Back on LYN after a loooooong break. Whee.

Second hand or new? New is around RM3k.

You might consider the Canon Ixus 100/110 IS or the Panasonic Lumix TZ15?

It's a good start off point for DSLRs, no doubt. Just wondering what is your budget?

The Fuji's work very well in low light conditions, but in normal shooting conditions, I'm not sure. The Canon and Panasonic are marginally better in those cases.

Blends down to personal preference. These three brands are really good ones. (;

18-200 kits are really hard to find. The 18-55 is a more popular choice.

I personally would go for the 18-200. You won't go wrong with it. But it'll set you back about 1K more. If I'm not mistaken. If you have the extra cash, you would definitely wanna opt for the 18-200.

In my opinion I'd go for the 18-200 too although it means another 1K gone. You'll find the extra zoom range useful for a beginner. I started off with the 18-55 LOL. It's a very short lens. You'll find yourself restricted to 'that' zoom range after a while.

Not really. The 110 is hovering around the RM1k price range, while the 100 goes for around RM700-RM800. Good luck securing your deal. (:

And if you're considering the Panasonic, it's been out for a while already, but I think it is still a worthy contender.

This post has been edited by TheWandererX: Dec 15 2009, 11:10 PM

HAHA. What to do. Photography is an expensive hobby.

RM2000? Just wondering what are you aiming for in your camera first? Superzoom or prosumer?

If superzoom, there is the Panasonic Lumix FZ35/FZ28 or the Canon Powershot SX10/20. The P90 is in the same category as these, so you might wanna do a bit of research to see which one would suit you best.

If prosumer, there's the Panasonic Lumix LX3/GF1, or the Canon Powershot G10/G11.

Off topic, but I'll share this bit. Recently came back from Korea after a long trip and during the start of the trip, one of my friends' cameras broke down. He had to buy a new one and ended buying this model for RM1300 converted from Korean won, LOL. And I saw it selling for RM1k in Taman Tun. Banner ad.

Back on topic, I think it's a really handy camwhore camera, but the quality,... I'm not so sure at all. Not much is being said about Samsung anyway. I think it'll do just well for a mid-range PnS.

Can't be that expensive.. I think the shop you visited placed high price tags, which surely can be bargained down..

You might want to do a lil bit more research in the Garage Sales area, the price is almost around there. The 500D (body) is around RM2.5k, while the kits...

Now there are two popular kits.

1. 18-55: RM3k
2. 18-200: RM4k+

Good luck on sourcing your deal, and don't forget to bargain, both for the price and freebies.

I like the way you think. In fact I'm using the same setup, different body only. I'm suggesting the 18-200 because they're just stepping into DSLRs, and I think the 18-200 is a very good choice for a beginner. Personally I don't like changing lenses. Every time I need the zoom range when I'm shooting wide, I have to change lenses, and if I want to shoot wide when I'm on the 55-250 I have to change again. It is a bit of a hassle, don't you think? I wouldn't want to be burdened by that.

It gets really annoying sometimes for me, but I had no choice because back then, 18-200 kits were scarce, exception being the 50D. And I'm sure they'd love the accessibility of the whole range with one lens as a starter.

Definitely the TX1, if you can afford. If you want to go for a cheaper alternative the WX1 would be nice. Not many cameras cater to the 'stylish' category nowadays.. Not much choices.

Hmm, I don't really know much, no chance to use a Micro 4/3 system.. but there's also the Olympus Pen series, you might wanna have a look at that.

General purpose? I think I'll settle for a 70-200 F4 if you have jittery hands/want a lighter but as powerful lens. In fact I read on a review site somewhere that the F4 and F2.8 quality is almost the same, only the f-stop difference. So yeah.

The D90 is an intermediate DSLR, while the 500D is an entry-level DSLR. There's a RM1k price difference in between though, so choose carefully.

Haha. Well, for one I haven't used it before. I see. Hahah. Thanks for pointing out.

Sony has been a not-so quality emphasized.. but recent models like the TX1 and HX1 are quite noteworthy. Still the best remains to be in the big market leaders.

Another brand that is quite good, but less talk about it, is Fujifilm. Not much is said about it, but the comments have been really good.

For your GF? Might wanna consider a Sony TX1/WX1. If she'e the type which likes stylish gadgets more. If not, she'd love the Panasonic Lumix LX-3. It's something you won't go wrong with.

This post has been edited by TheWandererX: Dec 16 2009, 10:24 PM

F70EXR? Well I haven't heard a thing about it, LOL. Well good luck! (:

I'm not going to agree with noprob. Full frame right ahead?

I say these three choices are catered to three different groups of users. The EP-1 is for the enthusiasts who want a smaller camera which isn't that bulky. The K7 is an intermediate DSLR. And 70mm 2.4? Umm, I don't think you'd want to be stuck at 70mm forever... The Sony A850 is for those running studios, etc, or they just wanna experience full-frame.

Either way, could you use the template? It'll give us a really good guide to work on. Thanks mate.



Advertisement everywhere what to expect?

@gwendoLYN:

Your G10's lens is not a fixed aperture lens. It's a 6.1-30.5mm 1:2.8-4.5. Which means, at 6.1mm, your maximum widest is 2.8, while at 30.5mm the maximum widest is 4.5.

2.8 v 4 is quite significant if you shoot indoor a lot. I find it very, very hard to deal with indoor shots cause I have a 55-250, but I'm contented. Haha. Well, you could increase ISO to compensate, but it depends on what body you're using. If you're using a 1000D like me, don't think of touching on 1600 unless really necessary. The picture quality is horribly affected.

Btw, IINM a simple rule for steady shots is 1/focal length. In your case, which would be 1/200 without IS. IS helps tremendously with telephoto shots (we're bound to have jittery hands no matter how professional we are, we're humans after all), and I think you'd manage 1/50 at 200mm just fine. There is no set calculation, just formulas to help you find out the best settings to use.

Both are equally good performers. Since this is so, it's down to other factors. Consider the focal length, the product (it's new, or out for awhile already) and the usability. Different people have different preferences.

Good luck making up your mind, these two are really wonderful cameras.

Mmm, long term planning. I like the way you think.

Well, since you mentioned, here's the breakdown.

1. You might have a chance with Micro Four Thirds system as it looks to have been revived. Is it a fad or a real future builder for cameras we don't know, but I think it'll be a big hit. Your biggest chance would be on this, out of your three choices.

2. Pentax? To be honest, I am not being brand-promoting or anything, but if you ask me, I wouldn't go for Pentax, and stick to the majority. Finding lenses here in Malaysia is so hard, and I'm not sure if their CS in Malaysia is any good (if they do have one).

Depending on where you're from, it'll affect your choice a lot.

3. Full-frame. It seems like quite a big leap for me. Nevertheless, a good idea, but not sure about the lens choices. I think you shouldn't start off with the 50 1.8 first, and get a normal kit lens or something. A normal walkaround for you to familiarize first.

And about your photography style, you'll need a few lenses, just so you know. An ultra wide-angle for scenery and building; portrait, macro and product should be able to be covered by one lens. But an extra macro lens won't hurt.

I hope I've helped you a bit in making up your mind, mate. (:

The best Ixus for you might be the 110/200 IS. Panasonic on the other hand, models which might appeal to you, might be the FX580/TZ6/TZ7.

The one which you should get is the one you're most comfortable with, cause when it comes down to this point, most models performance are already on par with each other. Therefore there is no 'clear winner'.

About the shops, I haven't been surveying around much, and therefore I'm not so sure. That I can't help you alot, sorry mate.

Oh, no wonder. Haven't been here for awhile, sorry.

Well then I guess it's safe to say, your best bet would be on FF (;

Yghsin? YL Camera? DigitalsMania? These are just a few good shops you might wanna consider.

Hmm. Now this is quite a hard decision to make. You could either settle for a Panasonic Lumix LX3/Canon Powershot G10/G11 or a DSLR like the Nikon D3000 or the Canon EOS 1000D. You'll have to narrow it down to personal preference. All of them have practically every basic DSLR feature (basic controls, etc) so you'll have to decide: do you want a pocketable camera or a DSLR? That I can't help you answer.

Good luck in making up your mind.

Haha. Yups. And just a note, if you do ever come by a D60 deal, don't get it. The D3000 is MUCH better than its ancestor. Honestly.

My sincere apologies for leaving you with such a short line.

The three I just mentioned are essentially, a few of the big camera shops in KL.

YGHsin is located in Taman Megah, DigitalsMania and YL Camera in Pudu Plaza. I don't think I can link any outside links here, but they do publish part of their stock onto a Lelong site. A simple search for their names will bring it up. DigitalsMania has a LYN account too, just so you know.

Next there are quite a few shops I've heard to be reputable, which are AverAwards (not sure about this one, but recently I went for a price quote and hey, their prices aren't so bad, just that you might needa bargain a lil harder to get some extra freebies), Leos Com (part of a shop in Digital Mall. It's like a 'joint operation' as in that shop there are 3 shops: an Apple shop, a phone shop and the camera shop). AverAwards has their own site, you can head over there and have a look at things, but I think the online pricing should be exorbitant. Leos Com however, is located on the ground floor of Digital Mall. It's the first shop to your left when you walk in.

Totally. Your last phrase practically tells the story.

But there are prosumers which do produce good quality pictures that might be able to contest the big guns.

Assuming your maximum is 2k, I'll suggest a Panasonic Lumix LX-3, albeit old, still a very good camera. A Canon Powershot G10/G11, depending on which you can find below 2k, both are equally powerful cameras too. Also there is the mid-ranged cameras, but seeming as you have a high budget, might as well go for the best.

If you need a superzoom, there are models like the Nikon P90, Lumix FZ/TZ series, and the Canon Powershot SX series.

I have an FS15 too btw. Got it with a purchase of an LCD.

Apologies for leaving out you guys. Suddenly had to rush out.

Prosumer superzoom? Well, you have quite a few choices. There is Panasonic with the FZ28/FZ35/TZ7 and Canon with their Powershot SX1/SX10/SX20 IS. Along with the P90, these few models are the best in the respective category.

Personally, I'd go for the TZ7 because it's a pocketable superzoom, while the Canon SX1 for the quality images. Not sure where the P90 fits in as I haven't used it before.

The LX-3 is a dedicated prosumer. And the sensor is noticeably bigger than the Ixus 200 IS (1/2.3" over 1/1.63"). That's a huge difference.

Unless you need the looks of the 200 IS, go for the LX3. You won't regret it.

These two cameras are on par in terms of hardware specifications, so it gets down to which one appeals more to you. I'll suggest you go to any photo shop and have a play around with these two before making up your mind, cause if I had to deal with this choice I wouldn't know which to choose either. Both are equally good performers in their category.

Yup! a while back.

Btw, the 450D is really cheap now, good idea. Haha. Well, the 18-55 has a minimum of 0.25m. I find the 55 to be too short for my liking, but yes, it's a perfect camera and yes, the lens will be okay. Be warned though that when you step into the realm of DSLRs... you'll never stop craving for more

External flash is something really out of poster's league. It's something you need to learn about, not just attach and snap. Just my two cents, an external flash on an LX3 is pointless. (if the flash mentioned is going to be one of those Nikon SB flashes or a full-sized flash).

Haha. What did you get?

HAHA. Not unexpected.

Slowly, slowly. You'll get to learn everything, don't worry. Only question:

Got money or not?

Kick the FX38 out if you have the FX48 in - it is a lower-spec FX48, that's all.

Now the FX48 and the 200 IS are both very similar in terms of specifications. The 200 IS outdoes the FX48 a little though, you might wanna have a look at that. Other than that it all boils down to personal preference.

Yup quite a reasonable price.

HAHA.

You might want to consider a 2nd hand 40D alongside. That's all the competition left. Happy choosing sides.

Not really sure. Well, just wondering, what is your budget? Might help with a few choices.

The G11 is obviously the better. It's about RM500+ more expensive, what else can I say?

I'd say go for the G11 in this case, but if you want to save the extra money, yup, the LX3 is a good model too.

RM3k will get you:

1. Nikon D3000 with extra 1K
2. Canon EOS 450D/1000D with extra 1K
3. Canon EOS 500D with no extra
4. Olympus E-520 with less than 1K extra
5. Sony a550 with no extra

If you ask me I'd take the 450D, because the previously 3k+ model has now dropped to 2k, it's a deal well worth your every cent.

Definitely the 500D. While some fanboys might criticize me and label me as brand promoting, you are free to do your own research and take a look at reviews all around.

Like here.

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/canoneos500d/
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/sonyalphadslra550/

Not much has been said about Fuji cameras, but so far no bad reviews, so I guess you'll be okay with that.

Definitely the 7D is out of reach - it is already RM5.6k body only.

50D doesn't have video recording which leaves you left with the D90.

My personal opinion, video recording is pointless unless you're talking about the real deal ones (in the 7D, 5D MkII, etc).

So yup. In a nutshell, if you really need the video, get the D90. If not, the 50D would be a much better choice.

Statement 2 notes that you'll be able to get a 450D/1000D with RM1k left to spare if your budget is RM3k.

Btw, IMHO video is not a big deal, and video for an extra RM1k? It's more worth it to settle for the 450D.

UOW student? Wow. I've lived in the campus with my cousin before for a few months, and hey, I kinda like the facilities and the frequent events.

Anyway, back to the topic. I recommend you make a trip down to KL and get a G11 at RM1.6k +- (Garage Sales average pricing). Coming down to KL with AeroLine (RM70) and bus/taxi fare (varies, from RMx to RMxx) is totally worth it. Instead of forking an exorbitant RM2k for a G11 in SG.

I assume you'll be there for quite a while, and I think the best is to get the best. You never know.

The G11 definitely outdoes the LX3. It's priced higher for a reason. The Leica lens MIGHT be the best lens in the world (example), but if the body is mediocre, the results will also be mediocre.

Comparing the LX3 with the Nikon D60/Sony a200 would not be a wise decision. The LX3 is a prosumer, while the D60/a200 has a full-fledged APS-C sensor. Although this might be a big difference, the D60/a200 are entry-level DSLRs. Not to mention that the a200 was previously at the same price range with the LX3.

It is a really hard question to answer, but in my opinion, the D60 and a200 might lose out to the LX3 in normal shooting conditions but when it comes to low light, the DSLRs will excel. Even my entry-level 1000D does really well at ISO 800/1600, although if I pixel peep, it is horrible.. a little.

Anyway, in my opinion it is not worth to get a D60/a200 unless you're really into DSLRs and you want a quick buy to satisfy. If not, I'd suggest you stick with a prosumer, or save up a little bit more for a DSLR.

For your info, the Canon EOS 450D/1000D is priced at 2k+- now, whilst Nikon has their own new entry-level model, the D3000, priced at RM2k too. A bit up from the G11 but if you ask me, totally worth it.

Before I proceed, may I know if you're a starting beginner or have you played around with DSLRs before?

Well, IF you're a starting beginner, I wouldn't recommend going for a 2nd hand DSLR, as you may not know how to handle it if problems arise. If you have done so before, well, here's a few of your choices.

There is the Canon EOS 450D/1000D as I've mentioned, or you might want a Nikon D80/D3000. In my opinion, the D60 just doesn't cut it. 3 AF points is not going to satisfy your needs, and I'm pretty sure you'll get to feel the lack one you get it, so I definitely would not recommend a D60. There is also the choice of going for older models like the 400D/30D/Nikon D70, but you'll be best off with the 5 that I've just listed (these models are already very, very old, and while lenses do not devalue, camera bodies do because the technology in them is constantly improving). In short, your choices with the biggest potential are the 450D/D80/D300, but you might want to consider the 1000D too.

D90? As far as I know the most basic model is 4k, and body only, it is already 3k. It won't fit in your budget unless you fork out a bit more.. perhaps a 18-55? But honestly. I'd rather you get the 18-105. The 18-55 is a slow focuser. I had a chance to try both the 18-55 and the 18-105 on my girlfriend's DSLR, and the difference is big.

Now, the GF1 is a really new model, but Panasonic have been doing really well so far, so I think it'll do you good. No promises though. It's based on the Micro Four Thirds system though, so it should be a good performer.

18-50? Are you sure? Are you mentioning the Canon EF-S 18-55 instead? Or the Tamron 17-50?

I'll assume you're mentioning the normal kit, the 18-55. It's not ngam, neither is it outrageously overpriced. But in Garage Sales the average price is RM3k. I'm sure you'll be able to find a better deal with one of the sellers, paying an extra RM450 is not something I'd do.

Haha. Any camera shop would do, as long as they quote you a proper price. There are two shops that I know of, that will give you a good price, both being in Pudu Plaza. DigitalsMania and YL Camera. Not so sure about LYP/Sg Wang, because I never go to shop there. Never have a chance, actually.

Well good luck scoring your deal, and don't forget to bargain for freebies

Forget the D60. The D3000 kicks its ass. The D60 has only 3 AF points. Wanna suffer that? I'm sure not.

The Canon 1000D is a notch down from the 450D, and now that the price is the same already (both also RM2k), definitely go for the 450D.

Between the D3000 and 450D, the 450D does marginally better than the D3000 as it was meant for a segment in between entry-level and intermediate-level. Therefore the better would be the 450D, but you're free to make up your mind by personal preference.

Low noise? That'll definitely be the Fujifilm F200EXR/F70EXR. Not sure how well the EXR technology is but so far no complaints, I shall regard it as satisfactory. If not, you might want to consider a Canon Ixus 110/120 IS or a Panasonic Lumix FX.

Nothing specific? Well the cameras that can fit within your budget are the Panasonic FS15, or the Canon Ixus 100 IS.

For the 450D, in M mode, you just need to turn the dial to change the aperture. While for the shutter, you'll need to hold down the +- button and turn the dial. I think the same thing applies for the D70, only the difference is that the buttons for the respective commands are on top with the screen, rather than at the bottom.

Now, I would suggest you get a Canon EOS 450D/Nikon D5000. The 450D is in the middle of intermediate-level and entry-level while the D5000 is an entry-level with video. The reason I'm recommending the 450D is that the price has dropped steeply following the release of the Canon EOS 500D which is just a blown-up megapixel DSLR with video. Paying RM1k extra isn't a good idea.

I'd therefore go for the 450D, and have RM1k still in my pocket.

He was mentioning D70, the model released before the D80.

Not so sure about the entry-level PnS range. But I think you might do well with a Panasonic Lumix or a Canon Powershot A-series. Never go for the Samsung/Olympus PnS. They are honestly horrible in image quality.

Definitely. Well, there is the Canon Ixus 110/120 IS or the Panasonic Lumix FX series as quoted previously from the similar request above. Both these two are leaders of their pack and will do well.

Lower price D90? How low do you want to go?

The basic D90 kit is an 18-105, which is priced at 4K, which will fit perfectly in your budget. Definitely, DSLRs are wonderful tools for stock photography. The 18-105 is a wonderful kitlens too. Compared to the 18-55 offered in the entry-level models, the 18-105 owns.

I shall repeat this - never go for a D60, although it is cheap because it is discontinued. The D3000 does much better if you want a RM2k DSLR.

Now, as you have an extra 1.5k, why not consider the D5000/500D? These two have video, if you want the function.

If you don't want the function though, my advice is to quickly grab a 450D as they are very cheap now (2K) and as previously mentioned, a notch up from these two models. Therefore the wisest choice, if you want a DSLR and don't need the video, is to get a 450D.

Adding on, if you do find a 2nd had D80 in good shape, go for it. It is a very good intermediate-level camera too.

A Canon A480/A1000IS might appeal to your needs. Canon most probably dominates the entry-level sector as they have managed to lower the price drastically and create a cheap and powerful camera.

The S90 is a prosumer while the 200 IS is more towards style. Although the 200 IS is a really good camera, it can not beat the S90, because the S90 is a no-joke camera.

That is a really subjective comment. These can be altered using Picture Styles in both Canon and Nikon. The twisting screen.. yeah, I agree, maybe because I don't see a use for it in my usage. Different people use DSLRs for different reasons though.

The best bet for you, seeing as you're a newbie, is to go for a Canon EOS 450D or a Nikon D3000, which both cost RM2k. You might be able to find one at RM1.8k, but hard.

Definitely the Canon Powershot series. Consider getting the A480/A1000IS. These two are considerably good cameras for their range. Other than that you might want to give the Panasonic Lumix a thought, but as far as I know their entry-level cameras aren't as good as the Canon's.

Definitely suitable. It depends on your preferences though.

As mentioned previously, at this point of time, the two best entry-level DSLRs are the Canon EOS 450D/Nikon D3000. And as mentioned previously too, the 450D sits in between entry-level and the intermediate-level range. Therefore it is a wiser choice to go for it. No promoting though - you're free to choose the model to your liking.

Definitely, if you could, the Canon Ixus 120 IS is better for non-flash situations. Good ISO handling coupled with a fast lens (f2.8-5.9 compared to the Sony's f2.4-5.9 and the Panasonic's f3.3-5.9) will be really a really good tool. Although the Sony has an f2.4-5.9, I still don't trust their ISO processing enough to recommend the Sony, although it has improved remarkably over its previous models.

Not sure if I can comment. Not informed about the Fujifilm line, but as far as I know, Fuji is quite a good brand.

This post has been edited by TheWandererX: Dec 25 2009, 11:22 PM

I think the FS15 will outperform the 61 and 95 IS. I don't really like the 95's performance. Not as satisfactory.

All these models are already old ones. A300 and A350 replaced by the A380, and the E520 replaced by the E620.

I definitely do not recommend aiming for ANY of these, as Sony and Olympus have improved a lot, and those models were, really... mediocre. You'd expect more from a DSLR. If it IS a must though, you should head for the A350, as the E520 was... not really good with high ISOs, and the A300 is a notch lower,... and worse. In fact, IMHO the A200 and the A300 were underperforming cameras. I have used both before and even the D60 performed much better.

If you would accept recommendations though, I suggest you look for a used Canon EOS 450D. I can't help repeating it but it's the best camera you can get at an entry-level price.


No problems mate.

Extra zooming will lead you to the TZ7. LX3 has a measly 2.5x zoom range only. If you're willing to sacrifice image quality for zoom range, then get the TZ7; if not, get the LX3. You won't regret it.