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 Credit Card Thread V5, (added FMB website to 1st post)

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SUSOptiplex330
post Nov 12 2008, 11:38 AM

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QUOTE(perror @ Nov 7 2008, 01:26 PM)
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

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Personally, I avoided Citi like the plague. Very frustrating dealing with them.


Added on November 12, 2008, 11:41 am
QUOTE(perror @ Nov 7 2008, 02:24 PM)
On the other hand, I am also thinking of getting a debit card that's tied to an account with only small amounts of cash (maybe RM500). Hopefully that should help limit loses in the case the card is stolen. What do you guys think about this?smile.gif

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What I did was applied for a basic card (I don't want gold or platinum) with the very minimum credit limit of RM3000. I had requested for lower but that's the lowest limit possible. That is my main card for use in places whereby I can't see them swapping my card like in the restaurant.



edited by b00n: help include the spoiler tag to shorten a long post for better reading.


Added on November 12, 2008, 12:12 pmUsing CIMB DA card doing 3 purchases in UK GBP.
1. Twice, the exchange rate given by DA are lower then BNM's interbank for the date. 6.249 vs BNM 6.305. Forgot about the other one.
2. Once was higher. 6.359 vs BNM 6.225.

I could understand DA charging higher rate than BNM's interbank rate. But I could never understand as to the lower rates given for the other 2 occasion.

http://www.bnm.gov.my/index.php?ch=12&pg=6...ype=Mid&unit=rm

This post has been edited by Optiplex330: Nov 12 2008, 12:12 PM
SUSOptiplex330
post Nov 12 2008, 02:33 PM

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You missed my meaning completely.

Let me take this as an example:
Credit card charged me 6.249
BNM rate is 6.305

I have reason to believe those BNM rate of 6.305 is interbank or wholesale rate that is NOT available to us normal consumer. When we go to the bank to buy GBP, we are guaranteed to be charged higher retail rate.

Since bank typically add 200 to 500 base point to those wholesale rate, we will be charged:
MINIMUM of 6.305+0.02 = 6.325 or
MAXIMUM of 6.305+0.05 = 6.355.

If that assumption hold, then how is it possible for us to be charged a rate that is LOWER than the wholesale rate? In this particular case, I was charged 6.249!!!

I have a Vista gadget displaying almost real time exchange rate on my pc screen and I have never notice it going anywhere below 6.3 for the few days I tracked them. And of course, it might have momentarily done so when I am asleep at night. So it's either a mystery or I must be super lucky that day while sleeping.


This post has been edited by Optiplex330: Nov 12 2008, 02:42 PM
SUSOptiplex330
post Nov 14 2008, 05:43 AM

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QUOTE(alexwsk @ Nov 13 2008, 08:32 PM)
I got what u meant, but u din get what i meant. Maybe my explanation not good enough blush.gif
Refer to this thread, http://forum.lowyat.net/topic/402992

However, I hv no idea how visa/master determine their rates

Updated
======
VISA Forex rate = http://corporate.visa.com/pd/consumer_serv....jsp?src=ex_rez
For more info, read this
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You still do not get what I meant.

Based on my 2 past experience and using this as an example. Right now,
The Vista gadget (drawing data from some internet site) quoted 5.352
And assuming BNM quoted rate is 5.36
(These 2 must be wholesale or interbank rate not available to retail customer)

The Visa site you gave me quoted exchange rate of 5.40
(This must be the rate charged to retail customer)


But my credit card company is only charging me 5.29!!

How is that possible?




SUSOptiplex330
post Nov 14 2008, 11:05 AM

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QUOTE(alexwsk @ Nov 14 2008, 10:21 AM)
The site gave me a calculation of 5.30, which is pretty close to 5.29


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No matter how you wanted to argue, the fact remains the credit card is making a lost in 2 of my previous transaction. That is simply NOT possible , hence the mystery.

Using your example, 5.40 vs 5.29 is 100 base point difference. AFAIK, bank normally mark up 200 to 400 base point as profit when they sell you foreign currency. For larger transaction, they may even be willing to mark up only 100 base point so your 100 base point difference is significant loses to the credit card company.


This post has been edited by Optiplex330: Nov 14 2008, 11:11 AM
SUSOptiplex330
post Nov 14 2008, 02:31 PM

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QUOTE(MilesAndMore @ Nov 14 2008, 02:23 PM)
UOB is NOT a local bank. It is a Singaporean bank.

As much as i adore Public Bank (it's my main bank for savings and such) but you may just forget it if you intend to use their credit card. Public Bank credit card doesn't give you much benefits and is one of the worst credit cards in Malaysia. The cash back reward is also unbelievably low thus make their credit cards uncompetitive at all.

I suggest you to apply for CIMB Bank Mastercard but too bad you don't want to consider CIMB. It got lots of promotion year-round and it is absolutely free-for-life with no catch at all.
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If you wanted to use your credit card overseas or overseas purchase, CIMB DA card do not have transaction fees. Others add 1 to 2% on top of VISA/MC exchange rate.

The only catch I know of CIMB DA card is that you must be a professional or graduate to be entitled to free-for-life annual fee.

As for ATM, Public Bank ATM card can not be used to withdraw cash from overseas ATM machine. RHB very limited. Best is HSBC ATM card.


Added on November 14, 2008, 2:38 pm
QUOTE(alexwsk @ Nov 14 2008, 01:53 PM)
well, i would say that no one is losing. You gain some through lower FOREX rate (most of the time though not always), your bank pays the amount requested, and VISA/MASTER still can gain from the lower FOREX rate than banks. Don't forget that Visa/Master are powerful global companies that can even fix their own FOREX rate.

I think the relation is like this
You ----> Bank ----> Visa/Master <---- Merchant

Your bank is not going to earn from the FOREX. It might be more complicated than the above but my knowledge are limited. Maybe some forumer who works in the financial institutions can explain further.
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On several occasion, the currency exchange I got from CC is so low that it is available nowhere else in the world (because it's even lower than interbank rates). Heck, it is not even available to the bank themselves, let alone their customers. When you think about that statement, it's truly puzzling. Hence my original posting asking as to whether anyone here know something I don't.



Foreign merchant ----> VISA/MC -----> CIMB -----> You.
AFAIK, CIMB DA is one of the very few bank that do not earn anything from you for foreign transaction.

The merchant makes money from you. VISA/MC makes money from you. CIMB do not charge transaction fee so do not earn money from you.

Other banks do. HSBC add 1% on top of VISA/MC charges. PBB also 1%. EON adds 2%.




This post has been edited by Optiplex330: Nov 14 2008, 02:38 PM
SUSOptiplex330
post Nov 15 2008, 11:01 AM

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On foreign currency conversion rate. It's entirely done by VISA/MC and my bank has absolutely nothing to do with it. So what you said has nothing to do with this particular case.

In this particular case, it seems VISA/MC is MAKING A LOST (by giving me BELOW wholesale market rate) and that can not be true! Hence THE mystery that I am trying to decipher.

From the posting so far, nobody seem to have an answer to this mystery.

SUSOptiplex330
post Nov 16 2008, 08:22 AM

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http://www.directaccess.com.my/index.php?c...ard&ac=7&tpt=da

Free for life for professional and graduate. No other strings attached like minimum numbers of time you have to use the card etc.

And the zero overseas transaction charge by DA is very attractive to me. 2% fuel rebate is another.

They also allow up to 8 supplementary card for free. And the best thing is, you can set different credit limit for each of those supplementary card, something not often available with other cc. For example, you can give one supplementary card to your college son and set his limit at RM3K. Then another one to your wife with limit of RM10K etc.

DA previously belongs to Southern Bank and there aren't many of their branches around so payment can be troublesome for me personally in EM. But since taken over by CIMB, that is no longer a problem.
SUSOptiplex330
post Nov 20 2008, 10:04 AM

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QUOTE(Optiplex330 @ Nov 14 2008, 02:31 PM)


Added on November 14, 2008, 2:38 pm

On several occasion, the currency exchange I got from CC is so low that it is available nowhere else in the world (because it's even lower than interbank rates). Heck, it is not even available to the bank themselves, let alone their customers. When you think about that statement, it's truly puzzling. Hence my original posting asking as to whether anyone here know something I don't.
Foreign merchant ----> VISA/MC -----> CIMB -----> You.
AFAIK, CIMB DA is one of the very few bank that do not earn anything from you for foreign transaction.

The merchant makes money from you. VISA/MC makes money from you. CIMB do not charge transaction fee so do not earn money from you.

Other banks do. HSBC add 1% on top of VISA/MC charges. PBB also 1%. EON adds 2%.
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It's happening again.

18-Oct. BNM rate 6.1108. DA rate 6.102
28-Oct. BNM rate 5.5856. DA rate 5.56
11-Nov. BNM rate 5.6031. DA rate 5.621

As you can see, only the last conversion rate is normal, aka above the wholesale rate. And only marked up by 200 base point whereas bank normal marked up by 400 to 500 base point.

It seems it's actually cheaper to use DA credit card than buying GBP bank draft. I simply couldn't figure it why.

http://www.bnm.gov.my/index.php?ch=12&pg=6...ype=Mid&unit=rm


SUSOptiplex330
post Nov 20 2008, 10:24 AM

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I posted this in another tread. A summary of my experience so far.

This is incredible and I have a hard time understand why. But it could be very significant for those having to study overseas.

Now, when you needed money to pay for UK university tuition or accommodation, you typically go buy a bank draft from Malaysian bank and send it to UK. But here is another incredible method: It's may actually be cheaper to use your Malaysian credit card to pay for those thing in term of foreign currency conversion. Not sure of other CC.

I have used my DA credit card to pay for several things in UK and here are the records:

23-Sep. BNM rate 6.305. DA rate 6.249
30-Sep. BNM rate 6.225. DA rate 6.359*
18-Oct. BNM rate 6.1108. DA rate 6.102
28-Oct. BNM rate 5.5856. DA rate 5.56
11-Nov. BNM rate 5.6031. DA rate 5.621*

BNM indicative rate is supposedly the wholesale rate or Interbank rate. That is supposedly the price your local bank pays for GBP. So when the bank sell you the GBP, they will typically mark up by 0.04 ot 0.05 (400 to 500 base point) to the wholesale rate and sell it to you.

2 of the transaction is considered normal (*) in the sense that there is a mark up of 1400 (highly excessive) and 200 base point (considered super cheap).

But what I could not figure out are the other 3 transactions. They are 600, 100, 300 base point BELOW the wholesale rate. It is like as if your bank is subsidizing your GBP purchase. Instead of marking up 400 to 500 base point, they actually make a lost of 100 to 600 base point on those transaction. For bank to make a lost is most ridiculous and impossible but the records seem to say otherwise.

What's up? Anyone got an explanation?

http://www.bnm.gov.my/index.php?ch=12&pg=629

SUSOptiplex330
post Nov 23 2008, 08:26 PM

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QUOTE(Colaboy @ Nov 23 2008, 01:39 PM)
The new AmBank CreditCard with free for life as well is it good?

Pls give some feed back . . .  for those good in this field  thumbup.gif  thumbup.gif  thumbup.gif
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Many years ago had one of them. I have such unpleasant experience that I swore I would never touch them with a ten foot pole.

They may be good now but the bitterness lingers......


Added on November 23, 2008, 8:38 pm
QUOTE(vin_ann @ Nov 23 2008, 08:06 PM)
my experience with DA customer service is not that bad. just that sometime, the waiting time is quite long...

the DA customer service quality is dropped since the acquisition by CIMB. previously got people mentioned it.
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I have DA's Platinum. One of the better service compared to my other cards. Often get a REAL human being talking to me with 20 second unlike others that takes you through numerous selection menu.

For non-standard request. One of the best and the worst is EON which I am hoping to find another easy "free for life" card to replace it with.


This post has been edited by Optiplex330: Nov 23 2008, 08:38 PM
SUSOptiplex330
post Nov 24 2008, 08:39 AM

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QUOTE(vin_ann @ Nov 23 2008, 11:23 PM)
if im not wrong, Platinium holder can call another hotline, i thinks which is lesser people calling and u get the good services.

unlike us normal CC....  sad.gif
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DA Platinum number 03-62047979. Is that the number you called?


SUSOptiplex330
post Nov 24 2008, 09:57 AM

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QUOTE(hye @ Nov 24 2008, 09:28 AM)
No doubt about it. When it comes to service quality, you can't beat HSBC. The only downside to HSBC is perhaps their lack of promotions as compared to the likes of Citibank and they are less aggresive in terms of giving you bonus points.

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An acquaintance once told me. Not sure true or not. He said, when traveling overseas, HSBC charges/conversion rate is on the higher side. And they do charge an extra 1% for oversea transaction.

AFAIK, only DA has 0% oversea transaction charge. Most are 1% with EON the highest at 2%.


SUSOptiplex330
post Nov 24 2008, 11:22 AM

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QUOTE(hye @ Nov 24 2008, 10:45 AM)
If I'm not mistaken, the conversion rates are determined at the VISA/MC International level rather the HSBC's bank level.
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Yes, the conversion rates are supposedly determined by VISA/MC. But the transaction charge are determined by the local bank.

Anyone got any comparison of conversion rate by VISA vs MC?
SUSOptiplex330
post Nov 24 2008, 01:12 PM

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QUOTE(JamesPond @ Nov 24 2008, 12:05 PM)
i use my hsbc charge oversea...no charge oso...
never heard got additional charge....
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Those extra bank charges are clearly stated in black and white.

http://www.hsbc.com.my/1/2/personal-bankin...rd-fees-charges

http://www.directaccess.com.my/index.php?c...rd&ac=12&tpt=da






SUSOptiplex330
post Nov 26 2008, 06:53 AM

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QUOTE(cute_boboi @ Nov 25 2008, 08:50 PM)
Again, my weird experience. My salary is banked into HSBC every month. I applied HSBC CC, submit all docs, salary slip, proof, etc. But I got rejected.  doh.gif 

Then I not happy already. One fine day, HSBC tele-marketer called me, and asked me fill up one single form. No docs. I fill up, faxed in, and they send me the CC.  doh.gif  All happened within 12 months period.

Same company, same salary, same home.  rclxub.gif
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Then one fine day, a HSBC tele-marketer is short of target sales so you got lucky?


Added on November 26, 2008, 6:55 am
QUOTE(zenwell @ Nov 25 2008, 11:54 PM)
I dunno if someone has discussed about this before but recently only i know Citibank Shell card petrol rebate is only deductible if you have outstanding from previous month. But i noticed tha they will accumulate your rebate as well. Is it like that for all Citibank card holders or izzit me only?

All the while i thought the petrol rebate will be given every month regardless of whether you have outstanding or not(because i have had outstanding for long time until i cleared it recently  sweat.gif so i din notice)

My question is, is Maybank and CIMB petronas card also the same? i mean for their petrol rebate?

Also, for citibank card, do they have like point collection to redeem products?
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What's the % rebate for Citibank Shell now?

AFAIK,
RHB only for 1st weekend of the month: 5%
DA 2%


This post has been edited by Optiplex330: Nov 26 2008, 06:55 AM
SUSOptiplex330
post Nov 26 2008, 12:55 PM

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QUOTE(cute_boboi @ Nov 26 2008, 12:30 PM)
Anyway, if you are looking for gifts, just apply at roadshows where they'll give free gifts. I remember RHB offer the Renault F1 toy car and also a set of "plastic" crystal chess set. Quite nice actually.

Then hope they will reject your application  tongue.gif
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I felt so unsafe giving my details to those people by the road side. I have nightmares thinking what they could have done with it.


SUSOptiplex330
post Nov 26 2008, 01:07 PM

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QUOTE(cute_boboi @ Nov 26 2008, 12:56 PM)
No doubt, but if you know how things work, e.g. online banking, ATM, etc. You may not use it ever again  tongue.gif  Even the document workflow process over the counters.

Sometimes, it is better not to know it.
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OK. I went out and claim I am from ** CC company. I get your photostatted copies of your IC, your other Credit Card, your mother's maiden name and other details etc. The amount of damage I could do will be immense.

On the other hand, if you hand those documents to the staff inside the bank, the chances of mischief will be much less because at the very least, you know the staff is genuine. .

SUSOptiplex330
post Dec 1 2008, 09:56 AM

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QUOTE(Zack Styler @ Dec 1 2008, 08:33 AM)
Anyone encountered not receiving credit card statement for the month and ended up getting charged for late payment?

What the... doh.gif  doh.gif  doh.gif

Possible to request for the waiver for late payment charges?  shakehead.gif  shakehead.gif
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If it is Citi card, forget about it.
Assuming they waive. Then next month, they will charge you late payment charge on the 1st late payment charge and it will go on forever.
Been there. Done that. Many times.
SUSOptiplex330
post Dec 2 2008, 08:36 PM

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QUOTE(Aeon_Clock @ Dec 2 2008, 04:33 PM)
we should start practice paying the statement the moment the bill arrives, or on the usual date of the statement.

btw, anyone heard about that Ambank True Visa card? 12% p.a. Sounds tempting...
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How about this example for punctuality?

Statement date: 1-Nov
Statement received: 4-Nov
Payment made and check cleared from my account: 7-Nov

And still got hit by late payment mad.gif

As I said, been there, done that with citi

This post has been edited by Optiplex330: Dec 2 2008, 08:37 PM
SUSOptiplex330
post Dec 3 2008, 07:08 AM

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QUOTE(vin_ann @ Dec 2 2008, 10:30 PM)
i thinks some bad apple do happened. importantly u communicate with the Customer Service. demand explanation.

else, complain to bank negara.

since u face this kind of problems, did u know what's the reason why it's happened? how u solve it?
mind to share?

dun just complain, share with us, else keep it to yourself.
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This what happens next.

1. Called up. CC agree to refund late payment charge.
2. Subsequent month's bill will see new late payment charge of the late payment charge.
3. Repeat #1 again and #2 will also happen again.
4. Repeat #3
5. Repeat #4

I got so fed up that I send a check with a covering letter. In the letter, I mentioned they have no right to the money and if they have any ethic at all, they do not need to return the money but give it to charity. They cashed the check so what can I say? No ethic? Lousy computer system?

BTW, the same thing happening to my friends so mine wasn't an isolated case.

So there you have it. I will not want to touch another of their card with a ten foot pole.



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