Hi, I would like to ask these question on my mom's behalf. Thanks!

1. I am a successful bidder of a Apartment unit in Penang. I paid 5% to Auctioneer before bidding. After the becoming a successful bidder, I went to my lawyer to pay the remaining 95% of the auction price on the same day I bid. After paying the 95% to my lawyer, am I supposed or Allowed to lock or change the padlock of that apartment?


2. Whatever I see in that apartment such as movable furniture like cupboard, sofa set, dining table belongs to me?

3. Does all the fixed electrical item such as air-cond, ceiling fans belongs to me as well?

4. If the ex-owner wanted to remove EVERYTHING such as air-cond, fan, build-in cabinet, iron door (Gate or outside's door), including the movable and fixed furniture, Tiles (wth even the tiles don't belong to him) and leave cement and an EMPTY house for me. Does he has the right to do so since the I bought or Paid full price for the house before he even move all his furniture away? As I heard once you've paid everything, everything in the house, (occupiers) belongs to you unless the ex-owner moved everything away before you bought it?

This post has been edited by Angel-Look: Mar 21 2011, 05:58 PM

Hi guys need some info in this lawyer thingy


going to buy a property, 2nd hand at Bandar Mahkoa Cheras, problem is my cousin brother is a lawyer and i wish to use his service, owner has his own lawyer and refuse to use mine ? can i get both to quot me 1st and show to the owner which ever lower ? i do not know if this is possible to just ask a quot from lawyer 1st ?

any also i heard if both owner and buyer use different lawyer will have problem ? what problem i might face if i opt for my cousin brother and owner still prefer his existing lawyer ? appreciate if anyone could advice me asap

Nope. Is the best to use your own lawyer. If the buyer use seller lawyer. There's certain terms that might be disadvantage to buyer. Normally there's issue on deposit thingy. So it's ok for both party to use different lawyer

At which point is the bank going to release the money to seller ?

What is the order of events ?

- Get redemption statement

- Submit for adjudication (stamp duty)

- Release of bank loan



Can we submit for adjudication without waiting for strata title to be redeemed from seller's bank first ?

Thank you for replies.

Hi Dario,

Hope you still remember me..

I am now in the midst of reviewing the S&P for the sales of my KL property.

As you know, i am a singaporean, which mean non resident.

My lawyer was saying I need to travel to KL Jalan Datu tax department to queue for a non resident tax file no.

Is this true? Any way to apply on line?

If i will to travel to KL to apply this, can we have the tax file number on the spot? This will be great as I can also submit the tax forms on the same day and have everything done together since I will also need to travel to KL to sign the S&P in April.

Hope to have your advise on this.

Thanks.

Thanks James, but problem is the owner or the agent insist to use their own lawyer ? how is this gonna be ?

1. You can't just change the padlock until your lawyer gives you the green light to do so - check with him first if all the proper documentation has been done to the effect that you've been confirmed as the registered proprietor of the property.

2. Yes. You bought it on an 'as-is-where-is-basis'. All things - good or bad - that comes with the house belongs to you.

3. Yes. See above.

4. He can't remove anything. Once he vacates the premises, he can't come back and state that he wants to remove such and such. Once you have taken vacant posession of the premises, everything in it belongs to you. That's when you change the lock and it's game over for the previous occupant.

The seller has the right to appoint his own lawyer as he wishes. Sometimes the seller would not want to appoint his own lawyer and would 'tumpang' the purchaser's lawyer.

Yes there's nothing wrong to compare quotes nor to ask for a quote from a lawyer. It's always been done so. Quite prudent to do so too. But don't equate cheap fees to good quality.

There's no way of saying that there would be a problem or otherwise just by referring to the number of lawyers involved in the transaction. It all depends on the quality and efficiency of the lawyers involved.

You may have one lawyer running the whole show, incl your loan doc, but if he's slow and inefficient, things will not move fast at all.

You may have three lawyers in the transaction (vendor, purchaser, purchaser's financier) - but if they are all super efficient and there's good communication between them, things will definitely move fast.

So, there's really no justification to generalise things. The choice is ultimately up to the parties involved.

Hope that puts things in perspective for you.

More often than not, the solicitor would wait at least for a confirmation that the loan solicitor has advised for drawdown of the redemption sum first - before submitting the DOA/14A for adjudication. Once it has been submitted for adj, and the Notice from LHDN has been issued - you would have to pay for stamp duty. What if in the interim, the purchaser's financier decides to pull the plug on the loan and decide not to issue the cheque for redemption? Then there would be a problem.

Yes, and it's Jalan Duta, not Datu.

No you can't apply online.

Yes, you'll get your tax file number on the spot.

They've every right to do so,mate

Thanks Dario.

Great, if i can get the tax file number on the spot I can also submit the documents at the same time too. Save me the hassle of travelling to and fro KL.

I will see if my lawyer can assist me to fill out the forms and I can bring them along to LDHN when I apply for the tax file number.

Regards.

The auction section is in the morning, and I make full or 95% payment to my lawyer by using Cash that afternoon after becoming the successful bidder . As you said, I still can't lock the door yet since I have to get some document signed, and during that document processing time, what if the ex-owner go into the house remove everything? Does the ex-owner have the right to remove everything in his house before my document is completely done? Or once his house is auctioned, then this means everything in the house belongs to the bank? Thank you so much for your reply.

And btw, since buying this house creates a lot a lot of problem for me, the ex-owner even threatened me to pay him more than 12k so that he won't remove anything from the house. But I don't think he has the right anymore according to you. I told him since buying his house creates me problem, I would want to forfeit and I rather waste my 5% money away to the bank and he threatened me not to forfeit. What should I do



This post has been edited by Angel-Look: Mar 22 2011, 08:53 PM

Technically he is still the registered owner of the property until your solicitor finalises the transfer of ownership in your favour. Legalities aside, he has the existing keys and as such, he can go in and out and deal with the fixtures and fittings as he sees fit - up until your lawyer gives you the green light and you proceed to change the locks. Up to that date, whatever in the house still belongs to him. But once you change the locks - you're considered to have taken over posession of the property as the new owner (normal vacant posession would involve the handing over of the keys to signify change of ownership). He has no right over anything left in the house by then. You can stake your claim to it by then - but most people either throw it out or donate to charity, from what I know.

The ex-owner has no right to demand a single cent from you. Do not pay him anything. In fact, it would appear that he doesn't even want the stuff in the house and this may seem like a desperate attempt to squeeze some money out of you by making these baseless threats. Perhaps he can't afford to even hire movers to remove his belongings. Go lodge a police report that he threatened you for your record purposes. Perhaps next time when you change the locks you can bring it to the attention of the police and they can send someone to accompany you to ensure that the ex-owner does not cause any problems.

The problem which you are facing is the reason why a lot of people shy away from buying houses on auction, despite the temptation of lower-than-market-rate prices of same. The hassle can be too much to bear when there is someone still occupying the premises, which is often the case.

Facing a belligerant ex-owner is one thing - there have been instances where the ex-owners completely destroy the fixtures and fittings of the house before leaving and the new owners faced a huge repair/reno bill which would be more than the savings you made when purchasing the property below the market rate. Ex-owners who literally 'paint' the wall with faeces, ex-owners who leave mysterious small puppets, miniature altars, ornaments, etc in the house. Trust me, I've heard it all.

Best if you also speak to your lawyer and see if they can assist you in any way. Perhaps send a notice of eviction to the ex-owner and see if that shakes him up a bit. Pray that he just gives up and go away in peace.

Agreed with Dariofoo, the hassles and the interpersonal human aspects of dealing with auctioned props are the biggest of problems, not the payment or the price. If you can oversome this mentally, then you will always go for a second auctioned property.

Dariafoo,

What if the ex-owner purposely damage the property by knocking here and there to the property, what can the "new owner" do if the ownership is still in the process of tranferring?

That's the grey area right there. Legally the ex-owner is still the registered proprietor, so he can do as he wishes. If the ownership is still in the process of transferring, as you put it, then the new owner is still not yet the registered proprietor, right? So she can't really do anything to stop the ex-owner from doing whatever he wants to the property. Be that as it may that the property has been auctioned off, the new owner is still not the legal owner.

The important thing to bear in mind is that the property would be sold on an 'as is where is' basis. And as it where is would be when you finally get the green light to obtain vacant posession of the property - if it means getting a locksmith to break the locks, then what you see when you step inside is what you get - it is as is, where is. That is the risk attached to purchasing auction properties.

dariafoo is my sister. I'm dariofoo

Hi Dario,

I'm in the midst selling off my house.Just like others I believe,don't know much in this area.Glad found this thread.Appreciate your advise.Here the situation:

1) I've been called by lawyer to sign S&P (purchaser signed already) and the estimate charges is RM 1504.

2) No 1st draft S&P given and been told the current S&P is not allowed to bring back home for our own perusal prior sign it.(then requested 1st draft S&P and Note of Charges via email)

For Info:
The property is freehold and completed
There still an existing loan with the bank and govt
Joint loan (mine by bank & spouse using govt loan)

"Cons: You must read and understand the S&P yourself, do not expect any preferential treatment from the solicitors as they are acting for the purchaser and thus, you would have no avenue should there be any delays, etc. In fact, you may not even be updated very often as to the progress as the solicitor is not obliged to CC any correspondence to you. In the event of any late penalty interest, you would have to do the calculation and claim for it yourself from the purchaser's solicitors."

-Look likes this is happen to me.No?
-Is the fees charged reasonable?

Thanks.

Thank with appreciatin, u are indeed helpful.

---

Added on March 23, 2011, 1:22 pmSorry, typing error.

This post has been edited by Nepo: Mar 23 2011, 01:22 PM