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 Use of Ivermectin against Covid-19, LETTER TO NOOR HISHAM

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diffyhelman2
post Jun 14 2021, 02:54 AM

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QUOTE(tupai @ Jun 13 2021, 03:15 PM)
Where did he said January? I thought January was trials for vaccines. Not for ivermectin.
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from a facebook post he made on Jan 22.

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Ivermectin (IVM) and COVID-19
Oral Ivermectin is listed under WHO essential medicines from 2019, primarily as an anthelminthic drug used to treat various parasitic infestations.
IVM is cheap, easily available and safe for use, and in Malaysia is only licensed for use in animals.
Laboratory work showed IVM has broad spectrum antiviral properties against RNA and DNA viruses. On that basis, some clinicians have repurposed IVM with other standard of care against COVID-19.
There are now case reports and case series indicative of potential beneficial outcomes if patients are prescribed IVM early in SARS-CoV-2 infection as the mechanism to limit viral load and prevent severe  disease  progression or person-person   transmission.
A pilot study published in the Lancet a few days ago showed some promising results but the authors concluded that the study “warrants further exploration”under larger trials with clinical outcomes in patients with risk factors or more severe disease.
https://www.thelancet.com/.../PIIS2589-5370(20.../fulltext
The current opinion over IVM is that there is insufficient data to support the use for prophylaxis or treatment of COVID-19
https://www.covid19treatmentguidelines.nih.gov/statement.../
https://aci.health.nsw.gov.au/.../20201223-Evidence-Check...
The Institute of Clinical Research and KKM Infectious Disease specialists are in the process of developing a clinical trial on IVM, as well as Favipiravir to further ascertain the efficacy of these medicine. We shall update the outcome in due course.


This post has been edited by diffyhelman2: Jun 14 2021, 02:55 AM
diffyhelman2
post Jun 17 2021, 08:14 PM

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https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/202...5.31.21258081v1

Favorable outcome on viral load and culture viability using Ivermectin in early treatment of non-hospitalized patients with mild COVID-19 – A double-blind, randomized placebo-controlled trial

Background
Ivermectin, an anti-parasitic agent, also has anti-viral properties. Our aim was to assess whether ivermectin can shorten the viral shedding in patients at an early-stage of COVID-19 infection.

Methods
The double-blinded trial compared patients receiving ivermectin 0·2 mg/kg for 3 days vs. placebo in non-hospitalized COVID-19 patients. RT-PCR from a nasopharyngeal swab was obtained at recruitment and then every two days. Primary endpoint was reduction of viral-load on the 6th day (third day after termination of treatment) as reflected by Ct level>30 (non-infectious level). The primary outcome was supported by determination of viral culture viability.

Results
Eighty-nine patients were eligible (47 in ivermectin and 42 in placebo arm). Their median age was 35 years. Females accounted for 21·6%, and 16·8% were asymptomatic at recruitment. Median time from symptom onset was 4 days. There were no statistical differences in these parameters between the two groups.

On day 6, 34 out of 47 (72%) patients in the ivermectin arm reached the endpoint, compared to 21/ 42 (50%) in the placebo arm (OR 2·62; 95% CI: 1·09-6·31). In a multivariable logistic-regression model, the odds of a negative test at day 6 was 2.62 time higher in the ivermectin group (95% CI: 1·06–6·45). Cultures at days 2 to 6 were positive in 3/23 (13·0%) of ivermectin samples vs. 14/29 (48·2%) in the placebo group (p=0·008).

Conclusions
There were significantly lower viral loads and viable cultures in the ivermectin group, which could lead to shortening isolation time in these patients.

This post has been edited by diffyhelman2: Jun 17 2021, 08:15 PM
diffyhelman2
post Jun 25 2021, 10:22 AM

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QUOTE(desmond2020 @ Jun 25 2021, 10:12 AM)
i don't realised non hospitalised patients need to take risk by consuming invermectin

what is the purpose? low risk group would recover on their own anyway
to credit that with a drug is such a nonsense. shorten isolation time lol
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The authors already anticipated such reaction.

From the discussion section of the article:

QUOTE
One may wonder about the public health benefit of treating mild patients since shortening the period of relatively mild symptoms may not merit a mass drug administration of ivermectin to the large population of non-hospitalized patients. However, inducing faster viral clearance and therefore reducing the time until the patient reaches a state of being non-infectious have an extremely important public health impact.

In short, if we are so concerned about Covid positive patients (and suspected, close contacts etc) spreading the disease, reducing the period of their infectiousness would result in a significant decline in Rt.

This post has been edited by diffyhelman2: Jun 25 2021, 10:23 AM
diffyhelman2
post Jun 25 2021, 10:44 AM

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QUOTE(pimai @ Jun 25 2021, 10:35 AM)
The shortcomings of this paper has been extensively highlighted before.


1) Conflict of interests
authors were receiving funding from gsk, sanofi and janssen , ie covid vaccine manufacturers.

2) changed the end point outcomes for the study mid way thru the trials (thus making their study underpowered)

3) accidentally gave ivermectin to both arms due to a labeling error.

diffyhelman2
post Jun 25 2021, 10:51 AM

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QUOTE(desmond2020 @ Jun 25 2021, 10:45 AM)
so only research favorable to your view is without shortcomings?

wow
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can you stop throwing strawman arguments in this thread? this is serious kopitiam.
diffyhelman2
post Jun 26 2021, 10:56 AM

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QUOTE(gogocan @ Jun 26 2021, 09:26 AM)
Sembang kencang mmg best anything happen blame KKM
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Simple. Anyone want to take off label use of ivermectin, make them sign waiver. Same kind of waiver they make you sign when you take vaccine, btw.
diffyhelman2
post Jun 26 2021, 11:00 AM

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QUOTE(bani_prime @ Jun 25 2021, 10:29 PM)
u dont provide the answer directly to my question.
since some of u propose that ivermectin use for covid prophylaxis. please provide us the research that support it. so far ur source fail to show as such
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And i say you are shifting the goalpost and attacking a strawman in order to derail the thread. Majority of the posts in this thread are talking about therapeutic use of ivermectin.
diffyhelman2
post Jun 26 2021, 11:11 AM

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QUOTE(Cheeky @ Jun 26 2021, 10:57 AM)
I support what you way. Ivermectin has not been approved for use for C-19 by any trusted authorities (FDA, Malaysia MOH or Singapore MOH) but just because you read if on the net or your neighbour said on WhatsApp that it works, then you suddenly know better than the experts.

And yet somehow, C-19 vaccines that are in billions of arms without much problems is deemed unsafe for some people.

I can't brain the logic.
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QUOTE(aspartame @ Jun 26 2021, 11:06 AM)
Because there’s this feeling that something not allowed must be  good and something that’s pushed to you must be bad lor..
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This quote is copy pasted from a channel. Forgive the minor English mistakes, pay attention to the concerns articulated by the writer. I believe he’s trying his very best to expresses his concerns sincerely.

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To be fair on all sides, I think all of us know that with such a "rushed" vaccine, there's bound to be some form of collateral damage.

But the thing about this "damage" is unknown. Because there's not enough testing period to accumulate data. The population became the largest data gatherers. So along the way, more side effects are known.

If our governing body can help us  prove that the cases are not related,  than i think this chat group will also not exist. But the problem is that the family of those injured have too much questions unanswered that makes it difficult for them to move on.

We are just layman trying to lend support to each other. When the professionals in the industry are just as divided by the possible results of the vaccine, who are we to say its ok, its safe.

By trying to get more information,  we are being labeled as anti Vax.
The funny thing is, we are not even entitled to a free packet of 🍟fries (shake shack) if we are not Vax? Since when a matter of choice have become a social bias that business can leverage on?

Everyone knows the side effects irregardless of the scale affect a certain number of people. Though some may claim the number to be low and the benefits outweigh the risk, but who are you to judge whether or not the benefits are larger? If i were to get a stroke, a mild one for that matter, who's to take care of my children,  my family? I have to utilize my own insurance payout to settle my own daily liabilities. So since I have to use my money to settle if anything goes wrong, I have the right to make my own decision as to when I think it deems fit. The articles here serve as an additional information to people like me, to aid our decision making process but they are not making a decision for us.
diffyhelman2
post Jun 26 2021, 12:46 PM

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QUOTE(bani_prime @ Jun 26 2021, 12:34 PM)
so u can concur with me that ivermectin prophylaxis is bullshot... n not a reason to avoid vaccination?
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This is ivermectin thread. Why are you trying to derail it by bringing up the anti vaccination debate here?


diffyhelman2
post Jul 1 2021, 10:17 PM

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QUOTE(6942nole @ Jun 29 2021, 08:55 PM)
yahudee small sample test, got positive result for mild cases patient.
at least 3x more effective than placebo.



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This video is basically about this paper.
https://forum.lowyat.net/index.php?showtopi...ost&p=101326202

diffyhelman2
post Aug 23 2021, 12:34 PM

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QUOTE(lowya @ Aug 23 2021, 08:44 AM)
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https://journals.lww.com/americantherapeuti...tment_of.7.aspx
I went to to look at the paper. I am surprised that this paper still included the Elgazzar preprint data which has now been withdrawn. They should have presented their data without this preprint in it to see if their conclusions were still valid (the main one been 62% reduction in death risk with Ivm treatment).

Edit: more context here

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-02081-w

QUOTE
Before its withdrawal, the paper was viewed more than 150,000 times, cited more than 30 times and included in a number of meta-analyses that collect trial findings into a single, statistically weighted result. In one recent meta-analysis in the American Journal of Therapeutics that found ivermectin greatly reduced COVID-19 deaths, the Elgazzar paper accounted for 15.5% of the effect.

One of the authors of the meta-analysis, statistician Andrew Bryant at Newcastle University, UK, says that his team corresponded with Elgazzar before publishing the work to clarify some data. “We had no reason to doubt the integrity of [Professor] Elgazzar,” he said in an e-mail. He added that in a pandemic setting, no one can reanalyse all of the raw data from patient records when writing a review. Bryant went on to say that his group will revise the conclusion if investigations find the study to be unreliable. However, even if the study is removed, the meta-analysis would still show that ivermectin causes a major reduction in deaths from COVID-19, he says.


This post has been edited by diffyhelman2: Aug 23 2021, 12:37 PM

 

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