Hi guys, so lately I've been doing some brief reading on tuning and remapping, and have a few questions. Excuse my lack of knowledge , still learning here for some future projects. I know tunning and remapping are essential if you change to a full exhuast system, to ensure the ECU is working appropriately from the huge air intake (from the exhaust system). In turn it adds some HP and prevents engine damage (though I've read you can tune based on what you want? E.g. fuel economy, more HP, etc...). Here are some of my questions.

1) How does tunning/remapping work? Like does it recode the codes of the bike's ECU from the factory? Won't the engine parts be a limitation no matter how much the ECU is being recoded to balance the fuel and air intake? Do they like add in additional structural parts to the bike's engine? By doing either, will it be detrimental towards the bike engine since the makers have made the bike specifically to perform optimally?

2) What are the steps in remapping a bike following a complate full system exhaust change?

3) I've heard that to tune a bike , there are different types of auto tuners? And each are coded differently?

4) also read that if the tuner (the person who's tuning your bike) isn't knowledgeable, he could possible ruin the bike ? If so, what are the basic parameters one needs to know when tuning?

5) what are the best recommended auto tuners specifically for the Yamaha r25 (yes, not a worthy bike for tuning, but hey why not lol) ? Or are all auto tuners universal?

6) any recommendations for a reputable shop who knows how to tune properly? Preferably for Yamaha r25. What about these - tuneboss and motodynamics ?

7) Thank you for reading these long thread. I hope to learn from the sifus here.

What for ?

actually all the answers u can find online..

just need to do a lil more work.

if u go ask pomen, most wont tell you the truth.. some might even 'bull xxx' you.


so u need to get infos from reliable sources,

any keen scholar will definitely turn to books. ..

for eg like this.. will answer all your Qs..

https://www.amazon.com/Motorcycle-Managemen...gine+management


if one came from car tuning, i think bike is like piece of cake. ???

those car efi tuning like the b series stuffs are all over the internet.. tested n proven for many years..

I see , interesting. Haha, my background knowledge for automotive vehicles is zero. I've googled and many websites cover them superficially, they only mention recode ecu > boom > better fuel intake to compensate for the huge air intake > performance > engine won't die.

Would love to equip myself with some basic knowledge about tuning so if ever in the future, hopefully, I won't get conned lol. Thanks by the way ! You've been very helpful and guided me with all my threads that I've opened haha.

EDIT: I find this website to have covered way more detailed explanation . It's all making sense now haha https://www.motorcyclistonline.com/all-abou...-mc-garage-tech

This post has been edited by kshen: Dec 15 2018, 11:59 PM

Planning to tune my r25 in the long future meanwhile doing some research beforehand so I know what I'm suppose to look out for, though not worth it for a quarter litre bike (yes I know), just solely for my engine to support a full exhaust system - slip ons doesn't give that nice "bassy" sound on the r25.

Are you sure slip ons can't give the sound you want? I've seen multiple types of slip ons used on R25s, and some do sound nice and not annoying. It's usually the one bigger slip ons, not the super short super small acah GP bike one.

Well, I wouldn't say it's a full frontal "experience" but rather based on hours of intense youtubing haha. In person, I've heard the pro liners before, they give off a bit more "louder" than the stock. Currently looking for something more "Bassy". Do you have any recommendations ?

To add, I've already read that slip-ons, if not made specificially for that bike's model you'll need to tune it regardless (some added that knockoffs from original brands may cause this problem). But to my knowledge, Akra and SC does make R25 slip ons, might consider those but the price is a killer. Their sound samples on their website seems pretty good, but with all the knockoffs in the market, I'm a little skeptical to get them owing to that I have no knowledge in telling the difference between ori and fake.

This post has been edited by kshen: Dec 16 2018, 05:16 PM

so .. you considering spending .. 3k++ for full system and ECU just for 5hp gain (if can) and awesome loud noises presence on the road?

and those money you will spend all on a R25?

you got the wrong bike buddy...

1/ how it works, yes basically changes the codes already pre-set in the factory... what it does it tells when and how much to pump fuel... and when to ignite it... a retune, adjusts these maps to acoomodate the changes in ur engine setup.. retune/remap is basically limited by ur hardware. so yes, engine is a limitation... but thats the thing... u are tuning ur map to suit ur engine.... not build ur engine to suit ur tuning. doesnt work that way. when it comes to car/bike builds, u always do hardware first, then fine tune the software to suit ur hardware. a good tune may actually help ur bike to perform better than factory setting. coz factory basically uses 1 tune for ALL scenarios (weather, climate, elevation etc). so a custom tune will suit YOUR bike, with YOUR hardware, with YOUR choice of fuel, with YOUR climate etc etc etc

2/ assuming uve done ur research on available tune options as well as its costs and tuners, choose ur tuner...bring bike to shop (preferably on a hot day) and get it tuned... thats it

3/ i've never heard of a single person in malaysia running auto tuners. id say forget it... go back to point 2.

4/ correct, tuning isnt just about software, it is also a skill needed by the tuner to fully understand what he/she is seeing on the screen and graphs so they can make informed decisions on what to change. hence a good tuner is also important. back to point 2. do ur research... r25 is a super common bike.. so many tuners out there for this bike. as for what are the basic parameters.. no idea.. basics of tuning isnt so basic..diff softwares has diff way of displaying data. do take note though, that no matter how good a tuner is... the risk is always there when u climb on the dyno. and if anything happens, tuners are not liable.

5/ back to point 3.

6/ besides the 2 u mentioned (which ive never researched), theres also dr dyno in puchong and also adam performance in sek 7 shah alam. bike concept in kota damansara. all have different tuning options with different prices. so yeah... do ur research on what they offer, feedback on the tuner etc etc.

with all that said... for ur r25.....seriously, just get a slip on and get on with ur life since all u want is the sound. spend just a few hundred and ull be happy. can be fakies, can be ori.... no need to worry about "specifically made for ur bike" thing. this rule doesnt apply to mufflers imho as mufflers are usually universal... only issue may be fitment but even then, with the correct link pipe, all is fine.

plus with a full system, u can expect quite alot of popping from exhaust even after a good tune... slip on wont really have that.

Clearly you didn't read through my explanations above, buddy. I'm well aware of how stupid it is to do the above mentioned , and I agree , but hey if you have extra money to burn why not . If I wanted awesome loud noises and HP , I'd have went for a Ducati panigale V4s lol. The whole point of this thread is mostly understand how remapping works for future projects, the subsequent questions were solely out of curiosity. Thanks anyways for your helpful input.

This post has been edited by kshen: Dec 17 2018, 01:31 PM

Thank you for your helpful input. Found it very helpful. I've heard many slip ons , sadly none of the sound emitted isn't to my liking which unfortunately I think it's just the sheer nature of how a two cylinder bike sounds like haha. However, do you have any recommendations on some that's pleasantly decent?

u heard via youtube? doesnt sound the same if thats the case. join TTs ull get to hear them all first hand.

n yes parallel twins typically sounds like shit..... and most mufflers will sound the same on these engines... just a matter of volume... i used to own a z250 with a slip on... and i barely heard any difference with other 250cc parallel twins besides volume.

as for wat sounds nice... up to u man...i personally like loud and rough sounding exhausts... so i tend to gravitate towards the SC Project CRT or M4 mufflers although i didnt use these... mine was one of those big carbon fiber cans which came with the bike when i bought it.

Maybe yes I am too lazy to read string of text, apologize for that.

Come join us for TT and ride LYN group.. if you keen PM me your contact..

Yeah, I think that's my mistake right there - trusting YouTube sounds over a tablet haha. I'll check them out , apparently I'm looking for more "bassier" sounds but I guess it's pretty difficult for a parallel twin mesin jahit haha. What's your input on Arrow and akras ?

No need to apologize bro, I too would've done the same haha. You're helping in a constructive way and I , as a virgin to bikes, appreciate your input regardless. You guys don't mind newbies right ? Haha.

as a brand in general... both are good brands with quality stuff.

as for sound.. depends on model... but no diff in my opinion.

a fellow forumer has a ninja 250 SE which comes with original arrow slip on...sounds the same as my chapalang akra.

a neighbor also had a ninja 250r with original yoshimura slip on... sounds the same as mine... but mine is louder.

I also a noob... only mod I did with my bike was adding handlebar riser and a top box...

Youtube doesn't do the sound justice, you need to hear them in real life. And since parallel twin engines sound about the same anyway, you can hear not just the R25 but the Ninja 250 and Z250 as well.
As for slip on recommendations, I would advise to get the Arrow slip on that came with the Ninja 250 SE. These are pretty cheap secondhand and are made of good materials [since they are original Arrow not a knock off].

Thanks bro. I will look into Arrow. If only I can request for a "try on" for the slip on before installing them haha

Lol. Will PM you my ddetails ! Thanks for the offer .

Do you reckon the arrow would have similar effects on a R25 compared to the Ninja?

If you make the exhaust freer flowing, the ignition map needs to be adjusted accordingly.

The built-in stock ECU may compensate to some degree, but it may not be enough. So depending on what you changed your bike might run leaner as a result or you get backfires.

Stuff like Powercommanders & Bazzaz come in at this point. They piggyback on the stock ecu to allow the ignition signals to be manually adjusted even further. So the bike goes on a dyno, and the tuner will finetune or reprogram the ignition map to suit the freer flowing exhaust to eliminate flat spots in the horsepower & torque curves or even to add a few more.

But all this ain't cheap.

The question to ask is... is it worth the cost considering what u use the bike for?

wanna join sir..
which area anyway?

I spent almost that for 0 power gains on my R25

https://forum.lowyat.net/topic/4638131/+20
Not bad stuck by your words.

Words of caution:
1) Chipping/breaking exhaust valves (ironically this didn't happen on my bike)
2) snapping con rods
3) badly filled front forks
4) 3 recalls
5) burning wirings
6) burning stator coils and/or rectifiers
7) burning wiring sockets

You didn't brake at corner with that Ohlins .....

Lies

i am also a witness to this

main 3p

Thanks . Damn , that list makes me tremble. Is there a specific year model that all of those have occured? How does one know whether above has occured? Still relatively new with this bike. I'm praying that the 2018 models would be corrected from most of these problems since my bike didn't fall under the models for HLY's recent recall.

should be corrected.

praying more maybe helps.

my bike power train/engine etc all bone stock.

in Quaza's case.... not year manufacture problem...

but rider problem



This post has been edited by mADmAN: Jan 4 2019, 05:05 PM

I see, did you experienced any of the aforementioned problems during your time with the R25 ?

I've been told the same as well. Do you know what handling methods would cause the problems listed above? Or rather the proper steps in handling a bike? Would like to ask because I've just started riding and have no idea whether the way I ride is considered detrimental towards the bike, perhaps I could get some inputs from the sifus here. Here's what I've been doing/faced so far :

1) Riding around gear 3-4 at 30-40km/hr within town area (maybe less, I don't often see my speedometer as of now) - reason being I'm still not ready for highway rides, even for a short distance. Still learning how to upshift at the right RPM, but usually I upshift around 5000rpm for gears 3-4 , but for gear 1, usually at around 1000-2000 rpm i'd shift to gear 2.

2) Rev-matching when downshifting - At times i do experience a bit of a jerk with a somewhat-loud engine roar, could be improper rev matching ?

3) Coming to a halt at gear 3 then only shifting down to gear 1 while stationary - was been told that this is okay for the bike

4) The standard checks for coolant, brake oil (front and back), engine oil and lubing the chains

5) Speed bumps - Sometimes I come in a bit too fast but not until the point it hits the chasis or engine (no sounds of materials scratching?) but the bike has that "oomph" feeling whereby you can upward force travelling throughout balls till your head.

6) At times when slowing down (eg: when a car slows down right infront of me) I tend to forget pulling in the clutch which causing the bike to have that jerky-soon-to-stall feeling , but never has it ever stalled because I'd pull in the clutch and downshifting + rev match.

7) When approaching the red light, I'd drag/press the rear brakes and pull in the clutch (plus cutting off the throttle) and gently pull in the front brakes, will pulling in the clutch while the bike is moving be harmful? I've heard some say it'd "eat" the clutch.

8) Avoided gravels , muds and stuff

9) Giving the bike a bit of throttle while letting go the clutch slowly during take-off

10) Currently breaking in the R25 until i reach 1000km by not exceeding 7,000rpm as per what the manual stated. But at times, still a virgin biker, I tend to throttle to much with the clutch pulled it, causing the rpm to raise pretty high (but not till red line) while stationary. This happened 3-4 times since the 1st day while taking-off at a traffic light which just turned green.




Lastly, thank you to those who helped I hope my long silly questions are not too extreme

This post has been edited by kshen: Jan 6 2019, 12:18 AM

Pay attention to my post, notice there was only one item I mentioned didn't happen to my R25.


2) yes.

Is your bike new or used?

Wow fck me sidways, that's a lot of problems . It's new 2018 model.

EDIT: What do you think of no.3 ? Downshifting at a stop.

This post has been edited by kshen: Jan 6 2019, 11:39 PM

1/ fine as long as ur comfy with it
2/ yes
3/ this is fine. i sometimes do from 6th on my bike lol
4/ can do this when u service but no harm taking a peek every now n then. for lubing chain, i recommend lubing every time u fill a full tank. wash once a month minimum
5/ normal... slow down lor
6/ usually fine, best to avoid
7/ what ur doing is fine. clutch is only "eaten" when its engaged. pulling the clutch disengages it. stop listening to those some people.
8/ yes
9/ thats how ur supposed to do it
10/ no worries. its fine.

Doesn't matter on 3

Thank you bro for the answers and guide.

Thanks bro.

Thank you guys once more. Really appreciate the replies , especially towards the silly questions