Here you go..
http://www.proton.com/innovation/rnd/campro.php
IAFM, CPS, CamPro, All Discussions here.
IAFM, CPS, CamPro, All Discussions here.
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Apr 7 2008, 10:01 PM
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#1
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Apr 7 2008, 10:30 PM
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#2
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QUOTE(yu_wang @ Apr 7 2008, 10:17 PM) more info here: Thats why they doesn't mention Campro CPS, just CPS. Even the emblem at the boot also just CPS 1.6.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Campro_engine For those lazy ppl, i'll try to summarize. There are 3 Campro engines out there: 1. Plain old CamPro (all proton cars after Waja and before New Saga) 2. CamPro IAFM (New Saga and latest batch Persona) 3. CamPro CPS (Gen-2 CPS and Waja CPS) The plain CamPro was supposed to have cam profile switching technology since the very first version, but it was dropped to save cost(?). As a result it had a big ugly torque dip at lower rpms (i.e. no power unless you rev high). IAFM stands for Intake Air Fuel Module (lol @ i am fat man). I dont know how it works, but basically the torque dip is gone. No need to rev so high, easier to handle in city driving and traffic jams. CPS is the real Cam Profile Switching technology, which also has the same effect as IAFM. Maybe a little bit more overall power. It comes together with something called VIM (Variable Intake Manifold) but usually it's shortened to CPS only. Interesingly, if you try to read CamPro CPS in full (no short form) then it sounds like Cam Profile Cam Profile Switching. Sorry if i made any mistake in my post...cya QUOTE(athlonxp @ Apr 7 2008, 10:17 PM) campro = no variable cam, no variable valve, no nothing To be fair, the hp in CPS is low than the older VTEC engine, some are contributed by complying with Euro-4 standard (something about polution etc... iafm = TVIS found on 1st gen 4AGE from AE86 from year 1985 cps = variable valve lift which dont work. a sophisticated and well designed engine with valve lift tech should make 165hp like B16A. this "new technology" could be found in 1988 EF9 CRX B16A vim = variable inlet manifold today is 7/4/2008. phailed |
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Apr 7 2008, 10:40 PM
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#3
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QUOTE(RCrex @ Apr 7 2008, 10:35 PM) What to do.. QUOTE(yu_wang @ Apr 7 2008, 10:37 PM) Maybe they want to drop the name 'Campro' becoz it already have bad reputation.. |
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Apr 7 2008, 10:47 PM
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#4
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Apr 7 2008, 10:51 PM
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#5
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Apr 7 2008, 11:54 PM
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#6
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QUOTE(the_catacombs @ Apr 7 2008, 11:47 PM) I prefer changing the hi-cam to a higher one. Can save petrol if kept revving under 4k rpm. QUOTE(aizad02 @ Apr 7 2008, 11:50 PM) errr...IAFM is external device at the air intake rite?so,is there any chance to put it to normal campro arr?? I think its possible. |
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Apr 7 2008, 11:59 PM
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#7
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Apr 8 2008, 07:16 AM
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#8
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QUOTE(the_catacombs @ Apr 8 2008, 04:43 AM) change to highcam can save petrol??.. The 2nd cam in CPS is not as 'wild' as VTEC and it also engage early (3.8k) compared to VTEC.2 sets of cam??... or u mean the cams has 2 profile lobes like vtec??... somehow i dont see any difference in performance during switch over of the cam profile.... |
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Apr 8 2008, 09:22 AM
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#9
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QUOTE(farique @ Apr 8 2008, 07:47 AM) seriously, this is the first time I heard such thing as installing high cam can save petrol. CPS got two profile cam (low lift and high lift)... As long as keep revving before the activation point, it still use low lift, thus normal FC. so, they basically have the secondary cam eh? How's the activation of the higher cam? Is it similar of to the VTEC's? I thought CPS is something like DVVT, VVTI, etc? |
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Apr 8 2008, 01:34 PM
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#10
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QUOTE(the_catacombs @ Apr 8 2008, 12:19 PM) VIM cover the torque dip I thinks. Because CPS open earlier than VTEC, it cannot use a wild cam like VTEC. A high lift cam would only give optimum power a high RPM. The higher the RPM, the higher lift is better. VTEC open at 7k (if not mistaken), thus it can utilize higher cam than CPS. High cam (high lift) is useless in low RPM. This is what I understand about cam profile system. Pls correct me if I'm wrong. |
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Apr 8 2008, 05:19 PM
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#11
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QUOTE(the_catacombs @ Apr 8 2008, 03:34 PM) vtec open at about 5k plus i guess.... 7k almost end of the power graph lor.... Dont know much bout VTEC, but isn't 5k is too low, even MIVEC open at 5.5k.. campro cps using what ecu??... siemens??... u think anyway in the future someone would take campro cps cams and regrind the higher profile camlobe for better performance??.... u've mistaken VIM for CPS ler... Donno what ecu CPS are using, how to know? I also hope R3 would try to experiment regrind the lobe, which I think is possible QUOTE(WisePrince @ Apr 8 2008, 05:07 PM) VIM are commonly mistaken because CPS and VIM both are usually referred as CPS only.. |
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Apr 8 2008, 07:27 PM
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#12
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QUOTE(athlonxp @ Apr 8 2008, 07:08 PM) vim at low end? cps at high end? proton website tell u this of course..but real life it is not like this I've managed to get average 18cent/km with highway cruising at 140km/h (CPS engage) and often rev till 7k rpm.. I've notice that by cruising at 120km/h and less revving above 4k rpm, I've managed to get 16cent/km. My previous ride, Saga LMST also give me 16cent/km for 120km/h cruising. CPS is not high peformance engine and not fuel economical engine..then wat is this engine good at? boat anchor perhaps.. if cps isnt mean for fuel economy..why should proton make something that is not economical and put it in a low cost everyday family saloon? IMHO, Gen.2 and Waja is not a low cost family car. Saga is. Gen.2=sporty Waja=premium saloon |
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Apr 8 2008, 07:39 PM
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QUOTE(cloudstrife07 @ Apr 8 2008, 07:33 PM) yeah like i mentioned up there. sometimes THEORY can't be use in REAL LIFE situation, hence need hands-on testings. I don't think at low rev CPS can perform as efficient as VVT system as the latter varies the timing across the RPM range. But the best I think is i-Vtec where the lift is varies across the RPM range and VVT-L system (variable valve timing + lift) . |
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Apr 8 2008, 07:54 PM
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#14
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Apr 8 2008, 09:11 PM
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QUOTE(the_catacombs @ Apr 8 2008, 08:57 PM) VIM = variable intake manifold I dont think VIM/IAFM phailed since it removed the torque dip in Campro. I also don't think CPS phailed although it maybe not as great as VTEC. At least it allows me to get 0-100km/h approx at 10sec and to 175km/h in 35sec without any modification. why CPS and IAFM/VIM phails??... VIM phails because there isnt any major difference manipulating the intake length path... CPS phails because the higher cam profile isnt as great/powerful/high as vtec or mivec..... wait, i dont think it is necessary since there isnt any significant switchover between both cam profile... haha... CPS and vvt is totally different thing lah... vvt/dvvt/vvti all those manipulates the cam timing (advance or retard according to driving condition/style)... while cps the technology of the valvetrain, similar to vtec or mivec.... Both 'valve timing' and 'lift' has its own advantage and disadvantage. Thats why I said that VVT-L is better since it has both. Valve timing at low rev and lift at high rev. I-Vtec uses solenoid to control the valve lift, giving it variable lift. CPS uses VIM and lift to produce a 3 stage engine operation. xzoukx liked this post
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Apr 8 2008, 09:31 PM
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#16
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QUOTE(the_catacombs @ Apr 8 2008, 09:25 PM) okla... dont say it fail la... say it incomplete.... isnt outstanding.... True2.. CPS can't be considered as a perfect engine, more like a decent engine only. It actually quite challenging to do R&D for Campro as the cost is high and total sell volume is quite low compared with other engine. Thats why they use CPS from Lotus.vtec engines took years and millions of money to improve its technology... we'll see how cps will fair in the future... yea... jz like malaysia football.... didnt lose 10-0 consider ok lor.... lost 2-0 considered win as well... About the torque dip, it is a problem that should exist in the fist place until someone decided to release the Campro without the cam profile system. |
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Apr 8 2008, 09:49 PM
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#17
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QUOTE(Max @ Apr 8 2008, 09:45 PM) how the cps operate? No idea.. interested to know also. i mean, like vtec it uses rocker arm n solenoid to allow oil pressure engage the high lift rocker arm. got any cps cross/cut away section of engine/head ar? Found this.. but cannot understand oso http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KkE6oQnCuWI&feature=related This post has been edited by sphiroth: Apr 8 2008, 10:02 PM |
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Apr 8 2008, 10:35 PM
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QUOTE(imperialrealcs @ Apr 8 2008, 10:30 PM) 2 set of cam since it is DOHC, not because it is CPS.. they have 2 sets of lobe on 1 camshaft CPS is considered a VVT system as it varies the valve timing but not continously.. VVTL-i has been phased out due to bad emission it make.. Isn't CPS varies the lift, not the timing? |
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Apr 8 2008, 11:36 PM
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Apr 8 2008, 11:46 PM
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QUOTE(the_catacombs @ Apr 8 2008, 11:41 PM) since it utilises high cam profile at higher rpm like vtec or mivec, why not make it a little wilder and produce more horsepower??... Since petrol is getting pricier everyday.. This post has been edited by sphiroth: Apr 8 2008, 11:47 PM |
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