Helo Sifu all,

I have a dilemma, the layout of my house is as below. I have a beam on the right hand side which marked yellow, that's between kitchen and ground floor room. It does not goes up to the roof, just at the first floor, there's water tank above at the roof, I have two options:

Note: There is a water tank above for the 2nd toilets.


1. Remove the column and use RC / RSJ beam to support it back.
2. Move the single floor column to the right and hide it in the room wall making my room smaller.
(This is Original layout. I have drawn another new layout where walls has to come down.

The column is pretty thin as i detected it 6" x 6".

What options do I have ?

Of course the best would be able to remove it without having to shift it.

Sifu, architects, draftsman. Please help.

Thanks.





This post has been edited by enzoch: Feb 13 2022, 01:34 AM

Reds are thick columns that goes up the roof
Orange are ground floor only columns
Blues are beams that runs on the ceiling.

Why do you need a wider entrance to the kitchen ?

What I can suggest (if wider entrance is not a reason) ....

1. Wall-up the existing dining/kitchen entrance.
2. Shift the bedroom wall as per your idea to a smaller room
3 Use the bedroom door as 'new' entrance to kitchen.
4. Make a new bedroom entrance/door facing the dining.

I am no architect or civil engineer, but I think it should be ok to remove the yellow column. The purpose is to support the room wall and door frame.

There is another entrance to the kitchen at the shared wall dining corner. Will that remain or wall up ?

This post has been edited by mini orchard: Feb 13 2022, 06:41 AM

Yes break off that orange column to make dining and kitchen with bigger space to see each other so it looks more open concept. This is an old house build with perfect symmetry, 10 feet left , 10 feet right. So opening up the space this way make it looks bigger.

The modification is like below. You are right, some of my friend who's in construction business said, it MAY be there to support the door but why must it use a concrete steel rebar column?

I need more opinions from sifu sifu here... whether is it safe to remove this column.

1. remove entirely without doing anything (least cost)
2. shift to the corner of the room (most cost) forcing the ground room wall has to move up (L shape) to hide the column
3. use RC beam, RSJ beam.







This post has been edited by enzoch: Feb 13 2022, 08:26 AM

Out of topic. What software you use to draw the 3D layout?

https://sourceforge.net/projects/sweethome3d/

I would say that it need a strong footing to support any joint wall which normal bricks would not be able to withstand any hard impact or if there is any soil movement.

If you see around some neighbourhoods, there are some garden wall fencing which are tilting esp corner units and I believed the columns are merely constructed using bricks.

If you are staying in USJ area, drive to USJ 13 school field to see the extend of the tilting wall fencing. Is will collapse anytime.

This post has been edited by mini orchard: Feb 13 2022, 09:14 AM

I just went into the house and did a roof inspection, the water wasnt there as mentioned before it is located in the diagram below.

Therefore that column is not to support the water tank. The only on top of the column is only the bedroom walls.

If the span of the beam is not long, normally the middle column is not to support the beam if the above is only a wall.

Better to pay for professional opinion b4 starting work.

This post has been edited by mini orchard: Feb 13 2022, 02:56 PM

Whenever there is a column, there will be a beam above it. If the beam is located at any floors but the roof level, it is basically to support the heavy brick wall resting along the beam, the RC floor slab above it and followed by the human and furniture loads. To have it removed without any form of compensation is really a bad idea.

"I am no architect or civil engineer", you said it yourself, hence it is best to stick to "non-structural" comments or suggestions.

The real sifus will be charging you for these consultation, they are known as consultant. The remaining that offers you free advice will be monkeys.

A column is designated to perform load transfers from beam and to the foundation. Removing it without having to compensate anything is like having to sit on a chair with 3 legs instead of 4.

A beam designated for a low rise residential structure usually has a depth between 450mm and 600mm. Imagined having to compensate it with another RC or I-beam side by side of underneath the existing beam will only create a massive structure and also a large mass to be compensated by existing columns. Forget not you are removing a supporting column and compensating it by adding more dead load in the form of RC beam or I beam??

Please engage a professional contractor to perform the task at hand. Having to be pinned down by collapsing structure is not a laughing matter.

This a forum discussion and I did said that to consult a professional for further advise.

If someone were to trust everything in a forum, then he is a nut to believe this is an engineering classroom tutorial.

I have done the same in my previous property which I didnt even want to mentioned to confused ts as I believe such work is best left to the professional as every construction is different.

And is not necessary to open a new dupe account at 2.14am just to reply and that doesnt meant your post is more right since you also advise to seek professional advise, so is best to stick to "non-structural" comments or suggestions, unless an official credential is attached

This post has been edited by mini orchard: Feb 14 2022, 09:17 AM

Thank you sifu all for your comments, went into the house today and redetect all the beams and columns,

thickness of the column and also the beams.

What puzzle me is that the column that i want it remove is only 2 feet 8 inch apart from the big column straight up to the roof.

Please refer to the picture below. Though the beam is not straight but goes in a zig zag manner. can the center beam support it as well ?

If the column is to support the upper floor, it would have been in the centre to even out the load.

Guys, I am seeking for opinions and suggestions, definitely I will seek for professional advice in the later stage. dont have to put disclaimer here and there saying I am not architect/draftsman and please get professional advice.
If every comment I get is asking me to get professional advice. What's the point of this forum anyway ?

Lets have constructive discussions here, (sometimes I find lowyat members Love to be keyboard warriors). Anyway I cant stop you all from being one.

1. Look at the blue beams existing beams
2. Look at the Main big columns red
3. Look at the Orange column I want to remove (small a standard wall 6" x 6")
4. Look at the the distance apart from the main column and the orange column.
5. Look at the orange beam, it is at the T joint of the beams.
6. Beside the orange beam, there's a door

If want to have a discussion, dont have to run down others to prove pov. Let others be the judge.

We can learn from each post.

Pro and cons oredi given .... you decide.

This is a specific discussion. Either it support or doesnt, unless you are looking for majority say ?

This post has been edited by mini orchard: Feb 14 2022, 07:27 AM

I am not looking for majority say, I am looking for a constructive POV.
What I found after all the chat is

1. Dont Remove, It will collapse.
3. Get professional advice.

i dont see any PROs and CONs suggestion as there is no option given at all through out the chat at all, all i get is it will collapse or professional advice

Since this are the suggestions I get, I have no choice to just go for option 3 because non has experience this before, and non is architect or draftsman or expert in this field.

P/s : I like your comment about the support room door. That's what that column does.



SAFEST solution

This post has been edited by enzoch: Feb 14 2022, 07:58 AM

No rightful professional in this forum will give an affirmative answer based on drawings. Even if yes, there will always be a disclaimer statement.

How much one dont like the statement ''seek professional advise', that is what many laymen and professionals would say for safety issue.

Anyway my answers are from an experienced reno. Professionals may not agree with me but that is their professional' rights. Again, dont follow my answers as every house is differently constructed.

This post has been edited by mini orchard: Feb 14 2022, 08:40 AM