I have checked the server list everyday since 9/19 and the no of servers had not grown at all. I hope SWTOR will be a WoW killer which by my definition means at least 20+ servers in NA alone. Twelve servers is just lame.

Why do you care if a game company beats another game company, just play a game that you enjoy.

And why do you measure by server count, EVE online only has one worldwide server

i had read thru many, many forums including wow europe and oceanic (by lurking ofkos) and the top 5 reasons they that would kill wow would be:

1. nice graphic, wow iz cartoonish
2. high character customisation
3. arial (maximum 1 minute?) combat
4. grindfest
5. pvpve

some of them does brought out some reasonable argument that each MMO would be an individual game of their feats and strengths that should not be compared with one another.

technically, have wow killed EQ? although EQ is pretty much have least players but wow still lives in shadows of EQ with terms and certain aspects directly borrowed from there.

Having played a few MMOs now, what will kill WoW is a game without latency.

Yea a game without latency and not to mention sumthin that can match up to WoW itself.

im about to happy when see the title lol...

as it had been discussed since last few years back regarding wow killers, as nobody believe wow cant be beaten...

from warhammer then aion, next blade & soul... the following dunno what crap gonna be... keeps dream on...

also wow is keep on going & growing by sooner with another expansion shall be released...

the only capable wow killer is it's own creator, Blizzard...

WoW FTW!

Yeah, I would love that. Even Brewfest sucks for those with high latency. Yeah, the Ram racing thing. I am a sucker for whole event. Good thing we can sell back the costume after the achievement.

local mmo's have good latency...

Bogardan, next thing is less grinding to level. That's the problem with local MMOs.

Hmm...Warhammer had a really nice concept but the lag spikes was so terrible. I think for the first 6 months, annoying. Their BGs were interesting although just spam spam spam. And I ran around as a big ugly tanker. Haha! What was interesting about Warhammer was the forced-male characters and no female versions. And the Goblin side was hilariously funny. I enjoyed their quests!

The other thing about Warhammer was the PVP and siege engines. The siege was kinda boring after awhile because it became a case of raiding while opposite side was asleep. As for the siege engines, wasn't easy to use as in WoW. The responsiveness of the WoW game/servers are a lot better than in WoW.

Then again, while I was playing WoW, wasn't using a tunnel then. So it got pretty annoying.

But being in a PvP guild, that was an eye-opener. I guess it was a big difference from how my previous WoW guild was run.

A game without latency will kill WoW...diablo 3?

and that's not theoretically MMO and that title is from Blizzard themself

so the conclusion hence told, only Blizzard can/must kill their own game, which they almost done too many times unconsciously.

technically there *used* to be few potential companies that could do that

remember games like 'lands of lore'? the game content was already great (back in those days), the dev team built the game from ground up without even caring general D&D rulesets and the end result was superb!!!

owh, almost forgot 'nox' in a sense tha some people dubbed it as 'diablo 1.5' after the release (funny thing is, both game has no similarities). it's fast paced and quite story driven

those were some unique games with in depth story stlling and if the company survives until today they had high chance of being made into MMOs, but thx to EA that buttsecks this uniquely company that and turn some srs games into joke.

EA buttsecks everything and turn gaming-world into a joke, i lose heart to EA ever since they kill NFS with underground shiet.

Underground 1 and 2 was good. ALL NFS games after that sucked.. But for me, the 1 reason that WoW will die is to have TOO many things to do. Even now, you gotta farm, do dailies and so much more to even survive raiding costs. Yeah, you may say that raiders have good gear and they can do things easier (farm or dailies) but as new stuff gets added and levels keep increasing, there will be a point that too much is too much and people will burn out just doing things to survive in the game.

AION

LOL@Koreangrindmmorpg. Its exactly same as Lineage 2. Pretty graphics and hollow gameplay.

Hey there Goblinsker! I wondered what happened to our usual wet blanket.

How's your move to Sandakan?

Im a wet blanket LOL

Lol, Sandakan ok la. Got streamyx and gamepath.
The problem is no time to play wow now. Work in hospital is super tiring, come back login for awhile and go to sleep for tmw.
Short raids like TOC is a blessing for me right now.

lol'ed.

and no, WoW didnt really lived in the shadows on EQ, WoW simply took every previous mmorpg's strong points, mashed it all together, and cut out their flaws. and it became the WoW we know today.

---

Added on September 28, 2009, 1:00 amQFT

ill never ever touch any korean mmorpg.

This post has been edited by Quazacolt: Sep 28 2009, 01:00 AM

World of Starcraft

LOl. latency i caused by streamyx connection all the time, wish tht wow would expand to southeast asia. maybe a server in singapore or something

not really necessary... imo

---

Added on September 28, 2009, 11:12 amhappy with the current state...

This post has been edited by ch@ich@i: Sep 28 2009, 11:12 AM

What the hell u guys talking about. WOW already DEAD ONCE i play it...me login = wow dead! FEAR ME! lol

oh, quaza!!!

but i'm expecting around 60% of pve players would return back due to the fact that each Aion server *is* a pvp server, plus alliance thau were quiet for past weeks.

tbh, i'm more eager waiting for the world of sancturary (minus the ghey mage class), where barbarian still roxx. still 1 more class to be announce and i wonder will there be additional levels like

secret exploding-sheep level?
secret tauren-wearing-battle-suit level?
secret vodoo-doll-that-resembles-either-paladin-or-adolescent-girl level?

wait a sec... wtf beta-zul-gurub-trinket?!

aion pvp makes me giggle. their attempt to follow WoW footsteps in esporting it is just laughable. saw their "arena" videos? so horrible >.>

guys... dun be so harsh on other game developers.

>_>

did checked the joo-tube for pvp clip (mostly koreans?) and it made me wonder

wow and it's proclaimed 'WoW killer' ('waaaaaaarrrggh!!!', 'AoC', etc) has standard tanks, healers, dpser, disabler that made those game played more like a rogue (pvp/bg wh0re should know what i mean) but seeing those clip i had an impression that every class in Aion/ linage (except for ranged) plays like a tank although there are tanks, healers, dpser, disabler in the game, which is quite... odd... in a sense... or izzit koreans likes to do it up front and personal?

oh quaza, waddaya mean by 'JUSTICE IS SERVED' in saimoe thread? the only skill with 'justce' tagged that can whack people up badly is the hammer of OP justice, and tauren would be way way op during the launch of cataclysm.

Why taurens would be OP? Have you guys ever heard of stun DR

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paladin_(character_class)

read up what paladins are. and then tell me, are they even resembling the original lore? heck, original paladins of warcraft2/3 are mainly healers, with the exception of war2 paladins being extreme anti death knights. (lol exorcism, *dong* sound = gg dk)

for a more specific perspective, look at lolrets.

=edit=
warcraft2 not 3

This post has been edited by Quazacolt: Sep 28 2009, 03:45 PM

I've always wanted or wish for a really good MMO other than WoW. I've always been waiting for an MMO that can steal some subs away from WoW.

Not because I'm tired of WoW and I'd totaly jump ship, but its because of competitions.

I mean look what Warhammer did to WoW. All of a sudden we have graphics update! And then we have shadows! Queue BGs anywhere! Achievements! Separate server restart times for Oceanic realms!

Its a pity though that WAR didn't pick up steam.

WTB more threats to Blizz!

Those things were already in development way before WAR presented itself as a threat. These features take a long time to implement, so if they actually waited until WAR beta to start, it would have been too late.

Lol you are entitled to your own opinion I guess

Again.. LoL..

Start from AoC, people QQ about WoW and were so excited bla bla bla bla bla, then come back to WoW..

Warhammer, QQ again about WoW is dying, then the wind blows away again.. You could see the Warhammer thread in lowyat no activity de after the "new fresh feel" gone..

Now AiON, I've seen the video on youtube, the priest is freaking amazing casting his so called "heal and shield" I don't know if I could stand playing it.. I mean it.. LoL.. The PvP was so amazing with wings chasing people around and I fall asleep watching it.. The skill animation for each class is so "anime-like" was so hilarious I could "cleave" him dead if he is in WoW b4 his skill animation ends..

Seriously, this AiON mmo looks dead to me already.. Freakin rubbish..

2) and here i am thinking the WoW threads are dying, lol.

3) the flying pvp bullshit was actually quite entertaining imho. wait till you watch the "professional" "arena" pvp videos lol. 2 guys running in circles for minutes chasing each other. fun.

all said and done, its a korean mmorpg, nuff f***en said.

Whats with Koreans obsession with unnecessary long winded flashy casting animations?

Almost every Korean mmorpg i have seen have casting animations that would put Sailormoon's transformation to shame.

Who cares, Aion has really beautiful characters with wings, unlike WoW. For example:

LOl. the best thing frm korea was RO. LOL then f2p frm maple start taking over coz its f2p. my 1st mmo was RO. i cant believe i paid to play it if i have the option to play WOW at tht time. honestly, i think f2p games sux.

is aion gonna be f2p or p2p?

Lol sounds a lot like WoW's arena. Healers and Pillars

The general chat is filled with WoW players. It's like non-stop comparison with WoW and WoW jargon. LOL!

YOU'RE DOIN ET WRONG

---

Added on September 29, 2009, 3:55 amumm. good one.

---

Added on September 29, 2009, 3:57 amnow we're on that page, imagine this:

1) virtually no snares
2) the bollywood chasing lasts well over 5 minutes AT LEAST (at least they're flashy. you know, wings and pew pew effects, right?)

This post has been edited by Quazacolt: Sep 29 2009, 03:57 AM

IMHO - WOW - has content worth reading n lore game play rocks too.

AION - another mindless korean grinding game which requires little or no reading. for ppl who dun L2R. lol

spent around 5 hours (i can't sleep, must be caffeine running low) lurking in some forums and i noticed Aion are having issues that hit wow earlier during starting phase: long queues, gold sellers and half automated macros for ez-mode play/ bots for auto grindfest.

from chat with a fren that quit wow that refuse to give me his gold this early morning (like 5am), he mentioned blizz had revamped portions of it's macros and game play to let user interact more with the game (except paladin that lets people alt tab for pr0n), banning bots/ gold sellers during vanilla

i think the following month will be crucial for NCsoft to keep their servers from the usual MMO plagues (especially bots and 'ni hao') at minimum level on US/EU servers to keep the players confidence level up.

I don't think bots are their main focus atm. They are rushing servers to cope with the demand and other technical problems (their forum still doesn't allow them to post officially yet, in-game chat is a headache, imagine private stores causing queuing problem where they now limit it to 30 min of the private store being open, EU servers in US still).

One thing that they did very well was the open communication with the problems and ETA via Twitter. They don't always reply every single query but some they do.

I think with WoW, yes, it sounds like vanilla launch but unfortunately, they do not command the respect that Blizzard does so players may not be willing to wait 3-4 months for them to sort things out.

yea. i bet aion is ur typical good vs evil game, u know the common plots. wow's story line is really good. remember cabal? theres a quest where u have to read through called old man's romance. and they ask questions based on what he said. pages longgggggggg and really a drag i ended up guessing answers. really stupid. how many people actually read through the quest before they accept it? i know i dont unless im stuck, but thanks to qh, i hardly ever read.

imo RO brought a very interesting castle raid sys (minus potion spam)
multiple castles, only open for taking/defending during limited duration of the week, each castle having their own instance & unique loot... etc

if wintergrasp (or to an extend warhammer sieges) used that concept, i think things will play out very differently.

This post has been edited by fr0sti3: Sep 29 2009, 05:07 PM

Good news, looks like they add another server to a total of 13. The new server I think is Fregion. Other than Guild Wars which I played for 3 months I can say this has some quality but switching over is impossible. I still need more gears for Arthas.

But yeah it is very amusing all supposedly WoW killer never really been able to reach 20 servers. So what is next in line? SWTOR?

Why does it matter how many servers a game has? A game can have 1 server and have the capacity of ALL WoW servers, does that mean it has less people playing cos it's ONE server? Don't think so.

i think the only wow killer is the american government, coz they would want to break wow's monopoly on on9 gaming =0

Not unless they decentralize their servers all round the globe (at least some for Asia regions), or else we will all suffer from bad latency issues.

the best thing about Blizzard - Not only they try hard to improve their own game, but they learn from others and even make better versions of it

You can clearly see how WoW evolve throughout the years - from a mostly PvE gameplay with a scary 40 man requirement raid, to a full fledge PvE Raid content for hardcore raiders and serious Arena for PvP junkies.

But while satisfying the hardcore players. they never forget those 'not l33t' players - you have battlegrounds, regular/heroic dungeons, daily quests that not only gives you fun; but also gearing up while you do it; making the transition to raid/arena much easier

and World PvP like Wintergrasp spices things up - you literally saw your whole server population fighting over this 'tiny' castle for both loot and buff

and lets not forget Achievements - as much as i hate how some players abuse this 'stat', it is a nice thing to see your hard work gets rewarded. Or how it makes you try something you never thought you can do - like Glory of the Hero/Raider?

and the latest expansion are coming with even more new things and changes - like how Fishing is going to be changed to be more like Animal Crossing

we might be even seeing Warhammer's RvR siege battles in WoW someday!

aion might not be a good game, but i don't think i can stand playing wow anymore. after doing 7 seasons of arena(minus season 4) the game has gotten really stale for me. i don't pve much and there deosn't seem to be much new pvp content coming in 3.3 or even the expansion, i think my time in wow will finally come to an end this time for good. i'm gonna give aion a shot, if it's bad i don't think i'll return to wow, probably gonna just quit MMOs for a while till a good one comes out.

agreed. they should have servers scaterred all over asia. specifically singapore. but if they do tht, i will miss my american friends tho

don't worry about it.. when tmnet screw up, even nearest game hosted in malaysia or singapore get screw up too, so it's no different at all xD

I think all these so called "WoW Killers" are created by the players. I dont think any developers will call themselves WoW Killer.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinions. Its the different market that each game caters to. Remember how WoW changed from 40man to 25man? Everything is tailored according to their market. I'm pretty sure there are some Chinese games we have never heard of and if you ask the players they will say WoW sucks.

WoW is still grinding just that its a different type of grind. There is no MMORPG that doesnt require grind or you having to do something repeatably. WoW just changed it to another form of grinding. Can we really say dailies arent grind?

WoW started off with quite little PvE instances as well and i'm sure a lot of players here dont even know what is DM west,east, north and DM arena and it was introduced quite late after WoW launched.

So i'm just saying no need to judge every other games out there. WoW is 5 years old and developed by Blizzard and Warcraft series was already a very well known and accomplished game at that time. Blizzard has the funds and manpower/knowledge on how to make good games.

Dailies are a grind, but it isn't forced upon you. It's a very very small part of the game, and most of us only do dailies when we reach max level, so it's not grinding to level anymore. It's grinding to stay competitive with the loot and gold.

Its still the same if we put it this way.

Leveling isnt forced upon you as well, if we look at Warhammer, we can say you can choose not to do PvE in order to level fast instead you can just continue grind PvP and stay competitive at lower tier. Nobody force anyone to reach max level in Warhammer

People grind to level in order to stay competitive as well. Hardcore gamers will grind in order to reach highest level the earliest. Remember the DK who got rollbacked? Otherwise, we can choose to play casually and enjoy the game while leveling slowly. Some grind certain mobs or zones over and over again for loot. Its all personal preferences again.

No MMORPG can avoid grinding. Like i said earlier, WoW is just another form of grinding in disguise. Some games like Warhammer really had the intention and concept to be successful but it was executed badly probably in a rush.

We have to admit WoW really did set a standard for the future MMORPG to follow which is why many players will just go back to WoW after a while...they just dont have the patience like 5 years ago when they started WoW as they had not much other choices to choose from at that time

Anyway, WoW storyline isnt superb. It was good when it started and imo it has started to get ridiculous since BC launched. Story wise, there are some other MMORPGs that might be better such as DDO

WoW strongest points i believe would be endgame raids and the game can be easily picked up by new players. Aion has a very tedious gathering and crafting system where new players might be discouraged to level it

WoW will get extremely addictive once you devote your life to it. When one devote his life to WoW, no other MMORPGs will appeal to him till he burn out. This applies for every MMORPGs in the market

i devoted my life to ro and maple, before i realised they are money sucking games especially ms where those tht has extra money get better stuff thn those who do not pay. ro is botting alll the way. but wow is different its a really dynamic game tht constantly changes.

Given the discussion here, I think this blog discussing WoW (which I've been playing for 2+ years) and SWTOR(eagerly anticipating this) and basically dissecting if the two really are direct rivals?

http://darthhater.com/2009/09/30/swtor-vs-...ally-a-rivalry/

End of day, WoW of today is waaaay different from Vanilla. WoW evolved over time to what it is today. Other new MMO's often are just rushed too fast into retail before being actually being ready. Which usually ends up with lots of complaints, QQ's etc from people who start playing & have some sort of WoW experience.

SWTOR will have the hardcore SW fans & then the numerous MMO gamers looking for the next big thing. SWTOR seems to be leaning towards more story & character based progression playstyle than WoW's Raiding & PvP focus.

Let's just hope Bioware doesn't succumb to pressure to release an incomplete game to retail too soon!

Cheers!

lol, so you're limited to play non-end game content if you dont grind. yeah, it isnt forced upon you, but if you're paying your subscription to 'enjoy' lowend content, compared to say, WoW, where you dont get forced to and you still get to enjoy end game content... obvious, right?

see what i just did there? comparing warhammer with WoW.
forget about it, futile.

---

Added on October 3, 2009, 1:14 amdevelopers and publishers need money, anyone can succumb to money. Blizzard is already established with games like sc/d2/war3, and blizzard's way of making games gives their fans a lot of confidence and in return, said confidence is given back to the devs so that they know fans will still buy/play their game. and such they can avoid the usual "preasure" other devs/publishers face.

granted, blizzard has been abusing said "trust" over time in WoW, then again, if you compared to everyone else, they are still at the top. think of it as screamyx. they arent good, but compared to everyone else, you're better off with them.

This post has been edited by Quazacolt: Oct 3 2009, 01:14 AM

for one who played warhammer and wow, i would agree on warhammer's concepts...
they got everything right, until when its time to implement it then the lag ruined it...
if it is not good, WoW would not have copied so much from warhammer...
heck into cataclysm would have some ideas originated from WAR such as guild lvling gystem...

pvp wise, warhammer's pvp is much better if u are looking for casual open world time...
too bad the lag and the lack of end game content on launch for the hardcore kills off the game...
the whole hype given to it before release was justified to me...

IMO, grind is very subjective. End game raids isn't grinding, not until the time comes when I only need a few more upgrades from this dungeon and it never drops. I have went for 5 weeks without any loot. The frustration can build up heaps but then on the 6th week, I got a BIS drop and everything feels fun again.

Dailies shouldn't be a problem with Blizzard adding new dailies every content patch. I think the problem comes when people does 25/25 dailies everyday.

we'll see how things goes, but so far WoW is definitely leading on the MMO pack

contenders are bound to come up - thats for certain

but so far none have got close

lol i only do 2/25 XD

End game is never grinding, cos even if you don't get loot, others will. It's a team thing. Just because you don't get loot doesn't classify it as a grind =)

But yes, I've done SWP for AGES and everytime the polearm drops off the trash, someone else gets it. And then on the day WotLK was released, the trash decided to drop 2 polearms in 2 pulls....

ah yes - the miracle of RNG

just drives u nuts, aint it?

and you dont have to deal with that on pvp looting. unless you wanna count vaults, but then again thats a grayline between pvp and pve

being in a guild, there is no need for RNG...
EPGP ensures every1 get gear up...

only under 1 condition - you have enough 'points' to buy your stuff

or the other 9/24 guys liked you enough to let you have your stuff

being in too much raiding guilds, i have enough bad blood experiences when comes to guild run item looting - 80% of the time, drama ensues and next, the guild splitted

systems like DKP or the new KARMA was 'meant' to help - but it actually creates more drama, where some guy with a hidous amount of points can undercut another that actually needs the upgrade

of course, i'm not saying all guild are like that - but these are some basic knowledge one should at least aware off before you decide to dedicate your time to constantly raid with your guild of choice

what u mention is DKP...

EPGP works differently (go have a look at the whole theory about it)...
there's a decay of EP with a fixed value of GP on various gears...
so u can't hogg ur points forever saving for something (of course u could but the nett loss in gears is much more that any sensible person would mind) or undercut by bidding more points...

as for the drama u mentioned, if the undergeared guy jz waited a bit more then it would be his turn and every1 gets gear...
u dun expect to be new in the guild with a low EP/GP and yet wants loots that are an upgrade for u...
unless of course u alone can carry the rest in a fight which u can't...

This post has been edited by evofantasy: Oct 5 2009, 01:15 PM

you missed out: "if item drops or not" <-- biggest RNG factor (the rest you've listed arent really RNG as it can be controled)

unless ur guild is unable to down the same boss consistently every week, that is not a factor...
as currently, there is no RNG algo to date...
all u get is a pseudo-RNG algo which sooner or later would cross that vector for that loot...

Would the EPGP decay be punishing for raiders who want to spend but their gears just won't drop?

u gain EP when u participate in raids (kills, on time etc)
u gain GP when u get a loot (each item have its own GP value)

loot is given based on the highest EP/GP...
only EP would decay (10% per week for my guild)...

so let say: -
A = 2000ep 400gp (5)
B = 2000ep 500gp (4)
thus if a decay of 10%;
A = 1800ep 400gp (4.5)
B = 1800ep 500gp (3.6)

thus on the decay, A loosed 0.5 while B looses 0.4...
so it does not promote points hogging...
A still have the higher EP/GP and would get the next loot so it is not really punishing for him and over the long run, everything would even out...

loot are given out to the highest EP/GP...
there's no such thing as bidding by offering more...
so ppl can't actually 'spend' their points...
this is not a currency like DKP where u can go bidding frenzy and dramas trying to get the other to bid more dkp than u...

sigh.

there is a big difference in terms of RNG and pseudoRNG in comp science...
psuedoRNG tries to mimic RNG over a period and wutever after the period would returning to state 0...
in other words, psuedo RNG is not random at all...

/sigh @ the nerd explaination that is needed to be given

that condition is kinda like pre-built - one doesnt even need to mention it, coz drops are always RNG based

just like how hard u tried to get that epic axes from the place, but it never drops - and when it does, ya either aint around, or someone else beats ya to it

systems like DKP, KARMA or evo's EVGP were created to 'maximize' the raid efficiency - as in who's more 'eiligible' for the upgrade, or who would contribute to the raid more if he/she is given the upgrade

there is no perfect system though - so it is always a good idea to at least get to know your raiding guild's rules, so ya dont get shafted/jacked

personally, i find the greed/need rolling system is good enough to handle item distribution - but alas, most ppl hate betting their luck

apparently it isnt so according to someone

mathematicly, you can prove it wrong - why is why we have databases indicating the drop %, like 15% or even 90%

the thing is, sometimes (or most of the time, depending on your personal experience) the bad % takes a higher roll

some say patience is a virtue - it is. then again, running the same place for Nth time cant getting what you want/need can really, really drives you nuts

my worse personal experience would be the staff from heroic oculus - not only it is the only place where the only pre-raid epic spell staff drops, it is also infamous amongst most dungeon goers; despite my personal liking of the instance

i'd say it took me almost 4 months just to get it drop - and thats just a rough estimate

exactly.

where there is no guarantee over a certain factor, it would become a random factor. and the definition of RNG is simple, Random Number Generator, aka that very random factor.

some reading for u since u dun get the difference between RNG and pseudoRNG:-
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Random_number_generation
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pseudorandom_number_generator

and some related concepts that would help u understand better wut i've said
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gambler's_fallacy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gambler's_ruin

again, there is no 'true' randomness for drops in WoW...
the loots would somehow even out in the end when such content is on farm...
have fun theorycrafting about ur loots =p

This post has been edited by evofantasy: Oct 6 2009, 02:20 AM

way to miss the point entirely. here, ill make this simple for you:

can you guarantee me, that if i go kill KT 25 this week, he would drop sinister's revenge, and me rolling a high number winning it against a pug if its being contested? hell, ill make it interesting for you, rm50 to you if i get the dagger, rm50 to me if i dont. dare to take up that bet? lol. i mean, its not random, according to you, right?

dude did u even read wut i wrote in the first place?

i'm talking about being in a guild, not a pug (or a fail pug since u get saved without reaching the boss u need)...
the whole context of not making it a grind in wow = being in a guild that raid the content (thus content on farm after a period)...
why are we even bringing up pugs or even rolls for a guild using effective looting system (unless u wanna be in a guild with rolls and drama)...

over a certain period, the randomness dies down (unless some1 manage to implement a 'pure' RNG algo to be used by blizzard) as u can read from all the links i gave u...
applying such concept while raiding in a guild (good one) would eliminate these 'randomness' and every1 gets the loot they want after a certain period...

seriously /facepalm

This post has been edited by evofantasy: Oct 6 2009, 11:24 AM

more like, did you read what THE REST of us wrote in the first place?

we were talking about how loot is random and it doesnt matter if you're in a guild, having a uber flawless perfect loot distribution system. and yet you decided to be a smart ass and point out something that is incorrect in the first place

why even mentioned about fail pug when ive specifically mentioned 'kill KT 25 this week', which meant (hello?) DOWNING KT and right clicking his sorry ass for epix. the point of even mentioning of rolls is simple, to knock the simple sense of randomness in your head, since you just couldnt comprehend it.

and why even mentioned farming content when in the first place the very essence of it denies your argument of saying loot is not random (which means guaranteed) you wanna start explaining why guild a can get a legendary item on the 1st/2nd kill, while guild b farms it for months and never ever gets it?

if you can never guarantee a specific loot, it is random, no matter how geniusly you're trying to argue it out.

just give up evo. no used explaining to him. WHY?























BECOZ HE CAN tm

so you're saying loot is guaranteed now?

did i?

you've said because i can, which is a piss poor way in displaying your sarcasm, of saying what im saying is false. if what i've been saying is false, that would mean loot is not random.

haha..that made my day already.

---

Added on October 6, 2009, 12:41 pmhaha..that made my day already.

This post has been edited by Perunding: Oct 6 2009, 12:41 PM

loot is guaranteed over a long run being in a guild (not pug) thus not being a 'grind' or QQ i dun get the loot...
seriously u never read the theories i've posted on how things are in a long run?
pseudoRNG repeats itself after a certain period thus breaking the definition of 'randomness' lean towards 'predictability'...
this would only be false if blizzard have a trueRNG algo which does not exist in the current age of computing...

being in a single pug (ur KT-25) where only 2-3 drops over a possible of 10+ dun guarantee u the loot...
but farming the same boss with the same group (a guild) would cross the loot vector (again see the theory i've posted)...
1-3 of the same loot over 10runs...
a good guild raid compo would have 1-3 of those needed the loot as well thus every1 is happy towards the end

u got ur own guild...
u should be aware on how being in a guild makes looting a difference over a pug...
how looting for a guild is consistent over a long run where every1 get gear up for harder content whereas a pug which ppl in/out and every1 wants loot...

both me, perunding and several others are in raiding guilds...
u dun see us with loot problems lol...

i guess knowing how probability, randomness and predictability actually works makes me
dun QQ over randomness when being consistent beats psuedoRNG...
if not, ppl wont bother posting drop % when it is random...
pure/true randomness dun work the way...

i guess he can™ change psuedoRNG into trueRNG...

keyword: over a long run, period

This post has been edited by evofantasy: Oct 6 2009, 02:14 PM

My guild was farming KelThuzad for quite a while. Like months at that time? My dkp was like 1000 more than the rest because I was saving it for The Turning Tide. Never seen it drop.

Got firesoul from Leviathan 10man on the 2nd week of Ulduar's release and, although it isn't as good, but good enough for me to not meet KelThuzad ever again lol.

months as in how long?
if u follow the gambler's ruin, every week would have an equal chance of dropping the loot and not getting it this week would not mean u getting it next week at a higher probability...

dont know bout you, but my biggest pain of RNG was binding from molten core. i wished it never ever drop even for a single binding. so i wouldnt ever have hoped to get thunderfury >.>

said binding is still in my bank... never had the courage to delete it... LOL