Thanks, will try to be there and I haven't been there before? Maybe GPS will lead me to Jalan Pasar....
cos I just love electronics items....appreciated

This post has been edited by West Wing: May 17 2009, 08:50 PM

100% agree but if you disagree and unhappy with the presnt President and BOD for their "tidak apa" attitude , try kick them out first as it is to the best of our interest that we are united as one. Too many Assoications in one town will create unnecessary problem and opinions and thus will create problems and trouble when wnat to negotiate with the authorities. First, localise and unite all BHs in your area as unity is strength.

Presently, most towns have own Associations to represent BHs but whether they are effective or not, that's the question. Join and if you and your fellow ranchers/sanctuaries providers find them useless or not doing enough, hold a EGM and request a change of leadership but if fail, then, the second option, form a new Association but do it with sincere and true heart in wanting to help fellow ranchers.

In my opinion, BH association must not only look after the welfare of the members but also to take in to consideration of the town as a whole. Please remember that we have right but others too have right and everytime must be win win in everytime we do......like I always advocate and preach to my fellow BH owners but still we have some black sheeps who never stop to annoy neighbours with their loud sound day and night. It give us so much headache until that we are even force to report to the authorities to keep them on their toes. Better we report then to let others report, then at least the authorities know that we do care and our neighbours are happy that we are concerned and care about them, too.

As usual, my humble opinions on the matter and hope all share my view on these.

Since this is a forum on perfecting BH meaning creating a artificial sanctuary as close to the natural environment for swiftlet but must be man friendly, too so I shall forward my share of idea in the construction of BH. Please remember that what are posted here are only my view and belief and have no ill intention.

I shall talk about roving area as alot of siwftlets lovers here talk about. To me, a roving area maybe the sky and that to me is the best of all roving area cos it's big and is natural and free. Having a roving area is only require if your birdhouse need one or otherwise the whole BH can be a nesting area. Roving area is like a boarding area for air plane where you all wait for the plane to be ready it is a waste of area but then, you need it to ensure all goes well before you all enter the plane as not to have a last minute delay.

So is our roving area, it is to ensure perfection for the nesting room. An area where the birds may build up confidence and feeling relax before really trying out your nesting area. I usually do not have a specially build roving area in my BH as I need to see if I need one or not by observing the feed back that I get from my finding on the area next to the entrance where all roving room are and the tell tales of the birds. After that, I might just decide to make one. In fact most of my modification of BH (I don't call my designs as I build my BHs in Buildings @ town that cannot satified my full inspiration of a prefect BH), the entrance area is my roving area where the birds initially will fly in and out or circle round and round. Once they are use to the internal area, the nest area become their roving area as well, they will circle and play there as well as make babies and nests.

That's a idea for those who have limited area and still thinking a good roving area which will used up alot of precious area.

Not that I am saying that I am right but that I maybe greedy and to fully utilised all the available area.

Like to add a little more to what I have posted that we need to set up a local town Association to keep peace and have a sort of Fast Action Force similar to SEAL force, a quick action group that can jump into action without waiting for the national body to take action which by the time, we are already dead and gone and by then Nothing worth saving . Chinese saying " Far water cannot save near fire".

Start your own town Association and also unite under a state and national umbrella Association, giving the National Association the strength and power to negotiate and represent us in the national level; provided always that the national level Association leaders are not sitting on their big A** only.

Above are my own suggestion if you agree or concurred.

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Added on May 19, 2009, 5:26 pm1.Can someone teach me how to place pictures at the forum? It don't work with copy and paste, right? Please remember that what I know about posting @forum started with swiftlets and before that, nothing @ forum concern me, only fellowship as WW stand also for Wine and Women, no offend if any lady viewing my posting, HaHa Ha just joking....me, honest and clean man.

This post has been edited by West Wing: May 19 2009, 05:42 PM

Lucas is correct as far as I do know cos I have advocating open roof entrance from day one and even better if your shop lot has a open air well like 10 by 30 feets; that I love the best. Use the air well as the roving area as well and once in the building, you are in business. Consultants normally will encourage dog kernel as they make more money by building one. everything they do, you pay, right?

Open air well does not disturb neighbours or create unpleasant looking structure outside.....same appearance is what the authority wanted. No modification outside. Neighbours can sleep peaceful, you can go on your BH buz happily. Another thing to remember, ensure all existing windows must be sound proof as most of you, newbizs will use internal sound 24 hours non stop but as for me, I never like to use internal sound during the night ans so far I am very successful. Use it and it's OK as long as you don't disturb your neighbours and do remember that walls do carrysound and keep your night internal sound as low as possible for God will need to bless you if you didn't. Amen

As I always advocate that questions should be forward to the forum for all to learn, since you pm me then I need to reply you and I also will like to share my views on your questions here. Any Sifu around at forum will like to add or disagree with my views, please do so as I also learn.........

Answer to a reader @ forum:
From the pictures, your entrances to all floors are OK and now it shall be a matter of tweeters, sound and aroma to attract them to try out your BH. To stay will also depend on your interior like humidity and internal sound and temperature………no unpleasant smell to the birds.

West Wing

Dear friend,

I am still blurred and maybe due to too much of internet at my age......better wait for my children to return for UK this coming july to teach me on the basic of copy and paste.

Anyway, thanks for the advice . appreciated,

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Added on May 20, 2009, 7:04 pmEven we have our local BH Association but I am willing to join National Assoiation for BH.....The reason for local town Association is to take care of our local problems and there are so much like complaints for the public, meeting with the authorities and having trainings, seminars and courses to keep us well informed. There is no where a national association can provide.

By the way, really what are we suppose to do in national level...........joining DL's group or the present one....all please give your comments to share. These are for the future of this loving industry which we all share and wish to continue inrespecting or what the outcome of any unpleasant guidelines that may force us to vacate our BHs.

I love DL for his work for swiftlets and appreciate all he has done and so what you all say............I may end up joining all to be safe for me and my sanctuary for swiftlets whom seem to like me alot and wherever I go, they follow.. #the last few words are just for the joke and don't you believe me..hahahaha

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Added on May 20, 2009, 8:52 pmMany builders think of birds only and forget about themselves which to me is more valuable than the birds. In Dungun, as you all heard that a very rich man fell down because he covered a manhole with wood and over time, the wood gave way, and down he went……I heard that he died on the way to the hospital….even if he live, most of his bones were broken anyway.

Remember, especially the stairway which most of you and birds use for entrance to all floors and most the railings have been removed for better movement for bird but rather dangerous for human, make sure you at least have some sort of stoppers like 2 bricks high to prevent you from slipping and fall. Stairs can sometime very slippery.

Better safe then regret later. Just for thought...

This post has been edited by West Wing: May 20 2009, 08:52 PM

Now for some entertainment on swiftlets. By the way, how many of you haves seen swiftlets making love. I have seen it but then I believe that they are making love in the sky or look like they are doing it but it was so fast ...just few seconds and then they are separated. I think in their mind is only making babies like we human used to say.

Do they have sex in the BH? but I guess not otherwise, the lady bird will scream " You are hurting me with your sharp claws!!!, dear".

I don't know about the negative effect on the birds but I do know about the negative effect on human. Around my area, the residents are up in arm against the telecomunication company trying to install the transmitter up in the area. The owner of the building has recieved so many nasty calls that will cause you sleepy nights. I won't want to offend the residents around my BH area and if the birds keep coming, you really don't want the extra publicity from the transmitter which may cause cancer from the radiation.....

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Added on May 23, 2009, 1:10 pmIf you are looking for "Food Source Generator", I could recomend you one that is free and don't cause you a penny to use. Move a termites hill near to your BH and you will have a life time Swiftlets Food Generator for free. Promised no maintenance and trouble free.

Every time before the rain, just sit and watch the swiftlets go crazy over the sky and I have seen thousands of swiftlets going after flying termites and you need to see it to believe it. If you put the termites hill into your entrance hole, do you know how many birds will fly in and out but then, as in everything, nothing is free and you need to pay; for this time your pay with your meranti planks...hahahaha...just for fun, no offence, pls............

This post has been edited by West Wing: May 23 2009, 01:10 PM

@ this Forum
We share because we care
you learn because we share
All we want from you.........
share and care

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Added on May 24, 2009, 11:29 am
A Eco farm may take about 5 to 10 years to be successful if the Eco Farm can get their supply of new birds from the towns

I maybe a swiftlets protectors but it human life first before swiftlets and this is what I shall recommend if the authorities give a deadline to move, start from that day, make sure that you all do a 45 days cycle and no new birds will fledged and see how the so called Eco Parks going to succeed. With no new birds from the towns, it shall be a black time for any Eco Park to get new bird and in less than a year, most of those new buyers will go busted and the developers will go Bankrupt.

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Added on May 24, 2009, 12:19 pmTHE STAND TAKEN ON THE ISSUE

(The Director General of SFD who is also the Chief Executive of the SFC Datuk Len Talif Salleh stressed that the industry should be developed systematically based on the existing laws.

"Many of those seeking license are in towns which by the definition of the law they do not qualify," said Len Talif adding that the risks of epidemics like bird flu being the reason why the state government does not want to allow swiftlet farming in towns.

There were also complaints from the public on the stench from the bird droppings and the din from the speaker to entice the swiftlets to nest in the farms.

Len Talif also claimed that the setting up of swiftlet farms within towns disrupts business for some especially those in the food business or having stalls near the farms.

"There should not be guideline to setup the birdhouse in town. This contravenes the law," he said adding that the state government will build an eco-park and provide licenses for individuals keen)



Above are from someone who know nothing about swiftlets or someone who has hidden personal agendas. Anyway, God bless his soul if he has any.

This post has been edited by West Wing: May 24 2009, 12:19 PM

[quote=Lucas 1,May 25 2009, 02:15 AM]
"Aiya……..ai………. There gone the 30 plus K ………..and the hope………into the drain.
Looks like the Sarawak owners are not given choice by those corrupted bastards……..Now left with two choices……1) the legal battle…..and 2) the political way.
1) Sarawak owners, our advice is that no point further pleading and kowtows anymore. It is time to really stand up and stand out in unity and pool in funds for a legal battle whether you like it or not. It looks like life or death for your BH business any time as from now. And you have to fight and fight it real hard. Don’t be selfish any more. Hiding behind others for a ride. We understand that many did not pay up as agreed to the previous expenditures of close to a few hundred K incurred. Only a handful foots the bills. All of you have to sit down once and for all and discuss sincerely and urgently as to how to find the best formula to share out the legal fees. This time, you all have to be prepared for a COURT INJUNCTION. Better start preparing now. Don’t get caught like a sitting duck. Or else you shall cry without tears but with bloods. You better believe than not. With the COURT INJUNCTION, you are able to stall them till the next General Election any time in less than a year".

Agreed with you on getting a court injunction on it and battle in out in court and this will buy you time which will be required if you fail to convince the present authorities, you may have time to change the sky if needed. Otherwise, to leave it like this for political changes on the next election, years later, your BHs are already totally demolished and there are nothing to save at all. What the Sarawak BH owners must do are to unite and contribute toward a legal fund and battle it out in court and with so many BH owners and supporters in Sarawak, there shouldn't be a problem at all. Get some sort of a formula like a certain amount per BH and then pay up to a qualified legal firm to prepare for battle on the first battle call.

Meanwhile, those who have contacts with all Societies concerning preventing of cruelty to animals, wild life protection or some similar type of associations to support you on this and apply pressure on the Sarawak Government..........if these societies refuse to help , tell them to go to hell for they are not doing anything to support what they are standing for and only doing all for publicity and trying to get fund from all the Animals loving people all over the world......a cheater and liar, I would say...

THose affected need to take the initiative and if you are not, nobody will care. Again, above are my concerned and any unpleasant remarks or comments are deeply regrettable and obviously unintended at all.

I Luv Swiftlets

This post has been edited by West Wing: May 25 2009, 11:28 AM

I received questions for a reader who PM me to asked about Planks in the BH and his diagram show all standardised lenght and distance between planks.

My humble answers to his questions are follow:

1. All planks installed must be fitted tight and solid as swiftlets don't just land,, they sometime they hit hard at the plank to gain grip on the plank and if your plank is not stable, the birds will not be able to make a good landing or hook.

2. Really I don't see why do you need the same wide or lenght for all the planks as you are not making it to be nice but pratical and to the birds, any size of sufficient area will be just great.

3. Utilize all planks if it mean to have different size rectangular planks. Doesn't look nice but we are not concerned as our objective to have birds and appearance does'nt matter to the birds and cost factor. Althought, if the cost is the same, then go for all standard size as it will make your work much easier and faster.

4. Size of plank: 4 or 6 or 8 and to me, it all depend on your area like wind and light, height of floor for easy movement of birds. So, if your floor is low, never go for 8 ins plank and most common usage nowaday, is the 6 ins. plank. cos you never go wrong with a 6 ins plank and you do save plank. Personally, I like 8 ins plank if the situation allow as I can have double layer of birdnests...greedy me.

5.I don't like small boxes type as it hinder the birds movement during landing and I always think like a bird when designing a BH and so far I am OK. Distance between planks and that the most argumentative of all, your Sifus may think otherwise, to me I will stick to a min. of 18 ins. and a max. of 20 ins.

I hope that the my above comments satisfied you and if other Sifus will like to add their opinions or comments, I will be most happy to learn. As usual, here we share information and understandings of swiftlets and hope others do feel the same and share their ideas and information to the betterment of all swfitlets sanctuaries. May we all be rich and wealthy plus birdnests bring us good health and long life, too.

I have known the PM personally since he is from Pekan, my home town and then, my father was then the chairman of the MCA and was very closed to his father Tun Razak.

Because of these, readers will say that I angkat kaki when I spoke good about him but at least he is the most kind of all PM to our industry. He back us up at state and federal lever but then, in most of our postings here, we hit him hard and hope that doesn't change his support for the industry esp in the towns.

Give him some space and let preform for this term and then we decide whether that we shall give anothe 5 years of mandate or not. BN under M really have kill us and nobody has complaint and not that he allow all to make freedom, everybody hit him like nobody's buz, do you think you will get such from M..............he has been losting enough sleep and do you think that he drop dead will be nice? Actually, he is of the same age as me but we are not classmate nor schoolmate because his father was PM and could offord to send him far away to be educated........

If we keep hitting him from head to toes and putting him on the defensive on all sides, if the country wil to become the unexpected or worst, we are to be blamed, too.
I believe that he know what went wrong and maybe trying to correct past leaders' mistakes, give suggestions and recommendations and he need to hear from the other sides , too.

Sorry about a little politics here......................

This post has been edited by West Wing: May 25 2009, 03:08 PM

As We are taking as if the BHs concern and belong to the Malaysian Chinese and mind you that there other races in the Industry, too. So, we should have encourage our brothers of all races and creeks to help to save our BHs @ town. Chinese chamber, Malay Chamber, Indian chamber or any chamber for that matter, please give us a helping hand for the betterment of the industry, welfare of fellow Malaysian, to prevent of repeated Killing field of swiftlets and economy of Malaysia as a whole.

We are infact one race, Bangsa Malaysian keturunan berlain lain. Chinese tak boleh balik China, Indian tak boleh balik India, Melayu tak boleh balik Indonesia or others , too. But we are special, Ahmad having some chinese blood from his mother, Ali may have indian blood thru his grandfather, Minah maybe the granddaughter of Yap Ah Loy......even some of our PMs and many ministers are descendants of mix Malaysian races.

Once, I was in China and my chinese friend announce that we are one family and I should always return home, a statement which I objected. I question him whether the chinese government consider me as a citizen of China. NO! just a visiting oversea chinese.... as I was born and raise in Malaysia and Malaysia is my home and my country.

As always, the above are my view in the matter and appologies if offended.

One reader Pm me on SS99 that there is She She sound and the seller told him that it is normal and that the bird is OK with the she she sound. I haven't seen ss99 and I believe that the SS99 Amp are the same as others like SS66 or SS88 and they are infact made for human usage but we use them for the birds, right?

So far, among the SS series, I found that the SS66 is cheap, powerful and practical as one amplifier for the whole BH unless you need another one for the night or 24 hours play. So far, so many BHs have been using this model and all are well and running. What's the opinion of our technical sound specialist/sifu comments and advices?

Another small suggestion and not advice, never short the tweeter and better use tweeter capacitor to prevent damage to you amplifier. Once short circuit your tweeter, kaput your Amplifier.

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Added on May 27, 2009, 6:46 pmBy the way, I haven't heard from our Building Engineer Lee lately who was always helpful around here. There are also many formal sifus and great forum friends around not giving guidance and comments these days and I do miss them and their postings and I do think you all share the same feelings.

I normally will try to drop in to all sites of swiftlet to say "Hi" and one of them is Eng. Lee @ http://weloveswiftletfarming.blogspot.com/.........I like his site because it very swiftlet friendly and frank. So, Hey guys....post something for at least we know that you are alive and kicking... hahahahaha sori lah, just joking.

One more word that I would like to add is that I do often offend people which I have no intention of doing so and I do talk too much......pls. bear with me....

This post has been edited by West Wing: May 27 2009, 06:46 PM

At least you are around Hahahaha joking lah cos some of my friends,about age 50's are gone.....nowaday, people kaput very easy like the new cars, new few months car just stop because of electronics failure and must toll back to the **** workshop cos no ABC workshop can repair???? All the high tech nowaday and we, humans are also high tech, very efficient but KO easily and must toll back to the maker also.

Bro, so take it easy with your job and in a few years, your life will be much easier and more relax....with over 10kgs nest per BH........birdnests for breakfast, lunch and dinner, keeping you healthy and young. Chinese used to say "shark fin" but we say, Birdnest for mouth washing.

Old story telling time if you all don't mind.......60+ years ago when the price of rubber was very high, the rubber tappers were so rich that they do not what to do with their money. So, they came out to the town to shop and what happened was that when the shoes was only S5 but they pay $10 thinking that the price is for one shoe and not one pair. They even buy refrigerator thinking that it was for clothing and what's good for refrigerator as all estates have no electricity then. Hope that we one day will be blessed with the wealth from the sky but we certainly won't use fridge for clothing.

[quote=aeiou228,May 28 2009, 01:10 AM]
Pictures of BGB AV-9550 6 channels I've just bought today. SS66 look alike ?

Yeah, it look the same and I believe that it is the same as in OEM using house brand. Must get a few for my BHs for backup.........Thanks alot and still have no time for Pasar street. Any shop in particulal may I ask. We, in BH alway want the better one as we have spend so much money and time in our BH and so we will be looking forward to a brighter and better future. IshaAllah.

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Added on May 28, 2009, 1:14 pmOne Reader so worry about to weakness of planks over time…..my answer to him are as follow and other forum readers welcome to have their comments on the matter

It all depend on how secure your planks are to the ceiling and if you secure it well, there should not be weakness in structure as you mentioned. I rather that you provide enough space for the birds to land and fly………Too small a space will be difficult for new birds to make a safe landing (hooked) and easy flight. Anyway you do, make sure that the planks are secured good. Try bang on the plank with your hand and it shouldn’t vibrate. Remember no space between ceiling and planks, 100% if possible but impossible.

Even if you are using a 20 feets plank, all you need if required is to do is to use “L” metal joints to secure your planks and it should last you for at least 15 years and for every 6 feets to 8 feets, a width plank to make it stronger. Width planks need not be too wide around 18 to 24 inches.
Also remember that the birds will make the planks more rigid with their saliva over the end of the planks as time goes by.

This post has been edited by West Wing: May 28 2009, 01:18 PM

Hey guys, need some help!

Anyone with knowledge about Kelantan's status and how much they are charging for the license for BH matters. Any special conditions as to the application. Our General in action need this information.

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Added on May 30, 2009, 2:55 pmMe no Sifu but your friend in need, maybe.

1. Let begin your problem solving by asking yourself some questions as before anyone can be able to help you, our experts around need to know more as we are no fortune tellers here. Questions and then try to answer them yourself first......

2. Start Day one till now, how the birds reaction to your BH? Giving a brief descriptions of the birds attraction to your BH, birds in the BH, shits and when they started making nests and how and when it happened and when it stopped do so or have you did some modifications before or after you did so modifications.
3. Ask yourself as many questions as possible and maybe, you may not require any help as after you finished with your own lines of questions, you have already know the answers to your problems. Sometime some simple answers we often overlook and we are expecting difficult trouble......I do sometime and I knocked my own head and yelled," How's silly of me"

Hope the above help you in a small way...........anyone Sifu may want to help and give their opinions to assist our friend in need?

# As to your request for CD exchange, PM me although I don't need new sounds but will exchange with you all except the oldest that's my first LOVE. Hahahaha

My motto is one good bird call is worth more than 10 birds calls in the bush.



This post has been edited by West Wing: May 30 2009, 02:55 PM

A reader asked about humidifier and if the humidifier did cause high temperature in BH. My 5 sen tell me that this can only be due to the fact that you use direct water supply as when the weather is hot and the pvc pipe is warm up so instate you are getting cool water, you get warm water. One thing for sure, although warm but high in humidity is better than cold and dry because birds will die in cold temperature and not in warm temperature but must be of good humidity.

To prevent too hot the water and too high the pressure which your Taiwanese humidifier does not require, tap it from the water tank instead of using direct water, thus saving cost in using normal tubing and not the high pressure tubing which is very expensive. You get cooler water and also less pressure plus very cheap hose.

So many years in this field, I have seen birds died in cold condition but not because warm condition but only the nests are very fragile and thin nest. Easily to break and in bad shape only.

Love to hear other comment on the humidifier in BH management discussion.

What's buz other then BH, are you blind (((((sori not intended, just to make the statement sound great like the bird sound))))

BHs bring along so many other down stream businesses that you can never imagine. Contractors/developers and their associated buz like suppliers of building materials. are all good investment as long as BHs allow to flourish. What's about electrical, electronic in concerning BH, security and maintenance field.....infact, alot of business opportunities come with this swiftlets which is worth investing and many have make million building houses, renovating buildings, consultancy, suppliers and just name a business which is not making money with this industry. Insurance agents, financial companies and brokers and what have you.....and govt are banking in this industry....it is the industry that will able to hold and withstand even during the worst recession, bad or good time.......it was infact this industry that help our building industry to get back on its feet during the last glut of properties market....but we the BH industry buy up all unused, unsold or out of place buildings and convert them into profitable business......so no developers gone bankrupt and infact improve their sales, volume and prices, too.

So as we, the birdhouse owners pray for the betterment and increment of swiftlets and nests, the other involved business partners like the building industries should also pray for the future of our BHs for should we sail well and prosperous so will they.

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Added on June 1, 2009, 12:52 pmSince we are talking about buz, I approached a friend to sell his BH for Rm$4,000,000 (just love to put the zeros down) and he refused. What if he agree, do you know how much I would make from the sales commission, a cool Rm$80,000. just for asking for someone to sell. How can a person refused 4M for a BH that he bought @ 1.5M 2 years ago, that's I can't understand, too.........I rather go into broker buz instate of doing my own BH but then I do love the birds.

This post has been edited by West Wing: Jun 1 2009, 12:52 PM