Hi Dario

oh ya i also did not notice the legal fees is difference.
i request them a best price (you can said discount) before i appoint their service. Then they give me the quote RM 4691.14.
In beginning, they just verbally give me the price. They only give me the copy of quote when i insist of it.
Do you means letter complaint to this lawyer firm? or complaint to lawyer bar council?
If to lawyer firm, they will not entertain me. They not reply my email, even i asked a simple thing like "when can refund the difference amount to me".
Then i call up talk to the boss, he said this is the only amount they can refund. If want then come to collect. If not satisfy can report to police. Also he said can face to face talk about this thing. So now i thinking to go the lawyer firm to get an explanation from him face to face. And at least get back the legal fees difference first.
What to write to bank actually? Anyway i don't think bank will layan me, since this is issue between the lawyer firm and me.

Is it in the lawyer firm can simply put any charges of amount of the disbursement in the final notice to Bank? or they should follow the disbursement charges as what listed in the quotation to me?
I wanna know whether i am in the right side? If yes, then i can only confident fight for my right.

Legally speaking and from the facts which you have presented, it appears that the owner of the upper unit ('owner') is the one who ought to bear the cost of repairing the leak. Now that the defect liability period is over, the owner has no basis to blame the developer with regard to the leak. He has to bear his own cost to repair it.

Now, you have two options:

1. Talk to him to repair and bear the full cost of it. If he refuses, use the legal method. Appoint a lawyer to send him a legal demand. That might scare him and result in him complying. End of story. Or he might refuse and then you'd have to go to Court, etc etc.

2. Use diplomacy. Talk to him and see if he'll bear the cost of it in full. If he declines, see if you can afford to bear half, perhaps. Or even full, if you think that you can afford it. The point is to see if the money spent now will save you from spending even more when the problem worsens and it affects your unit to the point that you end up forking out more money to repair any future defects. Perhaps you can get a quotation and take it from there.

Good luck

That's where the problem started. They take you for a ride when you ask for a discount.

Complain to the firm in writing. State that the first invoice was xxx but the second invoice was xxxx amount. Ask for an explanation. Only when you're not happy with the explanation, do you complain to the Bank. It is your money anyway. The Bank incorporates the legal fees into the loan but at the end of the day, you're paying for it.

No they can't as you're paying the legal fees by virtue of the loan agreement. It is incorporated in your repayment. It's different if the Bank absorbs it. This is considered your money, so you have to right to find out and agree to the quotation submitted to the bank.

Go see the managing partner and see what info you can get. See what he explains to you. Remember that you don't hold all the aces as you had already asked for a discount and same was given to you. You can't expect to have your cake and eat it too right? However, the law firm can't give two quotes, and end up billing you higher than what was initially quoted to you.

After the meeting, do let me know how it goes. Good luck.

Relax bro. After get heart attack how?

Thanks Dariofoo.

I tried not to terminate them by sending them another email to answer my questions within 7 days but they just keep ignoring me.

I called to the Bar Council to seek for help. They advised me to lodge a complaint against them.

I am very surprised the SPA lawyer would spoil their name for the sake of helping the Vendor'.

Thanks anyway for your advices.

Cheersssss~

This post has been edited by irise.ufall: Jul 16 2011, 10:07 AM

I have tried to nego with the owner but they absolutely refused to share the cost. If I bear the full cost and hire the repair contractor, would it be possible for them to blame me in the future for anything wrong with their toilet?

I think maybe your e-mail not garang enough. At the end, you ought to put - Please revert in writing within 7 days from this date failing which I will lodge an official complaint with the Advocate & Solicitors Disciplinary Board against you.

Good luck

Then perhaps you need a side letter whereby they agree not to claim against you for any defects to their toilet following the repair work done. If they even refuse to co-operate to sign that letter, then you have to play hard ball since they're playing hard ball as well. Unless of course you want to be responsible for their toilet even after you foot the bill to repair their defects. Up to you.

Hi Dario,
i think it is quite normal to ask law firm to provide a quote before appoint their service right?? i guess everybody will do it like that.
Actually this is second time i use their service. 1st time is ok, as i pay cash. it is very straight forward, just pay what they quote to me. and i feel their service is consider ok that time.
i also dint expect why this could happen in the second appoinment. Very disappointing, law firm also can break promise. who else i can believe??

anyhow i am very very appreciate you kind advice.
i will meet up the managing partner and see what they explain first.
i think i will still get back the legal fees refund first in whatever case. And decide what to do next in later part.
Hope everything in peace.
Will update you.... many thanks..

Hi Dario, I'm a first-time buyer (buying subsale) and need your advice on the following:

There was a buyer for the apartment, but after he paid 3% deposit and engaged a lawyer to draft the SPA, he decided not to buy anymore. Then the agent offered to sell it to me and said that I should use the same lawyer to reduce the legal costs. The agent also told me to straight sign the SPA without signing Offer to Purchase first.

Questions:
1. Is it ok to proceed directly with SPA without the Offer to Purchase?

2. The lawyer quoted the following for 230k freehold apartment in Bukit Jalil
a) SPA fees: RM2060
b) Lodgement of Private Caveat & RPGT Submission & Submission of Borang I: RM 650.
c) 6% Service Tax: RM 162.60
d) Stamp duty: RM 1800
e) Disbursements: RM766
Total: 5438.60

On item (b), is CKHT2 for RPGT Submission? If so, then the fee is RM 200. Plus, Private Caveat of RM 350 and RM 100 for Borang I (this fee is also posted by another member so I think it should be ok)

My main concern is the disbursements charge.
3. Are the title search, bankruptcy search, etc (those items billed under Disbursements) already done before the preparation of SPA? If so, I think the previous buyer should bear those costs. Is my request reasonable?


4. Do I get a copy of all those documents obtained from the various searches?

Your early reply is much appreciated. Thanks!

itsybitsy:


1. Yes you may proceed directly, provided that parties sign the SPA in the shortest possible time so as to avoid the vendor from 'shopping' for a higher price. A simple letter confirming the sale at xxx price would suffice, if you still need something in black and white. I think you can demand for it. Better be safe than sorry.

2. What is Borang I? A change of name form with the local authority?

3. It doesn't work that way. For all you know, those searches would not have been done anyway by the lawyer as it may be too soon. If you want to check if the searches are done new, and not 'recycled', you have the right to demand for a copy of it for your record purposes. You can check from the date to ascertain it.

4. Yes, as explained above.

My mgmt office said they will issue 2nd reminder to the upper unit owner, then if still no action, they will bring up to CoB (Commissioner of Building). I've never heard of CoB before, would this person be able to help?

What I really want to achieve is actually for the owner to understand it's their responsibility to fix, & when they agree to fix, I will offer to bear half the cost as a goodwill gesture. I already got a quotation from a contractor. Do you think black & white is necessary for the offer? Would you be able to recommend a strategy? Another thing, does the side letter you mentioned need to be issued by a lawyer? If yes, does any lawyer that deal with property would do & what would be the estimated fee?

Thanks for your advice Dario.

If I still need to negotiate with the lawyer on his charges, does it mean that the lawyer would not work on the S&P until we both agreed on the price?

Well, let's put it this way - once he has started work and incurred costs, you already lose the bargaining power as he's already the solicitor on record for you. If he then refuses to budge on the disbursements, you would find yourself on the losing side. If you opt to change solicitors then, you have to pay half of the legal fees and all disbursements incurred to him.

If you read the earlier posts in this thread, you will note that many forummers will try to get at least 2-3 quotes to get a fairer idea before making up their minds. Legal fees would be standard, but disbursements would differ from firm to firm. You can see the various quotations in this thread to get a fair idea as well.

Good luck

Reminder? Why did the JMB issue a letter to the owner when it is not part of common property? It's the owner's private property right? With regard to COB, the JMB would normally request the COB to invoke his power under the Building and Common Property (Maintenance and Management) Act 2007 for issues of non-payment of maintenance charges only. For scenarios like this, the COB would not interfere. Perhaps the info given to you was wrong. By right, even the JMB ought not to get involved in this matter, as it is entirely private. Unless any of the common properties are involved. So, the letter from JMB would not be of much effect.

Of course. Always get black and white. Cakap mulut is of no use.


Not necessarily. You can draft it out yourself. Or you can use Google and type out letter of disclaimer, or something like that. Fees would be subjective and differ from firm to firm - like the respective price of a Rolls-Royce and a Proton.

Dariofoo sifu,

really thank you very much to u

i get the detail from lawyer

1-facilities fee - 3231.77
2-6% govn tax - 193.90
3-stamp duty & disbursement - 2582.25

total = 6007.92

then after disc i pay 5500.

dear sifu, as my calculation the
facilities fee = 2693.15 + DOA = 269.31 + PA = 269.31 = total 3231.77

the lawyer only give me 507.92 discount which is not = SRO third schedule no C - 70% of scale fee (actual 30% =807.95)

if the facilities fee 2693.15 - 507.92 = 2185.23 then the govn tax should be 131.11
for DOA & PA is 10% of the facilities fee = 269.31 which is b4 disc

so can i do reimbursement from the lawyer ?
is this legal ?

thank you sifu advice

may1126:



So basically he gave you a "discount" which was not really a discount because he did not follow the SRO (which only allows him to bill you 70% of the scaled fees).

So what you need to do now is to ask him politely whether under the SRO, if buying from developer, is it still full scaled fees or is it less. Surely he has to say that it would be less, as per the SRO. Then you just get the new calculation, and pay him accordingy la. You save another RM300 roughly, and the lawyer earns the scaled fees accordingly.

And everyone lives happily ever after.

The end.

Sifu, the problem is i already paid 5500 to lawyer, but chq haven clear. how should i do now, stop the chq now ? or reimburse back from lawyer if he already bank in.

thank you very much ur advice

This post has been edited by Seremban_2: Jul 18 2011, 03:46 PM

Just saw your post. A bit too late in the day to call him now huh. Hope you did without waiting for me to advise you though. If you did, then ask for the new note of charges with the 70% scaled fees reflected.

Otherwise, if cheque cleared, ask for reimbursement.