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 How to Avoid "Chinaman" Companies, Tips

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TScoolbuddha91
post Nov 3 2019, 03:02 AM, updated 7y ago

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Please bear with me. Will be quite a long thread. Thanks for taking the time to read it.

I just finished reading the "Chinaman' companies thread, and boy, I'm having a very mild migraine and stomach upset just by reading all the horror stories from the first page till the end.

Took me 2 hours.

I used to think my company is crap, but now my view has changed 360°.

I'm actually preparing to leave my current job (trying to aim another MNC - but actually now my company is also a MNC), but after reading the thread, I thought to myself, "man, will this be a wrong decision?".

I saw one poster replied like this:

QUOTE
I personally worked with Chinaman company small or listed and even MNC before.

You can't compared Chinaman Benefits to a INternational MNC, simply because the Organisation value, profit margin and expectation of job performance .

I seen fresh graduate jumped from Chinaman to MNC for better wages & benefits but can't cope with the job expectation and pressure- go back to Chinaman comp for easier life.

MNC job - pay more & benefit higher, flexible
your job performance review every 3 months
Expect you to contribute more and a lot of processes
In short, stretch your capability and comfort zone

Chinaman - pay can be slightly lower. Benefits a lots lower
Job performance review 12 months or some 6 months
Expectation - as long as you do your parts. Of course some requires multi tasking.
In short, less structure. Provide more room for creativity and initiative for improvement.
Promotion chances - easier if you are a talent.


So, now the company I'm at is the latter one - excluding the job performance review, which is the "Chinaman" company and I'm worried that I can't cope with the job expectation and pressure and lastly need to go back to a Chinaman company for easier life in future.

But still I think it's not really ideal to stay in any company for too long (I'm at the 4th year now). I really want to experience/explore different things. Nevertheless, I feel like I've made decision earlier and I should try it out no matter what.

So, now my questions:

1. How to avoid "Chinaman" company?
What questions we can ask during the interview to determine the work culture so that we don't end up with such company? What are the red flags?

2. Can I email the company before I apply to their job posting? I mean asking questions such as working hours etc.? Or you think that it's best not to do so, especially when I'm desperate for a job and this might hinder them from inviting me to their interview session?


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This post has been edited by coolbuddha91: Nov 3 2019, 10:48 AM
TScoolbuddha91
post Nov 3 2019, 11:00 AM

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QUOTE(DarkAeon @ Nov 3 2019, 08:11 AM)
actually that style isn't unique to a particular race. it is similar across businesses where competition is great, margin is low and funding doesn't come in big pots

as a business, u need to do all u can to survive - minimize cost, maximize productivity.

after u understand this, then what u want to try to avoid isn't 'çhinaman' but particular industry which characteristics u don't like
*
Yes, that's true, I don't think that style is subjected to any race. Well, after govt change le, things also becomes different for the company. I think it's a type of company culture instead.


TScoolbuddha91
post Nov 3 2019, 11:03 AM

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QUOTE(yhcyber @ Nov 3 2019, 09:37 AM)
Inb4 360° = back to square, it shd be 180°....
1. How to avoid "Chinaman" company?
What questions we can ask during the interview to determine the work culture so that we don't end up with such company? What are the red flags?
- You can get some clue during interview session, especially when interviewer told you that they got special holiday during Chinese festival, like Dong Zhi, Mooncake fastival, etc., or even got special holiday during CNY and need to open the office at specific time, then confirm it is Chinaman style company.
- Management, if lots old people in the management, then you got 50% chance that is a typical Chinaman Style, especially if the founder \ top management is building their business from sketch. To know this info, you may do some research before interview \ applying the position
- Company target market, and customer base, this can give you some hint on the company characteristic.
2. Can I email the company before I apply to their job posting? I mean asking questions such as working hours etc.? Or you think that it's best not to do so, especially when I'm desperate for a job and this might hinder them from inviting me to their interview session?
- Usually if you are not even a candidate, they wont reply your questions, just because it is waste of their time + afraid of "spy" (for those typical mindset), but if they reply your email, meaning to say that they are confident on themselves and there is SOP to reply even a stranger email, then you can start to consider on job application.
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Paiseh, bad math concept. 1. Then my company fits this criteria, good thing they is allow us the off day on CNY eve using our own AL. Some don't even let you off during CNY eve.
2. thumbup.gif
TScoolbuddha91
post Nov 3 2019, 11:05 AM

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QUOTE(ipohmali70 @ Nov 3 2019, 09:17 AM)
I suppose you can directly ask the company whether they are Chinaman company or not. 

Nothing stopping you.
*
If they admit. I think they don't even realize that this term existed. I only knew about this term yesterday.
TScoolbuddha91
post Nov 3 2019, 11:06 AM

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QUOTE(hft @ Nov 3 2019, 05:25 AM)
If you own a business, you want to run it Chinaman way or GLC/MNC way?
*
Ang moh way, Denmark way but still have to suit the local culture
TScoolbuddha91
post Nov 3 2019, 11:24 AM

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QUOTE(ipohmali70 @ Nov 3 2019, 11:12 AM)
If you want to suit local culture, then it's the Chinaman way already.
*
Haha, true also. Oh well, what do I know. Only when I work for in a German company in Germany then I will know...

But to be more specific what I mean is if I ever hire a Malay employee, I'd like them to be able to go for Friday prayer something like that. Mindset/concept still based on Germany style.
TScoolbuddha91
post Nov 3 2019, 01:07 PM

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QUOTE(ipohmali70 @ Nov 3 2019, 12:25 PM)
Errrr... Letting Muslims perform their prayers, that's the culture here, Chinaman company or otherwise.

You want 100% Germany style, you need to have the following:

1. Pay RM 10k starting salary for fresh grads.
2. 5 day work week.
3. No work or staying back after 5, absolutely no OT.
4. No WhatsApp/ email after 5pm.  It's against the law.
5. Absolutely no pressuring the employee.
6. 30 to 45 days annual leave.
7. 6 months maternity leave
8. 2 months paternity leave
9. Free snacks tea for morning and afternoon.
10. Subsidised lunch.
11. Free 15 minute massage once a day.

Do the above and I salute you.

Anything less, you're still a Chinaman company.

Good luck.
*
Wow, a dream environment. Looks like it's going to be impossible in Malaysia. but who knows kan...


 

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