Fundsupermart.com v14, Happy 牛(bull!) Year
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 Mar 14 2016, 10:25 AM
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#1
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Elite
5,608 posts Joined: May 2011 From: Here, There, Everywhere  
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QUOTE(river.sand @ Mar 13 2016, 07:52 PM) See my siggy... ignore?How much risk is a fund is related to how long your investment horizon is. If your investment horizon is 20 years or longer, basically you can ignore volatility risk.  i'd prefer to CAPITALIZE on wild "volatility risks" - buy fear.. perhaps sell extreme greed  |
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Mar 14 2016, 09:11 PM
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#2
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Elite
5,608 posts Joined: May 2011 From: Here, There, Everywhere
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QUOTE(river.sand @ Mar 14 2016, 08:30 PM) aiyo... people are just learning Newtonian Mechanics, and you're telling him Einstein's Relativity ok ok.. This guy, aftering reading your words, is going to hoard cash and wait for the market to crash. Keep buying every month or 3, VCA or DCA consistently - Newtonian Mechanics, long term diversified businesses goes up thanks to inflation + value created THEN when kaka happens.. load up the warehouse - Einstein's Relativity (holy kaka! blood everywhere, relatives jumping from buildings, etc - buy buy buy) thus must have asset allocation through at least 2 classes - Equities AND Fixed Income + already built-up emergency funds. Use up a buch of % from Fixed Income when lelong  right or right? got emergency funds ma - can hold them lelongs looooooong time This post has been edited by wongmunkeong: Mar 14 2016, 09:12 PM |
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Apr 22 2016, 12:06 PM
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#3
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Elite
5,608 posts Joined: May 2011 From: Here, There, Everywhere
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QUOTE(cybermaster98 @ Apr 22 2016, 11:54 AM) Yes understood. What u're saying is correct. UT is long term. .. and this is why the typical "investor" makes little $ from mutual funds or unit trust.But even if its long term, what kind of returns are we actually looking at? The way the world's economy is going, we are no longer in a bull market. We're basically drifting in and out of bear market and its going to stay that way till at least next year. 12 months ago, if I had invested my FSM funds into say ASB, I would have made a net profit of RM11K. But now, ive lost 9K. That's a wipe out of 20K of my potential NAV. Not blaming UT investments but what i've learnt is that UT investments is based on timing of your entry. U cannot enter when the market has just started a downturn and surely not before the bottom is reached. All those here who made decent returns entered when the market was still on a bull run. But then again, any investment e.g properties, share market, UT all would have made decent returns during a bull run anyway. Right now, the market is no where near a bottom. We have not seen the bottom yet. I kept telling myself many times over the past year that the worst is over, but the market always surprised me after that. I'm still holding on to my CIMB Global Titans and may go into UT more aggressively when the market improves in the future but for now there are better investments out there which deliver a better return in the current economic climate. Just my 2 cents worth. 1. Expectations - realistically? 5%pa to 9%pa ON LONG TERM AVERAGE note - purposely CAPITALIZED. Ever heard of the joke of a 6' man drowning in a river with AVERAGE depth of 5'? the deepest part can be >6', the shallowest part can be <1" Get it? Like UTs/mutual funds - the average is average BUT the tail end can be -50%pa and +80%pa (yup - literally experienced those numbers before) 2. Good time to go in is when market is on a bull run? Bull kaka - good time to go in MORE is when kaka has hit OR hitting the fan I still don't understand the logic of people PURPOSELY wanting to buy / buy more when prices/cost is up VS purposely buying more when prices are down, just like... SALES in ISETAN, TESCO, etc 3. Drifting markets no good? Even in drifting markets - the equities held (assuming equity funds) still do business, still makes profits (assuming good Companies/biz la), pays dividends, etc. So, hold back and don't invest until? for how long? Sorry ar boss - not purposely picking on your post (not U too). Just that there seems to be so much HOO HAAH when markets are running up BUT phtui when down. I get a "stimulated" with market downs and side-ways heheh No right/wrong - just.. huh? compared to obvious logic to me  This post has been edited by wongmunkeong: Apr 22 2016, 12:07 PM |
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Apr 22 2016, 02:37 PM
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#4
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Elite
5,608 posts Joined: May 2011 From: Here, There, Everywhere
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QUOTE(kkk8787 @ Apr 22 2016, 02:33 PM) I guess thats the reason y ppl prefer low cost index funds. But as per sifus here malaysia dun have low cost or performing ones dude.. U want INDEX style & lowest fees pa%?go ETF lar - bursa ada |
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Apr 23 2016, 04:09 PM
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#5
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Elite
5,608 posts Joined: May 2011 From: Here, There, Everywhere
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QUOTE(xuzen @ Apr 23 2016, 11:11 AM) Cybermaster, no lar, UT/MF xboleh pakai wanYou told us that your NAV dropped and you have been in the UTF market for one year thereabout. Please note that in Q1-Y2016, all indices were affected. Not one was spared. So no matter where you put your money, it would have wiped out your gain in that one year. That is the nature of investing and time and time again investment professionals and gurus always say that investment gain is due to the "time spent in the market" and not timing the market. For example, for those who invested since 2013, their NAV should hold up quite well. If I were to be able to peek at WMK's portfolio whom has been investing in UTF > 10 years, I am sure his NAV is still very much positive right? Paging WMK! Xuzen kennot make $ wan (exact same words from an ex-MAA agent, then trying to sell land banking to my buddy)  thus went into ETFs (cheap mgt fees but have to know the countries' tax rules) & trading options (dang work.. setting up pasar malam nearly every day) from UT/MF & stocks  but hor.. still buying UT/MF bwhahaah (energy, Emerging, Developed).. like old flame lor  This post has been edited by wongmunkeong: Apr 23 2016, 04:13 PM |
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Apr 23 2016, 04:26 PM
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#6
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Elite
5,608 posts Joined: May 2011 From: Here, There, Everywhere
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QUOTE(Ramjade @ Apr 23 2016, 11:45 AM) Yeah. Also curious to know Sifu Wong IRR. Living example of someone in UT for > 10 years. see-food (not seafood too, i see-food, eat-food  ) lar brono sifu here just big "L" plate, on my forehead (yo yo busta ryhme)  i don't track total IRR or XIRR for mutual funds wor - just each individual funds & per transaction eg of highlights. my PRS (been in since May 2013), excluding my tax relief (ie. being tracked as normal UT/MF) is floating around 8%-10%pa range. my old flame (>10 years held/pumped in.. er.. that doesn't sound too right ) PruSmallCaps.. oops.. sorry honey, nama glamour ESI SmallCaps, still in the 15%pa-17%pa my Tits fell to 8%-13%pa my lousiest currently is that energy fund lor -7%pa to 73%pa (er.. the crazy numbers are due to me plonking in 2015 last quarter till 2016 Feb) the rest are in between my Tits/PRS to energy fund This post has been edited by wongmunkeong: Apr 23 2016, 04:28 PM |
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Apr 27 2016, 12:48 PM
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#7
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Elite
5,608 posts Joined: May 2011 From: Here, There, Everywhere
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QUOTE(wonglokat @ Apr 27 2016, 08:15 AM) And here I am DCA-ing and second-guessing myself dude - have a plan So guys, once you're down, say, 7% of the value though within what you're prepared to risk, do you i) prepare to cut loss ii) screw it, I'll average down! iii) look at another fund to reduce overall volatility to feel better that average is still in the green I understand from my time here that it'll, for instance, be tiring to chase / time the market (xuzen) and continue averaging down (master Wong). Since we all have goals in mind and don't plan to be invested forever, how should I go about making sure the longer term goals are achieved in good time? eg A) Accumulation phase: (maybe up to age 50? ie 5 years before planned retirement?) IF market goes meh.. THEN.. DCA / VCA IF market goes VIAGRA! THEN... eh which one went way too crazy? eg 60% net profits in less than eh which one went way out of my Asset Allocation or sub-allocation? rebal rebal - sell high, buy low IF market goes limp / suicide squad THEN... eh which one went on suicide mission due to depression/sad? can buy MORE ar? big lelong ar? or simple 10%-20% discount je? eh which one went way out of my Asset Allocation or sub-allocation? rebal rebal - sell high, buy low Personally i only average down on BUCKETs of investments or long time high quality companies (think Nestle, PBank, XOM, CVX, MCD, etc.). If a mutual fund goes meh meh and down for 3 years+ straight VS similar funds in that sector/country, i move the sum to another fund (same sector/country). --- B) Retired phase: (maybe up to age >=55? ) different sets of IF THEN ELSE --- C) Moving from (A.) to (B.) Bridging actions' IF THEN ELSE different sets of IF THEN ELSE --- Simple right? U know why the saying "Kerbaus makes $, Beruang makes $, Khinzir gets slaughtered"? Coz "Khinzirs" don't have any plans or thoughts BEFORE hand. Another famous thought: U shouldn't draw your fire-escape plan DURING A FIRE, right? It should be planned BEFORE it happens. No absolute right/wrong plans ya - unless one happens to be totally illogical AND unlucky . |
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Apr 27 2016, 05:24 PM
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#8
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Elite
5,608 posts Joined: May 2011 From: Here, There, Everywhere
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QUOTE(Vanguard 2015 @ Apr 27 2016, 05:07 PM) Off topic a bit. hehhe - i aim to be "the first" When I analyse some rich clients and friends to see how they became rich, it was either by:- (1) Property investment. I am referring to long term investment with more than 5 rental properties. Not property flipping; (2) Running their own business, being housing developer, rubber factory, electronic factory, construction line, etc.; or (3) Inheritance because their family is rich. Sad to say but I have not seen one person who has become rich from unit trusts investment alone. I have also not come across a person who became a millionaire from trading in shares (excluding those who became rich through insider trading or maybe playing contra?). But having said that, speaking from experience, a white collar worker with a university degree will earn at least RM1 million in his working lifetime. Whether he will become a millionaire in his retirement age will depend on his savings and spending method, not on his investment. Without savings, there is no money to invest in the first place. Check 1. not a property enthusiast BUT have bought/rented out/sold before Check 2. definitely NOT a businessman - i'm a 1010110 guy, nerd + introvert (except when talking about things i'm passionate about.. like $ & risk mgt, investing, usable statistical approaches to investing AND trading Check 3. Family is typical 1 man working for $ + 1 woman working @ home for baka kids (i'm one of them) Check 4. Not a stock trader or day trader per se but i do set aside 10%+/- for "pasar malam" (options) trading (it's tough work, not as passive as value averaging & value investing) Realistically, i'm 100% sure i won't be the first or last - heheh, any monkey that can save >=33% of working income & 100% of invested/business income sure can hit millionaire (investment assets) status. The main fight is how one prioritize one's money allocation - some prefers a new car every 5 years (with 5 years loan), overseas vacations, etc. No right/wrong - just priorities. The real game IMHO is USD or Pound Sterling Millionaire and.. DECA MILLIONAIRE This post has been edited by wongmunkeong: Apr 27 2016, 05:36 PM |
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May 1 2016, 06:10 PM
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#9
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Elite
5,608 posts Joined: May 2011 From: Here, There, Everywhere
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QUOTE(wil-i-am @ May 1 2016, 05:27 PM) Penang Workshop: Financial Empowerment - Time to Take Charge, Ladies! sexual discrimination.. hmph http://www.fundsupermart.com.my/main/resea...adies!-7051 Y FSM doesn't organize workshop for guys?  |
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May 3 2016, 11:27 PM
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#10
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Elite
5,608 posts Joined: May 2011 From: Here, There, Everywhere
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QUOTE(wil-i-am @ May 3 2016, 11:14 PM) Crab is 1 of my favourite dish Alaskan crab very expensive neh  |
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May 6 2016, 05:04 PM
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#11
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Elite
5,608 posts Joined: May 2011 From: Here, There, Everywhere
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QUOTE(dasecret @ May 6 2016, 03:57 PM) to answer your question, I think it is not worth to jump in straight, however, if you are the type who would procrastinate and not take actions for months, then maybe different story yeah - sometimes "ready.. SHOOT SHOOT, adjust aim, SHOOT" is better, I have an alternative solution for you though. In the next few days, try to read up and decide on a few funds in different categories/geographical areas - sign up for the RSP within the 30 days new account bonus. The amount of RSP does not have to be big; that way you can get 1% sales charge for the next 6 month's RSP; and if you don't like what you signed up for, you can cancel them and just end up with 1 or 2 months RSP purchase. At least it's not the entire amount you planned to put in. But you still need to put in effort to read to decide on the few funds you want to sign up especially for procrastinators and people who can't be bothered to track & manage if no skin in the game ( like me)Re-plan / Tweak as we go along heheh |
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May 10 2016, 11:03 AM
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#12
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Elite
5,608 posts Joined: May 2011 From: Here, There, Everywhere
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QUOTE(river.sand @ May 10 2016, 07:51 AM) How do you guys see the outlook of REIT funds, e.g. AmAsia Pacific REIT? Personally, it looks kind of rich to me (the value held ran up already high in terms of average Vs stand. dev.).BTW - i'm on PRS that feeds into this & trigger to top-up preferred is $0.6x or by end Oct 2016 heheh, for the tax relief & getting more properties-based assets ma, whichever comes first. + my sis' is invested too (cash), thus i'm looking at it on/off. Note - no expert here ya, just my PoV |
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May 26 2016, 12:38 PM
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#13
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Elite
5,608 posts Joined: May 2011 From: Here, There, Everywhere
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QUOTE(xuzen @ May 26 2016, 12:32 PM) Wah Lau Eh! What happen to US exposed UTF and Global Titan ar? Suddenly on steroid + Viagra again ar? S&P500 has been running up Mon-Wed maXuzen This post has been edited by wongmunkeong: May 26 2016, 12:39 PM |
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Jun 3 2016, 05:14 PM
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#14
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Elite
5,608 posts Joined: May 2011 From: Here, There, Everywhere
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IMHO:
1. What we know, is the NOW 2. All predictions & soothsaying are best left to dreamwalkers on happy grass or similar vision-inducing concoctions. 3. Have a plan - IF THEN ELSE, and execute the plan. Track it and after 3 to 5 years, analyze and tweak if necessary. No point in "planning" during a firestorm OR trying to see where the markets will go. May be worthwhile to see where the markets WON'T GO though |
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Jun 9 2016, 09:26 AM
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#15
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Elite
5,608 posts Joined: May 2011 From: Here, There, Everywhere
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QUOTE(lukenn @ Jun 8 2016, 08:14 PM) Agreed, but should you actually put real properties into the mix? Reits and developer stocks I would definitely say yes, but to put an illiquid asset into the same category as assets with MTM value? IMHO - real properties should be in one's total asset allocation trackingReason: Its "illiquidity" is subjective - yes, more iliiquid than common stocks & mutual funds, FD, etc. BUT it's more liquid than non-listed / private businesses (which can be substantial), equivalent value of "unmarked" (ie. not sealed & certified) gold bars and "collectibles". Also, real property prices do fluctuate - just that we do not have a daily easy "measure" / watchlist - unlike the share markets / large auction exchanges. Also, the Talmud says so 1/3 in businesses 1/3 in land 1/3 in reserves Hey - i'm not religious but there are nuggets of wisdoms/common-sense from even waaaaaay long ago |
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Jun 15 2016, 03:44 PM
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#16
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Elite
5,608 posts Joined: May 2011 From: Here, There, Everywhere
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Investors fearing ‘summer shocks’ are hoarding the most cash since 2001
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/investors...2001-2016-06-14 Snippet from article to think about: "..Still, despite the gloomy tone of the report, there is a reason to be optimistic, Hartnett notes, citing the average cash level above 4.5%. That move tends to serve as a contrarian buy signal for stocks whereas when it drops below 3.5%, it is a contrarian sell sign, he said..." |
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Jun 16 2016, 05:09 PM
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#17
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Elite
5,608 posts Joined: May 2011 From: Here, There, Everywhere
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Just a PoV-sharing - hope U guys/gals don't face this:
hm.. FSM now does not allow third-party bank-in for investments ie i invest for myself, my sister & wife when i buy for my sister or wife, THEY have to transfer $ online from their account unlike now where i do everything. jialat lor - my sis is like "anti" banking-online one. Back to Public Mutual.. sigh.. for my wife - i'll have to transfer $ to her a/c, then she to FSM.. urgh |
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Jun 20 2016, 11:27 AM
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#18
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Elite
5,608 posts Joined: May 2011 From: Here, There, Everywhere
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QUOTE(hurtedheart @ Jun 16 2016, 07:18 PM) If your sis purchase cash management fund in one go, say an amount which is targeted to be invested in a year, would that help to eliminate the need of her to transfer money to you whenever a purchase is desired to be made by you on behalf of her? My sis "makes" more % with her flexi-mortgage than cash mgt account, thus toughBeneficiary account can use the principal holder bank account to make purchases |
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Jun 20 2016, 11:29 AM
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#19
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Elite
5,608 posts Joined: May 2011 From: Here, There, Everywhere
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QUOTE(xuzen @ Jun 16 2016, 07:43 PM) You have that criminal look... they scare you money-laudering mah! good lord.. it's not like RM50K per transaction leh Joke aside, this is in line with BNM directive to help combat the menace of money-laundering. Xuzen + not "often" leh (once in 4 to 8 months) funny how AMLA hits us Vs those move billions |
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Jun 29 2016, 10:07 AM
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#20
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Elite
5,608 posts Joined: May 2011 From: Here, There, Everywhere
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QUOTE(Ramjade @ Jun 28 2016, 10:17 PM) But how many people brave to topup? not enuf "blood on the streets" to "specially top up"   |
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