more lawyers alamak haha...

I don't know whether this questions have been asked or not but...

1. are u planning to practice in Malaysia or SG?
2. if u take UEC is it recognized in Malaysia?
3. if its not recognized in Malaysia, r u wilin to spend the rest of ur life to work in SG?
4. Can u find a job in Sg?
5. Finally if u go for UEC, its not a subject that is widely recognized elsewhere. As such its a handicap for u.

*would advise u take A Level subject as it would expose u to legal basics and wider recognition in terms of cert.

Career in the Legal Profession

So whether you r intending to join the legal profession and your at the cross roads as a student:
Law Grad
Master In LAw
PHD in LAw
Legal Executive/Officer
Advocate & Solicitor
In-house Legal
Judge
AG
bla bla bla the list goes on.

Let me debunk some myth for you guys/gals out there, who still think the lgal profession is a glamourous line to be in cause its not!

1. To get an insight in the legal profession
For students who are still in School or College or in the 1st yr of University, if u genuinely have interest to join the legal profession. Do an internship in a local law firm, this is one of the most important deciding factor whether u would enjoy the legal profession.

2. Job prospect
Look into the daily newspapers, look at how many positions r available in the Legal profession. You will notice if u only have a law degree, u r stuck at square one.
Take note: of limitation and requirements, i.e. been in practice, admitted as Adv & Sol, in-house, 5 yrs exp bla bla

Singapore than?
Ah yes, the small island across the sea. That is if u get a PR or u dont die from home sickness.

Silver lining?
F*** the legal profession, why not try other fields such as banking, investment banking, finance or property. This sectors ladies and gentleman employs the largest employers of ppl with legal background, however u need to note that u might also be competiting with other ppl whom are from other backgrounds i.e. Accountin, Bankin finance etc... So ur chance are close to slim

3. Financial Capability
Thinkin that a Law degree is cheap? by comparison degree vs degree its the cheapest u dont need special equipment and books mostly can be bought second hand probably might require some updatin but than again cheap. 3 yrs to complete a degree. Wow...

Profession Certification: CLP/BAR etc...
Not as cheap if u dont make it the first time around.

Note:
If u do not have spare cash/ money set aside and ur focused in doin those two certifications above. Its no different from screwin urself. CLP exam starts every yr in middle of July. Say unfortunately ABC had failed his exam which means he wuld have wasted another yr preparing for CLP, so what r u going to do? If u were to take up a job offer in Aug and quit in May wouldnt it be meaningless? So ur left hanging.

4. Academic
CLP is famous for being tough, 10% pass guarentees that it is a very tough academically tested paper.

5. Pay

Dont expect to be paid an astronomical sum, it is very true that salary is subject to experience, the longer u work the more u get paid.

But for beginers in a competitive profession in Law, chambering and 1st yr as an LA would normally be paid peanuts. Expect long hours and sleepless nights, verbal abuses, or being abused by ur bosse (if u manage so luckily to get a rough boss)

6. Ask for recomendation from Seniors

Those from the legal profession/private sector and dealing with legal matters.

7. Strategize

To avoid dissapointments, stragize at teh same time have contingencies. Make sure u have eenuf funds and also love what ur doin...

8. Remember

Legal profession is a life long career.

I suggest you do some research before you dive in, good or bad is very subjective and varies from person to person.

If I tell u its VERY good or its VERY bad I would be lying.

retire and die with it. cause u cant do anything else.


Say u got a Law Degree and you would like to work after ur degree rather than pursuing to be an advocate n solicitor, because of reasons... u need money, u want to have financial freedom from ur parents etc... (use ur imagination from here)

Now Sarah, what I want you to do is imagine that u have a law degree (if u have yet to grad) flip through the newspaper.

Imagine this is all you have:
Law degree (fresh grad)
0 experience

Than while flipping through the newspaper u see In house legal counsel wanted (dont qualify), than u will see alot of Legal Assistant wanted (again u dont qualify), u will find that in a single piece of paper there is more demand for accountants and engineers than a person who has legal background.

so ur stuck that is what I mean.

~ sry need to ask someone else abt doing double law degree

Legal advisor normally min 5 yrs exp in practice or 3 yrs in house... fresh grads can forget about bein a legal counsel/advisor.

If u can get more details on what Biz/Finance/Econs, what teh subjects focused on. I can advise u on some aspects of banking.

I work in an in house legal dept with an investment bank (is different from Banking), as a Legal Exec...

I am betting ur doing an Australian degree. would take u prolly 5 yrs to complete or 4.

Anyway I am no expert on Aus Degrees, shud ask from advise from some other person on this matter.

UOL, or a UK law degree or Australian law degree watever... it all makes no difference.. if u want to join an in-house legal dept u need only a legal dept and some experience from a law firm.

Legal advisor/legal counsel how ever u want to put or name it...
Speakin generally in Malaysia, normally companies would prefer someone who is from practice and has at least 5/9 yrs exp. Unless of course u started as a legal executive/officer and work ur way up the ladder. Than again that would take yrs.

Legal advisor/Legal Counsel r not "LAWYERS" and do not enjoy the privileges given to a practitioner (check LPA). (u will notice they do not have sijil annual or practicing cert etc...). they merely dispense advise to clients, in effect LA/LC r same like a lay person dispensing advise to another lay person, just that this particular former lay person knows his/her stuff.

Oh and one more thing law firms dont hire legal advisers, only companies do.

This post has been edited by aurora97: Nov 1 2008, 01:49 PM

yes..

I did twinning program 1+2 actually... so i will advise u on this area.

The exposure r greater, in terms of ppl, knowledge, learning and so forth. You will be covering more dept in most subjects compared to what u study (say ur 1st or 2nd yr is in Malaysia). Of course u'd be spendin a whole lot more compared to just doing UOL.

Recognition, if twinning offers u a prestigious University go for it... it makes job hunting easier.

UOL (aka london ext) is also quite a well known paper, so i suggest u might want to take into consideration that if u were to go abroad make sure the degree cert on offer is at least at par with ur UOL degree.

I dont think i need to say much abt twinning, u've been bombarded left right and center what u can do while abroad.

I just highlight the small things that u might wanna take note.

Cardiff... i think my batch was the last to have the University of Cardiff cert, now its known as University of Wales. I believed pre 2005 there was a massive merger of Welsh universities.

General perception is Degree gets u to the foot mat outside the door and the rest depends on ur skill to convince the inerviewer.

Your certificate rather than ur twinning prog would make a difference but prolly just 2% chance that it would affect the interviewers decision to employ u. in % terms its small, but in an interview for a job every % counts... from how u dress, talk etc...

Note. i said made some difference, but not a whole lot,


****

Xziled
"Hmm, i wonder then y 1 of my friend who did UWE till year 2 but now have to take UOL and retake Inter again because wanna accompany gf so that they can go to UK together..now she commenting that UOL and UWE syllabus is different and it's much harder. Though she got 2nd class uppers in UWE."

I wonder why he wanted to waste so much $ just to accompany his gf, well not the first case i've heard of anyway.

Well syllabus difference, i got no comment on it depends on the Uni actually or the lecturer concern. I heard the same thing too for UOL, its much harder compared to doing your law degree in UK Uni's but than again...

It's a matter whether ur lecturer can get the msg through to the students and students understanding the subjct matter.

you need A levels.

Anyway, whether my friend waste money or not it doesn't matter and not concerning the topic also
lol, had to reply to it since you left the statement there.

But the subject matter taught in UWE is different and more brief i guess. Even i heard from the staff in my college saying that can easily pass or maybe a B without any conclusion in ur essays. even for Uni of Northumbria also the syllabus r almost the same except for a few which is more to cover but not in depth. Btw, it is clarified previously that i said that ppl who take the course from Uni of Northumbria cannot practice here in M'sia if they do it locally unless they go over there and do it or u can practice but u have to sit for the BAR hence for the compulsory subject of EU law.

Whether the syllabus is simpler, easier to pass, or how the examination takes place is of little importance so long its recognized and accredited by the relevant agencies in UK (or that matter if ur plannin to practice in My, recognized by the Malaysian Bar)

Btw, it is clarified previously that i said that ppl who take the course from Uni of Northumbria cannot practice here in M'sia if they do it locally unless they go over there and do it or u can practice but u have to sit for the BAR hence for the compulsory subject of EU law

I find this sentence misleading are you really and absolutely sure that Uni of Northumbria graduates cant practice in My?

sry too lazy to find the link, but i suggest u read page 1 some hints here and there or the Malaysian Bar web site.

After SPM, take A'lvls 1st before taking up any law degree programme i guess. Applicable for most law courses, BOJ i not sure but i think same coz need STPM also izzit?

alternative STPM... read the Malaysian Bar web site for qualification & requirements

If u have such a view, well ur definately entitled to it no matter how right or wrong it may sound but my personal opinion is that you should refrain from making bias and unproductive statements.

Hearing from someone somewhere and knowing something for a fact is important, if ur a lawyer trying to dispense advise by hearing it from somewhere I'd be very concerned as a Client.

gd luck to u.

This post has been edited by aurora97: Nov 7 2008, 09:39 AM

This thread is an education thread, I believe those who contributed did so with their own experience and their own free will to do so to guide those who would like to pursue a career in the legal profession on the right track.

Like many students who are "Ignorant", who do not bother about finding out further information into the courses they r taking... end up either:

A) DOING COURSES NOT ACCREDITED/RECOGNIZED BY THE MALAYSIAN GOV, THE MALAYSIAN QUALIFIYING BOARD AND THE UK BAR;
B) DID NOT DO THE REQUISITE SUBJECTS REQUIRED TO QUALIFY AS A SOLICTOR AND ADVOCATE IN MALAYSIA OR IN THE UK; &
C) GOING TO COLLEGES & UNIVERSITIES NOT RECOGNIZED BY THE MALAYSIAN GOV, THE MALAYSIAN QUALIFYING BOARD AND THE UK BAR.

As i mentioned, to those who have doubts can just check with the respective colleges /uni's to find out more abt the routes.

I am not suprised one day to find a thread saying, the College/Uni told me that the College/Uni was accredited by the Malaysia Gov fr a particular course but how come my degree got rejcted after completeing the 5 yrs course and spending Rm XX-XXX!?

Life is too short for such mistakes, 5 yrs wasted a paper degree turned into toilet paper and after spending thousands of ur parents hard earn money. Whereas asking for such crucial information could have savd you all the above problems.

I hope you read newspapers cause such things do happen.

Btw, i wouldn't want to take up ur task for providing info, guess u're the only 1 free to do it

If u think the idea of contributing to a forum is such a waste of time, why r u still here?

This post has been edited by aurora97: Nov 10 2008, 10:12 AM

applies only to those who take UOL external...

3rd class and u can kiss ur degree bb

1. i dont know about u guys but I'd prefer to get it right the first time (or at least the second time around if avoidable)
2. If possible to link all references to its source, so as nto to mislead others.
3. Misleading others may cause others to misintepret and read awhole lot of unnecessary thread (like this one) especially in an Education thread, when such discussions shud be in kopitiam.
4. Don't feed the troll.

i surrender...

not going to prove u guys wrong or right... knock your selves out.

if u really really want to just go and set up a thread in kopitiam.

if a person cannot decide what to do and lets his/her parents dictate to their tune, well i suggest that the person do not do law. The person might most likely hate it and end up wasting 3 yrs of hating a subjuect that he/she didnt like in the first place or felt forced to do it.

Obviously if a person is confused or dont know the direction in life, their parents would come in and kick some sense into their children... otherwise if decision is left to tht peson most likely he'd be sitting around for yrs thinking on wats the most suitable course to take.

but once its determined and the person has accepted and agree with his/her parents and they have started their educatyion there is no turning back... the time and money has alrady been spent. No regrets no turning back.

Otherwise that person can kiss his/her parents mney bb and also his youth...

My advice.

2 choices.

speak up be heard or keep quiet and submit...

Speak up
If u told ur parents that u didnt like law in the first place and they r still persistent and u fair poorly, u can blame it all on them (haha... at least give urself an escape routemah)

Keep quiet n submit..
If u choose this option and u fair poorly, ur parents r gonna say, "hey u picked the course, we only suggested to you, u never told us u didnt like law and now see what u done u wasted money and time - GTFO and work!".


My thoughts/opinions...

The story about speakin up and shuting up


In my case

[quote=yanniieee,Dec 5 2008, 08:03 PM]
like this..i told my dad that i want to take up law from UOL external..he said its no good,he keep saying government university is the best =.= i dont want government university..so many rules to follow up..he keep saying this benefit that benefit,how?

---

Added on December 5, 2008, 8:04 pm

There nothing wrong with doing law in a local university (esp. Gov) but problem is there r only a few seats available so it'd prolly be snapped up pretty quick. You skip the hassle of going through CLP and directly right after u graduate u can start ur chambering.

furthermore, if u were to do UOL check the pro and cons of it firzt. u need to ask urself whether u would want to practice as well as an advocate n solicitor.

other factos u need to put into consideration is ur financial background.

you said your dad wanted u to study in local unversity compared to doing UOL, so i advised u on that. i didn't say it was easy, please read carefully before responding. I'm not ignorant of the fact that there maybe other reasons that may hinder ur entrance in to local unversities.