hmm... I'm interested to know more on this also.

I'm in KL. You can PM me if needed.

Good analysis. I'm interested and also received brochures from MBB. Still evaluating and gathering info.

I did a simple excel calculation. Assume 5.5k in FD @3% (very conservative, instead of investing in others with higher returns). Annually compounded.

Yr Int. Cumm.
1 165.00 5,665.00
2 169.95 5,834.95
3 175.05 6,010.00
4 180.30 6,190.30
5 185.71 6,376.01
6 191.28 6,567.29
7 197.02 6,764.31
8 202.93 6,967.24
9 209.02 7,176.25
10 215.29 7,391.54
11 221.75 7,613.29
12 228.40 7,841.68
13 235.25 8,076.94
14 242.31 8,319.24
15 249.58 8,568.82
16 257.06 8,825.89
17 264.78 9,090.66
18 272.72 9,363.38
19 280.90 9,644.28
20 289.33 9,933.61
21 298.01 10,231.62
22 306.95 10,538.57
23 316.16 10,854.73

On CHGS, assume average out 8% flat ROI p.a.
= (5500 x 8%) = 440

440 x 23 yrs = 10,120
Assume worst case scenario, we lost the initial 5.5k investment / land, which is what most of our concerns are:
1) Cannot sell as no buyer
2) MC not going to redevelop/replant after 23 yrs
3) Lease expired

My opinion: The returns are a little bit lower.

However, if we can sell the land >1k, then it is worth it ? 23 yrs locked in with minimal liquidity compared to FD ? Land appreciation/depreciation ?

Note: CHGS 10% ROI p.a. = 11,500 excluding 5.5k initial investment

my 2 cents.

Hi neocapuccino,

I'm basing the FD on annual compounding interest, instead of taking it out and investing in others with varies ROI, which will complicate the assumption-calculation further.

i.e. the interest earned, is top-up into existing FD.

---

Added on February 20, 2008, 6:02 pmHi michael,

Thanks for correcting. I'm new in this CHGS and learning more

I've modified the calculation, to assume the annual rm440 dividend, put into FD with annual compounding rate @3% also. Don't want to further complicate it, if invest in other things, etc.

Bank FD @3% annual compounding
Yr. Int. Cumm.
1 165.00 5,665.00
2 169.95 5,834.95
3 175.05 6,010.00
4 180.30 6,190.30
5 185.71 6,376.01
6 191.28 6,567.29
7 197.02 6,764.31
8 202.93 6,967.24
9 209.02 7,176.25
10 215.29 7,391.54
11 221.75 7,613.29
12 228.40 7,841.68
13 235.25 8,076.94
14 242.31 8,319.24
15 249.58 8,568.82
16 257.06 8,825.89
17 264.78 9,090.66
18 272.72 9,363.38
19 280.90 9,644.28
20 289.33 9,933.61
21 298.01 10,231.62
22 306.95 10,538.57
23 316.16 10,854.73


Assume CHGS 8% annual dividend and put in FD @3% annual compounding
Yr. Div. Total Int. Cumm.
1 440 440.00 13.20 453.20
2 440 893.20 26.80 920.00
3 440 1,360.00 40.80 1,400.80
4 440 1,840.80 55.22 1,896.02
5 440 2,336.02 70.08 2,406.10
6 440 2,846.10 85.38 2,931.48
7 440 3,371.48 101.14 3,472.63
8 440 3,912.63 117.38 4,030.01
9 440 4,470.01 134.10 4,604.11
10 440 5,044.11 151.32 5,195.43
11 440 5,635.43 169.06 5,804.49
12 440 6,244.49 187.33 6,431.83
13 440 6,871.83 206.15 7,077.98
14 440 7,517.98 225.54 7,743.52
15 440 8,183.52 245.51 8,429.03
16 440 8,869.03 266.07 9,135.10
17 440 9,575.10 287.25 9,862.35
18 440 10,302.35 309.07 10,611.42
19 440 11,051.42 331.54 11,382.96
20 440 11,822.96 354.69 12,177.65
21 440 12,617.65 378.53 12,996.18
22 440 13,436.18 403.09 13,839.27
23 440 14,279.27 428.38 14,707.65

FD = 10,854.73
CHGS = 14,707.65

Difference = CHGS returns is 3,852.92 more if 8% ROI or more EACH YR. Please correct me if I'm wrong again, or the calculation is not fair to both FD & CHGS

Note: If CHGS returns 10% (rm550), then yr 23 = 18,384.56
12% max = 22,061.47

---

Added on February 20, 2008, 6:07 pmYes, I'm also interested to know also, if I understand correctly, our profit is capped at 12% maximum ROI.

What is the minimum return we can expect ? 0% ? Negative ? Any annual admin fees/charges ?


This post has been edited by cute_boboi: Feb 20 2008, 06:07 PM

In normal land terms (not just CHGS) it is subject to the local government whether to renew the land lease or not. The RM5500 is your payment to lease the land for 23 years, plus the action of planting palm oil, etc. After 23 years, the land goes back to the owner (Kelantan state govt) and it is their option whether to lease out the land again at another price amount (e.g. 50k per lot after division) or keep it.

Another e.g. is those who bought condo at Tropicana, the land lease is 99 years. If you bought a condo for RM300k there, after 99 years (or whatever remaining years), you have to move out from your condo. The owner of the land can take back the land. You can take the condo with you, if you can take it.

Most likely, for home owners, they will renew the land lease, as in PJ Jln Gasing area, Kajang Sg. Chua area, etc. For agriculture/mining land... not sure though.

In this case, my opinion is after 23 yrs, it is subject to CHGS whether to renew the agreement @RMxxxxx or to offer buy back the land @RMxxx ?

What if the offer price is too low ? And if you don't wish to sell it at low price, you can still keep the lease for 66 yrs, but CHGS decides to leave the land as it is, turn back into jungle ?

Just some questions in my mind... I know nothing is perfect in this world and there are a lot of risks on investment.

To refresh this thread, MAPEX fair at Mid Valley, CHGS is selling a plot at RM7,500 now.
According to them, the price will be RM8,000 if go through bank, and as stated in their brochure.

Any latest comments ?

Update: iProperty fair or something at Mid Valley 24-27 July 2008. CHGS is there selling at RM8,000/plot now.
4 plots = 1 acre.

greenland123,

I'll try to explain from a non-accounting background. Hopefully someone else can explain in better way.

All the money is deposited to a trustee, held by a bank. Every month, the trustee will release X amount for the expenses, land acquisition, seeds/trees, fertilizer, equipment, etc. for that project. At the end of the year, there is a income statement, P&L, Balance sheet, reports to the plot owners (shareholders)

Insolvent as in bankrupt is unlikely, although there is a possibility or risk. Worse case scenario like total lost? (typhoon, fire, flood until the trees die, Hellboy/Silver surfer drop by, disease, etc.) there will not be any returns for the year (or several years) until the trees are replanted and produce fruits again.

If you interested, I suggest to talk direct to the sales person there. I did throw out several point blank questions and the answers I get are mixed. After all, there is a risk on any type of investment.

I heard if those RM5500 wants to withdraw, CHGS will purchase back at RM5500 from you. But they will resell at RM8000. I'm not sure how valid it is, just rumour I heard. Did you sell at RM5500 or RM8000 ?

Also heard rumour it will go up to RM10k per plot. I'm not trying to spread rumour or fake price increase, but just sharing what I heard. I'm not involved or related with CHGS at all or any of their companies.

I'm interested on palm oil itself, and gathering/learning also.

Just to share, recently I received offer with MBB CC. RM9,000 per plot now.

Option 1
12-Month Installment Payment Plan (IPP)
0% interest
Purchase minimum 2 plots, enjoy 3D2N at Palace of the Golden Horses with room rate of RM260++ (per night) inclusive of one (1) or two (2) buffet breakfast.

Option 2
Purchase minimum 2 plots, entitled to 2D/1N stay at Palance of the Golden Horses

Purchase minimum 2 plots, entitled to 2D/1N stay at Palance of the Golden Horses
TCM Wellness package at Golden Horses TCM Wellness Center (120 min) or Aromatherapy Massage at Jojobali Spa at Palace of the Golden Horses

BTW, I'm not working/related to CHGS/Mines/etc.

Yes, as I'm typing now, the KL CPO Future Index is at 1380-1430 for Jan-Apr 2009

Cheque dated 15th Jan. I received on 16-17th Jan (Fri) in KL Bought in Jun? '08 if I remember correct.

I think it is for the period from the date purchased until 31/12/2008. E.g. For 1 lot at RM5000

1st year is 1/4/2008-31/12/2008 = RM300

2nd year is 1/1/2009-31/12/2009 = RM400

3rd year is 1/1/2010-31/12/2010 = RM400

but the 4th year 1/1/2011-31/3/2011 = RM100 is payable at 8% or not to complete 3 years guaranteed return ?

Then the returns for 1/4/2011-31/12/2011 is based on performance, 2%-12%, etc. ?

I have received the 8% cheque from Plentiful Gold-Class Bhd

CNY angpow

Yes, I received SMS a few days earlier about it. Nearly forgot about it already.

... and yes, doesn't matter if DannyOP quit from agent or not. There are many agents (insurance, mutual, etc.) and SI vendors account manager/salesman that come and go every 3-6 months. But he did help to provide some info and his points here previously.

I also not yet receive cheque. Just faxed them the e-debit form.

Hmm... I got SVG GIRO money in my account yesterday, not sure if it is or not, got cent figures.

Can't get that amount from your formula, if I count from my purchase price. If based on your formula, they pay me ~RM400 extra.


If I count 1-Jan to 31-Dec @12% and then minus 0.1% , I still get ~RM60 extra.

Ok, finally confirmed. The amount is from CHGS. I called up and they email me the softcopy.

1/1/2010 - 5/3/2010 = 8%
6/3/2010 - 31/12/2010 = 12%

Less: 0.1% management fees (6/3/2010 - 31/12/2010)

Note that I get 8% for 2.16 months and 12% for 9.84 months, as compared to what you all mention for 8% @3 mths and 12% @9 mths.