there's a long history regarding the formation of pmutual and pb series of funds.. (back at when pm was not fully owned by pbank)

anyway, i supposed you're referring to specific questions (other than general unit trust que)? i suspect you may be interested at the technical/investment side of the fund at which i believe not many agents have any access to (those info that they have are taken from those quarterly reports of the funds)

yes, pmutual agents don't get paid for dealing with pb series fund (and vice versa, although i'm not in the position of figuring out the commission rate, if any for the bank's pfa/officer)

summary - your answer lies in those quarterly fund reports.. get a copy of the funds that you're interested and take a read, lots of read (it gets tiring at first but later on.. you know what to zoom in on).

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Added on August 18, 2009, 11:42 ambecareful of your language here.. you're most likely to have less than a peanut size of understanding about the top-10 private investors in pmutual.

i doubt that you bark because you really 'know'.. but in retrospect.. the very ignorant that you claimed.. you bark because of your ignorance, dood.

This post has been edited by lwb: Aug 18 2009, 11:42 AM

this is why it's the most difficult to be a shrewd investor.. your emotions tell you to look for things that are usually less beneficial to a shrewd investor's mind.

i'm sure you've heard of the adage "buy low, sell high" right?
an-chor lu ki opposite direction le? highest fund um-see currently best fund, u chai bo?

you probably think this is like FD, highest today oso means.. highest all the way..? si beh kau sai lo, ani kuan! *lol*

This post has been edited by lwb: Aug 18 2009, 12:26 PM

lim peh kalu kong oh.. lim peh would choose "education" fund. sim mi si ji le"education" fund le, lu meng wa?

well, invest in learning the knowledge.. hence educate yourself before thinking what's cheap, what's expensive and why it was so (cheap/expensive). asking here won't gain you an iota of plausible knowledge, if you'd ask me. because alot of folks focus on the "what"... not on the "why"

This post has been edited by lwb: Aug 18 2009, 01:07 PM

do you understand what is the significant of a dividend in a unit trust context?!?
i think you're superimposing it as per any stocks in the stock markets.. very errornous.

given the chance.. i wouldn't want my unit trust to declare any dividend at all..
cherroy has it right on-the-money.. look at your nav

This post has been edited by lwb: Aug 19 2009, 12:42 PM

there is.. if you know the right correlations of it's underlying assets.. i've made a near 40-grand in 2 months from such movements from 1 pm fund alone.

throw a dice, and see if it can help you decide..

imho, i find both of your post regarding the preference to unit trust than the stock market and this one.. reflects poorly on your lack of understanding about unit trust.

trouble is, you like the easy way out.. quick profit and all that but you failed to recognize the cognizant importance of knowledge and due-diligence before a choice/decision is at hand..

a good one on that, david
some of us already paying high taxes on our salaries.. this is a good respite to earn something tax free in return.
the mechanism of distribution in unit trust is very different from an ordinary stocks.. i really pity those who opted to redeemed their dividend units as opposed to reinvesting them..

this option should be barred in the first place! for it gets the investor.. no-where!

you don't get much after you factor in the price equalization..
it's not as though you actually get 8cent/unit in cash like from a stock/shares distribution..

does anyone of you here received an "invitation" upgrade to mutual gold elite recently?

i'm weary of what pmutual is trying to achieve here.. it's like creating a layer of cost in the business..

am aware of the requirements and i doubt i met them. the strange thing is.. i think i belong to this category

"Heard that investing in low loaded fund like Bond/Money Market Fund (even exceeded RM500K) is not qualified for MG Elite."

.. that's why i asked, what are they trying to do here? i'll write to them, maybe it's a mistake?

This post has been edited by lwb: Sep 16 2009, 02:25 PM

hi,

i'm not entirely sure about the 99.9% ratio there regarding smallcap.. it's not entirely a local fund mixture (otherwise, the price update would be on the same closing day, but it's not). same goes with alot of other older funds that have taken up foreign parts in their portfolios although i can't ascertain correctly the ratio (only historical records are available via their periodical reports sent to investors)


oh yeah.. sales charges are not charged monthly!! it's charged per sales transaction.. one time.


This post has been edited by lwb: Jan 3 2010, 03:08 PM

and most of the time, pm agents will keep mum(silent) when you ask them about bond funds.. you may wonder why..

it's because they don't get any commission on your purchasing of bond funds. they rather you would stock up on premium stuff.. well, it's their rice bowl (at the end of the day)

hi,
you're correct about the front loading sales charges.. and i agree with you about the minimum threshold return to cover all the charges/commission..

the interesting thing about management fee is that.. it's not so obvious, it gets blended into the fund's accounting before the nav is calculated.. so in essence, the price you get at the end of the day, already has the component of management fee taken into consideration (and thus a separation deduction is unnecessary)..

but yes, the initial 8% is required to cover one's cost in the initial stage/year of investing.. i doubt this is explained by lots of agents selling them.

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Added on January 3, 2010, 3:19 pmi doubt fd is currently at 3.25%.. it's way below that, unless you're comparing those multiyear contracts..

This post has been edited by lwb: Jan 3 2010, 03:19 PM

it's not a fair comparison per se.. a contract like an fd has some sort of exit penalty added to it, especially those multiyear ones.. on the other hand, there isn't any obligation for an investor to stick permanently to a single fund for a consecutive number of years..

so, in terms of mobility and how maneuverable(sans penalty) are one investment cannot be compared vis-a-vis between multiyear fd and pm funds..

in an updated investment paradigm.. "long term" is still being used, albeit differently..

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Added on January 3, 2010, 3:36 pmbond funds/fixed income is a very important component in one's investment portfolios.. i can only assume that your gung-ho approach lightly reveals 2 things..
1. you're still at a young age in relative speaking.
2. you've not been spite by the ravages of a downturn that can wipe off more than half of your asset worth.

if you've not discovered about fixed income funds.. i wonder how have you weather through the 'dive' of march-2009? yes, you may end up better by the end of the year.. but imagine, you've switched away from equities by early march-2009 and
switched back in.. say, at a later stage(for assurance).. in may-2009..

not only your capital is preserved by the 'dive'.. your gain later is fantastic!! > 40%..


This post has been edited by lwb: Jan 3 2010, 03:36 PM

jasonkwk,
probably i shouldn't catagorized 'all agents' in all context.. i've came across some agents(whom without any ties to me as an investor) who spoke strategically about fixed income funds.. these agents not only sells but have their own portfolios of fund to take care off as well..

i believe i've mentioned in this thread before.. the entire bulk of my investment in pm is classified as '99'.. and i've other channels of charity that i participate in than providing it through as sales commission..

let's say that this is out of shrewdness that i've avoided the use of an agent thus far..

that's why if you have alot of money.. i mean, really alot of money.. eg. those that instantaneously make you a mutual gold (elite) member status kind.. you'll have to buy into pm in a shrewd/smart way..

or else, pmutual will have additional monies for their annual dinner, thanks partly to this sort of commissions.. (and of course, not forgetting the fortunate pm agents who brokered that deal for you)..

imagine.. $500k initial investment can generate a commission of $27,500! (i'd definitely like to stand at the receiving end of that payout too for making you fill-in & sign 5 copies of forms *lol*)

wodenus,

if you have a huge capital of investment to manage.. maneuverability without incurring too much cost is an advantage to have.. by saying so, a 5-year fd is by no means the same as being able to "optimize" by maneuvering around with pmutual funds (given within this same 5-year period in scope)

the moment you liquidate that 5-year fd, you'll face a punitive penalty..

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Added on January 3, 2010, 4:06 pmif you look at it from a 'forest perspective'.. it doesn't matter if you have lots of money to invest now.

if you've diligently invested the same sum of money over a period of time.. say, you've managed to accumulated the $500k over 5-year period.. you would've cost you nearly the same $27,500 of sales commissions accrued to the fortunate pm agents..

i said nearly because.. over the time period, if trends can be of a good reflective use.. fees/commission will eventually go down..

if you want to find out more about mutual gold (which their benefits are getting less and less over the years), you can read about them via their webpage at pmutual.. hear it from the horses' mouth, ya?

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Added on January 3, 2010, 4:08 pmjasonkwk,

ask your agent.. he/she has a code, right? ask him/her what '99' is.. if you're unable to get an answer from them, let me kown.. i'll tell you (although i've mentioned it here before)

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Added on January 3, 2010, 4:12 pmanother thing i'd like to mention is... there's alot you can do with pmutualonline..

i was happy to find out that i can even buy into new funds from there.. and thus eliminating from having; an agent/walk-in to do so..

you guys should make use of it.. get in control with your own 'sweat & blood' investment..

This post has been edited by lwb: Jan 3 2010, 04:12 PM

fuuoo.. amortization of cost. that's a nice way to see it (but i would rather marked it to market and realized the cost in the same financial year and keep the rest of the yearsss.. clean)

but it's a nice way to look at it..

i wonder if we can equate sales charges/commission as a sort of deduction of our income tax as agent fees? (how nice if we're able to do that.. lhdn more motivated investors, going by such rulling).. just like how i can deduct an agent fee from a rental(property)

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Added on January 3, 2010, 4:22 pmyes, you've got it correct!! just multiply the total invested amount with the commission charges (regardless of period invested)

try not to complicate a simple issue.. (if you throw in amortization, it starts to get creative and thus confusing *lol*)

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Added on January 3, 2010, 4:26 pmkmarc,

a shrewd way to investing is not solely about profit.. it's also about cost. because at the end of the day.. it's not how much you make, but how much you get to keep and grow it.. that counts..

think both sides of the accounting equation.. what i've invested in pmutual was done at zero cost/commission. that's how i preserved my cost..

This post has been edited by lwb: Jan 3 2010, 04:26 PM

kmarc,

sorry the amortization is referring to something else..
talk to an agent and ask them about code 99.. if they're not telling you, i will (fair?)
i'm not sure if i can be your consultant.. afraid of conflict of interest may arise. you may be advised, but never forgo doing your own due diligence..

hint - agents are doing too!

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Added on January 3, 2010, 4:38 pmi think i see your point from your perspective.. you're correct by the very factors you include in, to substantiate those point.. i think what i use is, a different sets of factors.. and because of it, we have a differing outcome.

i see you view..

This post has been edited by lwb: Jan 3 2010, 04:41 PM

wodenus,
thanks for highlighting that.. *lol*
our context is not medical, yes? keep it within context..

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Added on January 3, 2010, 4:43 pmpm me if your agent is not telling.. *lol*

This post has been edited by lwb: Jan 3 2010, 04:43 PM