Hiya guys. Need some help from the gurus of warcraft here. I have always played clothies, mage/priest/warlock..but now i'm stumped.

I have a friend in the guild, dwarf warrior, that refuses to act as a tanker.

We have all reached level 70. We are all running lev 70 instances now and gearing up for 10man and perhaps 20+ man raids in the future but for some strange reason he refuses to respec.

His reasons:

1. I have all this elite gear and can churn out high dps. you actually think i'm crazy enough to sacrifice all that to become a punching bag?
2. I can tank well enough... I've been accumulating protection gear so all i need to do is wear em and switch to defensive stance (is this correct? i'm not sure)

Also as a warrior attempting to tank in arms specialisation, i find that he is unable to hold aggro. He claims in every instance run that its the fault of the mages (me included) for dpsing to early. So we let him get 5 sunders in, we release frostbolts & combination of arcane spells for threat reduction and guess what after two shots..mobs start running to us???

My priest OOMs in every run. He says the warrior is taking so much damage that his heals cant keep up and worse he is holy specced. This warrior also has a habit of not following Marks that have been assigned by the leader e.g. feels that he is uber enough to solo a single mob by himself when the rest of the team is resting..that kinda thing.

and whats even worse...he can't progress further than sethekk halls cos he still believes that he can tank??!!

He basically says we clothies have no idea what it takes to be a tanker.

So Main Tankers out there...please oh please tell me how one respecs and gears to be a good tanker cos I really am in the dark in advising my real life friend.

Help much appreciated.

LOL my my...everyone is so into this game anyways its good to hear feedback from you guys. its like a chicken and egg situation now. See the tank is blasting and moaning and complaining that the rest of us dont support him. He wants to get better gear but cant cos no one wants to run instances...so i organise runs for him but he cant tank and the party wipes constantly...soon everyone is avoiding partying with him like the plague and back to square one he starts complaining again...lol

Its strange but he is also the first person that condemns shadow priests for being lousy healers in an instance run...sigh..so i guess his ego couldnt take it when the rest of the party suddenly turned around and told him that he was an awful tanker lol.

with your feedback at least i know what kind of gear to look out for and perhaps what enchants i could try and coax the warrior to get. That way he wont be frustrated at his constant death and plate repair bills and overall people wont freak out when they are asked to party with him to gear him up as a tank.

Great advice guys

coming to this forum can occasionally scare ppl away. we are perceived as harsh.

so how ah?

this entire posting reminds me of the shattered halls question that was ask awhile back. boy, was that a long one.

raid kick
gkick
i sure as hell dont pay for his monthly subscription fee
but he doesn't pay the otehr 24 ppl who raids with him to wipe day after day after day due to his selfishnes

being a guild main tank, you get consumables sponsored... i dont see what's so pain in that

sets and quaz are not arguing 
sohz what did you guys do last night?

Kepoh!
And there's usually an off topic comment like the one above which is usually more about the posters rather than the topic at hand...

Sigh.

Its used to be Healer > all in pug... but now it's different.

Tank > Shadow Priest > Healer > Dpser now...

Hmm... something must be wrong, wtb more heal spec pally/shammy/druid so all priest can respec to shadow.

(Me for one will never refuse to be shadow)

To me if the tank refused to be proc, and if there is no mage water, I'll remove myself from the grp to save my water bill. and put him on my never to grp again list.

lol...ok update guys...wah he was not a happy puppy when i sorta let him know about how to improve..i was diplomatic as possible...same shit like b4, mages/dpsers fault bla bla...clothies dont understand shit about warriors bla bla...sacrifice dps for a bunch of morons bla bla...

ugly story shortened:

looks like he will be playing his "farmer" warrior to get grind mats for alts and focusing on playing his rogue that he seems to like. Our guild would prob have to look elsewhere lol.

After running 5 man instances for some time, you can pretty much gauge what you are in for from the get-go. As much as i try to be the carebear friend but I really am fed up when after much explanation he still doesn't see the big picture. Unless you pvp, the natural progression is pretty much completing the instances for rep and gear to prepare you for larger man instances then raids...its inevitable or you would prob end up putting your character in cold storage and working on leveling another alt..but for how long?

Anyways, he put me on his ignore list, doesnt want to hear a single word from the guild and he has made it absolutely clear that he just doesnt give a flying f..fist about tanking. that pretty much sums it up lol.

dps warriors blow in dps meters due to the fact they have no aggro control nor aggro reduction... if you're a dps who can't dps, i dont see the fun in playing that

and no dont give me shit that a dps warrior can top dps meters, that only when u count trash mobs in. give a meter of the tops guilds where their fury warrior comes out on top then yeah, we'll take more dps warriors... till then... spec prot like you're supposed to

sigh at the lack of viability of dps warriors now. But see how black temple gear does have solid warrior dps gear? Maybe they're trying to bring dps warriors back! =p Wishful thinking...

But i rather play tank more than a dps now anyday. Come on first dibs at loot!!! lol.

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Added on May 12, 2007, 2:00 am

Not disagreeing with u but the mage gets 5k crits off the bat, its pretty hard to hold aggro as a tank. Solid tanks normally trash out 600tps or below intially and only above if SS crits. Well geared sometimes doesnt work to ur advantage with the avoidance available on it. And sometimes u just run into a string of bad luck i.e f***ing dodge parry miss miss in sucession. God i hate those sometime. Or u can run into good fortune, like on prince tonite i did manage to maintain 1150tps for 20secs or so due to SS crits, multiple windfurys n tf procs all together.

And fury specced warriors just can nvr tank (as in hold aggro properly) so long the dpsers are geared. Its not even remotely possible.

Real top end raiders bring warriors as DPS.  The main weakness of warriors is that they don't have any threat reduction skills.  But at the same time because they're not limited by silly things like mana, they tend to get stronger as fights progress.  Not to mention additional utility in 25 mans and unbeatable damage post 20%.  I personally like rolling with a DPS warrior by my side for offtanking in Karazhan where necessary because lets face it, more than 1 Prot warrior in a place like karazhan is a waste of space.

We encourage off specs at my guild so people get to play the way they want as the last thing I want is raid burnout.  My guildmates are also the type of people who will respec for a raid if we're short of healers/dps/tanks so yeah we show a middle finger to spec elitism.

For viable DPS warriors check out armory profiles of Anise of Forte on Kazzak, EU, also check out the profile for Ellayne in Failure on Magtheridon, EU.  One has killed Lady Vashj (in a legit kill apparently), the other one frequently msns me complaining that he isn't getting enough epixx in SSC...

Not to mention Kungen revenge crits for 500k!

edit: confusing method with forte... ignore lady vashj bit

Why would anyone want to reduce threat on Aran?

To the OP, this might be late as ur friend is ignoring u now   but maybe if u have a chance u can let him know some ideas i have.

Taking sethekk halls don't need u to be prot. No need to respec.
I think it is more on playing style.
Watch his playing pattern and tell him (if he is not doing)
(1) Taunt is his best friend. Loose aggro? Switch stance and spam it to get it back. (i presume he is not in def stance since he likes dps) All mobs are tauntable there. so he should be able to use it (10sec cooldown if i remember correctly and I presume he has no talent on prot tree)
(2) Use skills like mocking blow / challenging shout etc. Cool down is long but better than no one wanna party with you.
(3) Since he is 70, if possible try get def above 490 which will remove crit form ur dmg table & and have at least 25% shield block. Shield Block removes crushing blow. But this is not a game breaker in sethekk halls and might be tough for him.
(4) Be more mindfull on the situation. Mobs on healers? Taunt! Hamstring mobs so they run away slower. Switch target when mob is below 5% etc casters will nuke it and chances are it will die within the next sec or so and move on to next one (more time to build up aggro)
(5) Must have the following :-) SHIELD. More armour = less melee dmg = less mana healers need. Unless u r an expert u can tank in 2-hander but i doubt this is the case. At least whipped it out on boss fights
(6) NEVER think too much of DPS meter etc when u tank. (U said he just wanna finish sethekk halls right?) Take back ur ego and just go get the loots (farming)
Party survival is key.
(7) Remember to switch stances Intercept and intervene is key for last boss fight.
Need to get it off healers after the AOE. Int and TAUNT (best friend)
(8) Bring pots. Lots. Rage pots armour pots, health pots etc
(9) Spams attacks like HS/Sunders etc.
(10) As a party CC well. Resheep / traps /sap. Minimize stray mobs.
(11) buy him a book on shapes and tell him skull in general = ur target. If all else fails tell him that if u kill mobs in the following order Skull - X - Moon - Square etc, u get more DPS. It is a hidden programming code from Bliz.

Bear in mind that no matter what, ppl are going to pull aggro. Mages...pyro/POM/pyro...ouch
It is how fast the tank get it back that counts. TAUNT!!!

-nub tank-

hmm....backtrack to this one. wanted to find out more.

Scenarios happened over the weekend.

Scenario 1: Shattered Halls
Pally tank + pally healer. Pally tank had crusader of aura out. Pally healer decided to put seal of judgement during single mob pull. Mob switches to pally healer and pally tank cannot pull off.

In multiple mob pulls, pally healer seems to get pummeled more. I've run with the pally tank as well as some of the ppl who were in the team with no problems but that was Botanic/Mech where we don't see these problems happening.

Scenario 2 : Shadow Labs
2nd boss room pull. 4-5 man pull. Prot Tank pulls. Before tank can pick up, pally healer puts seal on 1st mob tank pulls. All 4-5 man switches target immediately to pally healer if no one started pulling their targets.

Pally healer then stops putting seals on any of the mobs. Still gets a lot of aggro. Same thing happens when Shadow Priest drops VE and Shadow Word:Pain - only in these 2 instances.

I've not seen Scenario 1 and 2 happening except for those 2 instances. Mech, Bot, SV : no problems. Just in those 2 instances (SL & SH) that it seemed easy to reach the aggro threshhold a lot faster?