[quote=xunji,Jun 26 2011, 10:19 PM]
[quote=northface,Jun 24 2011, 11:21 PM]
Yes the original entrance is better, but after 5 months like I said, only 2-3 spots on top floor, rest of the lower floors nothing.
So I scouted around the area and noticed most BHs there were facing the direction where the NEW side entrance is now.

correct me if i'm wrong.

if i not mistaken, yours is a standalone . pls draw what the pitch of the roof n type of roof?

if your is a r.c roof i will suggest convert it to dog kennel cause it will be minimal disturb.

10' x 12' LAL sufficient.

[/quote]


Yes this is a standalone BH and roof is indeed RC.

Reason I advised my friend to do try a side ent because everything was done in 2 days. Hacking off the RC roof for a dog kennel will take days.

Is it ideal to have LAL design where your birds would need to drop 30 over feet (assume every floor 10-11 ft high) to reach the ground floor?

My experience/observation is that LAL followed by each other in a row like manner, not directly to the bottom yields better results.

Yes I have seen both in action myself and those with a straight down LAL design experienced slower growth. Same area, same house design, in fact both BH just opp each other separated by a 2-lane road.

The one with straight down LAL took a long time before seeing droppings on the ground floor, while the offset one after 2 weeks open sound already seeing droppings on ground floor.

Straight down LAL took abt 4 years to achieve 1000 nests while the offset LAL 2.5 years already 800 nest.

I can be wrong but my observations are as so.

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Added on June 30, 2011, 1:53 pmAs for safety, I build mine with a 2-layer brick wall around the void so ppl don't fall down.

If you think this might hinder bird's flight path you can put metal railings with larger separation between posts.

But as long as the void is 10x10 or bigger I don't think a 1 foot high wall would hinder flight path, but definitely safer.

This post has been edited by northface: Jun 30 2011, 01:53 PM

I left nesting planks out of the area above the void, so you waste the ceiling space on 1st floor and 2nd floor.

I've seem some other people come up with some mechanism to harvest that space. To me it is not worth it risking a fall from those places I just left them empty. Besides, if your 3 storey BH is really full house, that little space won't matter anymore.

If you compare this to your straight down design, actually you're only wasting 1 more void section. If your void is 10'x10' you have 100sq.ft less space, not a big deal imo.

I have a question for sifus here since I have no knowledge/experience on this particular part. How have BHs that are located in higher elevation area fared? Places like Bentong/Batang Kali/ Kuala Kubu Baru.

These towns are located near peninsular's central mountain range so I would think it's elevation would be definitely higher than places like Kuantan or Segamat.

Any sifus with BH near these area willing to share some stories?

I won't be going but from the description of the conference is sounds like an educational conf, probably gonna discuss long term prospects and things like that than ACTUAL swftlet farming itself.

Yet they are still charging $800 per person?

What kind of structure requires no column/beam?

I've seen BH using precast concrete blocks to form the beam and columns, they just need to combine them up after delivering to site, only thing that takes time are the floor slabs like you said.

However I doubt the safety of such structures, a magnitude 8 earthquake in Sumatera and your structure might just crumble like a house of cards.

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Added on July 14, 2011, 9:06 amOh and I forgot to add, the contractor that builds BH using such methods around the East coast area proudly told me that his record of completing a BH from scratch using such method is like 2 months.

This post has been edited by northface: Jul 14 2011, 09:06 AM

Bro satay,

Thanks for the info, do you actually own any BHs in Batang Kali or you were just visiting looking for potential?

I'm up for chit chat and sharing stories for anyone in Klang Valley area!

He means foraging area, place the birds cari makan.

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Added on July 22, 2011, 5:50 pmAll these talk about consultants let me share mine. When I first started this about 4-5 years ago, I paid a consultant like 60k just to do the nesting planks and sound for a 3 story 22x72 BH.

I can probably do it for 1/4 the cost myself today, but the point is the entry into this business is pretty tough. You know the Chinaman mentality, nobody will share unless you pay. You can goto seminars and look at their wonderful pictures of BHs, but when you ask any of them to visit their BH, you will get a look as if you're ET that just arrived on earth.

Of course, being an engineer myself I'm quick to learn the trade and now I can build and design my own BH. But the very first time, sometimes you just have to kena 'chop' one time before you learn.

Nobody can guarantee your 1st BH will be 100% successful, no matter how many books and BHs you visit, your BH design has to conform to your land's topography. But one thing for sure is, if you never try then you will never succeed

This post has been edited by northface: Jul 22 2011, 05:50 PM

You identify them visually, that is mature ones are larger and fledglings are smaller.

However, I wear glasses so I'm not very good at identifying them unless they are real close

Old sifus like WW should be very good at identifying them

I read this book called 'Swiftlets of Borneo', which specifically deals with the edible nest making swifts, I thought it was pretty informative
http://www.nhbs.com/swiftlets_of_borneo_bu...fno_126856.html

Basically their conclusion was that EBN making swifts are monogamous and they take turns building a nest and care for the young. As for old sifu WW's observation of a single parent bird at night during roosting hours, maybe one was claimed by nature?

The Mat Sallehs do spend a lot of resources researching wild life that's why they are so much better. I can only dream of the day where there will be one of those National Geographic style documentary on swiftlet farming and the empirical studies on the optimum habitat and environment for swiftlets.

Right now a lot of the information that we have in regard to this industry is from what others say. There are no real scientific studies done to backup claims.

I think this can be good in a way, most of the processing are done by Indonesians anyways, and they were and still are the ones that come up with all these dirty tricks to maximize their profits.

Most Malaysians cleans bird's nest on a small scale only, in fact if China suppliers import raw BN straight from Malaysia we might even get better prices than what Indonesians pay us.

Good post sifu ww, the misconception of red nests being the best actually came from the Ming dynasty book 本草纲目by李时珍.

And they even believed that the long textured fibre of bird's nest comes from fungus that they ingest and then regurgitate to build nests. Anyways, in the internet age I think ppl are starting to become smart. I have friends/clients from China/Taiwan that only buys some unprocessed nests from me when they come to Malaysia.

Which is why I think it is good that they know the Indonesians have been fking them from behind for hundreds of years, as they add all these poisonous stuff into the nests to make it RED or SNOW WHITE while reaping millions off them.

This post has been edited by northface: Jul 30 2011, 06:13 PM

Bro satay, pigeons shouldn't be able to navigate in the dark mind telling how they got into your BH?

Or is it just near the entrance hole.

I give you seminar for half the price, even got field trip to real BH.

If you really want to process BN only, get a pair of tweezers and some bird's nest and you can start cleaning them up.

But like any industry, if you only learn 1 part of the process you're most likely going to fail. Learn about the WHOLE industry first before you decide what to do.

I've read Dr. Lim's book but never attended his course. But from other similar courses I've attended before, this is what I learned:

They do touch on the issue of nest cleaning but nothing too specific. And they definitely don't teach you how to export to China sd they probably don't know how themselves. They teach you how to grade different types of bird's nest as well, but nothing too specific.

Maybe some of the sifus here that have attended Dr. Lim's course before can tell us more about what you'll learn at this class.

Bro Rangnok do you accept day visits? I'm interested to visit how much do you charge?