Hi all,

I want to hang a few artwork with large frames and quite heavy on concrete wall.
Which drill should I get to do this? Please recommend a reliable brand that is not expensive.

Thank you.

This post has been edited by Slash21: Oct 14 2020, 02:11 PM

Concrete wall, and light duty (less than 20 holes)
can try TOTAL brand. Get this version with 2.5J impact energy will be strong enough for any wall.

https://shopee.com.my/TOTAL-3-IN-1-26MM-ROT...QRoCUQEQAvD_BwE

There is a slightly cheaper version of Total rotary hammer but the impact energy from that - a wired tool is 1.7J only (you might save 50-60 bucks but it might have some issue if you kena stone inside the wall, and I'm thinking that if you wanna get a wired tool might as well get a decent one that will handle anything) - whereas if a 1.7J power is coming from cordless tool we know the limitation but since its cordless we are ok to live with it.

This class of drill is called rotary hammer and will use keyed drill bits (SDS Plus).
SDS Plus bits are very common and you can use any brand (Irwin, Stanley, Bosch, Makita, Hitachi) that is cheapest, it is a common standard.

This post has been edited by ceo684: Oct 14 2020, 03:08 PM

If just for 1 time drilling, try this ....

https://www.12rent.my/

Are the bosch ones better or over rated?

Is this better or lesser than the Rotary:

https://www.lazada.com.my//products/i323316...EX&urlFlag=true


This post has been edited by Slash21: Oct 14 2020, 05:33 PM

Impact drill is NOT the same as Rotary Hammer. It is like kancil vs big truck load capacity.

This Bosch example you shared is an impact drill only, it is NOT a rotary hammer.
Impact drill on concrete will annoy your neighbours as you will take at least a minimum 5 minutes per hole in concrete (huffing n puffing coz u really need to LEAN into the tool summore), because this one is NOT a rotary hammer, it will be hard for it to attain the critical mass to break the concrete, almost like using plastic toy hammer.
Rotary hammer will drill holes in 10 seconds or less. Even a small frame person/females can easily operate one coz no need to press hard, just guide it smoothly and the tool will do all the work.

Concrete is very easy to break if your rotary hammer has enough power (hence they always state power in Joules) to smash through the concrete mass.
2.5J and above is great. 1.7J also can do but kena stone may have issue if your hole isn't deep enough yet.

Real rotary hammer will use SDS Plus (or SDS Max for real big job - construction heavy duty one) bits. Round shank is light duty for brickwall only.

This is SDS Plus bit, notice the slots and keyed grip


Bosch rotary hammer is going for RM419 for the GBH 2-24 DRE. https://www.lazada.com.my/products/bosch-ro...ghoCF5kQAvD_BwE

Makita HR2470 is around RM525.

This post has been edited by ceo684: Oct 14 2020, 08:32 PM

Many thanks for your detailed explanation. So the Bosch model you show is recommended?

For drilling holes to hang artwork or painting, what kind of head should I use?

Yes it will work fine the GBH 2-24 DRE will be perfect for your usage. A cheaper (but decent brand) like total or stanley rotary hammer also will work fine, as you're not doing 100 holes per hour mass installation works.

The bit for concrete is a SDS Plus drill bit for masonry, it looks like these, not necessary to get bosch bit (expensive) but any decent brand (makita/hitachi/irwin/stanley) also will work great as long as its SDS Plus:

https://shopee.com.my/Hikoki-(Hitachi)-SDS-...8386.3245113792

https://shopee.com.my/100-ORIGINAL-MAKITA-T...8128.3633186010

Usually in description these are the things you need to look for:

Hikoki (Hitachi) SDS Plus Drill Bit Broca 6mm / 8mm / 10mm

Features
-Suitable for masonry, concrete and reinforced concrete
-Appropriate for all rotary hammers with SDS-plus holder
-Diffusion bonding technology provides stronger carbide bond for a longer-lasting bit

Model: 401006 / 401008 / 401011
Drilling Dia. mm: 6mm / 8mm / 10mm
Overall Length: 110mm / 110mm / 160mm

Do note, wood plug also got sizes matching the screw thickness and length. You can get the 6mm drill bit that will be common size.
If your painting is like a TV weight 30kg++ then you might wanna consider to use sleeve anchor

Edit: there is also cheap rental option if you just need it one-off basis: https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/381834746188466

This post has been edited by ceo684: Oct 15 2020, 08:13 PM

Does this come with the SDS drill? Thanks.

Unless indicated usually it does not.
Solo tool is just the tool only without all the bits.

Better to buy your own bits just the size you need as its cheaper than all-inclusive because all-in ones will add cost.

Boss I bought a Black and Decker cordless 18V drill thinking that it can drill through my concrete ceiling. But the most I can go is around 10-15 mm. I checked the product spec it says masonry limit is until 10 mm only.

How do I drill a hole deep enough to fit in a 3 cm wall plug ya? Will a 650w corded drill be sufficient? And is all concrete the same? Because I've seen people drilling concrete using 18V cordless drill before, and when I do it it's impossible for me to go any further.

18V rotary hammer or any corded rotary hammer using SDS+ slotted drill bit is the performance level you need.
Reinforced concrete floor slab (ceiling slab) is a material requiring a Mike Tyson punch when drilled. Otherwise all the prisoner would have dug big big hole in their prison cells to escape easily.
And only Mike Tyson punches from rotary hammer break concrete in 6 seconds per wall plug.

18V cordless drill driver, and any cheap corded drill "hammer drill" using those round drill bit basically is all the same regular untrained people like you and me.
If we were to take on Mike Tyson 1-on-1 in a boxing match probably we'll just end up in hospital or broken bones everywhere for life.
And even if you are willing to break every bone in your body just to fight Tyson, to make him even start to sweat will need you to "tahan" like 10-15 mins of his punches.
So that is how ineffective our weak punches are against Tyson level fighter. That is also how ineffective a normal "impact drill" is in concrete.
As per previous post, do not get another "untrained fighter" like me and you aka "hammer drill" to fight Tyson. It is ineffective.

Concrete strength gets harder over time. It can range from our national level boxing champion (maybe not broken bones for you and me but just black eyes) if its freshly cured within a couple years; or world champion Tyson level if its an old building made in the 1980s. You can buy bigger machines for those MRT/LRT rail pieces (Hilti level).

Concrete also can be made to different strengths depending on what the maincon ordered (as per requirement by architect/QS/project engineer). A 3-storey building may not need very strong concrete but typical high rise is like 40-50 storeys nowadays so it has to be stronger.

It also depends on exact material (AAC blocks i.e. lightweight aerated concrete "sponge" oversized bricks) vs RC (reinforced "poured" concrete).
AAC blocks may still be able to drill with 18V drill driver.
RC wall/RC floor slab, 5 mins also nothing much happen.

The question of your wall plug size.. if its one of the wood plug sized like a ciggie or anything finger size, then ANY rotary hammer will work, even the smaller BOSCH GBH 220 PROFESSIONAL ROTARY HAMMER WITH SDS 720W 4-22MM 3 MODES will work fine. Keyword: Rotary hammer

Rotary hammer is not expensive. For minimum standard Daewoo/Stanley/Total ones are around low 200 bucks, the lowest range corded GBH 220 Bosch about 320-330 bucks, and 18V rotary hammer (GBH180-LI)- the TOOL itself is not expensive but the battery is expensive. Since u already invested into the 18V B&D, I was gonna suggest just buying solo tool rotary hammer, but seems like there is none in the B&D product catalogue - prob because B&D is the lowest end of the Dewalt-Stanley-B&D group.

This post has been edited by ceo684: May 24 2021, 01:34 AM

Thanks , was wondering why I'm not making any progress when I'm drilling.

How about a 500w impact drill, will it work ? Just need to drill it in, even if it takes longer time

This post has been edited by victorian: May 24 2021, 01:39 AM

You could have hit a hard stone, or rebar at that spot.
its hard to tell with an "impact drill" since its all a hard journey but more likely the former.
with rotary hammer, it goes in sooooo easily that u instantly know if u hit something - then try again, if really cannot means u kena rebar already.

--------------------------
As per previous post, do not get another "untrained fighter" like me and you aka "hammer drill" to fight Tyson. It is ineffective.
the 500W or 750W is just the eating appetite of the person when it comes to concrete.
if the person cannot throw a punch like Tyson, but the maximum punch is like small kid only, eat how much also useless.
The working principle of drilling in concrete requires the Tyson strong punch to break up the concrete. No need to be fast punches, just strong punches
U use toy plastic hammers to hit the concrete 40000 times a minute the concrete also won't break.

If you still insist to go for impact drill, you need to get something along the lines of the higher end GSB16RE (750W impact drill) which is not cost effective as this machine already cost as much OR more than a rotary hammer itself.

It must say ROTARY HAMMER for concrete.
U don't see installers/contractors carrying the cute orange toys for jobs do you?
They all use rotary hammer (Bosch, Makita, Hikoki).



This post has been edited by ceo684: May 24 2021, 01:59 AM


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A few holes just buy from Mr.DIY, last time was rm99 now maybe add 10%. SDS drill bit 6mm with some nylon wall plug settle. I hang 12U Server rack also can used this impact drill. So far no client died yet from falling server racks. Btw, for sever rack I used metal types wall plugs. Sorry, price from rm99 to almost 175 now
Drills

This post has been edited by adamw: May 24 2021, 02:00 AM

Rule of thumb for power tool, don't get the bargain basement one, easily overheat.
A decent one is only low 2xx bucks and still have secondhand scrap value if wanna dispose on FB marketplace.

TS is drilling few holes only but seriously I didn't realised rm99 5 years ago now is rm175. I used that for almost 5 years + before it konk. Damn worth my rm.

No la not going to purposely buy a new drill, because I just bought the cordless one. I have a impact drill at home, wanna give a go at it first. If really cannot then need to go borrow a rotary drill already

Impact ok ...just need strength to push when drilling plus use metal drill bit. Sure work.

This post has been edited by mini orchard: May 24 2021, 08:45 AM

if you drill ceiling with RC concrete with that you gonna take a long time since ceiling concrete is usually tougher, i bought my cheap Bossman 850w rotary hammer and it still take a while to drill a 5cm hole at my condo ceiling, but brick wall is twice as fast

and make sure you get a good stand and support so that you can push the drill against the ceiling, will take some practice

Update:

500w impact drill can't penetrate at all...

Looks like need to buy another rotary drill again...

Show drill bit head.

This post has been edited by mini orchard: May 24 2021, 01:09 PM

Exactly what I meant.
This toy is like plastic hammer beating at 30k or 40k per minute.

Floor slab is poured concrete but from the hole pic u havent gone deep enough to worry about rebar.

Buy extra drill bits. If drill bits hot it will not go through. I have 5 drill bits standby. If less dust produce I change bits. Will have this problem with concrete wall. Ask the hardware guys for the good one. Last longer.

This post has been edited by Noryume: May 24 2021, 01:57 PM

Heat generated also proportional to runtime so you could be right. But any decent *branded* bit for wall plug 5.5/6mm should be able to make 30 holes easily. And these are just normal masonry SDS bits..ie the lowest range (not the fancier ones)

Using new BD drill set, masonry 6mm

Try this ...

Same applies for RC pillar?

My drill ... for column and beam



This post has been edited by mini orchard: May 24 2021, 03:24 PM

Brick wall you can get that many holes. But my experience for concrete, two holes only. This one using just the normal borch drill set. Now have rotary no more headache.

My rumaweep using concrete (RC wall) hence thats why using rotary hammer. Using hitachi SDS bits (valued at Rm2); as it came in a 5-for-9.90 set. I have spares but hardly wear out even went to 2nd bit even when drilling customer place for curtain rails, easily 20 plus holes for 1 unit.

It also depend on right tool for right job I guess. I dont think my wall plug bit (SDS 5.5mm) even exceed 10min total runtime for 30 holes.

This post has been edited by ceo684: May 24 2021, 04:34 PM

for tungsten carbide tip even the cheapo one does extremely well.......so far i havent encounter shitty ones.

only thing to watch out for is the tolerance of the sds part. the bad one may have bad tolerance or get stuck in the chuck.

No wonder using rotary. I just bought rotary last year. So not many experience with it just drill 3 holes . But easily to drill concrete. Last time using normal hammer drill for concrete have to stand by a few drill bit to change when it get hot. If not waste a lot of time to drill many holes.

Technical correction:
The spec on the drill is how big (diameter) u can drill.
The length (how deep u drill) is determined by length of the bit, so it will not be shown on the drill (ie. irrelevant).
A short 6mm hole and a longer 6mm hole - to the drill - is the same effort because it's drilling the same cross-section area all the time.

RC wall, pillar, floor slab janji RC it is highly recommended to just use a rotary hammer, coz when material (concrete) says you need to fight Mike Tyson u need a professional-level boxer to do it well.
Using impact drill, well no-one stopping untrained people to go 1-on-1 with Mike Tyson but most likely end up "not so successful"

U can experiment taking on Tyson as an untrained boxer..it will be a long drilling effort and u have to press it in, whole arm will shake from holding it in 10mins per hole, if kena hard stone its just impossible without wearing out the impact drill (rotary punch using air piston, impact drill still metal on metal inside the machine)

This post has been edited by ceo684: May 24 2021, 07:37 PM

Mine rumawip as well



I think I can borrow one Bosch BGH 2-26 DFR, which drill bill should I use ya.

Can I still use the 6mm masonry drill bit ?

Buy a branded* SDS Plus bit for less risk. (If that thing break and you not wearing PPE..it can hurt you bad)
There is a reason why the drill bit is slotted for SDS. U cannot use round shank bit with impact mode on the rotary. You will just damage the chuck adapter.

*Branded meaning not the no-name stuff..u can get bits from those power tool makers, even their low end SDS bits also more than enough for home use.

Hitachi 6mm SDS+ https://shopee.com.my/Hikoki-(Hitachi)-SDS-...8386.3245113792
Bosch 6mm SDS+ https://shopee.com.my/CEO-🇲🇾-BOSCH-DR...5456.6022946069

Actually the person whom u borrow the 2-26 rotary from would likely have the bit in their collection already.

This post has been edited by ceo684: May 24 2021, 07:54 PM

mane dapat?? cari kat shopee tapi tak jumpa...

Dulu this guy sell too cheap now he jack up edi
https://s.lazada.com.my/s.219Cd




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Still can't drill using Bosch rotary. Did I do anything wrong ?

Try to start from small to big drill bit.

If you cannot drill though with rotary drill, you may hit into rebar in the concrete.
Please choose another drilling spot.

This bit you using now, is SDS plus or round shank?
How deep (hole depth) have you drilled right now as well?

The correct bit and mounting procedure (push in to attach, push down the ring and plug out the bit to remove) for SDS+ chuck head of the drill, as per 1:42 https://youtu.be/S4K-oAQDBJc?t=102

The wrong one is using the turn-turn-turn one (this is only used for non impact bit like wood/metal only) as per 1:25 https://youtu.be/S4K-oAQDBJc?t=85

So I guess u need to ask the owner of the 2-26 to give the push type SDS chuck head for use with SDS+ 6mm bit.
Then you should be able to drill concrete just fine as per 2:16 https://youtu.be/S4K-oAQDBJc?t=136

-----------------------------------
Coz i see the chuck from your pic, seem to be the 3 jaw chuck used for non impact bit
Round shank cannot grip the masonry bit well enough (slides in the chuck). The SDS operation is boxing while turning (rotating at same time).

Those shiny chrome bits in my pic below (top 2) are round shank. These lose power due to slippage (and also all the impact energy is wasted) and not suitable for your purpose.
The darker ones (bottom 2) are SDS+, where the BODY is fatter than actual drill bit (5.5/6mm) are correct as they transfer FULL power to the concrete.

This post has been edited by ceo684: May 29 2021, 03:15 PM


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you need to use SDS+ head with SDS+ drill bit like the one ceo684 posted, the round shank that you are using will cause slip and the drill bit will stuck in concrete and damage the chuck

At the end my neighbor borrowed his china drill and jobs done lel. Drilled through like butter


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Ahh ini baru correct.

Ahh, feel so stupid handling a 800+ drill but don't know shit.

Hahaha after all getting the right tools matter

Already say those Mr.DIY drillz are gooding but /k too many 20k earners aka SKL recommend Bosch etc

Let’s say if im planning to get only one tool for drilling wall and screwing. Is it possible ?

Which one more suitable. Rotary hammer, impact drill or cordless drill ?

Or i must get a rotary hammer for drilling and a cordless drill for screwing ?

This post has been edited by incubus69: May 30 2021, 12:40 AM

Correct boss. The owner who borrowed you the 2-26 should've passed it to you wirh the SDS chuck head. For the 3 jaw chuck/round shank bits, not for masonry use. 2-26 is a powerrul trailer lorry to which a 6mm is just a shopee single package (piece of cake).

Actually all rotary hammer can do 6mm holes provided the correct SDS bit is used.
Using the chuck adaptor with round shank bit it is wrong tool for the job, it cancel out all the punch power from able to be transferred into the bit coz its heavy and it slips.
Not a problem for Bosch tool itself. It was a case of expecting a fish to fly like a bird

Bosch for heavy duty use, it doesnt overheat easily its not that expensive after you compare with Makita/Hikoki level.

If you dont need to drill concrete at all then an 18V drill driver will work just fine, ie the GSB 180 Li - this will drill brickwall (clay/sand bricks) and tiles (with tile bit, no hammer).
In short, which option depends on ur intended material and is the cordless convenience a must-have.

option 1
For brickwall drilling + screwdriving = 18V drill driver (cordless) will be convenient and 18V powerful enough to drill brickwalls.

option 2
For concrete wall drilling rotary hammer highly recommended, as the primary function
you can get a wired Stanley/Daewoo/Total 26mm rotary hammer for 200-240 bucks. Or smallest Bosch 2-20 for 320.
SDS carbide tip masonry bits (branded) will run you around 4-5 bucks for 5.5mm/6mm size and they last quite well, I think both in pic already drilled 30-50 holes each.

For screwdriving as the secondary function
rotary hammer can be used but you need to be aware:
Screws are easier to control in a drill driver than using a rotary hammer. Coz drill driver will skip by ratchet torque limiter but rotary hammer always max torque for drilling, u need to be careful always press in the screw hard otherwise its too easy to strip screw head the moment it jump out of the head.

Also rotary hammer can a bit hard to use one-handed due to the size, normally u should start the first turn with normal screwdriver first.
If cordless functionality is important maybe get a 12V drill driver GSB120LI/GSR120LI.
This GSB120 maxes out at 8mm for brickwall so its not very powerful. To be used as a screwdriver it is very capable.

option 3
For the purple section (option 2) additional consideration.. if you are doing two tools, cordless rotary + cordless drill driver in both 18V are not expensive for the tool itself vs corded, just the battery + charger need investment.

This post has been edited by ceo684: May 30 2021, 01:44 AM

Boss CEO, let's say u have a budget of 100+, which one of the SDS drill below will you buy:

4S Professional S1118 SDS Plus Impact Rotary Hammer Drill 5pcs BOSCH& Makita Drill / Chisel Bits +, 1 Year Warranty | https://s.lazada.com.my/s.2WOPE

RM178


Or



Check out KTO ROTARY HAMMER DRILL 2-26 26MM SET + 2PCS 10MM x 165MM SDS PLUS CHISEL for RM133.90. Get it on Shopee now! https://shopee.com.my/product/170086754/641...66-1622381418.9.

RM134

Hi @victorian,
the cheapest one.. I do not recommend because what u see isnt what they send.. is diff item


For 195, get the DAEWOO 850W 4 IN 1 Rotary Hammer Drill DARH-26SRE
at least it will last you 10 years easily without worrying too much whether the machine start to fall apart at the control switches
https://shopee.com.my/DAEWOO-850W-4-IN-1-Ro...7400.5462085701

Package Includes :
1 x Daewoo Rotary Hammer
1 x Depth Gauge
1 x 13mm Drill Chuck Adaptor this is used for the HSS (black round shank bits) u have in ur collection for Wood/Metal (NO impact)
4 x SDS Masonry Drill Bit = 5, 6, 8, 10mm (150mm Length) these are the ones u need for Concrete wall plug drilling. Add bits if necessary (there's 5.5mm RM4-ish or cheaper if u find 6mm too loose)
2 x SDS Hacker Chisel Bit Flat & Point in case you need to break holes in the wall
2 x Carbon Brushes

after buying rotary hammer, u will use only SDS+ masonry bits for wall/concrete.
the existing masonry round shank u have,
can keep as collection/demo use just like my round shank masonry bit, thats why they are still shiny

This post has been edited by ceo684: May 30 2021, 10:04 PM

https://shopee.com.my/NEW-GBH-2-26-DRE-26mm...1878.6466021686

Bosch GBH 2-26 DRE for RM 128? Wondering why so cheap though it mentioned it's from kilang. but still damn dirt cheap.

spec doesnt match from official website.

official is 800 watt. length 377mm

pictures also dont look original

obviously it is not bosch

This post has been edited by slimey: Jul 13 2021, 09:19 AM

Is there even the word "Bosch" in the entire advertisement?

Oh no, stupid me. I didn't realized that!

If look carefully the title and the option below for model also different yo.

Instead of gbh, it is rgbh

Not stupid, we tend to overlook that, since the ad is exactly written to make you think so! That's how the seller gets the item sold. And if you raise a dispute with Sh*pee, the seller will state "I sold exactly as the advertisement stated". Ends up Sh*pee will side with the seller. I know, it's happened to me before with some other item.

Anyway, DongCheng is one of the better brands that is coming out of China. A bit rough in finish, and you can see the similarity with other power tool manufacturers, but so far is quite robust. I own a speed control grinder, a wall chaser, and a belt sander of theirs. I also have 3 of their pneumatic nail guns.

^{Edit : grammar}

This post has been edited by stormer.lyn: Jul 13 2021, 02:33 PM