Hi all

As fuel subsidies will be removed soon, there is tendency people will switch to non-petrol car... as EV car and infrastructure started a year plus and take years to mature ... what's your thought on hybrid cars like Honda, Toyota? Will you see a jump on sales on hybrid cars during this transition ?

Cheers

Maybe yes.

Hybrid or EV both also got battery inside which need to be replaced.

The petrol subsidy depends how much it affect you TBH, to me currently I spent <RM200 per month for 2 cars combined, if say once subsidy remove price doubled, I will be paying RM400 for the same distance covered, but is that enough to make me change my current drive to EV/Hybrid? I doubt so for now unless my petrol spent changed from RM500 to RM1000 then it is worth considering.

This post has been edited by zero5177: May 17 2024, 05:26 PM

Yes prefer hybrid. Less bullshit

You got the point, it depends on one's milage and fuel consumption.
I have a rather low milage per month. Cheers.

Prius using nimh battery that is safe and cheap

Japanese are smart , they know there will be a transition from petrol to electric cars, Thus they come our with this hybrid cars, heard now their sales of hybrid cars are as good as petrol cars . I think there will be a demand in hybrid car in local automotive market.

Maybe. Last time some people convert their car to NGV when petrol price increase. I am not surprised if some people will move to hybrid without thinking much about anything else but fuel saving.

The H city hybrids are a good practical buy if you want fuel saving without the worry of planning where to charge.

Then you have to worry about 2 things that may go wrong, the battery and the engines.

For 2 cars family, get one ICE. The 2nd car can be an EV to go to office, shopping, pick up kids etc.

If only 1 car, Hybrid will make sense. But then you have to worry about 2 things that can go wrong...the battery and the engine.

From statistic, Hybrid is the most common to catch fire.

Likewise. Electric motor and battery for EV

there are 3 categories

HEV = hybrid EV = normal petrol engine + small ev engine + small battery pack, no more tax breaks for this category that's why HEV's are the most expensive and highest trim level of that car model, e.g. City e-hev, etc. it mainly runs on the petrol engine and the hybrid engine is mostly a gimmick used for pickup from start/stop traffic, extra power when overtaking, or using electric power in the morning to crawl out to the highway while your petrol engine warms up. you cannot charge the battery it is charged by collecting braking energy. think of it like the F1 KERS system only used for a boost

the future for this would be the reverse, meaning it is 100% using electric but the petrol engine will be used as an emergency fuel source of range extender.

PHEV = plug-in hybrid EV = similar to the above except it has a bigger battery pack and you can charge the battery, so basically it is a dual fuel vehicle. this for me would be ideal for the moment as you can safely try the EV lifestyle with a backup. usually the battery would only last 20-50kms but at higher speeds than HEV. you can charge it by braking kinetic energy or by plugging it in, this is why it is called a plug in hybrid.

EV = 100% EV = bigger battery, longer range but dependant on electric only. getting alot of tax breaks so cars are artificially cheaper to buy.

u can also consider conversion

I was shocked when I found out the battery in a Hybrid Camry can only run, on battery power, for ~2 or 3 km.

because it is a gimmick imho
for my prius i usually let it run in 'silent mode' or 'ev mode' until out of the car park
coz need to really crawl else the engine will kick in
i usually want to let the fuel pumps start working for a bit before engaging the petrol engine

When EV is merely a 1.3% of Malaysia car market share, do we really have insufficient Charging infrastructure issues?

https://www.wapcar.my/news/bevs-market-shar...s-removed-79382

So far, living in KL and travelling daily , I only seen once a Tesla need to wait for a charging spot, while most non Tesla charging spot are empty 99.9% of the time

As far as Toyota hybrid and Honda are concerned, let us put these arguments in perspective

When petrol price jumped in Thailand or Indonesia, did we see a big jump In hybrid sales there?

https://www.statista.com/statistics/1282933...ctric-vehicles/

I don't see a significant increase, from 2022 to 2023, do you?

Meanwhile, BKK Auto show tell u , what to expect....

https://www.nationthailand.com/business/automobile/40037099

The reason is simple : Thailand government gives no subsidy for hybrid.

Unless Malaysian government change stands and gives incentives for hybrids , I don't see any stimulus for hybrid sales from petrol price jump . alone.

FYI, Malaysia government did incentives hybrid once... But no more

https://www.aseanbriefing.com/news/electric...-manufacturers/

https://www.aseanbriefing.com/news/electric...-manufacturers/


And I don't think they will change the stand.

Now let's look at Indonesia

https://theinvestor.vn/indonesia-aims-at-th...year-d9876.html

Again you will only see incentives for BEV , sorry not hybrid.

Giving incentives create the difference and partially in certain cases, governments are not the culprit, sometimes it is automakers who refuse help...
E.g.


https://www.bangkokpost.com/business/genera...by-3-car-makers



This post has been edited by EnergyAnalyst: May 21 2024, 09:58 AM

If I'm not mistaken, the cheapest EV car is RM100k which is out of reach for low-income earners or some in the middle-income group. There are no EV cars in the range of RM40k-50k. Even though subsidies for petrol will be removed by the government soon, majority of people can't afford the cheapest EV, not to mention lack of infrastructure especially for people who often travel on long journey outstation trips.

Apart from hybrid, I believe smaller or low engine capacity turbo engine cars will be the focus as demand for 2.0 litre engine or higher be lesser. Apart from reducing subsidies for petrol, the government can also increase road tax for higher capacity engines if they wish to.

I don't know but I suspect people will put hybrid EV (HEV), 1.0, 1.2 or 1.5 litre NA turbos or small cc NAs ahead of full EVs in the event the transition to full EV is more rigorously implemented by the government, for example removing fuel subsidies, increasing road tax on high cc engines or even targeted subsidy for the middle and high-income group although I'm not sure how they can implement it. As some have mentioned here, to me the main disadvantages of full EV are the high price of entry for the masses especially low income group (minimum price RM100k for the cheapest EV car) and the lack of charging facility and cost of electricity charging. Full EV mostly appeal to people who stay in landed properties who have installed solar panel electricity to keep the overall electricity costs including cost of EV charging down. Frequent charging outside may not be economical, though I read some EV manufacturers provide free EV charging for the purchase of the EVs until a certain period, that I'm not sure. Also, as mentioned earlier on the disadvantage of full EV with frequent outstation long journey trips when charging facilities in small cities or towns are lacking, unlike petrol stations where you can find it everywhere.

For the next family car, I"m looking at the upcoming Nissan Kicks which is a HEV which may be useful when the cost of petrol jumps up after the subsidy is removed. Personally I don't think the government will remove a huge chunk of subsidy but do it in several small stages to not put a burden to the lower income group who will not be able to transition to full EV anytime too soon.

This post has been edited by SportyHandling: May 21 2024, 12:22 PM

Petrol costs of less than RM200 for 2 cars combined per month, either you are working from home or your office is very near to your home. Although my workplace is quite near to my home, my petrol costs about RM200 a month for 1 vehicle which I consider to be rather low.

This post has been edited by SportyHandling: May 21 2024, 12:28 PM

Well, I don't think lower income group will be much affected but fuel subsidies will be gradually removed by 2030 or 2050 Net Carbon Zero.

The most concern will be medium income group, only if one can get "affordable" RM70k to RM80k EV or hybrid car during the transition period.

For Japanese culture of "do not cause disturbance/inconvenience to others", this was not gimmick.

Their use case would be last mile into neighborhood after work late (actually social drink late), they don't want any noise to the neighbor.

But with current younger generation generally do not own a car in major cities, and rebel against the after work social activity, yea.... it is kinda gimmicky now...

Hahaha

I’m also the same as RM200-250 per month for 1 car, but I decided to transition to EV and convinced my wife for it
Reason being, it does help reduces the petrol cost per month as well as service cost.

Plus, I’m looking for medium size suv since my current one just compact suv and bootspace really small. So why not just go for EV since B/C-segment Petrol SUV are relatively expensive and not include service cost lagi.

HRV, X70, X50, Madza CX-3, Corolla Cross

Lets do a simple comparison for ICE vs EV.

Say normal sedan car.
1 full tank RM 100 get 400km. (RM 0.25/km)
Fill up 4 times per month means 1600km ( average 50km per day.) make sense?

For EV, taking BYD Atto 3 as reference.....
345km range, 50kWh battery.
taking each RM 0.56 /kWH= that is RM 28
That will be 0.08 RM/km?
which is RM 130 per month for 1600km reference.

this will be RM 270 per month or around RM 3000/year.

In absolute term, it is not a lot, but still substantial right

Take C-segment SUV corolla cross 6.8 L/100km
1600km comsumes ard 110 liters
Current ron95 2.05 = RM225

Electricity cost will be increased hahaha

6.8L/100km i believe it's on highway, but for normal road and traffic jam, hence i think average fuel consumption should be around 9 L/100km.

Cross is hybrid? That’s why so economical?
6.8 not real drive data right ?

elec cost needs to add taxes.... 0.65 is the better number, i'd just use 0.7

FC for Cross hybrid is 4.57 L/100km, ideal case, should factor in extra 20% for city road for more realistic

BTW, today Perodua reveals its inaugural EV... MyVI conversion price not more than RM100k, and no less than RM50k ... Will see

Yes, that is why government is pushing for solar panels installment even for household to leverage down the electricity bill, unless you live in condo/flat will be a bit trouble.

Need to consider, if your current car already no more loan you are loan free and the most spend on maintenance.

You need to calculate also the loan repayment, maintenance fee (tires, services) for new ride + the expected electricity/petrol bill. If the car loan is high and you dont travel a lot is not worth to pick up any also.

Solar panel only can generate 10kWp for big bungalow, for average terrace house only 5kWp. Say, average most efficient sun ray for 4 hours, it only can cover 50% car battery capacity (assume 50kW) ... not to mention house electricity

And make sure your house surrounding without high rise building in future.

Good to know. May I ask which SUV EV have you bought? The Chinese SUVs are looking real good inside out at the moment. As I've commented before, the Chery Omoda E5 looks like a RM300k vehicle when compared to equivalent petrol versions such as Toyota Corolla Cross, Honda HRV etc.

I presume it depends on the capacity option that is chosen since higher capacity will be able to generate more solar electricity power? It depends on the availability of sun light and the angle it hits the solar panel too but that's another matter. I've read that most who have installed solar panels have reaped the benefits, some getting almost free electricity in every month.

And roof orientation & slope too. Like my house... worst orientation for solar panel + it's a steep roof. Won't generate much electricity.

a lot of cheaper EV still cant import into msia just because want to protect P1 & P2, we can get cheaper EV after P1 & P2 intro their EV....
Its not a good move to remove ron 95 subsidy 1st before we can release cheaper EV...

CKD Neta Aya for you? Q1 2025

https://www.wapcar.my/news/ckd-neta-v-to-st...y-q1-2025-79503

Can't be protected for long

Rafizi has cooked up some formula it seems to target the rich and perhaps middle-income also since the Prime Minister already mentioned earlier to distribute the wealth equally. Nevertheless I'm not sure how effective will the implementation be as there are loopholes. For instance, higher petrol price for the a certain group of people while the lower income group continues to benefit from the fuel subsidy. As I've said earlier, the government can always look at other ways to earn more revenue instead of removing fuel subsidies across the board, such as increasing road tax for higher capacity vehicles being one of them.

This post has been edited by SportyHandling: May 23 2024, 07:42 AM

should be easy to get 20 billion more if GST not abolished. Instead trying to cut here and cut there and implement many never-seen-before new taxes.

I'm still surveying as malaysia still receiving new EV car.

Initially consider Omoda E5 but upon close look up.. the rear seat really cramped like my head bong into the ceiling upon entry and even my wife also felt claustrophobic.. boot size. is slightly small compared to Atto3.

hence we drop from watchlist.

Now either Atto3, Neta X or Proton coming EV (if Geely Galaxy E5 within atto3 price range).

Our dilemma as SCMP post below ... still looking for affordable EV car , government should look into lower taxes to promote more people afford to own EV while EV charging station infra are developing : -

https://www.scmp.com/week-asia/economics/ar...hinder-adoption

yea

no need to solely rely on P1 and P2.. can just give grant or one-time rebate (new car only) from customer transition from ICE to Hybrid/BEV.

best if provide focus on B40 and M40 people and set applicable car below RM201K only.

We won’t find any imported EVs under RM100,000 due to the current policy which is seen as a move to protect the local automotive industry.

Here's good stats on EV preference in Malaysia

https://soyacincau.com/2024/05/27/jpj-ev-re...020-april-2024/

I have never put my faith into hybrid because it consists of engine and battery that we actually not saving the cost in long run. Hybrid still need regular ICE service meanwhile in 8 years time may need battery replacement. Imagine hybrid is always 10-15% higher than ICE model. We save some petrol in hybrid but the initial purchase is already more expensive.

EV is the future and battery technology is keep evolving. In China Nio and IM both brands have launched semi-solid state battery that theoretically can last 1000km as claim. Even if it cannot achieve 1000km with 30% off it will still capable to go up to 700km which is pretty decent. IM claim that the battery is 900v and capable to give 400km in just 12 min charge (400kwh charger).

EV tech is not mature yet and the range will get better, charging time will get shorter and more charging ports in the future. Giving another 5 years time we should see more advance EV compare to current one.

Many are 2 cars family. Get a ICE and the other an EV

ev tech... basically motor and battery, are quite mature actually, only production/economy of scale is not here...

ev nowadays is great as city car and its battery should last its lifetime... buy for this purpose and you won't be disappointed...

as for long distances... i prefer more changing stations than longer range battery... for example, my diesel car can go pinang-singapore-pinang with one full tank... petrol cars cannot but is non-issue because plenty of stations around...

technology will keep improving until it becomes uneconomical... next 5 years may see generation improvements, will buy again then

In next 5 years there should be at least 3-4 times more charging stations around Malaysia and more convenient for long journey drive. Of course not yet like petrol which take 5 min for full tank of 600km range, but a 30 min DC charge for 300km range should be very good to carry on the journey.

Hopefully solid state battery will reveal in next 5 years that solve the current problem of EV, longer range and shorter charging time.

imho range is not really an issue now...

lets take mid size 50KWh ev, 350-400km range... this is KL-Kuantan... or KL-Ipoh-Pinang with a quick charge... 6 hours festive jam aside, no issue here...

main problem is queuing... 3 evs in front of you, will be 2hrs later when you are done with your charging

the reason tesla is successful is all because of the supercharger network in the us... anyways longer range and faster charging is always welcomed...

This post has been edited by dwRK: May 30 2024, 12:55 PM

That's why I opened this post on hybrid vs. EV.

And BYD has launched their hybrid (petrol + battery) Qin L and Seal 06 which can go as far as 2100km. There's still a high demand on hybrid during the transition until fossil fuel reduced/extreme high price and electricity from renewable energy are adequate + EV charging station infrastructure readiness

https://www.scmp.com/business/china-busines...fficient-hybrid

question is... Malaysia got or not

cbu hybrid for now cost more than ev

ckd hybrid also cost more than some ev

wanna upgrade my hybrid but nothing catches my fancy...

From China price market, for example BYD Atto 3 is RMB 119k, BYD Qin L (hybrid) is RMB 99k. It really depends on local car dealer price brackets, based on supply and demand during the transition. And the recent EV road tax new structure in 2026, should also include PHEV/hybrid for more people to switch towards greener transportation.

Looks like hybrid PHEV is rising fast than EV especially in Europe. I believe the demand of PHEV locally is rising
with recent launch of Haval H6 HEV and today Jaecoo J7 PHEV , a good transition than EV IMO

I got a latest update from charging companies. The charging companies are willing to invest more charging ports in anywhere of Peninsular, but the holding part is the "approval" from local municipals, bomba and energy authority. Hope Miti or any relevent gov authority can help set a standard to speed up the process. Currently all local municipals have different standard even though from the same state.

Could be the new Planning Malaysia requirement under KPKT, as well as ST, Bomba, to take care car owners and public electric and fire safety. Hope the approval process will be sped up from local councils as well as the charging companies comply with the requirement.

This is true, you need go thru few agency like Bomba, TNB, local authority before you can install the charging station. I also ask Apartment/Condo management they also feedback same for installing it.

Bomba - Safety Concern, TNB also safety and billing issue, last authority green light.

After speed up the process we can see EV adoption will increase rapidly. If people who stay in condo and about 2km got a DC charging station, I believe some people will not mind to leave home early like 30min and go for the charging before heading to office, or people drop by for charging before home.

Why hybrid is still the best choice for Malaysia...




unable to post the link , please go and read the above post on its website.

This post has been edited by auronthas: Jan 15 2025, 10:58 PM

just joined the hybrid bandwagon.