Alhamduellah, till now, we are all well as Malaysia is full of natural resources
but all these years they have been spoon fed and one day will come and not so far away, when all natural resources gone and the coffer empty, the time will come when they have to find food and fend for themselves and that's the time, doom days will begin.

They have no experiences and knowhow as so far when they fall down, the father (Gov) lift them up and fall again and lift again and again and again.
So, one day when your sons wake up cos it won't happen in your time I hope, they will be told that we are to be blamed for all evils and all unfortunate and misfortune that behold on them. In their eyes, we are always the reasons for their failure and not the ones that spoon feed them so that they do not know how to fish but eat only. The Gov know well that by spoon feeding them, they will always at their mercy cos they do not know how to find food themselves. That's clever politic, my friend and as long as we have wealth to spoon feed and all good will come to an end, and so I beg them to allow BHs to flourish as this may be their only venue to get the wealth when oil and gas gone and so for us to save our investments and that of future generation.

Once, I lost a buz after many years of cooperation with a company and the purchasing head told me that my services are the best but then directive is to give the orders to orang kita....bukan kita semua sama orang kita , bangsa Malaysia. From that day onward, I know that I am just came to realise that I am just an adopted son, anak angkat bukan pendatang.

My advice to the Gov. now is that no matter how late or too long these methods must stop so that we all as Malaysian can stand up to fight, hand in hand irrespective of color, creek or religion armed with confidence and "Boleh" with own abilities and not fall back to demand your rights, your shares and your everything as if the rest are thieves or robbers that steal from you. Where can we all join forces and beat the world. Let start with the BHs and all will gain when the day comes, Malaysian can stand tall and sing " We are the champion of the World" to the world .......... the world biggest producer of BirdNest. Ishaallah.

I humbly apologies for any mistakes or abuses if any.

Coming back to more serious matter, has anyone any news about the new national guidelines from Jabatan Perancangan Bandar & Desa and that according to my source, it sound really bad for the town BHs. One point highlighted in the GL is that all BHs must be moved in 3 years.

Anyone has any information on the new National guidelines from JPB&D will be appreciated......if it's true, then all efforts made by DL in Kedah will come to nothing unless Help arrive before the gazetting. Any information from the Malaysian National Association for Swiftlets.....

Yes, Dato T has also informed me that guidelines from Jabatan Perancangan Bandar & Desa need further study but will still be under the same Jabatan.

Many thanks to the Dato and his team and also the Minister involved to be able to prevent it. Hopefully, all will be well.

As I am unable to help as the rules changes so fast for me and I feel so useless and therefore, I has withdraw renomination for the President of my local Swiftlets Association during this week AGM. Now I will be able to have good night sleep........hope that the new President can do a better job like ensuring that our local BHs are all safe and well.

As president of any Association, he must put members before oneself as to act otherwise or in bad faith will be an act of treason to the trust and faith given to him by the members.

Again, above are my own comments only.

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Added on March 28, 2009, 11:32 amAlso, all BHs must be very successful as there are not question on the problems of BHs, everyone must have been very successful with their BHs.....Syabas, maybe we shall talk on how to get a better price or how to sell our birdnests.

Anyone has bright idea? As for here, our Association has organised talks on how to export nest to China and lately, on how to process nest the right way....and from their feedback, all participants are happy and we are glad.

Have anyone know of any course on how to convince the government on allowing BHs @ towns................

Some points to share when dealing with the local authorities.
1. We move but the birds stay.
2. How to move
3. Eco farms will be a failure without the town's BHs as the towns produce 80% of the new birds so where to find birds for the new eco farms.
4. Since town produce 80% of the nests, we are going to lose the industry as a whole.
5. The complaints from others can be solved by local BH Association having dialog with the MPK/people concerned. The only complaints receives are from the tweeters which can be corrected.
6. Another, no diseases are transmitted by the swiftlets and most of the diseases are from pigeons and othere birds as the swiftlets do not touch the ground.
7.Also, Dengue cause by mosquitoes but each swiftlets take in hundreds of mosquitoes a day, thus helping to rid of the Mosquitoes carry diseases.
So, all forum participants should add more to the lists for all concerned to forward to the authorities.

Again, above are my own view on the subjects.

This post has been edited by West Wing: Mar 28 2009, 12:02 PM

In my opinion, we have with us many readers from all walk of life including those who are involve in the setup of any guidelines. Also, we have many of the Bumi swiftlets groups with their members whom some are maybe government officers and even YBs or VIPs who are very effective with the government and they will be able to apply leverage to support us.

So, by giving them pointers on the swifltets industry, I hope that they understand and will be able to forward our views better for what they lack are knowledge and experiance in the industry.

As always, above are my sincere suggestions and hope someone out there have better suggestion or idea.......better do it now than regret later.

I believe that we have with so many experts in almost all fields and they may contribute to the future of swiftlets' sanctuaries in town.

Since we do not know what will become and when it will begin or how it will happen but if we are informed on how and what to do if thing really turn sour....at least we know how to react fast and effective to save our life time saving and our children's education dreams. Some even of early retirement...need not wait until our house on fire then we look for well.

Thanks for all those who have help to preserve the BHs in towns and I wish them good health, good life and good fortune.

If you ever read from western websites on swiftlets, they ar against harvesting birdnests and will tell their readers to boycott birds nest because the cave swiftlets population is falling due to over harvesting of nests and killing off the chicks and eggs.....and here come the savers in the form of BHs in towns, increasing the population of swiftlets to the present level.

If we leave them to the state government of Sarawah, the swiftlets may be extincted in Malaysia's caves because of the high price of the cave nests but due to the fact that the public now accept the nests in town as par with the Cave type, the price of Cave Nests are even lower than the Town's nests. The reason because the cave nest need bleeching and difficult to harvest and now facing lower price than that of the town nest. I have a guy calling me all way from Sabah offering me cheap cave nests. Thinking that I can make profit, I phone up some cleaners and none are interested at all.

The Authorities now inform us that the Indonesia are now facing a drop in swiftlets population and they blamed all with the lack of food. Bullshit, all due to 45 days cycle now very popular among the BHs as this method provide the best birdnests and that fast recovery of the investment.

The problem will be that there will be no increment of new birds but the profit will maintain for at least for 6 to 8 years until most of the old birds are to old to reproduce and that the end of the swiftlets.

Luckily, we still have many swiftlets breeders or I would rather called Sanctuary providers which the swiftlets can safety lay their eggs and multiply. Previously, I did proudly told the new investors in the buz that I contribute to their success and alot of their birds are from my BH as my one BH can produced 24,000 birds per years enough for all the new BHs around my area.

Moving swiftlets need foster parent like swallows by throwing away swallows eggs, won't that be a sin or crime to murder the off spring of another species just to justify our hunger for money. Hand feeding, absurd as we really think that we are doing something right...I sincerely think that we are very wrong. Why swiftlet do not carry virus as they do not touch the ground but now by hand feeding and rearing swifltets, we are transmitting the virus by food to the swiftlets. One wrong incident will put all BHs to extinction.

Never play God as we believe in God. Allow nature to do its part.....I prefer to be called a provider of sanctuary for swifltets and I can demand my right to take the used nests as a payment for my services. Although the fee is high but then taking care of swiftlets is no easy job...for me at least.....ha.ha.ha.

Get any Government representative to talk to me on how they can successfully move all the swiflets to eco parks and I will show him my middle finger before I speak. Sorry for my bad manner.

Again, above are all my personal feelling for the swiftlets and have not intetion of hurting anyone at all.

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Added on March 30, 2009, 4:52 pmIf you ever see what the sky over the Sarawak's caves like say 15 years ago and now, you will see white spotted sky now but a black sky then. Millions and millions or swiftlets zooming into the cave during the evening but now, just like my kenching, sedikit lalu sedikit sahaja. Ask the East Malaysia harvesters on how much they collected then and now.....

Moving maybe possible or maybe fail but you need 10 years to find out if you are successful and also, some source of providers of swiftlets but then if you killed all swiftlets @ towns , where to get your supply...importing the eggs or chicks from Indo or Thai. But if all my neighbouring BHs follow my method of harvesting, I can assure them of the black (golden) sky in future like they saw at Sarawak 15 years ago, Ishaallah.

This post has been edited by West Wing: Mar 30 2009, 04:52 PM

Hey, I know you too well to think of you like that, bro.

No worry, just in case anyone has wrong infos so we need get matter right.

Let discuss about swiftlets cases

A friend whom I am guiding since he re-renovated his BH after a failure to get any bird after 3 years took me out for a coffee talk. Since he has followed my advice, he is very happy with his result of over 500 nest after over one year and the number keep increasing.

The reason for his visit was that his BH is a 4 story building and using an open roof type but these few days, alot of birds returning and many were trying to enter his 2nd floor back wall window and hitting at the window doing it.

Wonder why, my feeling is that since his next door BH has an back wall open window type and the new birds returning mistook his BH as his neighbour's. So, they are trying to enter.

I jokingly suggested that he move out of the building to allow his neighbour new birds to fly in thru his window to make their new families there.

What's your comments or what do you think has happened?

Hope the best for your project and that you can truly succeed in all that you all have said. With all these taking about mass moving swiftlets to another location are hurting the investment of the BHs in town, just that I truly believe you all understand.

Like to share a joke here....many years ago, a doctor just started a BH for a few month, I asked him on how was his BH and he replied that his BH has only one black bird, two eggs and a 1 kilo nest. With these words,he pointed to his pant and said, "there my black bird and the two eggs and look at the ceiling of my shop and you will see the 1 kilo nest. Doc.!, you crazy and I just walked away.

So, I shall be looking forward to your one kg nest and even a 20 grams would be nice.

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Added on April 2, 2009, 3:21 pmOyes, one thing that I wish to know if you are cross breeding swiftlet ans swallow should be impossible as they are of differently genes. Sorry for my lack of understanding on this science and maybe you are talking of selective breeding of the fittest or the biggest.

Another question, if the bird is to produce a huge 35 gms nest, wouldn't it take a very long time and maybe this time really blood nest will be produce due to over stress/overwork or to the last drop. Apologies if wrong as I really know nothing about the birds and the bees in swiftlet and hope someone really can enlighten us on the topic.

This post has been edited by West Wing: Apr 2 2009, 03:21 PM

If it is April Fool joke, then it is a joke with bad taste.....as many are watching us and if they are taking that as the truth, then all are habis. I sincerely hope that it is a April Fool Joke as I don't like to pass bad or unfriendly comments on friends postings.

Sometime when we play with fire, we get burned accidentally. The government will wish to move the BH out of town to save unnecessay complaints from the anti Swiftlets group and relocating swiftlets is not an impossible thing to do but it take years and alot of trials and errors...... it is just like if you lift a successful BH on to a giant trailer and move it a few meter away each day toward your destination; I believe that you will successful in shifting your BH to a new location.

About BHs...........
Initially, all BHs need all the right things to get good results but when your BH become successful, none of the so called Sounds, Aroma or conditions sometime aren't important all. The swiftlets just built their nest there irrespective of no anything and you may even switch on your light and they still produce nests. Once, my roof leaks and some of the nest are totally wet but they still build nest there..

Even if Bh has no sound as the tweeters are rusty and the amplifier is out of order. The humidifiers are damaged but the population keep increasing. The swifltets produce their music and the only the nests qualities are poor and out of shape. After Thousand, we maintain, service or renovate old BHs because we want quality nests.

Also, unless the new PM has a change of heart, he can be considered Pro BH from what I heard from an Pahang Exco many months ago.

Above are some of my experience to share.

As more BHs are built on land out of town, the more are favouring the relocation of BHs but we move but will the birds move.....no way and even if they fly away, do you think that the eco park nearest will get all the birds........ only fools will think like this.. con by the Eco Conman. Any experienced man will tell you that you can attract only new birds. Old birds will remain will try to enter the same building even if you seal off the entrance hole.


Those who have bought Bhs @ Eco park or standalone BHs are experiencing lack of birds or no bird. My advice to them is go begging to those TaiKo @ Town nearby to allow their birds to breed or otherwise you will need much longer time to be successful. Can't blame them all together as they are scare and wanting to get maximum income before if the sky fall down. Give the BHs owners @ town peace of mind and assurance that their BHs@ town will not be demolish will help to bring the inspiration of the nation to be the no.1 producer of birdnest in the world. Ishaallah, we will.

WARNING

I was a successful businessman before the swifltets fever but then since the fever strike, I spend more and more time with my birds than my buz and my buz is hurting......to quit buz and go 100% on swiftlets or to quit swiftlets and return to my buz.

Many BHs owners I believe are having or getting the high fever too and I must remind you all new incomers to beware of the swifltet's fever and you may be unconsciously fall in love with the swiftlets and forget all your buz or occupation plus your wives and that's very dangerous. Like I am spending so much time with the birds, for the birds, and even internet on line, on sites, blogs and bla bla all concerning the birds.

Many of those recently started BHs out of town are spending so much time there and even spending nights there even mosquitoes are no more a problem. Leaving their businesses to wives, relatives or employees to look after their shops or businesses. Beware and don't fell in love with the swiftlet too early as it really take some time before your BHs earn enough revenue to cover all your expenses. Don't be like me !!!!!!!...but at least my BHs are always nearby in town.

Even my wife is complaining and I don't know about you guys but I must try to see a specialist to see whether I am getting crazy or not.

HaHaHa sound crazy don't I

I share you same fate as the office on the mezzanine floor below my BH are all moldy and smelly and I just don't know what do do.
Previously, the building formally housed Maybank and for that reason all the floor are full of cables, wires and what have you. Now, I just don't know what to do but just turn off the humidifier temporary until I find a good but cheap solution for the problem and meanwhile let the problem stay.

I am now considering mist maker instead of humidifier which doesn't wet the floor. Anyone here having any success with the mist maker.....like the one that Nest tech sell with oscillating disk providing very high vibration.

So, before you renovate your Building in town to BH, make very sure that you first solve of the floor's problem or otherwise, you may get sued by the shop owner below for damages............ and to take care of the floor's leaking problem, we need expert's view like Mr. Engineer Lee or others here.

As all our feet are wet in this industry, we must support the leader who has us at heart......since our PM has openly encourage BN industry and he allows BH in towns, we need to support him for our future. If we elect the opposition, do we have any assurance that our BHs are safe from harm....kemunkinan pasti mati. Don't gamble with your lifeline and do support and back the leader that promise to allow us to retire peacefully and for our children and our own future, do not gamble, vote wisely and use your brain and not the wind. Care not what color is he but what and how he is. Even if a white man become the PM and if he do well, why not? If you go by the heart and elect a PM of your color and if he is corrupted or Anti-BHs kind and he may take you one way ticket to Timbaktu.

Remember the History of a HN man and all HN men supported him so proudly but he took all the HN men to Holland. Guess everyone knew of the story........pls no offence as my wife is also a HN and she also was one of them that got bitten. Vote wisely!!!!!!!

Why can we wait for 50 years and only recently we voice out and we should have done so maybe 40 years ago; we aren't stupid or are we.

PM has publicly announced it and why can't we give him 3 years to prove himself for we have allow others 50 years as you have said it. All these while, you all said all sheeps are alike and maybe this one is maybe different cos not all sheep are white, some are black and black is beautiful, right?
PM has only 3 years to next election and like it or not, we have to believe him and let the next 3 years be his judgment and we shall at least be fair to him as he just begin his job and we are not giving him a change to preform.

He can do it if he wanted as he unlike the formal PM who want to but too weak and has not good support no thank to M so as expected, he cannot preform. I truly believe that we give our new PM a chance to prove himself to be our PM...to be fair to all and to be love by all, a true Bapa Malaysia. During these difficult time, he will has alot of problems to solve and to rectify. We should have criticized M as he was the one that put us where we are and if he has used our wealth well, we will be the riches country with all natural resources and all at such high prices. Why? because then we do not have the freedom of speech but we do have some now or otherwise, you and me are now under ISA. I am sorry for taking about politics here but since someone bought it up and we shall discuss politics in general only which do concern our industry.

So far not one PM openly supported this industry but the present PM and why should we be so hard on him without giving him a chance at all. Will putting up the opposition up do any good for the 3 cannot sit together for a dinner without any fight lest to work and sleep together............each has its own different ambition, agenda and goal and which are 180 degree out and for that, unity can never be obtain..................

Not that I like the government for I disagree with BN during Dr.M days that take away my buz because of my color, split the races and rule but then do we really have a choice. Now, we will have a chance if the present PM does not preform but can't we wait as we have been waiting for 50 years.

Above, are my personal view and has no intention of hurting anyone. Apologies if offended. Also, I am not a politician and I believe that politic are dirty and I want to be clean......again, my own comment..................

Taking about Swiftlets, I have a new BH and after a few months and not a single nest....plenty of birds activities but no nest. I thought that I may need to do some serious fault finding..............

2 weeks ago, I tried making some trial rojak solution which I should call it double XO solution and apply it in my new BH plus some minor tweeters alignment. I entered my BH this morning and walau, beautiful, minimum 6 new nests from 3mm to 10 mm....it's a beautiful day for me. Celebration should be near...and I just applied it once and 2 weeks ago.

Confidential and I am not telling.....but once proven to be good, may sell to my friends here for a couple of hundreds per L and will get rich without worry about BN price. I still can't believe my eyes but wait until I get a hundred nests in a few months time. Maybe, it only temporary and hope not for my sake. Hope that it is not swiftlet hallucination as mentioned by Bobby C cos I counted it twice. HaHaHa..tonight ..must dream going to the bank.

A friendly advice here is that good smell is also very important to encourage swiftlets to make nests as I have proven it. I share my experiance but not my double XO formula hahahaha

Ans:When the good is coming, "let it be" as the beetle say and only try to improve when thing are bad or very slow or must do homework when it get stagnant. If you try to do repair when the good are coming, you maybe saying sayonara to those who just try to start family at your BH.

Above are my own observation of swiftlets behavior and other may have difference opinions and pls. do comments. I shall be happy to learn for you all.

Dear Siewan and friends,
A few pointers to share if you agree,
1. Once your BH show some form of improvement, avoid entering the BH for no serious problem and if you need to enter, best enter afternoon and leave before 4 pm.
2. A minimum of 2 weeks allowance be given before you enter for the next inspection and carefully examine the progress of the BH esp on the markings and tell tale signs.
3. Never do any major repair or adjustment when you are having result so as not to scare away any birds that you may have....a bird at hand is better than 2 in the bush.
4. Personally, I never encourage night bird sounds in all my BHs as it doesn't serve the function unless your BH really require the night sound.
It is so disturbing esp. to your neighborhood during the deep night. Why create trouble to all BHs in the region; you are not the only BH in the area, once the authority take action, all BHs will suffer all due your insistence of using midnight noise.
Here, we have a trouble with one BH owner who insist on using night sound and the neighbor has been complaining to the authority many time and this complainant has a mental problem and if he has complaint to the wrong person and if he had complained to his Doctor and with the doctor's recommendation to the authority esp. the Police Dept, his amp. and tweeters will be taken down in the middle of the night.

5. I always suggested that all BHs owners be considerate of your neighbourhood for they have right, too. Some BHs owners never understand that Peace is the best way for BHs to survive at town.......

Note: If your surrounding is like as in the plantation, you may want to use night internal sound to mask the outside predators or animals calls but not in the town where the birds are so used to human or vehicle sound and nosilence after midnight and even a cricket sound sound so loud ...you are asking for trouble.


Again, above are my own findings and may not the same as your learned and wised consultants.

This post has been edited by West Wing: Apr 13 2009, 09:44 PM

I was all for BHs@ TOWN and have a few @ towns but now, I must think of going out of town cos, my fellow BHs owners will kill us all, not this time but maybe sometime in the future. But the fact that I hate snakes and spiders, how then? Already did my best to share all my experiences for free and still bla bla at night and so I quit for not wanting to be told that I am like BN, getting the post but not doing anything about complaints and bad image from the public on BHs.

So, as I love my birds and this is the only way out, begging all BHs@town to cooperate; at least lower the volume and maybe end at 12 midnight and let the poor souls (your neighbours) to having a good night sleep, plus always smile when approaches and at least with that, we are united and have valid reasons to stay in town. If your consultant tell you that only with night sounds you will be successful, you can quote me as I never like to use night sound and I am successful. All consultants I know encourage and even force owners using night sound but till today, I don't see why? Either I am old and outdated or I am just antiCON.

So do what you like cos' I better sell all my BHs and be a retired millionaire instead of the swiftlet birds...all black, I shall be looking and caring for different type of birds, larger and more colourful plus prettier, too........joking lah hahahahahha

Let talk the scenario about Eco park, the owners usually will employ workers to harvest like at Indo ( If they can get the birds during the initial stage and I doubt so), harvesting workers going in half naked in to the BH and harvest but the owner's representative will wait at the entrance door. The workers will collect all nests ( with or without chicks and eggs) and will clean up the BH before the representative will go up to do inspection the cleanliness of the BH. The workers will clean up with the representative looking on to ensure that no nest is hidden under the pant or even in the underwear....expensive stuff, you know.

No representative will go up to any uncleaned BH and dirty their feet. If the workers do selective harvesting and just take the empty nests, do you know the extra time spend in checking the nests is more than harvesting the nests and what if you missed a nest or two, they are not going to do double work or extra work. All the owners' concern are maximum output and minimum expenses; normal factory expectation.

Town BH scenario.

Town BH,, we are mostly individual or family's concerned and we take care of out BH ourselves and we aren't stupid not to allow the birds to increase as the number will double if conditions allow and so will the nests. We have all the time as we normally stay downstairs or nearby and so security is much better. The more time we enter the BH, the more we feel closer to the birds and slowly but surely, the birds become part of our extended family......the provider of financial and wealth....just like our children giving us monthly maintenance but anyone of you having children giving you money monthly?

Unconsciously, we become their protector and the BH become a swiftlets' sanctuary.

With these scenario, do you think there will be any increment of nests.

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Added on April 14, 2009, 5:37 pmA friend of Swiftlets PM me on the planks for BH with some questions and the following are my answers to share among all @ forum but please remember they are all my suggestions and pls feel free to comment.


1. The meranti plank mustn't has any smell even diesel that some sawmill use for cleaning saw......pls. reject all those.
2. I normal like to use 8ins. by 1 ins thick. The thicker the better but the cost will be much higher. As for width, min. 6 inches but all depend on your floor height and surround.
3. Nesting box, as I will like to recommend one long plank provided that the plank stay solid and fast. The boxes are to hold the long plank in good solid position and not to move as the birds hit hard on the plank on landing. Corner are where the birds like best and the corners should be at the side of the walls where the birds will feel safe.

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This post has been edited by West Wing: Apr 14 2009, 06:32 PM

What kind of stupid act... forfeiting bird's nest at the immigration checkpoints is a really stupid idea and which country has done it except Malaysia and this Malaysia pasti boleh....come on , the tourists are coming to enjoy and spend and buy and what do you expect them to read the full laws book of Malaysia before coming......we sell openly and they buy openly and so what's wrong? I once did went to China to buy alot of goods from China and the chinese custom officer asked me why I bought so much goods and I shouted at her "why? it is wrong if I want to help China to sell her products?" and with that the lady officer keep quite. Tourists are coming to buy and do they have to ask every shops whether they have pay taxes or is is illegal to buy or can I buy or all nonsenses!!!!!!

Hundreds of kilos of bird's nest worth hundreds of thousands of ringgit have been confiscated at the country's exit points; oh my God!!! The tourists are going back home to tell all their friends not to visit Malaysia as Malaysian main silat mata....sekarang ada, sekarang hilang......


Why spend so much money to promote tourism when we Malaysia here are killing all tourism here. BH swiftlets should never be in the fully protected specises as we have increase the population many many folds........and the nests they are buying are from our building and not from the caves. It is nests created by man for Human consumption.

Why create so much problem to our guests and all they want are to have happy times in Malaysia and we, Malaysia before this are known for warm welcome and famous Malaysian smile> shame on us all, Malaysian!!!!!!

And again, above are always my own opinions and if offended, pls. accept my sincere appologies.................