As we all know, according to physics law, energy cannot be created nor destroyed but can transformed from one form to another. this is just my curiousity. everything that exists must be created from something. is it energy we using today is originated from energy that several perhaps million years ago? im not so sure if someone can understand what im trying to imply..

Energy from million of yrs ago changed in to carbon/coal/natural gas.. those that u can dig into ground and make into energy.

Current new energy all derive from the sun. From the sun energy it can be disperse to many different place example, plant absorb the energy and provide life. Or it can be harvest using solar energy panel. And so on...

those energy must be created from something right? for example, sun's energy is created from the nuclear fussion inside the sun.

U mean which energy? As i said the energy is from the sun, so created by the sun. Or the energy of wind created by the wind.

True... energy cannot be created or destroyed and can only be transfered... So where does the 1st form of energy come from? Good question hehe, but I doubt there's an answer... not at our current level of understanding and technology hehe

answer=potential energy

If u asking where the first energy comes from then its from God. Just like asking who create earth

Second law of thermodynamic tells us that all forms (energy, particles [particle is a form of energy, e=mcc]) tend to move from order to chaos, which means usable energy reduces, wasted heat increases, hence entropy increases.

If usable energy has no beginning and no end, which means it existed indefinitely long already, by now there should be no more usable energy, as all of them has transformed to wasted heat (entropy increased). This is what physicist called "heat death" phenomenon. The universe is not "heat death" yet could suggest that there is a beginning for usable energy.

Unless you subscribe to the idea that big crunch will occur where the spacetime expansion to reverse and back to blackhole singularity, but I don't see strong evidences supporting such claim.

Isn't "usable energy" need to had a beginning in order for second law to hold true? How could we explain "heat death" is not occurred yet if usable energy had existed indefinitely long ago.

If big bang model holds true, isn't the explosion of the singularity marks the creation (hence the beginning) of the usable energy? The usable energy is formed as part of the power residues resulting from the explosion. After that energy is conserved onwards.

What law of conservation of energy stated is energy can transform to usable + unusable energy, in a conserve way (energy can not be created nor destroyed, but transform) within the current observable timeframe, it doesn't tell if usable energy has a beginning or has an end. Second law of thermodynamic does.

There is one postulate suggests that the sum of energy immediately after big bang is equal to sum of energy that we observed now, and this value is always zero. And hence energy is conserved after the big bang. This sounds convincing.

However, whether energy already existed within the singularity (hence still conserved before and after the big bang) OR it was created right immediately after the big bang is debatable, as at the edge of singularity, law of physics as we know today, doesn't apply.

This post has been edited by nice.rider: Sep 3 2010, 07:22 PM

I guess you are asking for first cause... prior to big bang..... that is what CERN is doing now... maybe you can grab stephen hawking`s latest book

Can you explain this? Energy which is something intangible can change to to coal (tangible).

That's why and where big bang theory come in.

Coal is storing the energy within the its carbon bonding.

You burn coal to release the energy and use the energy.

So it did not changed to carbon as Fifi stated. It got captured by coal. Amazing, tell me how can coal managed to capture energy?

Energy doesn't literally change into carbon. It's absorbed by hydrocarbons, and coal IS one of them. Crude oil and natural gas are another two examples of hydrocarbons.

Not sure about the actual absorption process, my Googling doesn't work well. AFAIK, it's similar to how solar panels or planets absorb sunlight, but I don't know any further than that.

lol.. no energy doesnt change to carbon. Im just giving other examples of energy source other than sun that I stated. Carbon coal deep within the ground is fossil fuel energy.

Coal, oil, fossil fuel come from carbon content materials, aka died plants, died animals, anything related to carbon.

Energy from geometric force, gravity, then turn those carbon into hydrocarbon, (oil, coal, natural gas).

How plants grow?
From solar energy, and various energy source available.

Energy doesn't turn something into carbon.

Basic materials like carbon are exist natural and finite in the first place. Energy (solar, gravity etc) absorbed by earth, just transform how the state of materials, which in turn can be used as energy source.

Just like there is solar energy from the sun.
You use a solar panel, which you turn a solar energy into electrical energy.

Energy is just transform from one another form.

Carbon, hydrogen and oxygen in the form of water and carbon dioxide doesn't burn together. Carbon, hydrogen and oxygen in the form of oxygen molecules and carbohydrates(sugar) can burn together to release heat. Photosynthesis using solar energy in the form of light can convert water and carbon dioxide into oxygen molecules and sugar molecules. The number of atoms have not changed but the form they are in and energy content has changed.

Thanks Smith, I can accept that. Now I am waiting to learn how the absorption process works.

Ah yes, cherroy explained it right. Darn my faulty memory! *slaps head*

Energy is required to form ( or break ) the bonds between atoms which carbon ( or any matter ).

So, to form/break the bonds, energy is 'absorbed'.

Carbon materials like coal are used as energy source because it is easy to unlock the stored energy. In the case of coal is combustion. Nuclear fission is used to unlock/unleash/release the energy in uranium.

Though this is a simplified explanation. A very detail explanation would require going into the fundamental forces.

This post has been edited by befitozi: Sep 6 2010, 07:14 PM

BIG BANG