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> Waterproofing Water Leaking Problem, Ask Me Water Leaking, Waterproofing

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TSmoonhowler
post Jul 31 2017, 11:02 PM, updated 6y ago

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Hi Guys, ask me anything of Water leaking / Waterproofing. The more complicated the question is, the better.

Just ask me everything and i will try my best to answer when i have time.

The more challenge the water leaking waterproofing situation is, the more adrenaline i get smile.gif Especially those who appointed few contractors to solve waterproofing water leaking problems and yet still failed to rectify the water leaking waterproofing.

Those common water leaking i can share about are below:
1. Waterproofing Problem / Waterproofing Materials
2. Water leaking / Plumbing (toilet, roof slab, wall concrete slab)
3. Concrete crack repair solution.

In general, There are few types of waterproofing chemical
1. Liquid applied PU waterproofing membrane
2. Cementitious waterproofing coating
3. Chemical injection waterproofing system
4. Exposed waterproofing system
5. Self adhesive waterproofing system

I believe Water leaking or Waterproofing problem is the most nightmare defects rectification work compare other defects. Worse still some contractors proposed wrong method solving the leaking matter or some contractor disappear after owner engage their service and many nightmare stories that i heard.

I will be very glad to share some of my experiences rectifying water leaking problems or waterproofing problems and share my knowledge the best solution to rectify it smile.gif

First of all, apologize for my English and please focus on my knowledge sharing here smile.gif

I will show more picture example soon

This post has been edited by moonhowler: Aug 2 2017, 06:52 PM
Jonesyming
post Aug 1 2017, 04:06 PM

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Hi sir,

Appreciate your explanations. Would like to ask regarding first floor toilet floor leaking (terrace). What waterproof material shall be suitable to treat the toilet floor without much hassle or hacking?

Tq
Ash muhammad 28
post Aug 1 2017, 05:23 PM

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what is the cheapest waterproofing way for a small bathroom

spreeeee
post Aug 1 2017, 05:30 PM

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5. Self adhesive waterproofing system

=can diy?
BallSmasher
post Aug 2 2017, 01:21 PM

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how about toilet waterproofing. i know that if hire a contractor do, they will take out the existing tiles and redo the water proofing. is there any way we can DIY and without taking off the existing tiles.?
TSmoonhowler
post Aug 2 2017, 05:37 PM

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hi everyone, thanks for dropping your questions regarding water leaking or waterproofing problems.

QUOTE(Jonesyming @ Aug 1 2017, 04:06 PM)
Hi sir,

Appreciate your explanations. Would like to ask regarding first floor toilet floor leaking (terrace). What waterproof material shall be suitable to treat the toilet floor without much hassle or hacking?

Tq
*
To solve the leaking 1st floor (terrace), usually there are two methods to rectify it

Method 1. Hack the entire floor and redo everything[SIZE=7]
To hack the entire tiles,
To hack the existing cement sand screed,
To hack the existing waterproofing materials until the concrete base.

Once removed everything, Redo everything. Start with

Supply and apply with new waterproofing materials (Cementitious type),
Supply and apply cement sand screed (gradient/slope surface - gravity high level to low level to allow water flow)
Supply and install new tiles

Above method 1 is always the best solution. However required alot of time and the most expensive method. This method can be use if the water leaking area is too severe or too "complicated scenario"
"Complicated scenario like
I) concrete profiles full of crackline or full of porosity
II) the existing waterproofing embedded failed miserably
III) contractor forgot/never apply waterproofing membrane at all

Method 2. To inject chemical PU injection to permanently stop the leaking at that particular area only
Firstly Determine and analyze the leaking area
Then Inject Chemical PU grouting to stop the water leaking area. This PU grouting once react with water will expand form a tight, impermeable, elastomeric seal and permanently stop the water leaking at "that particular area only"

Above method 2 do not required those hassle or hacking. Very straight forward rectify the water leaking.

I will update more pictures to explain in more details. Currently busy smile.gif

QUOTE(Ash muhammad 28 @ Aug 1 2017, 05:23 PM)
what is the cheapest waterproofing way for a small bathroom
*
Is your small bathroom completely new? The entire floor is "naked'? If so get those "cementitious Waterproofing type will do. Cementitious Type waterproofing is the cheapest among other membrane type (Polyurethene PU, Torch On membrane, Acrylic Polymer etc...) Internal areas can be apply with cementitious waterproofing membrane because internal areas do not exposed the sun and rain.

Exposed area to sun and rain must not apply with cementitious type waterproofing. The reason is over the long period expand and contraction will easily damage the brittle type cementitious waterproofing.

QUOTE(spreeeee @ Aug 1 2017, 05:30 PM)
5. Self adhesive waterproofing system

=can diy?
*
I assuming your self adhesive waterproofing DIY type is pour on the tiles flooring surface and allow it penetrate into the concrete pore? This DIY type depending on the tiles and concrete profile surface. If the concrete profiles surface full of severe crackline / very porosity or the existing waterproofing embedded inside the concrete poorly apply. This self adhesive DIY won't be effective.

This DIY might work if the leaking is very minor and concrete profiles surface is not severe.

My definition of self adhesive waterproofing type is those apply at large scale project spec by architect. Its not very popular type of waterproofing

QUOTE(BallSmasher @ Aug 2 2017, 01:21 PM)
how about toilet waterproofing. i know that if hire a contractor do, they will take out the existing tiles and redo the water proofing. is there any way we can DIY and without taking off the existing tiles.?
*
I think those DIY type is less effective to counter water leaking unless the situation leaking area is very minor. There is another method solving the water leaking without hacking existing tiles and redo the waterproofing which is inject PU grouting. Inject PU grouting is pretty complicated and one must be experienced and skillful to inspect the leaking area to made the best decision. This PU grouting is the most popular method and widely use by the developer and contractor when newly move in house owner complaint their unit is leaking.

I will upload more picture as examples. Hopefully tonight when i am free smile.gif

This post has been edited by moonhowler: Aug 2 2017, 06:55 PM
TSmoonhowler
post Aug 2 2017, 05:44 PM

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reserve

This post has been edited by moonhowler: Aug 2 2017, 05:59 PM
TSmoonhowler
post Aug 2 2017, 05:58 PM

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This post has been edited by moonhowler: Aug 2 2017, 06:09 PM
enduser
post Aug 2 2017, 06:55 PM

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QUOTE

Method 1. Hack the entire floor and redo everything[SIZE=7]

To hack the entire tiles, 
To hack the existing cement sand screed, 
To hack the existing waterproofing materials until the concrete base. 

Once removed everything, Redo everything. Start with

Supply and apply with new waterproofing materials (Cementitious type), 
Any good brand of cementitious type waterproofing u can recommend?
VeeJay
post Aug 2 2017, 07:17 PM

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moonhowler When we are not sure where the actual leak is wouldnt it better to find the source by injecting a colored dye to figure out the source of the pipe thats damaged?

Say for example, the end flow is at the front porch; where the water is dripping.

We suspect its coming from the top floor bathroom, but there are couple of piping from the main that goes into the bathroom.

By injecting one by one with diff color, we could determine which pipe is the culprit.
TSmoonhowler
post Aug 3 2017, 03:26 PM

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QUOTE(VeeJay @ Aug 2 2017, 07:17 PM)
moonhowler When we are not sure where the actual leak is wouldnt it better to find the source by injecting a colored dye to figure out the source of the pipe thats damaged?

Say for example, the end flow is at the front porch; where the water is dripping.

We suspect its coming from the top floor bathroom, but there are couple of piping from the main that goes into the bathroom.

By injecting one by one with diff color, we could determine which pipe is the culprit.
*
Very good question VeeJay, Its always good to do initial investigation / inspection if the leaking condition is too complicated and to determine which area toilet leaking. We call this ponding test

And for your case, the problem should be Waterproofing issue if the leaking occasionally drip. Usually if the water dripping day and night with constant dripping speed, most likely its due to piping.


QUOTE(enduser @ Aug 2 2017, 06:55 PM)
Any good brand of cementitious type waterproofing u can recommend?
*
There are many brands of cementitious type waterproofing in the market. And most of them does work well as long you follow the manufacturer guides instruction. And contractor must have some basic knowledge how to apply. I will soon come out with some technical drawing details waterproofing.

Popular Brands Waterproofing in Malaysia Market for tendering contract project
1. Sika, Mapei, Penten, Estop, Fosroc, Xypex, Greenseal, Greencemt, Bostik, Daco, Axel Chemil, STO, Oriental Yu Hong (upcoming china brand)

Some of the brands above you can't find in any hardware store and can only get at their manufacturer plant. You can get very good discount with bulk quantity. Some of them only focus supply to big development project contract only.

The new waterproofing brand Oriental Yu Hong is the cheapest and have bigger coverage. A close friend of mine is dealing directly with the manufacturer. The sample quality is unbelievably good.

Example of technical drawing details submit for architect or consultant for approval

Attached Image

This post has been edited by moonhowler: Aug 3 2017, 03:35 PM
VeeJay
post Aug 3 2017, 08:39 PM

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QUOTE(moonhowler @ Aug 3 2017, 03:26 PM)
Very good question VeeJay, Its always good to do initial investigation / inspection if the leaking condition is too complicated and to determine which area toilet leaking. We call this ponding test

And for your case, the problem should be Waterproofing issue if the leaking occasionally drip. Usually if the water dripping day and night with constant dripping speed, most likely its due to piping.
There are many brands of cementitious type waterproofing in the market. And most of them does work well as long you follow the manufacturer guides instruction. And contractor must have some basic knowledge how to apply. I will soon come out with some technical drawing details waterproofing.
Yup Water ponding is other method, but its more for flooring, as for piping I was referring to Dye testing. Wonder why its not common in Msia?

https://www.pollardwater.com/pages_product/dyesdata.asp
Erza Scarlet
post Aug 3 2017, 08:45 PM

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you are doing waterproofing work for house?
lucifah
post Aug 3 2017, 08:47 PM

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good discussion. i am bookmarking this thread thumbup.gif
tcb2010
post Aug 4 2017, 10:53 AM

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Moonhowler,

I chance upon this thread, and hopefully u can help me out.

I'm currently extending my backyard yard to a wet kitchen, and the current progress is say bout 70% done. Roof tiles are the large cement(or clay) corrugated kind, and ceiling are plaster ceiling. There isn't any insulation in between.

The issue is we found moisture/condensation spots on plaster ceiling joints on a few spots, and we thought it was due to roof leak. Efforts has been done to seal the roof even more, with bitumen tape i think, hopefully will stop the issue.

However, since laying the wet ground cement (prep for tiling) yesterday, this morning i found the condensation was more severe on the ceilings, especially the usual spots..and i found out it might be a condensation issue instead of roof leak, when i wipe the inner windows and its all damped. Usually I close off that area during the evening and night, so no ventilation movement, and i can feel its very humid with heavy masonry smell.

Now, i am leaning towards this might be a condensation issue due to the wet masonry works that's not all dry out, and bad airing practice i have been doing at this phase.

Does anyone faced this kind of issue before, and hopefully can enlightened me, as me and my contractor are still puzzled. My contractor is those China-man self employed kind, so i suspected he isn't well versed on this condensation matter as well.

Next phase I will try hoisting the new roof with pipe water to chk if any leakage from roof, so i can rule out the roof.

Its a nightmare for me at the moment, not knowing what shit is gonna come down the road due to this water/leakage/ condensation issue.
iamoracle
post Aug 4 2017, 04:15 PM

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Instead of hacking, what about epoxy waterproofing flake coating option?
Any pros and cons?
lucifah
post Aug 5 2017, 09:25 AM

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QUOTE(tcb2010 @ Aug 4 2017, 10:53 AM)
Moonhowler,

I chance upon this thread, and hopefully u can help me out.

I'm currently extending my backyard yard to a wet kitchen, and the current progress is say bout 70% done. Roof tiles are the large cement(or clay) corrugated kind, and ceiling are plaster ceiling. There isn't any insulation in between.

The issue is we found moisture/condensation spots on plaster ceiling joints on a few spots, and we thought it was due to roof leak. Efforts has been done to seal the roof even more, with bitumen tape i think, hopefully will stop the issue.

However, since laying the wet ground cement (prep for tiling) yesterday, this morning i found the condensation was more severe on the ceilings, especially the usual spots..and i found out it might be a condensation issue instead of roof leak, when i wipe the inner windows and its all damped. Usually I close off that area during the evening and night, so no ventilation movement, and i can feel its very humid with heavy masonry smell.

Now, i am leaning towards this might be a condensation issue due to the wet masonry works that's not all dry out, and bad airing practice i have been doing at this phase.

Does anyone faced this kind of issue before, and hopefully can enlightened me, as me and my contractor are still puzzled. My contractor is those China-man self employed kind, so i suspected he isn't well versed on this condensation matter as well.

Next phase I will try hoisting the new roof with pipe water to chk if any leakage from roof, so i can rule out the roof.

Its a nightmare for me at the moment, not knowing what shit is gonna come down the road due to this water/leakage/ condensation issue.
*
it's concrete curing process - they release heat which causes the condensation

pus some fans to dry out the place during these 2 days (weekend) and see any difference on monday or not before continue work

damp rising from ground floor slab shouldnt be obvious at this stage and will not cause water droplets to appear on the soffit or ceiling board
lucifah
post Aug 5 2017, 09:26 AM

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QUOTE(VeeJay @ Aug 3 2017, 08:39 PM)
Yup Water ponding is other method, but its more for flooring, as for piping I was referring to Dye testing. Wonder why its not common in Msia?

https://www.pollardwater.com/pages_product/dyesdata.asp
*
malaysia standard doesnt have dye test method (IIRC) but it does have pressure leak test, whereby a sealed piping system must hold its pressure (with some acceptable drop) within 24hr period


Richard
post Aug 5 2017, 10:59 PM

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QUOTE(lucifah @ Aug 5 2017, 09:25 AM)
it's concrete curing process - they release heat which causes the condensation

pus some fans to dry out the place during these 2 days (weekend) and see any difference on monday or not before continue work

damp rising from ground floor slab shouldnt be obvious at this stage and will not cause water droplets to appear on the soffit or ceiling board
*
Concrete curing "Hydration" is a chemical process which consumes water not produce it..

Quote
Combining water with a cementitious material forms a cement paste by the process of hydration. The cement paste glues the aggregate together, fills voids within it, and makes it flow more freely.[26]
As stated by Abrams' law, a lower water-to-cement ratio yields a stronger, more durable concrete, whereas more water gives a freer-flowing concrete with a higher slump.[27] Impure water used to make concrete can cause problems when setting or in causing premature failure of the structure.[28]
Hydration involves many different reactions, often occurring at the same time. As the reactions proceed, the products of the cement hydration process gradually bond together the individual sand and gravel particles and other components of the concrete to form a solid mass.[29]

Heat doesn't produce water condensation.. Cool does..
lucifah
post Aug 6 2017, 12:22 AM

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QUOTE(Richard @ Aug 5 2017, 10:59 PM)
Concrete curing "Hydration" is a chemical process which consumes water not produce it..

Quote
Combining water with a cementitious material forms a cement paste by the process of hydration. The cement paste glues the aggregate together, fills voids within it, and makes it flow more freely.[26]
As stated by Abrams' law, a lower water-to-cement ratio yields a stronger, more durable concrete, whereas more water gives a freer-flowing concrete with a higher slump.[27] Impure water used to make concrete can cause problems when setting or in causing premature failure of the structure.[28]
Hydration involves many different reactions, often occurring at the same time. As the reactions proceed, the products of the cement hydration process gradually bond together the individual sand and gravel particles and other components of the concrete to form a solid mass.[29]

Heat doesn't produce water condensation.. Cool does..
*
i may have been a bit rusty with my concrete knowledge

erm... an easy analogy

put a plate on top of a glass of hot water (like u said, curing concrete release heat)

you will see condensate droplets on the bottom of the plate (the 1st floor slab soffit)

i know it's a bad analogy, but i am also interested in the source of the water droplets on the soffit. smile.gif

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