It was back in 1987/88 when I was in primary school when a friend of mine went on and on about a football team called Liverpool. Not being a football fan at the time, his words hit me like water off stone, but after months of constant mention, I just had to find out who Liverpool where. I had heard him bring up the names of Alan Hansen, Bruce Grobbelar, Ian Rush, John Barnes and Peter Beardsley but I could not put faces to their names. Back then we did not have ASTRO and RTM only aired EPL highlights that were 2 weeks old! The only live matches you could catch were cup finals like Dunhill's 'Road To Wembley' programme. Information on The Reds were also hard to come by because there was no internet at the time. I relied on football magazines like 'Shoot' and 'Match' that were selling for only RM3 at the time. Look at the prices now!

John Barnes was a mercurial winger and my favourite player at the time. If fans today think that Beckham was deadly at free-kicks, I tell ya, Barnes had a left foot that was just as deadly. To top it off, he had silky smooth skills and fantastic pace. Needless to say, I watched every game Liverpool played after that and fell in love with the noise emanating from the then, standing Kop. I feel in love with "You'll Never Walk Alone". I wasn't that Liverpool were a winning team, it was that I saw the passion in their players and the fans. I knew that if a set of fans could be so obsessed with their team, it surely must be a special team. The rest as they say is history.

Speaking of history, I began digging up any reading material I could find about the club. I read of Shankly, Paisley, Fagan. I read about The Spion Kop. I read about the bootroom. I read about everything and anything I could find on LFC. My education continues until today. This year after 19 long years, I was fortunate enough to make my pilgrimage to Anfield. I felt a sense of belonging. I felt what it was like to be part of the very special fans I had tonnes of admiration for. I was now a part of the noise I fell in love with 19 years ago.

Not long after I began my support, Kenny Dalglish announced his resignation and in came Greame Souness. It was a tough time being a Liverpool supporter at the time I tell ya. Barrel loads of Man Utd fans were sprouting from everywhere and Liverpool fans were getting stick from them all the time, as we went through a decade of mediocrity, finishing 7th at one point. As Souness tried to impose himself he rid the club of quality players like Barnes, Beardsley and Houghton. In came pedestrian players like Mark Walters, Mike Marsh, Paul Stewart and Phil Babb. Gone were the days of glory and our resolve as Liverpool fans were truly tested. To borrow a few lines from "You'll Never Walk Alone", some of us Liverpool fans had to...

Walk on through the wind,
Walk on through the rain,
Though your dreams be tossed and blown..
Walk on, walk on, with hope in your heart,
And you'll never walk alone.

Low and behold, before I knew it Souness was out, and in came Evans and Houllier. Back came the glory days and there was not prouder moment for me than 2005. I had heard stories of 77,78, 81 and 84 but I had never witnessed such occasions with my own eyes. In 2005 I wept tears of joy as I knew, I was now part of Liverpool FC history. I would now have my own stories to tell my children (well I have to get married first).

I've said before that not many fans here have gone through dark days, well I went through a dark decade and my resolve was tested. Most Man Utd, Arsenal and Chelsea fans have not gone through hard times. These days, not a winning a trophy in 1 season is considered a tragedy! You can understand why Liverpool fans like myself always talk about how fickle and impatient fans today are. You can understand how we are skeptical of fans who claim to love their club after a mere 5 years or so of support. We are skeptical because we are not convinced that many of these fans will still be standing by their club if they were just an average side that more often than not, won nothing. I can speak for anyone else, but my resolve has been tested and I know, I will.

This post has been edited by Duke Red: May 5 2007, 09:43 AM

Does anyone smell the stench of a glory hunter here?

Which is why I said most of your fans have no idea because a vast majority have only begun supporting after the EPL was established. In any case, Man Utd have always been on the ascendancy, with the exception of being relegated by Man City of course.

What constitutes a glory hunter anyway? You mentioned growing up amongst glory hunting fans from the 70's & 80's. Are they still fans now? If so, I don't think they can be called as such.

Well I started supporting Liverpool when we were a winning team, I'd have to admit. Like I said though, you don't get to watch too many games back then, only cup finals.

You talking about Beckham's legion of female fans in point no.1?

Geeze man how old are you?

I restrain myself from hurling insults at supporters of rival clubs but I do have sufficient reasons of my own for disliking their clubs. I don't want to start a war on that here, so let's just leave it at that.

Do you even read your own posts? What was the reason you stated for supporting Man Utd again? If you read some of our posts, we give deeper reasons for supporting a club i.e. tradition & culture. How can you call some of us glory hunters when we were supporting our clubs even when they won nothing?

And who the hell has been calling supporters of smaller clubs glory hunters? Your posts are really incoherent.

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Added on May 5, 2007, 12:20 pmIf we were glory hunters, we would have all been supporting Chelsea last season and the season before. Glory hunters are people who jump ship each time a new 'in' team emerges. It has nothing to do with whether or not he knows about his club or not, that determines the quality of fan he is.

This post has been edited by Duke Red: May 5 2007, 12:22 PM

Technically he's correct because we've never won the Premier League since it's inception. We have however won the League Championship 18 times but like I said, it's a matter of technicality.

Is there such a thing as a smart glory hunter?

Precisely, many Liverpool fans here began their support in their 90's. From 1990 - 2000, Liverpool collected a grand total of 3 trophies! We managed to win 1 Charity Shield, 1 FA Cup and 1 League Cup, hardly the mark of champions. Our league positions since 1992 were 6th (1992-93), 8th (1993-94), 4th (1994-95), 3rd (1995-96), 4th (1996-97), 3rd (1997-98), 7th (1998-99) and 4th (1999-2000). While we were far from being relegation candidates, we were surely only an average side based on the lack of achievement. How many can remember the last time your team finished 8th? These statistics tell me that Liverpool fans from the 80's or 90's will stay true to the team. If you read the reaction of some fans these days, going a season or two without winning anything is a travesty.

Imagine supporting a team that won League Championships in 1988 & 1990 and then next to nothing for the next 10 years. I know many fans would waver. Proof? Where have all the Leeds Utd & Blackburn fans gone?

When I first began watching football in the late 80;s, you would only see the likes of Man Utd, Liverpool, Arsenal or Tottenham play because ASTRO hadn't arrived on local shores yet and we only got to watch cup finals. It was then natural to support either of these sides, as I find it hard to support a club you don't watch play.

This post has been edited by Duke Red: May 6 2007, 09:21 AM

I agree with you! I thought it was a good game with both clubs really going at it.

I have friends who support Norwich and Southampton though they don't get to see their teams play. I totally respect them because of that. This is the reason I keep telling people that they need a deeper reason for supporting a club. We're not just here to be entertained. Notice how the American's came up with the term "Sports Entertainment"? We are here to be part of the club, through thick and thin.

What I meant was Chelsea have been champions for the past 2 seasons and thus, we would have abandoned our clubs and started supporting them if we were glory hunters.

This post has been edited by Duke Red: May 6 2007, 12:49 PM

Almost all fans in Malaysia behave i the same way, simply because we are all Malaysians, not Scouse, not Cockney or whatever. Therefore the fans behaviour here should not reflect upon the club. It's more a case of hating the rival fans rather than hating the rival clubs. Then again some of us do have reasons for disliking a rival club, reasons that are perhaps best kept to ourselves. Many a time, I've asked people why they hate their rival clubs and they don't have a reason. Just like how you need to know something about your club to love it, you need to know something about your rivals to hate them. A lot of it is manufactured hate. You hate another club just because you were taught to, without even knowing why. Oh and if you ask me hating a rival club because they are successful is just being petty. It's more envy and jealousy than anything, unless of course the club itself is cocky and arrogant about it.

Well I hate Man Utd because of the same reasons you do Chelsea and Real Madrid, it's about the principles, and not because of geography. I mean I don't live there so it's pretty hard to understand what it's like to live to close to one another. Having said that if geography were the main reason, the I'd hate Everton more and you Man City more, as I'm sure our fans in England do. To each his own by I don't hate my rivals just because they are my rivals. I mean I don't hate my opponents in a basketball tournament, because it's not personal.

I'm with you on this. Knowing about your club is essential. You sometimes see fans responding aggressively to rival fans who criticise their clubs, I'm talking about criticism backed up with facts, not just random insults. Thing is some of these fans react without even knowing if the rival fan has a basis for saying such things, simply because they have not done any research on their own club. Then it becomes like any other petty argument rather than an informed discussion or debate.

You only found out later? Must have been a really quiet fan!

Speaking about girls and Liverpool, a friend of mine recently used the lyrics to "You'll Never Walk Alone" in her wedding vows. She got married last month in Phuket, and the vows were recited by the beach, beautiful.

I've also attended 2 other weddings where the couple used "You'll Never Walk Alone" as their walk in song.

Not easy to find women who are Liverpool fans these days.

Perhaps, if he stays long enough.

I feel compelled to enter this debate between Man Utd and Real Madrid. Verx seems to be vastly outnumbered but credit to him for fighting till the death.

Comparing Chelsea with Real Madrid is a little unfair if you ask me. Chelsea for one do not have as much history as Real. They've also just recently struck the lottery and are looking for instant results by buying players at exorbitant prices. The criticism is that unlike other clubs with money to spend, they do not need to be accountable for Roman's spending. They could by a player for $30 million pounds, sell him the next season for $3 million pounds and no one would bat an eyelid. I'm not sure it's the same for Real Madrid.

Yes Man Utd have earned their money the hard way. They have won championships and have marketed the club successfully. Just look at the amount of people wearing Man Utd jerseys these days, some of which can't even name you 5 players and probably have no idea the Premiership has already been won. I'm sure no one here is in that category, else you won't even be here talking about your club but, I've see plenty of them even amongst my circle of friends. In some ways, I am disappointed that football is now treated like a business and you get many fans who look to be entertained these days. What's with people who switch off the telly or leave stadiums before the end of the game? Wasn't the game entertaining enough for you? There you have it, fans who only watch the match for entertainment, not because they feel a strong sense of affiliation to their club. I'm going off topic now, let me get back on track. Man Utd have had their fair share of lavish signings in recent years and I suspect that will continue next season. With the likes of Scholes, Neville, Solksjaer and Giggs approaching the end of their careers, surely there is a need to start looking for replacements. With little or no youth players of equal caliber, it's logical to assume that SAF will be looking abroad next season to build a squad big enough to compete on all fronts.

I must admit I don't know much about Real Madrid and how they run the club. I'm rather curious where the funding for big players comes from. It's just petty to fault a club for having more money than you, if it was acquired through legal means, and if they worked hard for it. So what if Real Madrid wants to buy stars if they can afford it? Are they supposed to look for bargains because they feel the rest of the world would envy them? Like Verx said, they pay because they buy the best. Surely, the best players in the world would only play for big clubs, and Real Madrid are a big club.

Just because you sign a big name player, it doesn't mean he's going to play well. Look at Sheva and Ballack for Chelsea. As far as I'm concerned, if you don't play well, you sit on the bench regardless of the price tag on top of your head. It takes a brave manager to bench high profile players but it needs to be done. Many players have inflated egos and it's good to put them in their place every now and then.

Sound like how I started mate. The EPL programmes were 2 weeks old! It was difficult to follow any club, let alone Liverpool at the time.



Good man! Stuck by your guns! Would have been easy to switch teams given you had only been supporting us for a year.



I remember that game against MU. Fowler's 2nd was a superb shot into the top corner past Schmeichel, that rattled the camera unless I'm mistaken. There were 2 classic games against the toon. I think you can buy the DVDs, entitled "Kings of the Castle".

You said it right mate, it is personal. People sometimes wonder why we go through the trouble of wanting to make banners, are starting appreciation threads for players but it's because there is so much emotion involved. Like you, I would not expect too many people to understand and it's really difficult to explain it to them. Until today, I still get teary eyes when I heard The Kop chant YNWA.

Well at least you're honest. Erm that's all the nice things I have to say.

Well apparently ricky_cassidy is one. For how long, I don't know.

Who's captain Tsubasa?

I think the term "glory hunter" came about later in the 90's when all of a sudden there were Man Utd sprouting up all over. These fans didn't know jack about the team but yet dissed rival fans. I don't think they referred to you as a "glory hunger". You can't deny that most Man Utd fans we meet these days began their support in the 90's. Most Liverpool fans I personally know began supporting Liverpool during the 80's. I'm surprised that many posters here have followed the team during the 90's in which we only won 3 trophies and were abysmal in the league. To me it's only natural that you begin supporting a club that has some achievement unless you've lived in England and followed the local team, even if it's Doncaster Rovers or someone. The difference is that you actually bother to get to know about your team, past and present and that you actually follow their progress without changing teams.

I know mate, read what I said carefully. I repeat: