I'll be taking A-levels next year. I wish to study medicine. I'll be taking Maths, Bio and Chem but I'm not sure whether to take Physics as a 4th subject. I know almost all unis in the world, including Oxbridge, list only 3 subs in their requirements lists, but for such a competitive course like medicine, is a 4th subject necessary? I'm hoping to secure a place in a foreign university, especially UK and Singapore (does Singapore require 4 subs?) I'm a slightly above average student and I can handle slightly above average workloads, but I don't really enjoy physics (least favourite science sub). Anyone here with some good advice? Thanks!

The definite answer is no

3 A level subs will suffice, if you can do well and even score straight A* s , you could qualify for 100% med scholarships for IPTS

Physics in my experience isn't too hard if you are talented in math ,one of my friends even managed to score A* for physics as a triple science student but for the sake of scoring the best results I had advise against taking it

If you are aiming for UK universities 3 subjects are really suffice. Most of the time, the students here take Biology/Chemistry/Physics without Maths for Med School.
Personally as a Physics/Chemistry/Biology/Maths - 4 subjects student, you are just bring yourself unnecessary hell into the picture doing all 4 subjects in 18 months.

I personally couldn't bare the struggle and finding balance in my A-Levels doing 4 subjects, despite doing well in SPM for it.

If you haven't decided to choose between "Life Sciences" or "Engineering" or other fields, like I was struggling to pick a "Biotech" vs "Electrical Engineering".
I would not recommend dropping either both subjects for Physics or Biology, and most likely try to score moderately in all 4 subjects, aka Bs or Cs.

Biology is a reading subject, at AS most of the stuff in SPM would aid your way, but once A2 it is another playing field.
I spent like most of the time reading and solving past papers for Biology and Maths, Chemistry, and literally threw Physics under the bench.
*Cough* The Topical Past Papers for Biology is horrible and badly organize.
Let's hope your A-Level College has their own topical past papers, rather than the one sold on the market.

If your teacher/lecturers doesn't bring you "light" in either 1 of your 4 subjects, you will definitely crumble in your A-Levels.
I've personally went through alot of bad and rookies lecturers during my A-Levels days and scored moderately with my own personal efforts to just make it into Engineering School, and scrapped past through all those minimum entry requirements.
You won't have such luck, if you plan to do Med School tho. Some of my friends repeated Foundation in Manipal just to get into Med School

This post has been edited by iSean: Oct 2 2019, 10:34 PM

Do you want the A-level past year question for free? Pls PM me.

https://forum.lowyat.net/topic/4832976

IMO, if you truly are a smart student you dont need very good lecturers to score well in A levels

I personally had a very mediocre maths teacher back then at INTI, yet I still managed to score an A* in math ( to be blunt I didnt even rely on my lecturer at all for A level math, everything is due to personal effort)

What I am trying to say is dont worry if you got "bad " lecturers, it really isnt the end of the world especially if you are bright enough yourself

Its all about understanding the concepts in order to score well, and tbh that's the only reason why you need lecturers to begin with

As a general rule, dont be afraid to bombard the lecturers and your peers with questions especially when you cant understand anything yourself, I didnt do much questioning back then and ended up with a B in chem alongside my A*AA which was very annoying back then for me, needless to say I regretted it

This post has been edited by ZenithSkirmisher: Oct 3 2019, 12:19 AM

Depends what background people and how strong is their SPM/IGCSE foundation, and just try to ask people for help and make study groups.

Don't be a lone ranger. If your lecturer can't help you your friends would be the better option. ELSE sign up for PAL session with a student mentor.

I've seen those with SPM and IGCSE and myself personally scored well in those, when it comes to A Level everything went against us.

Can't imagine what life if I continue with STPM 😂

YOU MUST TAKE 4 subjects if you want to secure a place to do medicine at a good U. Some U require you to have physics.

What results did you get at the very end? Can you further describe the struggles as a 4-subject student?

Well my results was okay in SPM level. As I went through intensive tuition classes in SPM, in the last 3 years since my PMR days.

- SPM (8A+/A/A-) - Biology Chemistry Physics Add Maths - A+ / A / A- / A-
- AS Results - Chemistry Biology Physics Maths - a b b d
- Overall A-Level (AS+A2) - Chemistry Biology Physics Maths - B B C D

Personally again I earlier mentioned that I've heavily relied on Lecturers, (even knowing they can't provide the materials I need), and became a lone ranger in studying the content at my own pace (which was slow).
My Add Maths in my SPM period never scored an A- before. It was a miracle to even get "A-" in SPM. Which lead to more struggles in A-Levels Maths.

Also I received 3 rookie lecturers who taught me for all my 3 semester for Bio/Maths/Physics.
While Chemistry I gotten one Grandma lecturer who reads out her notes in class, and we dictates in class, fortunately was replaced with my later 2 semesters. [NOT THE BEST WAY IN LEARNING IN A LEVELS]

Personally I found myself during AS doing alot of Maths, Chemistry and Biology Topical, and got extra time then do Physics Topical.
Physics Topical was scary, as it comes with two volumes. And basically I sidelined Physics for AS and A2.

If the order of time to understand concepts, imho, Biology & Pure Maths > Chemistry > Physics for AS.
When A2 struck, A2 Physics is no longer a subject bounded by formulas, and more theory bounded on concepts and went towards to Quantum Physics / Atomic Physics.
And A2 Biology becomes more time consuming to read, as there are more specific names and processes to read.
And A2 Chemistry would kill students doing "Organic Chemistry" on synthesis and elucidation of Organic Structures.

Physics Concepts you actually need to see the Lab Experiments to see what's going on, depending on school labs, at times you won't really know what is actually measuring and doing.
As not every chapter has labs. And the Physics Lab won't have all the necessary tools to do your experiments.

Mathematics just take more time to understand implicit and partial differentiation, differential equations and vectors and complex numbers.
Try to find solution manuals from online / friends / seniors who did complete their past year papers, because reading the marking scheme, will lead to more confusion.
Also seek for lecturer helps if really stuck even though progress is extremely slow.

But to be honest, after entering Engineering School, Subjects have been so Dispersed, you complete a subject module each semester to sit for an exam for 3 hours, you won't feel the stress of having lack of time and checking with your answers unlike A-Levels.
My CGPA and Grades was the lowest in A-Levels, and I rebounded back during my time in Uni doing a Technical Subject (Engineering). [Not sure this will apply to you in Med School tho]
The things you learn in Pre-U doesn't really apply to Uni most of the time. But hope the learning techniques you experience there, would actually aid you in Uni.

Not studying med, but I applied to both UK and Singapore university so I am a bit familiar with their requirements. For Singapore, you definitely need to take 4 subjects. If you are only taking 3 subjects, 90% of the time they will reject you unless you have some amazing achievement (world top scorer etc). For UK, although they say it is okay if you take only 3 subjects, however, you definitely will have a higher chances if you taking 4 subjects.

But since you mention you don't like physics, maybe you could try taking physics for AS first and drop it if you really cannot handle it or you really hate it. (Check with your college, my college allows us to do it). IMO, it is best to stick with just 3 subjects if you really don't enjoy doing physics, maybe consider other subjects?

I personally took 4 subjects and I find that it is easier than doing SPM as I picked the subjects that I enjoyed the most. (Physics Economics, Math and Further Maths) I hated Biology and Chemistry a lot so I really struggled during SPM. So my advise it to pick subjects you enjoy!

Good luck

Are my chances only higher if I take 4 subjects AND ace them? Unis would prefer A*AA over AAAA right?

Unless ur noble heart is there to help ppl and u are a straight A bright student together with the heart.

Forget medicine. Waste of money absolutely if its ur parents money. Unless ur on scholarship

Saturated.
UK closed its doors to Malaysians even those grad from UK and Ireland
Not worth it to have no life in Singapore and wait long years

U could do much better with other fields.
If we talk abt earning a living that is.

Forget private as well. It will be so saturated when u come out u probablycdont learn much with all the strawberry gens can't even handle after work hours wanna go back on time etc

This post has been edited by Jedi: Oct 11 2019, 11:50 AM

It depends, but uni will prefer A*AAA over A*AA for sure.

If you're aiming to enter Singapore's top unis, 4 subjects is a must, and you need at least 2A*s and 2As in order to obtain a placement there (speaking from experience). However, that's only for courses with higher quotas. IMO, if you're aiming to take medicine there, you MUST score 4A*s, and be active during pre-u. Active as in world-class accomplishments such as Top in the World, participation in olympiads, or participation in national/international-level sports competitions.

Other than that, you need to ensure you have enough capital as well, cause medicine is an expensive course, even locally.

I'm also in the same position with OP (original poster) aiming for medicine, deciding if I should take 4 subjects (physics, bio, chem, maths) and am a foreign student in MY trying to pursue for Seoul Nat Uni. The competition is crazy there so I'm wondering if I should go for fourth subject and it would be worth it.. What's your advice on this one? and may I have a recommendation for uni/col for A levels (concerned about lec & studying environment)? Thanks in advance!

Echoing what I said, taking 4 subjects is a MUST if you aim to enter top universities for medicine, and even then, you MUST score 4A*s to get a semblance of a chance

What about other science courses? Like biotech and pharmacy? Are 4 subjects still required? For Singapore, I know, maybe yes. But what about UK and Australia?

My take on this is, as long as you're aiming to get into a top foreign uni, you MUST always take 4 subjects. However, if your goal is only to enter any foreign uni, just do whatever you want. Most unis are lenient in requirements, and as long as you have enough money, you can study anywhere you want. Heck, some unis even allow students with 4'E's in a levels to study there.

Medicine is a money trap. Ensure it is recognized by our Malaysian government.

If you want to do 4th subject no problem.
I have a friend who did accountings / maths / bio / chem still got into UM MBBS.
So no worries, if you don't like physics there is computer science and other subjects to explore.
Avoid reading subjects if possible

This post has been edited by iSean: Oct 17 2019, 09:13 PM

Thanks for your time, however I didn't get "Ensure it is recognized by our Malaysian government." what are you referring me to check?

Check with the Malaysia Medical Council whether the degree is recognised .

Also , you must also have BIO & BM at SPM level, if you want to do houseman in Malaysia .

This post has been edited by tpleong: Oct 18 2019, 09:33 AM

Malaysia Medical Council approved Universities, if you plan to stay in Malaysia to work.
Else, if you plan on leaving the country like Singapore / US / UK.
See their Medical Council approved lists of universities

Malaysia:
http://mmc.moh.gov.my/images/contents/accr...04_-_latest.pdf


Singapore:
http://www.doctors.com.sg/medicalschools.html

These lists updates from time to time, it is better to try to find one with the least chances of being chopped off by the Country's Medical Council.

Again doing A-Levels to joining back Public University Might be a risky move, but it might be worth wild for RM 20k to 50k for A Levels.
Just don't screw up too much from your A/A*s

This post has been edited by iSean: Oct 19 2019, 10:01 AM

The following link gives you the latest SMC recognised universities update. You will note some of the medical schools listed in the above link are no longer in the latest update.

https://www.healthprofessionals.gov.sg/smc/...dical-graduates

it is a sunset industry. go find other job with better opportunity.
unless, u are too enthusiastic to study and work like no tomorrow.

Graduates of the medical schools listed in the following link are no longer eligible to practice medicine in Singapore effective January 2020

https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singap...ice-in-11459004

Hello, not a very related question but I'm kinda having trouble looking for a college now lol. Right now medicine isn't my only interest but I'm also interested in data science. So I'm planning to take Biology, Chemistry, Maths and Further Maths to keep my options open for both these courses. I'll most probably drop either Bio or F. Maths once I make up my mind. I originally wanted to go to MCKL because it's affordable and I may be able to get 75% scholarship there. It's also not too far from home (I'm a Kuen Cheng student). But unfortunately, MCKL doesn't have the subject combination I want. Unless I make up my mind to study medicine or data science now, MCKL is out of my options. Additionally, I've seen your many reviews on this sub about MCKL and I can see it's quite frustrating. But seriously though, how bad is it? What is the quality of lecturers? How tough and evil are their exams? Do they really use Singapore papers to fail scholarship holders on purpose? Do they test on content not taught in the classroom? Why are there still so many top students coming out from MCKL despite these claims?

I'm currently considering Sunway College. I have no intention of going to Taylor's cause I've been told there is a lot of rich students not interested in studying and only get by on their parents' wealth. Also, the budget is a very huge factor for me. Taylor's is WAYYY too expensive. Sunway isn't any better in terms of costs but at least the people there are not as ratchet, perhaps? And also, I'm planning to join January intake and Sunway scholarships can only be applied for with actual SPM results, so there's that little risk. Accommodation fees is also something to consider.

What are your thoughts on this and do you have any advice?

MCKL can't offer such classes because they separate students based on which Streams.
A - Arts
D - Double Maths and Econs
M - Mixed between Arts and Science
S - Science

Computer Science is C stream for what I heard ?

Anyhow, for Further Mathematics, it would be fun this year around
As Further Mathematics from 2020 onwards will be having an AS paper.
https://www.cambridgeinternational.org/Imag...22-syllabus.pdf

Last time Further Maths, it is only taken in your A2 with Further Maths 1 & 2. in 3 hours paper.

Personally my time in MCKL it was a mess for my class la in the 2015-16 era, especially with competent lecturer issue...
Not sure they fixed up the internal problems within the campus already.
Also the Ex-CEO just stepped down recently. Hopefully will bring in some new change.
But then most of the time you meet your lecturers, not the CEO, so I don't think that would drastically change la.

I wouldn't recommend studying in MCKL because of the lack of study area. Especially during exam period. It is a nightmare finding an air conditioned room to study.
Somemore it is a hot and humid sweaty place in you study in the open cafeteria.
Running multiple Pre-U / Diploma programs in MCKL is really a nightmare I would tell you that

Maintaining a Scholarship in MCKL is a total nightmare, if you are those with moderates SPM As during my era, alot of my friends dropped it eventually.
I find their tested Syllabus a bit illogical and out of Cambridge Syllabus, and dropped my 15% merit scholarship completely after 1 semester.

I spent about RM 30k in MCKL back in 2015-16 doing M Stream (Pure Science + Math), not sure how inflated their pricing is now.
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Anyhow please just close one eye, and just join Sunway College
Lecture groups and Classrooms and timetable there are much better there.
Lecture Materials Quality I'm not sure what happened lah, seems like after 2016 JPA Scholarship stopped, government stop sending students doing A-Levels already.
So I'm not so sure how dedicated they hard core provide study materials now.

But I'm assured their lecturers would give alot of hand outs to do unlike my lecturers during A-Levels

Do you think Sunway is worth it for its fees for 4 subjects? I'm going for the January intake and there's no going back even if I fail to get a good scholarship. A full scholarship requires 9A+ which I think is definitely impossible while 9A's of any kind is 16,000. Are there any other good scholarships out there?

IMHO it doesnt matter where u do your A levels, there are many really good students in Taylors as well. Yes from the outlook they look like some rich spoilt kid with some sports cars or daddykasi big cars or coupe or CX5, but there are also a considerable portion of studious people within.

If you are determined to succeed and focus on your goals, you are bound to no matter where you come from, as long as whatever you do, like other LYN ppl suggest here, u score the AAA+ requirements for the university that u plan to enter.

Do bear in mind it isnt easy to enter Singapore NUS.

And I still want to maintain, if you plan to commit to medicine, be damn well sure you are committed once you graduate, do not waste your 5/6 years of student life only to quit at the end because of job pressure/uncertainties. And yes, the contract based current first batch, some already waited for 1 year, and still cant secure a permanent post.

nus/ntu generally do not take foreign students for medicine anymore....with a few exceptions under the exceptional individuals scheme....there are already not enough places for spore citizens and residents, there was strong criticism for taking in foreign students....

Potential medical students and graduates should read Dr Pagalavan's blogs

https://pagalavan.com/