my cgpa is fine,3.50 out of 4.0,had working experiences in sales line and decent leadership positions in several clubs although i never done internship before and i just graduated and 26 this year.............both ey and pwc pg rejected me thru email after i called them up.........had a tax interview with kpmg thru friend's connection which i talked well and showed good knowledge but got a feeling they aint gonna hire me cuz interviewer said i was more of an outgoing dude who loves to meet ppl instead of sitting in computer all day and i screwed up the tax computation part a bit altho i told interviewer where my mistakes were............should i start from small firms cuz i got few offers with em?but it aint gonna look good if i apply as experienced hire in later stage.............. ..............guess deloitte is the last resort but i gotta find out where the wrongs at 1st b4 applying to them.....anyway bdo still hasnt replied me too

This post has been edited by Danielyo: Jan 23 2016, 09:04 PM

Depends on your uni as well. Managed to get interview at the Big 4 and a few in the remaining top 10 with a CGPA of 3.20. Only member of clubs in university. How bout you send me your resume and I'll try see where you went wrong

i did a twinning program which the partner university is among top 10 in australia,im clueless

No idea about that bro, could be that the job market is bad right now

how?i dont wanna die without a reason

Try Mazars or Baker Tilly as well.

tried all the top 10 no reply at all,only got offers from small firms

This post has been edited by Danielyo: Jan 23 2016, 11:02 PM

I'm not in the Big 4, but I have seen my bosses reject candidates who graduate at a later age than the usual 23-24. To them, it is a red flag.

no other way to break into it?can i make it up with my past working experiences and maybe 3-4 months in small firm?cuz friends at my age got into mnc with 2 pointer cgpa....................

This post has been edited by Danielyo: Jan 23 2016, 11:12 PM

n i also had a political background could that be a reason?

why need to red flag based on age? That's stupid! I'm guessing your bosses are that of chinamen mentality.

Some people took a gap year between studies to enjoy some life, instead of rushing into the rat race that you're not gonna escape till 56 years old.

Some people aren't so fortunate; they had to work their arse first to get money to fund their studies. So they entered university a little later.

This post has been edited by hirano: Jan 23 2016, 11:21 PM

Yep, personally entered the work force a little later than the average fresh grad as I had to take care of my family in my earlier years. In fact, had a friend who entered KPMG at 25 with me.

The big 3 have always been picky with hiring.

Did you go through their IQ and personality testing regime?

Because;

1) You're older and thus a generally have a higher expectation for wages
2) If you took 6 years to grad instead of say 4, you must have been an idiot
3) Gap years are for the aimless and for people with no goals, large companies want eager blood

If you say you spent the first 4 years doing an apprenticeship or vocational training at work and then you moved on to a uni degree, usually most would hire you on the spot even if you are older.

It generally boils down to what you did with your time, HR people look at this closely. HR people especially don't like gaps in your career or studies.

Did you try CH?

is it possible for me to reapply for ey n pwc again?i think it might be they are using older version of microsoft word to open my resume which was done using word document 2010 that caused alignments and all out of lines..........just realized that

r u tokin' to me?i spent 3 years working b4 i kicked off my uni life

If I had 10 years of sales experience and tried to join my current company, they'd laugh at me and tell me to bugger off because it's irrelevant to what they hire for. But if I had 10 years of sales experience and asked for a sales engineer job, I'd most likely ace it.

Also if you send resumes, don't use word, use PDF, comes out nicer looking due to set look and the anti aliasing that PDF uses makes it easier on the eyes. Also use contextual grammar and vocabulary.

You should give the recruiter every reason to believe your personalized your resume and cover letter combo just for them. I never just send a resume named "Resume.pdf", I always add context by using "Resume XXXCO XXXPOSITION DATE". Fine details make the difference.

thx for the words bro,do u think working few months in small firm would land me a job at big 4 eventually?

I think so. Because when I graduated 5 years ago, to get into a large oil and gas company you generally had to have flat 4, ace their IQ and other tests and have really good credentials. I spent 2.5 years working for a small company servicing the industry and every since then I've worked at the big players.

Trust me you'll learn 10x more things at a small company. I work at my first company for 6 months I learn more than working in my current position for 10 years lol.

and the quality of their hires are still mediocre especially pwc.

guess no other ways out but deloitte would be my last option...............

Pls use PDF at ALL TIMES. Also name yr resume with yr name-resume Fr eg

Daniel Yo Chun Kiat - Resume

what can i do right now?im so lost

Always save your resume/CV in PDF.

And I believe you have got nothing to lose if you reapply.

Good luck.

Frankly speaking, you were rejected probably due to your low English proficiency. Based on what you have written here, there is a huge room for improvement for your English language. This was probably reflected in your CV as well. That's why you were not shortlisted based on your CV.

where my wrongs at?cuz i cant see no screw up in my english

My personal opinion on the Big4 hiring preference (priority in ascending order):
1) Foreign grads (Ie: spent full years at UK, US or Aus) and with good CGPAs (age from 22 to 24). They will most likely represent the face of the firm. Most likely will be drafted to the best teams with best (cleanest portfolios). Drafted for professional qualifications (Ie: ICAEW) with bond period up to 4 years.
2) Professional qualifications (Ie: ACCA). Age normally 21 to 22. 2nd preferred hires due to able to hit the ground running with no requirement to further study. Will support the team when the foreign grads left to study. Mostly drafted as workhorse to support the team or cover all the "undesirable projects".
3) Local grads: Drafted mainly for normal projects
4) Experienced hires: Very few came through this route

My advice is to get a good referral. Set an interview with the referral and ask for help/endorsement. The higher level the better.

Btw, its not the end of the world if you are not able to join Big4.

theres a problem when even mid tier firms rejected u

Was this even written in proper English?

If you believe that's not the problem, good luck in searching for a company that you can get away with this.

my cover letter is well written no doubt about it ,its not like we have to talk like diplomats all the time in forum like this or everyday life..............i believe problems lie on somewhere else which keep me from breaking thru

This post has been edited by Danielyo: Jan 25 2016, 12:33 AM

As a professional recruiter, what I would ask from you:

1. What is your career goal, where are you heading to? most people pursue Big 4 for few reasons:
- To reach Job Grade of Manager (Associate -> Senior Associate -> Team Lead -> Assistant Manager -> Manager), usually take minimum of 6 years or more. Thereafter, they can choose to open up their own firm with the accumulated experience. OR become a team lead/finance manager of MNC.
- Some of them are aiming for BNM, Bank Negara Malaysia, pays really really well. Only elites enter. Big 4 is kinda like prerequisite.
- Easier for them to go anywhere.

2. Take the advice from the person below. Small firms is like a boot camp, but you've gotta endure how unstructured it may be. Once you've pulled through 2-3 years, you'll be like a refined gem, better than those from MNC.

That aside, I have an AP role in one of the MNC. If you are interested let me know.

Getting into big4 is like a dream to me and no matter what it takes I wouldn't let it go

How is that so ? Can share here ? Thanks.

Unless you have ACCA....
then the possibility will be higher

Some companies might have different version of Words than yours. It would cause compatibility issue when opening your Words file. Pdf will always look far better.

Different version of word. Different OS version. Different fonts. I've seen one instance where the same version of windows and word was used, the document only used standard windows fonts, and still, there's some reflow that screws up the carefully laid out alignment. I suspect, it's because the two computers have different default printer drivers installed. Who knows what's the real reason. There are some ways to minimize this problem. But the only sure way to eliminate it completely is to save your documents as pdf.

Maybe you indeed don't have the correct personality to fit in? Personality fit is quite important.

I got 2 first class fresh graduates in my team who I have just kicked out, not because they're dumb or what. But they just cannot focus on and finish their task on hand. Always want to move on to something new when they are not ready yet.

I will improve if chance is given

Are you seriously comparing English from a casual forum reply to a resume? You haven't even seen his resume! His English is better than most experienced working professionals in MNCs.

What an uptight keyboard warrior..

Personality cannot be "improved" 1... The real trick is to find out where can you really excel, not trying to fit into somewhere where you can't excel.
Give you an anology, fish are not built, and thus will never be able to climb trees.

PDF

1. More professional
2. Formatting can't change even if diff Word being used
3. Looks nicer

Good Luc

Why I can't fit in?its just some unproven bullshit that stand in my way,I believe my years of involvement make me stand out from the rest and record speak itself

Just google it and there are websites to help you convert for free and no need to dl any software

This post has been edited by oOoproz: Jan 25 2016, 04:28 PM

LOL. The analogy so simple but you still don't understand. Fish are meant to swim, not meant to climb trees.

The recruiters (if they have been around for some time), would have recruited hundreds or thousands of people, and will know what kind of traits would make a person more likely to be successful in the firm. Outgoing people who cannot sit long infront of a computer WILL be miserable in a Big 4. There might be exceptions, but why take a chance on you?

What you believe is irrelevant, what the recruiters believe is relevant. If you really stand out from the rest, why are you not getting interviewed?
Answer: even if you stand out, you might not be what they are looking for.

bullshit,partners in big 4 also need to be outgoing to bring clients in does that mean they suck as auditor or can't spend whole days at their desks doing paper works,things don't always go 1 way

You'll soon to realize its not as it seems.

Opportunity is everywhere bro. I applied to big4 and BNM. Both failed. I then got the opportunity to enter MOF which is on top of BNM.

So although u don't get ur first choice, u might get something better in the long run. Also big4 is not all roses.

whats the chance im gonna make it if i start working at small firm for couple of months and study for acca?by then,should i apply as fresh grad or experienced hire?

Most people looks to leave the big 4 rather than to join it after a couple of years there

But personality is important, especially in the context of culture fit.

With your attitude, not much chance.

Either you are treating this as a joke and trolling us, or you are so wilfully ignorant that it makes sense for Big4 to reject you.

Ok in case you aren't trolling, send me your CV/CL and I will have a look at it.

From the info you have given above, CGPA 3.5 isn't bad, it is JUST So-So and it can't make you stand out. Leadership positions is ok, tons of people have that to. You had never done internships before - huge minus point unless you can explain why you never bothered to do internships with companies that you claim to love so much. Sales line experience is good, but judging from your age they will be expecting some basic work experience, so it doesn't add too many points.

Why did you graduate late?

Honestly the outgoing stuff is just kind words as a cushion for your rejection, don't read too much into it.

You talk alot about
'believe my years of involvement make me stand out' - you believe only la, recruiters don't give a fark about what you believe. What do you have on your CV/interview presentation skills that wows them?

'I will improve if chance is given' - how do you convince them to give you the job over someone who is younger with a better CV? This isn't rhetorical. How well did you prepare and plan out your interviews? What examples did you use to show the best side of yourself, how do you market your sales experience to give yourself an advantage over the freshie baby-faced grad stepping into the world for the first time? Did you provide them with a career plan and strategy that makes sense and adds value to their company?

You did sales right? - you are the product, how do you convince them to buy you?

At this point, why not enter a smaller firm, slay it there, and make your way up to the big leagues?

This post has been edited by believe92: Jan 28 2016, 06:54 PM

Should always use pdf format, bruh. Btw, which line did u apply for?audit, tax or consulting? All based in penang?

Walao! is the age thing true where you get rejected if you're older than the usual graduate age? because I will graduate at the age 25. Does this mean I'm screwed?

So, u work in o&g sector? Mechanical engineering?

Bro PM me your resume, i see how i can help.. Also if u die die wana go in Big4, maybe cn help. they hire thousands of ppl annualy.

Can you share your story how do you manage to move from small company to big player?

How is your job application progression?

Electrical and Instrumentation.

Just work in small company, cover a lot of projects for big companies while being the main point of contact/engineering and learn their internal systems well, then just jump as an experienced hire lol.

Pwc mediocre? Thought they are top in msia

After working for 3 years in mid tier, PWC still rejected me mainly because of my uni results.

2nd upper?

Then consider it their loss and move on lor... The Big 4 are generally spoilt for choice and use results as the first level filtering...

It's somewhat similar to IBs

What is your long term goal, perhaps skip this step and take a longer route to achieve your long term goal instead

I would like to see you ordering BNM around

I graduated from an Australian uni, it's just a pass for me. 53% average lol. 50% is passing.

Sighh no point looking back on the past but honestly results is very important to secure a job as well or higher chance I would say. Which uni doesn't matter.

*u won't lose out starting your career in mid tier, big 4 have big clients and they usually are specialized according to specific industry.

do i apply at wrong time??thus far what i tried are all at penang and one of my schoolmates got turned down too despite being 1st class.........i guess those who did internship under their belts just outbeat those without

This post has been edited by Danielyo: Feb 15 2016, 09:32 PM

Could probably be the way he did the interview.

may have rubbed some people the wrong way ?

I have interviewed some people that I would consider borderline cocky.

I dont give 2 shits about your talking skills nor your leadership qualities. displaying them and talking about it too much is 2 different things.

If all you talk about is the prestige of working in a big named mnc and being a leader, you dont show the skills of being a worker / trainee.

could be cause of that. I have turned down many applicants who were too cocky for their own good. Like outright, told hr, never to hire in a million years.

academics checkout, personality nope.

This post has been edited by omnimech: Feb 15 2016, 09:40 PM

any idea on how should i handle the upcoming interviews ?got a couple of calls from mid tier

The question is what have you been doing in your current interviews and how to change it up so that you are more hire friendly.

do you wanna share your cv? blank out the sensitive, maybe the forumers can help.

also, look thru the interview thread to see where you can pick it up...

I don't think they is a problem with your resume, but rather on how the interview went. Look yourself in the mirror and perform your interview and evaluate. If your resume has issues you wont be getting the calls from the companies.

u spell one of the company name wrong. is Crowe Horwath and maybe that is the reason CH rejected u.

Ever heard of PDF?

The key to impress the interviewers is to be yourself. Calm, be confident and most importantly be yourself in showing what you are (what you are capable of? strength as well as balancing out with your weaknesses) Wear neat and professionally, that will do! Not ignoring that you must fully equipped with preparations on knowledge for that designated position you want to apply!

i screwed up the interviews again ,is it that penang top 10 audit firms dont hire people much?its hard to get the interview but its even harder to get a job

i dont think working for small firm will make me jump into big 4 tho as u gotta fight with those from mid tiers,so its better for me to hold it till i make it

edit

This post has been edited by Slyp: Mar 18 2016, 03:02 PM

Pls give a scenario of what happened? Failed technical questions? Attitude problem?

technical questions,i was losing my mind till i didnt know what i said.............

Then buckle up on your knowledge by reading up more business magazines related to the questions. If you can't understand, you should Google it and find out what's the meaning of it.

Do all Big 4 has a recruitment policy like if you not able to pass the interview or any test, they will screen you out for the next 1 year or so and encourage you to reapply again after 1 year?

Can I have specific details on all Big 4?

Thanks.

Means you go unprepared. Improve ur technical first.

What the interviewer told you about being outgoing is true. Of your personality us not suitable for the work that you will have to do a majority of the time, you'll be in trouble.

Accounting firms tend to be very structural and hierarchical. Being too vocal, can potentially be a problem unfortunately.

If you are going to specialise in tax, why not go to deloitte. The sentiment is that deloitte is the tax leader in malaysia.

Being an experienced hire only means you'll likely to be demoted when you move to a big 4 later on. The methodologies used, especially audit will be very much different too.

Is ur presentation skill good? IMO CGPA and resume is just an entrance ticket, u need to present really well to impress them. I don't have good CGPA but i have no problem interviewing, presentation skill is worth practice, most importantly, show ur confident.
Back in my college time, that's a guy everyone knew he can do no shit, but he is very good presenter, he can bullshit through any interview... ofcoz he never last long in any activity/group assignment in college back thn lol... Presentation skill is really important

This post has been edited by ragk: Feb 23 2016, 04:20 PM

and there is the problem lah. many accounting or finance grad are aiming to join one of the bigger firms as it is a good learning experience and stepping stone so why would they hire someone who isn't technically sound. I suspect it doesn't have anything to do with anything else, sadly. Go brush up your knowledge and try again later perhaps?

Not quite true la. Plenty of outgoing and fun loving guys working at the big 4. But sadly the demotion thing holds true, I was in audit so the methodology and approach differences will be a challenge. Many of the experienced hires had to start as an assistant, or at best senior assistant. Not sure about tax though, cause i would think that tax is tax, with little room for variations?

This post has been edited by madmoz: Feb 23 2016, 03:55 PM

hey guys, would like to ask is anyone out there tried applying Crowe horwath? i just got a phone call from them i think it lasted about 10 minutes plus, not sure whether am i shortlisted? would like to know will they straight offer you on interview when they called you or you need wait fews days for their call or email? hoping someone will replied me thanks!