i like to discuss the list of common problem which car owners are facing . we only read your problems in CAr club. Can we list out the common problem which is mainly manufacturer fault. Also list out the weakness of the car design and services which you all have face?

This can help new buyers like us to make comparison and make the best choice.

Like this also can open new thread...

Last Saturday went to test drive Suzuki Swift, Honda City and Toyota Vios. (All newest)

The verdict? Swift won.

Toyota Vios worse of all, sat down not even 30 seconds I felt uncomfortable. Headroom not that promising, interior looks very cheap. Both the Vios and City lacks the power which the Swift won. Of course, the City's FC is better, but the great handling Swift offer makes the driving enjoyable. Although the Swift is not that spacious, but as a single driver I don't really care. In fact, both my friend and I who went for the test drive have the same opinion (He's buying the car, not me ).

Anyhow, it's better for those of you who wanted to decide on which cars to test drive them beforehand. About my comments, I know many of you will disagree, but, every person has their own taste right?

wow.another vios VS city thread.

TS, I think those cars are good cars. It all boils down to personal preference

I've both the swift n city, i think in terms of performance, the City Vtec is better that Swift.. R u sure u test drive the Vtec series n not the iDSI?

vios problem = engine sound, wind sound on highway, remote control too far
honda problem= autolock only locks after a few distance thus dangerous.

it's not few distance...it will lock when your speed hits 15km/h like that. So, you can drive below 15km/h all the way without locking the car.

many claims swift handling is good but i drove my sis one and i disagree....the suspension is just too soft....when i take corner with the car....i feeled quite a lot of bodyroll.......well unless u are saying u test drove the swift sport then its a different story la....u are saying swift is more powerfull? vios,city and swift has about the same horsepower

i sit on my bro new vios..space for legs quite big.pickup slow.interior not cun.but abit comfortable

mmm...

i belong to latio side..

if from the 3 to choose..

i will get CITY VTEC! proven..since this model was there for sometimes already..everything was good beside some known big buck problem..

for new* toyota vios..errm..heard alot of bad thing..

swift..looks good..but other than that, no friends own that car..cant comment much

This post has been edited by ed1torz: Mar 25 2008, 02:01 AM

test drove all 3 cars...VIOS, City (idsi & vtec) and Latio....

Final decision was City VTEC. In terms of comfort, power, interior and exterior. I actually preferred the old Vios than the new one.

why there's going to be always a CITY Vs Vios Vs Latio Vs Waja thread...zzzz....maybe should pin this one up so there won't be anymore thread like this

Read the title again ... new Vios Problem vs Honda City problem

as many complain, new vios has poor sound proofing ... and the remote alarm not that sensitif

yes, please read the title carefully. this is to streamline the discussion out of other models like swift or latio or hyundai. I have tested latio and hyundai and i cannot categorized them here because the price is 90K above.

I want to compare the closest of 85K car which is Vios and honda.

This discussion is to filter out other discussion other than just problems and weakness in these two model

latio is actually not in the list..if were given the 3..must say lation..lol my pick was never wrong!

chio mah

if u check the torque and such correctly..it's almost sapu..

---

Added on March 25, 2008, 9:19 amohh back to topic

new honda vtec : go for it
new vios: still new (alot of bad comment from interior to exterior to performance wise) a big no no for now!
swift: not bad looking car..sporty..but not much comment on it..careful on high maintenance and parts/accessories

This post has been edited by ed1torz: Mar 25 2008, 09:19 AM

i was testing honda city car yesterday, the salesman asked me to pump petrol for the car and when finally done I drove just a short distance to the main road and stop. the lock havent reach the correct speed and it didnt lock at all. I found the weakness of it. Dangerous for woman driver if your speed have not reach the limit.

the lock u can manually use your hand and lock it what
aiyo


like that also problem meh?
so lazy ah?

sheeesh...........

even worse the lock is still using the old fashion lock. well , u know men seldom do that often. Have u heard of Myvi Brake lock? I think Myvi car came out long ago than Honda .

errr previous gen vios also what, jalan abit then only lock...

and what is so hard in manually locking the car yourself? <-- my main point....

love the front design of that latio . I don't think that bodykit is available here though. Haven't seen anyone using that bodykit on their latio.

coming in soon...lol..

back to topic please..

old fashion lo:w

New Vios G Oct 07: pickup good, stable, and no major problem. Belting problem (squeeking) on cold start, rectified/fixed on 3rd service. Now all quiet. I heard the belting problem for Vios is quite common. Feels empty, simple, spacious, rougher/coarser, but nice to touch.


City VTEC March 08: pickup linear, stable, builtin antenna (pre Nov07 is not), updated TCU - engine break now stronger, suspension harder than new Vios and also previous City VTEC (pre Nov07). So far engine more quieter than new Vios. Cannot play MP3, stock ICE is not as good as Vios, a little stuffed (lesser space) compare to new Vios and also lesser compartment/pocket to put things vs Vios. Feels like more attention to detail, more delicate, more refinement but not nice to touch.


As for the 'auto' lock of City, this is Cobra alarm system, with speed >=20kmph it will lock the door for forgetful driver safety - the driver should lock the car him/herself. Almost all Honda & Toyota cars are like that.

Unlike el-cheapo alarm that just lock the door when you press the brake pedal hard - even you traveled to 100kmph and never press brake before, the door is still not lock. Learn to lock your car when everyone is on board before starting the car.


As for major problem, usually are isolated cases.



This post has been edited by dstl1128: Mar 25 2008, 10:34 AM

i would say the el-cheapo alarm did better job than the speed thingy..
both car mentioned is auto with gear stick to P when parking.. by pressing the brake (which lock the door), then only u can pull the stick to ur desired operation.. and i would say 95% of people will press brake before run the car

I agree with dstl1128. What's so hard about locking the door yourself. The auto lock is just an additional feature to assist forgetful drivers forgets to lock his door.

This is not a problem also. It's technology!

Little confusion here, the 'auto' lock I mean, is not the AT lock but is the auto door lock.

Press brake depends on the sensitivity of the el-cheapo alarm system, sometimes it is just a light touch, sometimes it needs a hard press. And sometimes it is non-deterministic - it won't even lock when simply just pressing the brake itself.

Also most el-cheapo alarm system will unlock the door when car start - good for hijackers.


This post has been edited by dstl1128: Mar 25 2008, 11:00 AM

unlock when car starts or the moment the car engine is turned off?

When car starts and also when car engine turned off. Both.

You can try,
1. get into your car.
2. lock your door.
3. start your engine (immediately the door unlock again).
4. lock your door.
5. shutdown your engine (immediately the door unlock again).

I've tried few el-cheapo alarm before, they behave almost the same - seems like they are clone.

Btw, in between 3-4, when I press brake, sometimes it locks, sometimes it wouldn't.

This post has been edited by dstl1128: Mar 25 2008, 11:03 AM

errr... my car the door wont unlock even if i do steps 1-3 ?

super el-cheapo?

Maybe really is super el-cheapo. Around RM200 one.

This will be another sensitive topic again.

But for me of all the car outside, the worst would be swift. My relative owns it and cry. Spare part kill hims instantly. Original absorber cost him RM2k whereby new camry only cost RM1k. Can pay 2 monthly instalment liao . When sell car, value depreciate like meteor drop from sky, he also . Super powerful car (140hp) but kills owner instantly to manage the car.

city feels plastic-ky inside.
dont own a swift so i wudnt know.

vios, wind noise.

barrylin, u toking about swift or swift sport?

swift - 110 hp
swift sport - 135 hp

Sport de. When staring they sell expensive, then price drop till 70k++, many people

swift sport 70k ?
dammit... where?

good buy la.......

It not meant for SEcurity Reason. People when safe they remembers well to lock the car. How about when accident happen or hijacking happen or road rage . When u come down and u try to run away panicking away from the thief or road bully, the moment u speed away, they can still rush and open your door easily.

But with the Auto door lock using Brake system, when u get into the car u may just quickly step on the brake to lock which is faster than using your arm to knock on it hoping that it has lock. u think so!! try it when u panic.

This post has been edited by hackwire: Mar 25 2008, 11:33 AM

Im not sure about the prices of the Swift spare part but if im not mistaken, i heard proton or something liek tht will be selling the spare parts as well.
As i said, not sure about the prices, but usually those locally manufactured spare parts should be cheaper right?

Lawl. Yeah right the thing that I like about toyota interior, although its ugly but it's nice to touch and hold, sounds half deceiving aight ?

no, im not talking about AT lock.. what i mean is new auto car when u wana push the gearstick from P to other u need to press ur brake and by then, ur door will be locked.. or when u start ur engine, juz press brake then u can lock the whole car.. better than the speed lock where u need to reach certain speed to lock ur whole car.. if u park at some lorong and u cant speed up to lock ur car and unfortunately, there is a car hijacker there then

omfg! if u so scared of being hijacked....then please stay at home and lock yourself inside.....even then also not 100% safe cause thief also can break in your house......sheesh....first they complain about proton right hand side signal.....now complain about a simple auto door lock system?

This post has been edited by Pro-MX: Mar 25 2008, 12:42 PM

agree wif tat....
new vios wind noise got a big problem.....

dumb ! dumb!.. its 100% safe with a house of alarm and CCTV camera. face it honda boy. Cars Develop. if u can't accept this reality , might as well dont drive anymore new car. and if u dont like to hear people complaining about your Honda car, why bother to come into here in the first place. Can't u read the topic ? u want to know but cannot accept the Real Facts.

If for manual, that's different. And not all auto car requires you to press brake in order to shift away from P - especially for non-gated shift type.

But well, that's the problem of super el-cheapo alarm system where pressing brake did not 100% trigger the locking. I have few of these alarm systems lol. Of course, I would be glad if they include both 'speed lock' and 'brake lock'.



Truely deceiving.


Hmm... this thread is about problems. Any more?

i dont owned a honda but my parents has one.....if such a simple thing like auto lock also want to complain then might as well dont drive! and dont call people dumb....you are not that smart yourself!

Fren, then how bout the time between u just enter the car and before u start the engine or move the gear ? that time u still expose to hijacker ... and hijacker only need 1s to open the door ...

every system also not 100% perfect ...

sometimes human tend to rely too much on 'technology'

no matter what car you drive, once get in the car, lock the door straight ...

agree with ken on this....could not have said it better

This post has been edited by Pro-MX: Mar 25 2008, 01:40 PM

Just use brake light or a switch to trigger the central locking...so easy.

Just few bucks of mod.

exactly...

i just wonder like that also wanna to argue


so lazy until cannot move the hand and lock the door meh?
practice people, practice

malaysian mentality mah.....lazy! .... my satria neo also dont even have brake lock....this people drive expensive cars still want to complain eventhough got auto-lock system for them

This post has been edited by Pro-MX: Mar 25 2008, 02:30 PM

yup the Vtec. I dunno bout their power, but what my fren and i felt is that its power kinda limited (maybe bcoz both of us currently sitting/driving a 2000cc car).

and btw, my accord oso need to accelerate higher only locks itself (not brake-lock). i dun care bout it anyway.

This post has been edited by ShinAsakura: Mar 25 2008, 03:13 PM

Well, some alarm installer tap on the brake wiring for the trigger.

so u dont own Honda, your parents did. i see how silly people is right now. if its not your problem so be it. i think its a problem and i thnk Honda will change it. I didnt say im smart but not as dumb like you.

---

Added on March 25, 2008, 4:14 pmfren, its not only one hijacking case lah. u want to write rationally might as well write a complete scenario. What i mean also if u try to run away from a road bully who hides a weapon behind. Panic people tend to forget or clumsy when encounter this scenario.

U guys dont have to defend the car, u guys can say people are too lazy these day lah etc like that but there is a flaw. Its not meant for quick escape and lock behind a close door. when u panic, u can't even see the lock..

This post has been edited by hackwire: Mar 25 2008, 04:14 PM

Maybe you didnt rev high enough. VTEC engage at rpm higher than 4k if i'm not mistaken.

L15A VTEC engage at around 4000rpm. This is not a racing VTEC engine.

how often do you engage the VTEC? If do it often the FC sure like drinking water.

Yeah..but most of the people seldom rev higer than 4k. Then they complaint no power.

You bought car with VTEC but didnt want to use it? Better go with idsi if really concer bot FC.

mine F20C or F20Z i forgot d... din reli research wat engine a CF0 using

only rmb tat time my dad drove it at an average 170-190km/h so fun LOL
me....... i dun even dare to break the 150km/h

Good conclusion. Engage VTEC and FC goes bad, no engage VTEC and complain no power. Really, in the end, iDSI sales so much more than VTEC.


Aiyah... wait i-VTEC come then you know, everything will be different and Toyota will be sweating.

i-VTEC limits the power to somewhat under 150-155bhp (not for high displacement car). VTEC is better than i-VTEC in this matter haha..... but FC, i-VTEC wins.

oh, there's a high possibility i'm wrong.

Well, I strongly don't think i-VTEC have such limitation.

ivtec is not limited to 155 BHP la

look at the civic type-R
225 HP wei

i thought we are talking about city and vios? i thought both car only come in automatic variant? i thought both car also need to press brake to release the gear stick

then u r the only champion i know that shift the gear stick 1st before start engine
congratulation

if the alarm got the thing installed, why not use it

Swt just 1 alarm thingy can argue until so tension.

forum is to share info isnt it? doesnt matter i am the owner or not because i drove all the cars in my parents garage anyway.....u say i dumb ah?at least i not as dumb as u dun know how to lock your own car la dumb fark! ... people like this make people pissed off or else i also lazy to argue....u go write to honda japan and complain la if its such a big deal....i also see another problem in honda city la....the VTEC right....activate at so high rpm...i want drive fast also hard la.....i think honda should the engine also! hahahahah! .... oh yeah...VTEC activate faster i also can run away from hijacker easier

This post has been edited by Pro-MX: Mar 25 2008, 06:08 PM

vios problem versus city problem la wei..

dont talk about autolock, alarm and such..all these can easily obtained outside for less than 50bucks (alarm are more expensive la)

now we are focusing on problem!!! not safety

You are wrong.

Yes. No such limitation. i-VTEC uses selonoid to control the valve lift rather than camshaft. Thus, infinite variable lift.

ya lah forum is to discuss mah. so wats your problem when someone point out the problem , brain dead! u cannot absorb ah!! that's u i call u dumb. i said for security reason its not safe when people are panic to close the door instantly. you jump to conclusion like i am scolding your Mama's car.. ahahaah!! see now u ask me to write to Japan. u think this is school ah.. kiddo.! why dont u buy Kandos and eat when everybody enjoying Snickers .

people like this make me pissed off too. so Batu!

ok izzit a manafacturer defect? why cant write to honda if this is their fault right? what does school got to do with writing a letter? lol... nobody see it as a problem...only yourself so go figure kid...if u cant lock your own car door then u are really the one that is stupid...i dont see the japans considered this as a problem to them! u want to close the door instantly.....use your f***ing hand la...ur hand cacat adi cant use? panic then too bad la dei! who ask u to panic...thats human error.....nothing to do with the car! u think calling people dumb will make u smarter huh? so be it
ps: eventhough u can lock your door they still can smash your screen no?

This post has been edited by Pro-MX: Mar 25 2008, 08:44 PM

lol
chill la guys.
dont so tension.
better cut down on the vulgarities else later kena ban.

If u consider the price..City vtec/Jazz vtec should be compared to swift sport. Maybe the TS comparing idsi model with normal swift. both shared almost the same power..n swift is more cheaper.

but swift resell value is damn lor

if u check my post, i only call u a dumb but i refrain from using all the words that is vulgars. you have been using words like Fark, F***King that is so low as a human being .

when i mentioned the flaw when people gets panic, u said who ask u to panic. " that's human error" or perhaps to brighten your dark mind " that' human nature" to be more realistic. What Kind of Human Error you are talking about? this is what separates sanity and insanity.

I don't mind going on and on with this discussion as long as u mind your language or I will report u for using vulgar words. U also call me cacat! It shows your true character .

Let me recap back, New Toyota Problem vs New Honda Problem. Is this one of the Problem which toyota is having it also? I want to know how Toyota Auto lock is?

stupid reply

go read back wat u posting

wondering kids like u can be a dealer ...

He was talking about the hijacker entering your car *before* you start your engine. If you rely on the brake lock to lock your doors, don't you have to start your engine first...

Rely on brake lock, die (but it helps forgetful people).
Rely on speed lock, die (but it helps forgetful people).

Just press the lock button after you close your door. End of story.

Now, flaws. Not really flaws, just things I don't like.
Latio. The name. Always reminds me of FELLATIO. Sedan is ugly. Non-sporty wheels, tyres and brakes for the Sports version.
Swift. No boot space. Looks too similar to Myvi.
Vios. Center meter panel. Uses old engine. E spec. Just give ABS and twin airbags as standard, dammit.
City. 185/55/15 range means true comfort tyres like Bridgestone Turanza GR80 and Michelin MX V8 won't be available. Bumpy. Even with 4 extra spark plugs, IDSI FC not so significant from VTEC's.

These are opinions, no need to argue, there's no right or wrong.

Not whether lazy to use the hand to manually lock yourself or pressing the brake to lock.Some ppl come into the car and forgot to lock it even though they are not lazy to use their hand to manually lock it.Therefore,it is dangerous.

on problem wise, part of it depend your luck too

As far as I know, those using Cobra alarm of recent generation, esp Honda & Toyota (from City to Accord, from Vios to Camry), are the same.

finally, someone agree to me that its dangerous.
its not being lazy or wat but when new technology replacing the old type, many people have switch and some like me already use to QUICK auto lock .
I think Japanese is slow to pick up this detail. Yeah! It's Detailing. Perfecting it.

I dont think im lazy but forgetful.
I drove MYVI and im happy to Intant Brake Lock. Everytime i get into the car, My car just lock. As a Myvi owner of RM 50k giving Honda or Toyota a piece of Advise on this thing is not a good sign for car manufacturer that sells car over RM 80K above.

This post has been edited by hackwire: Mar 26 2008, 11:25 AM

u see, when people forget, its human error already, they should make it a habit, masuk car, lock the damn doors...


technology can only help so much, at the end of the day, its still human


not to say this auto lock, speed lock what ever is not good or not...
the car makers can only do that much and at the end, its still up to us to make full use of it...

Alright the world can blame on human error but not on human nature of forgetful? Mind can wanders away when a person is in distress. Anyway, the car will still lock , period,no problem with that, its not an issue now.

What we are mentioning now is about getting Panic and running away from road Bully. What happen if your car is block by a motorcycle or a car infront. You already came down and you need to flee into your car when something is not right. How quick can you lock the door?

im saying this from experience of getting into the car and lock it as fast as i can. u just dont have time to lock it with hand .

This post has been edited by hackwire: Mar 26 2008, 11:32 AM

dealing with panic,
this one will depends on individual...

some can still be calm and some will just go haywire....


so yeah....

haha!! haywire like a headless chicken running around. anyway, some consider it a small issue, fine with that. anyway, its up to individual choice. I am just closing the gap of flawness because i think MYVI auto brake lock give me that safety . There is one time, when I forgot to lock my car while waiting for someone and somebody suspicious walk to my window and i instantly lock the car with the brake. That's how fast my reflection to this as compare to using your arm. Even if u use your arm, that guy will notice you humiliating him. In the end, he just trying to sell me a fake watch.

exactly, its up to individual...

your preference is something like myvi type of auto-locking...
where as others might prefer the controller switch on the door...
and others might prefer to move their elbow and press the knob...

who is faster depends on how used to it are they lo..
but if they forget... they hailat themselves lo


but if your central locking fail, god bless u then, cuz u got 3 more doors to scramble and lock

so drive 2 door car lo next time

a very good way to promote ur satria neo...

I think Proton should make an ads based on your idea. Make sense and also funny in the same time.

sigh, just add the brake lock module into your alarm system if you think the speed lock function at 20kmh is insufficient. wat iszit so hard? only cost 100-300+ depends on the brand you are looking for. To me, buying a car and alarm system is the last thing i would concern coz its always better to be done outside. what concern me more about buying a car is stuff that you wouldnt change for a new car for mere normal drivers like engine, gearbox, chassis, suspension and etc.

tested vios today and city, vios engine when rev up seems to be noisier than city which is quite true. i also notice that city back seat is more recline and ample room compare to vios. is this right?

i consider dumb as a vulgar word to me too because its offensive to me also.....u can report all u want la for all i care....u think i give a damn? u think everyone will get panic huh? not really ....like what kcng said....dealing with panic also depends on individual...it already show your true character la by calling people dumb!...u wanna start the argument with the word dumb....i also can say other things that are offensive as well

All and all, invent new locking system la.. used fuzzy logic , than every thing solved

lol wut?
you are the only genius who will move the gearshift stick without turning the engine on
isnt that common sense? do i need to write everything in detail so that u can read properly?
sign, adults nowadays kids even better

---

Added on March 27, 2008, 12:48 ambesides, if press the brake without starting the engine will trigger the door lock, arent that very dangerous especially when children go press it as they like???


This post has been edited by imperialrealcs: Mar 27 2008, 12:48 AM

Dumb Boy is back. Dumb is a vulgar word to you than its your middle name now . i dont care a shit you spill out now because you have a diarrhea mouth. i think im going to spare you for reporting to the moderators but let's see how much shit can u shit out now.

what's the fuss with the auto lock?
each of them has their own disadvantage.
i changed my kelisa to some chepo brother brand locking system
window power works very slow, so i open door to pay toll
after toll and drive until reach housing area only got auto lock, why? cause the auto lock depends on break.

now driving honda city auto lock, the auto lock only engage until i reach the main road. why? cause early morning engine not warm up yet and i let the car moves itself until it warms up, all the while below 20km/h

i see no problem for both of this auto lock. just lock it using my hand, either kelisa or city for security purpose. you can't expect me to step on brake to lock my kelisa while i'm driving 100km/h
and also i won't accelerate 100km/h early morning just to auto lock my honda city.
use the work around way.

ok, enough with the auto lock. back to topic, some negative feedback from me about honda city:
- slow acceleration, even with S gear + manual mode. very hard to overtake car on trunk roads
- stiff suspension. not comfortable. malaysian road condition sucks
- engine breaking quite hard. very uncomfortable when in traffic jam. now used to it, knows how to control edi
- wind noise when up to 90km/h. even the SC told me it's normal
- air cond not cold. my previous iswara is way better
- wind screen very reflective. unsure it's due to my tint, but i test drove it before tint, it's still very reflective.


for the advantages, u can find tons of them in honda city thread.

TS should change the titile to "The Battle of the Autolock Design" .

Come on guys, let it go....