i am still working my way up the ranks, while not in any way extremely successful, my teams are still in a pretty decent standing.

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.x...ale&n=Quazacolt

my team consist of 3 australians, 1 singaporean, myself, and 1 night owl american as core.
except the american, all of us on 500-700 latency.

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Added on October 3, 2007, 8:55 amomg l2spell and go DIAF

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Added on October 3, 2007, 9:08 amyes 2v2 is actually much harder than 5v5 due to more rock papers scissors element and less teammates to back you up.

and yes you probably suck. you know you're latency handicapped, perhaps its time to try something different instead of sticking to cookie cutter builds/playstyles that most americans do. i can tell you that it WONT work.

my own solution to this as a latency handicapped rogue is to ultilize overpowering damage to almost any opponents. i know i lag to kick heals/stunlocks etc like other heals, so sometimes i just dont even bother doing them and overpower my opponents with massive dps. with that, even if they can get a heal or 2 off, it wont matter that much as they are still having more dps intake than their heals can output. not to mention wound poisons (your MS) will help in that regards too.

i am looking forward to publishing my own pvp video soon so if you get to catch it then you'll fully understand what i mean. most general rogues ultilize a lot of "skills" via stuns/kicks and a lot of timing based ninja looking moves etc. all i do is just run up to the guy and keep pounding him until he stops moving. latency dont affect that kinda strat at all. unless ur melee kited, then its a different story.

This post has been edited by Quazacolt: Oct 3 2007, 09:08 AM

US arena > TW lolz

world ranks = between US/EU then KR

- yes you are correct, tw arenas are new
- got a major difference. tw teams tend to focus more on dmg than survivability, majority of tw teams are dmg decked while US are 12 stam/resil decked. if you havent noticed majority of US players are ALL 400++ resil decked while TW players are mainly 300-350++ resil decked.
- US team will take warlocks if they are available, but they most certainly can be replaced by either mage or elem shams.
- and yes, team combo isnt a factor so long the needed skills/talents/gears are present. unless your talking bout 2v2/3v3 then yes, team combo plays a major factor as the rock paper scissors element is much apparent than 5v5.
- look at the #1 teams in tw server, and compare it to top 10 team in bg9. its like comparing heaven and earth.

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Added on October 3, 2007, 10:37 amwhats your formula to get 89%? lolz

This post has been edited by Quazacolt: Oct 3 2007, 10:37 AM

yes you do get a decent choice on your stats even for arena gears.

to give an example:

a rogue full dmg decked has only around 10k hp and 330-370 resil max, while having ~26-29% crit and around 1.4-1.6k AP
a rogue with full stam/resil decked will have around 11-12k hp, and 400-460 resil, while only having 1.2-1.4k AP and around 25-28% crit.

see the difference?

while what you say here MAY hold true for TW servers, in US server such combo would only yield top 2100-2300 ratings max. because stacking 2 sp/2warlocks, your losing out on a LOT of variations of skills/spells other class are able to offer to the table. to give an example, having 2 lock and 2 sp you lose out healing debuff from warrior/rogues. that will let you getting outhealed.

yes it "require less skills", but by all means its not something you can absolutely rely on to get to the top. not in US servers at least. and to many people claiming locks requiring less skill, i can personally claim otherwise as i have a very personal experience with them. we just recruited a lock with pretty good gears to be our 7th core, but his skills are piss poor, and resulted us in losing almost 200 ratings on 5v5. needless to say he is gone as we dont need failures within the team.

and you do realize while locks can do all 5 ppl, those said dots can be EASILY outhealed/removed right? the only counter to that is unstable affliction (which is why UA > demo in 5v5 but majority of tw players in 5v5 go demo, which is utter fail) but UA has to be casted, and you certainly cannot cast it on all 5 targets without gettin interrupted by good teams.

MY team is stacked with hunter/rogue (not warrior though as we dont have one), and while 2k ratings isnt anywhere near the top, i find it enough to prove a point where it isnt anywhere as horrible as people may think. granted rogues and hunters are the lowest tiered class, which further proves my point against yours.

and thats what the majority of TW arena members are doing, slotting dps gems.
obviously they arent slotting PVE based dps gems such as +hit/+spell hit etc. but AP/crit etc are dps gems be it pvp/pve.

and i dont know bout you but as a rogue personally, i dont EXACTLY press a whole lot of buttons in most of my pvp.
looking at locks, just 4-5? dots, fear, nightfall shadow bolts, pet silence pet dispel, pet assit macro button, drain life/mana, lolskillcoil etc etc, thats a LOT of buttons to press lolz.
im not saying that playing a lock is easier or harder than a rogue or any class for that matter, what im trying to say is that given that warlocks are op'ed, they still probably take the same ammount of skill as any class to play it at its fullest potential (and in lock's case, being op'ed)

druid HOTs out heal dots very easily, and the ONLY thing locks got against druids are fear/dot. fear will be diminished eventually, and if you got a 2nd'ary healer such as priest/paladin/sham, ALL 3 can dispel or even prevent fear. that solves the dmg portion, cc portion, and COT portion of the lock. and druids at any time can cyclone the lock to prevent UA AND dmg/dots being casted out.


yes perhaps you didnt clarify properly but thats what i percieved your statement as.

for my own team, locks arent our main concern as we got hunter/myself rogue, being anti casters and locks fall under caster category.
our primary weakness is having warrior/paladin combos having a direct individual counters (warrior > me, paladin > priest). or in some scenarios, the prime 4 class present (warr/paladin/priest/warlock), having the above individual counter mentioned above, then warlock > mage. and our team are burst based, we cannot fight for long, and warriors/paladins/warlocks are MEANT to outlast our team to oblivion.

and i dont have to compare the top, mid tier, or low tier arenas in US servers. its basically the same. we're facing the same counters/advantages since 1500 ratings until now 2k ratings. the only thing is different is the quality of opponents and their gear.

yeap, i will stand by my point that talent/skill/gear matters more than your class setup in 5v5's.

nope, not every arena team are fully geared.

take our team for example, go armory all of us.
you'll see that we could still use aprox 3-8k++ arena points to fully gear. yet we're accomplishing what we are accomplishing now as opposed to most teams having much better or even fully geared players.
and gear itself could include gem/enchant choices.

an mmorpg is based solely on gears for the most part if you havent noticed. unlike say, a FPS like counterstrike or halflife etc.

talent? funny you even ask this.
while there are cookie cutter builds, each said builds have their own fillers or points that are actually movable without reducing your overall performance.

thats not all, rogue itself got 2 builds, combat mace or combat mutilate. shamans got elem/resto, priest shadow/holy or even disc for the lower bracket healing. druids even vast, 3 major specs.

if you ask my predictions on where i will stand in the coming 3+ months, i would say top 50 AT LEAST in my bg, or maybe even top 10, im not gonna stop, im only going to keep going and going. ill only stop maybe when WoW is obsolete, or when pvp is no longer viable to be focused on (the dark ages, back in the days, where the only accomplishment you can ever get is from pve)

even if im only top 100, or even if im clinging on 2k rating, or hell even lower.
i still will stand by my team, the same way the stood up alongside with me.
if its working, no reason to change.

again, class setup in 5v5 wont make or break your team entirely. if ur class matrix is weaker against a particular team's matrix, you can ALWAYS avoid them. 5v5 is so well rounded that almost everything is fair play. (save situations like a warr/paladin/warlock/priest prime 4 teams)
again, im not saying pvp or 5v5 is entirely balanced either, but its not something that adding in say hunters, or mages, over warlocks or shadow priests would break your team and totally deny your chance at being a successful arena player.

wowarmory up hamchook, pretty much the world's most successful hunter player. no one think it would even be possible given how bad hunters are in 5v5's, or even in high end arenas for that matter. but this guy did it, thats all that matters.



good effort, but:

1) if being targeted is an issue, simply get another teammate that has higher "threat". eg: shadow priests/affliction warlocks.
2) not nessesarily a good thing as they can monitor and control your healer much easier, so long ur in LOS, and in range, it will do
3) dodge isnt exactly a good thing either, you can only dodge frontal attacks, and it goes without saying that pvp'ers WILL attack you from behind, especially rogues. also, you cant dodge spells. so why not aspect of hawk to take out people faster? or viper when ur going low on mana.
4) thats one of the worse choice you can make, especially if they are SL. fel armor +20% healing and SL and drains would easily translate to an immortal lock. banging over something "immortal" would mean a guaranteed lose for your team.
6) wheres 6?
7) viper sting on paladin without any method to ensure drains, would mean wasting mana. a paladin's cleanse is cheaper than your sting that cost more, and has a cooldown. same goes to marking.

choices are there, its just up to you to take up the choice. im not saying to go something unique as lolstep spec for rogues for example. im talking about the various talents like expose armor for example, almost ALL high end arena rogues dont take them. i do, and its working to my advantage. its it an entirely unique talent by just moving points? no, but is it different? yes. is it a choice? hell yes.

why my team arent fully geared yet? good question. we started only mid-season. and while we are starting up, we had no healer. we basically 5 dps as 5v5. we still managed around 1.6k ratings. until we got a priest. instantly we shot up to 1.7-1.8k ish. now we got a shaman healer to rotate with, again another milestone, 1.9-2kish ratings.

again, 2v2/3v3 is rock paper scissors, there is no denying yet. even 5v5 has RPS element to a certain extent, BUT its not to the point where it will make or break your team.
no matter how you see it, talent and gear matters. if ur insisting on my achievements are solely on skill, im deeply flattered, but i know well our level of "skills" are at. even if we got the skill, latency would be our handicap. so again, it would be gear/talents to back up what we lack in "skill".

first of all thanks for the compliment, secondly, like it or not latency is still present and a problem. you being a melee i dont have to further elaborate.

chasing targets but still unable to touch them even when they are in range (in ur screen anyways) or watching healing bars fly by but unable to kick in time and just wasting GCD and 25 energy to kick blanks... is pretty damn fun. /endsarcasm.
granted, we just overcome them one way or another. no use to cry about something that cannot be changed, might as well get used to it and figure out something else to that is "lag friendly".

i mean we can sit on a bench, whining and crying how sucky latency is, but in the end, does it solve anything? not at all. so why not figure out ways to overcome it? as the saying goes, if there is a will, there is a way.

and no, we arent really rollin with 4dps'ers. we run with 2 setup, 3 dps and 4 dps, the setup that got us the 2k ratings and the most sucessful setup is our 3dps, not 4 dps. 4 dps as priest or shaman is just plain shitty. paladin/druids fit the role MUCH better. but we still do it anyways and deal with what we have cuz we dont have paladin/druids. we need to roll in our hunter/druid anyways and we dont leave out people
we still get results, and thats all that really matters.

that said, we started our 5v5 with 5 dps (believe it b****es) cuz we had no healers. then came along a priest
so we 4 dps with priest ^^
now our shaman grew up, so we add in shaman for sexy 3dps ^^

all in all, 3dps > 4dps. at least in our situation, ESPECIALLY when ur under latency influence. 4dps isnt as easy as many may think. it puts way too much stress to ur healers, and also dps'ers in cc'ing enemy healers or dps.

and i truly believe gladiator shouldnt be far from our reach, only need 100-200 ish ratings
best of luck to you too.

oh shi-

*picture sets being raped by 10 brawny men*

i wonder which hurts more... im currently in favor towards brawny men over star shards

so i take it you like men?

i only hate them when my latency is over 550

lock war pal is a direct hard counter to our "holy trinity" (hpriest mage rogue), yet we owned a couple of those yesterday, netting 205x ratings
goal for the week is 2100 3v3 and 2050/2100 5v5

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Added on October 6, 2007, 10:43 amcyclone on you and 2 rows of dots on the warrior helps raping you dry too lolz

This post has been edited by Quazacolt: Oct 6 2007, 10:43 AM

lolz gogo burn outs

(never had one even after 2 years+, yay me for being a wow addict)