This is the wrong formula to use for our FD. This is a compound interest formula which works only if you remove the total Amount (Principal + Interest) each day and manage to put it back again at the same rate as a new increased Principal each day. Even then, the final amount cannot be expressed in such a simple manner due to the way the bank' s particular program method (algorithm) handle rounding to the sen given to you each day. There are differences between formula learnt in school versus what actually happens in a computer and different policies in handling customer's money. Due to these differences and a lack of mathematical standardisation and programs by monetary authorities, different banks and programming vendors implement different ways and you can expect different results. How loans, loan sharks and credit card actually compute is another matter but Off Topic.

This post has been edited by Deal Hunter: Nov 19 2016, 04:48 PM

I presume the Simple Interest method of calculation you showed for MBB GIA is supposed to show your expectation of the total interest due.
If I remember correctly from previous MBB GIA FDs, Maybank uses the 366 divisor for days in leap year and 365 divisor for days in non-leap years for FD paid on maturity.
If you are referring to e GIA that can be taken out any day without penalty, I have not tried taking out early. but note that monthly interests creditted to my savings account from e GIA since June differ from month to month as if the profit rate changes. I am not sure what product you are actually referring too, but I would feel that:-
1) You are likely to get less due to the 366 divisor effect for 2016.
2) You probably have monthly creditting of the profit, so you won't get 36 days or N days worth, but the remainder after deducting off monthly credits of profits.
3) The profit rate varies from month to month and the date you place will affect how much you get in a previous month and what you get the next month.
In summary, it gets a bit complicated and yes may be confusing as it it is probably not so simple.
If you are referring to my previous reply to Sitting Duck as a basis - please note it was meant for Hong Leong at 4.15% and they use 365 days divisor on 6 months maturity. Being a different bank, naturally things are different. Just remember - Mana ada standard sistem - and you won't be surprised by all sorts of things.

This post has been edited by Deal Hunter: Nov 20 2016, 01:40 PM

No need to apologise as far as I am concern. Everybody expresses own ideas of how things work and we can all share and feedback the views, hopes, experiences and weird differences we meet at different places. If we get it wrong, it just means some bank communications or staff are not clear enough or are also clear but confused themselves - something we meet all the time.
If you read my reply to Kamen Rider, the compound interest formula for Maybank GIA would have i/366 instead of i/365 for days in 2016.
The value of i profit (interest rate) is probably not constant and varies according to dates set by Maybank.
And even if you managed to uplift and replaced each day for a short period where the profit (interest rate did not change), you will likely get less than the figure computed by the formula, because of the effect of how the tiny figures after the sen are treated by the bank.
There may also be a potential problem of whether Maybank will try to ensure it is really fresh fund from other banks if depositors start doing daily uplifting and placing with the original money and interest, even though it may be attractive, legal and good business for the bank. Practices and policies depend on bank people's perspectives and certainly some can be really bureaucratic and not well thought out or helpful.
If I remember correctly, the payment of profit each month at the date of placement, is into your CASA (savings or your current account you named), and it is not added to your principal. Thus there is also no compounding effect on a monthly basis.

This post has been edited by Deal Hunter: Nov 21 2016, 01:25 AM

I was at a Maybank branch this morning for something else. Overheard old lady get reply that the 12m and 6m GIA FD offers were still on. I picked up the brochure on display and later asked whether still running. Still say yes. Dunno whether it is some kind of target differences at various Maybank branches or some confusion.

This post has been edited by Deal Hunter: Nov 21 2016, 04:56 PM

Thanks for the reply. It is a bit confusing here. But the question about the option is whether it actually means adding the total interest in one lump to the principal at the end on maturity (which for some reason could be a leftover from normal forms for normal FD), OR add monthly interest payments to principal to grow the principal each month - which is really nice. I hope LYN participants who had taken the option can share their experience here for our benefit.

This post has been edited by Deal Hunter: Nov 21 2016, 08:02 PM

Does that suggest that HL can lower their Tuesday FPX offer from 4.15% to 4.00% next week or stop the offer altogether? The other banks also lower their promos and board rates? With out a look at the status of the banks need for money for lending or the demand for loans, it is hard to speculate on individual bank reactions.

Could Nomura be wrong? Should there be some sort of gap between SRR and OPR or it really is of no consideration to BNM if both at 3.00%.?

Other than that, nearly all analysts are of the view of a rise in US Fed rates in December. So how? Is BNM going to pro-act or get slowly boiled like the frog? Or does BNM believe they are not in a frog situation? Why are other analysts thinking maintain OPR at 3% and not raising to 3.25%? How many previous quarterly figures from US are needed to disprove the economics of quantitative easing in both the personal and corporate areas?

This post has been edited by Deal Hunter: Nov 22 2016, 02:53 PM

It is still Tuesday. Can try for more from M2U to HL via PBX.

I think HSBC gets it wrong this time. It is not like got strong big reserves, high strengthening currency value and inflows - so start talking strong fundamentals and can cut down.

Nomura 21 Dec note on 50 basis point SRR reduction also being questioned by Royal Bank of Scotland as follows:-

The Royal Bank of Scotland (RBS) cautioned against an SRR cut on Wednesday. It said loan growth averaging 5.9% over the first three quarters against overall deposit growth of 0.2% "sets up conditions for a liquidity squeeze".

So what is it about? All the money consumed? Hidden in black economy? Sent out of country somehow? Spent on imported food etc? Or all money already tied up and nothing much left to deposit except debts? People get too smart and try other get rich quick schemes/scams to beat inflation and low unattractive FD rates?

If there is a liquidity squeeze, the promotion offer rates from banks should go up - never mind the OPR or SRR or the currency exchange rates.

So what and who do you want to believe and act on? It's your money.

This post has been edited by Deal Hunter: Nov 22 2016, 06:25 PM

I think the damage to the economy from low rate is bad and the correct thing to do is to raise the rate. If I have a few millions in USD parked overseas, I certainly won't mind if the ringgit weakens further. Otherwise I cannot really see any thing happening that supports the idea that low rate is beneficial. So, the trouble is whether we have kangkung economists/analysts or people with some sense and really check what is happening and willing to do something positive about it.

This post has been edited by Deal Hunter: Nov 22 2016, 06:37 PM

Everyone in trouble? Some people just love a weak currency and says it is good. Same for low rates. Well if you are not in the same boat as them, then take less sugar. Don't get angry - everybody got their own interests and views - with apathy, empathy or obnoxiousness.

Using FPX is a clever way to promote/educate the acceptance and use of this way of payment thru Hong Leong, which of course will be beneficial in future to the bank in other non-FD payments.
It also ensures that fresh fund is put into Hong Leong quicker than the other transfer methods and in larger amounts if they can iron out all the security and technical difficulties/delays from the various banks.
The free transfer is also an added attraction.
As for 4.15%, why not? After all only a few Tuesdays in November, not everyday. Also give people time to open Hong Leong account and internet banking. If they finish off the whole affair in two weeks finish quota, how are they going to capture new customers and introduce FPX and work off the bugs. It has been some time since they had any attractive promo - so much so that all my old FDs with them had matured and gone to other places. I imagine almost every serious FD depositor would have done exactly the same and are not at all attracted by free gifts or strange packages. The extra 0.05% is not much over 6 months - say extra RM 25 for 100 k - just to up their depositor base and attract deposits to replenish the FD money that already left. Having it spaced out weekly is also clever as it avoids the total loss of a depositor taking it all out in 6 months to a more attractive promo at that point in time on maturity.

You think so quickly grow balls to admit that they are wrong and reverse direction so easy? Much easier to follow the herd regardless wrong or right. The key perception is CONFORMITY and this colours the prediction and reasoning as to the flavour for the day. Hope they can surprise us with some transformasi or ubah.

This post has been edited by Deal Hunter: Nov 22 2016, 11:37 PM

Why are you so loyal to HLB? Other banks board rate already 3%. Look at page 1, Affin and RHB already 3%. If everybody keep putting their money into savings and low board FD rates, surely there is no pressure for the bank to increase the interest rates. If they have enough cheaper money from loyal clients, no need to be so desperate to raise their board rates or have competitive promotion FD rates. Some promos are not really about raising money but just to earn more profit by getting people to buy/use other products.

Quite sensible idea until collect enough money or wait to place at other places with higher promo rates later. At the moment, Maybank also has a distinct advantage over other banks as it allows multiple FPX transactions to HLB in the same day so that total paid out (not really transfer) is not limited to total for the day for IBG and IBFT. If not for the FPX problem, I would suggest bank that claims treat IBG and IBFT total transfers limits differently as they are treated as different money transfer organisations. Besides the better GIA, the ordinary 1 month board rate (same rate used for eFD) is 3.15% at Maybank.

This post has been edited by Deal Hunter: Nov 25 2016, 01:48 AM

Hope the paper OTC GIA FD will follow the brochure and advertisement screen for the final effective 4.10% this time. Previously, Maybank held on to the 4.5% stated in my case anyway. As at Monday 21 November, they still had the brochure for the 4.10% at my branch, although an old lady and myself queried as we were doubtful as already rumoured 12 months already closed and GIA rate going down. I placed one paper GIA earlier in first week of November when I found that they had not closed it yet, but no more money for 21 November.
In Mamamia case which is an eGIA online placement, your calculation is as expected as happened to my even earlier eGIA from June. The calculation is explained in page 97 of this forum thread, Deal Hunter @ Nov 20 2016, 01:35 PM in reply to Kamen Rider @ Nov 19 2016, 01:01 PM.
Andrew_1980 and those new/uncertain about Maybank online eGIA should take note of your calculation together with the explanation.


This post has been edited by Deal Hunter: Nov 25 2016, 03:04 PM

The miniwebtool calculator for fixed deposit is great for normal rough calculation of what to expect. It is based on the normal kind of arithmetic we learn in school and what you can expect from a financial calculator or a normal financial spreadsheet.
Various forum posters had posted about calculated results being different. One person even asked how come predicted/knew it will be 1 sen less from the calculation. Actually a lot more sens and even dollars off had being experienced. The simple explanation is that the calculation and results depends on the bank's program treatment of what is a bank day (or part off to give for some really not so generous banks), the divisor, and how they treat payments made or payments due, and when creditted/withdrawn.
Unfortunately, different banks have different ideas/policies/implementations - or maybe they do not really know what their different programmers and programs are up to actually in the nitty gritty level where things are usually different in many ways as each step is done although results are expected. Most times the banks do not like to lose/pay more generously, but also want to avoid what can be considered outright cheating or extra charges.
We cannot have access to what programs are used and study the quality of the documentation and the program modifications. Most likely, even the bank staff/experts are not really aware what their software vendor has done in real detail trying to comply in their own peculiar ways to the requirements or updates.
However, we can reverse engineer/compute various approaches/scenarios to come to a close approximation or eventually to an exact prediction that matches every time for a particular bank/product.
Just for illustration only:-
Principal 100,000 for 366 days at 1% using simple interest for an FD. What is the result and what do you think you will get at Hong Leong and Maybank. Let us not complicate matters by mentioning other banks at all. Try to explain the results. If you use the miniwebtool, the interest is 1002.74.
If you want to check with a 12 digit calculator, it is 1002.73972602. If you understand the question, and its implications, you will have learnt something basically useful such as questioning your instruments, programs or validity of what is done. If you think the answer is so simple, you can get a distinction in school where things are simplified, but life is not so simple after experience.

This was what I wrote as likely to happen based on my experience with my Maybank eFD and his calculation appears to back it.
It is great that Mamamia monitors what he is getting and letting us know to confirm my previous suspicion/understanding.

Is it correct? No I do not like it.
But let us go on from here to see whether it is correct or another one of those program / setting problems that need adjustment as per bbgoat OTC GIA experience but translated to eGIA instead. Making mistakes is very much easier than doing the correct thing, so it is up to Maybank to clarify where things stand as to whether it is the bank's actual intention (correct) or it is a kind of mistake (wrong) and adjust if proper.

Of course, I hope Maybank realises the need to honour whatever is promoted especially for the OTC GIA promo as funds are tied down on an expected interest at maturity. I have been told before by bank manager of another bank about actually adjusting down experience during discussion about Islamic products about the absolute reliability of income flow needed to sustain critical requirements.

This post has been edited by Deal Hunter: Nov 25 2016, 06:56 PM

It is quite OK to use the fixed deposit calculator from miniwebtool.com for Hong Leong as both Hong Leong and the calculator program uses 365 as the divisor even in leap years. That is why can get 1002.74 interest for 366 days.

However for Maybank, for 366 days you should only get between 1000 and 1002.74 depending which date you placed the 100,000 in 2016, as Maybank uses 366 as the divisor for days in 2016.

In 2017, the program works OK for Maybank as well. Thus it is not about the number of days (28, 29, 30, 31) in the month but about the divisor, which the miniwebtool program has no means to adjust. Hence it is impossible to use the program to get an answer like Mamamia did for his Maybank GIA.

Some months, the result for the month will be 1 sen off even for Hong Leong or Maybank for interests paid monthly. This is due to the fact that the miniwebtool program does not have a way to handle monthly adjustments. Adjustments are needed because otherwise, the total of monthly payments will be more or less than what should be given for the total period involved depending on the principal and placement date. Anyway the miniwebtool should not address such complicated little problems, as different banks have their own ideas of how to do adjustments.

There are other strange complications and differences at other banks, but peculiar to each one. When you use them and compare carefully, you will know-but not to over worry as most are relatively small amounts and doubtful if most depositors will discover at least a 1,000 ringgit difference as long as no busybody internal auditor questions what is obtained

This post has been edited by Deal Hunter: Nov 25 2016, 10:54 PM

Good question!!! Here's my take.

It is quite possible that both Mamamia and his friend, and Starry got what the program credits them. How can?

I put it to you that Starry got 3.6% because the program was not yet updated to 3.55% on 20 November.

However Mamamia and his friend were too late in the month on 25 November. By that time the server had been updated to 3.55% backdated effective 15 November.

Of course, I do not expect Maybank to go back and cut what was already creditted and shown in Starry CASA account on 20 November.

So here is another case of good days and bad days for placing FD to consider depending whether trend is up or down!!!

This post has been edited by Deal Hunter: Nov 25 2016, 11:20 PM

All this computer do. Automatic. Nobody touch, nobody involved.

Haven't you heard this many times already??