G (Withdrawal of caveat) RM 150.00

6% Govt. Service Tax RM 185.20

total : RM3,271.20

Disbursements
1) Title Search RM 60.00
2) Bankruptcy Search RM 40.00
3) Stamping of Sale & Purchase Agreement RM 40.00
4) Stamping of Memorandum of Transfer
5) Entry of Private Caveat + Notice RM 320.00
6) Withdrawal of Private Caveat RM 60.00
7) Registration of transfer RM 400.00
8) Affirmation fees RM 30.00
9) Transportation, papers & courier RM 150.00
10) Telephone, fax, stationery, etc RM 100.00

totAL:RM1,200.00

total legal fee: RM4,471.20

Stamp Duty for the Memorandum of Transfer calculated as follows:
(100,000 x 1% ) + (198,000 x 2 %) = RM4,960.00
50% =RM 2480.00
** for first time home buyer & below 350k I heard there is 50% stamp duty deduction, is this true?

total legal fee + stamp duty=RM 6951.20

Thank you Dario! Appreciate a lot for the advice.

Even if he takes you for a ride he's gonna bill you for that

Don't generalise la, chief. Not all are rotten scoundrels. Some are quite honest when cari makan.

Anyway, good luck to you

drakenkorin:


Legal fees are alright and according to scale. Bankruptcy search ought to be RM12/pax. Other disbursements are fair and reasonable. At least there's no RM50 for 'Miscellaneous' which lawyers always bill but can never justify apart from saying, 'The SRO [Solicitors' Remuneration Order] allows us to bill RM50 for misc'



With regard to stamp duty on MOT - you would be entitled to a 50% rebate



This post has been edited by dariofoo: Mar 31 2011, 11:26 AM

Keep us updated


This post has been edited by dariofoo: Mar 31 2011, 11:26 AM

cool, thanks a lot dariofoo
cheers!

hi good day, i have some questions on the property ownership transfer procedure. In my case, my parents had a house which is under both me & my sister's name. Recently, my parents decided to buy a new house to put under my sister's name, and the current house transfer to my name. But after contacted the lawyer via phone, he told us that this direct property ownership transfer for this current house cannot be done, unless the current house installment is fully paid or we sell the house. The lawyer ask us to arrange an appointment with him for more details.

need some guidance and advice from professions here, is that really we cannot direct transfer the property ownership?
my thanks in advance

HI.. since your current house is still financed to a financial inst. or Bank the only way to transfer your sis' 1/2 share to you is to ask your Bank for a consent to transfer subject to the existing charge. Most banks agree, just need to ask.
If not then you would have to settle your loan, transfer and refinance all at them same time. Basically, worst case is refinance your property, which may be a good thing if your current interest rates are crap!
Good luck