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 LG OLED TV Discussion Thread, OLED TV

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JustCheeze
post Jul 7 2020, 03:54 PM

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Do ppl use peak brightness setting for SDR? I am asking cos the TV installer told me to set to high but it seems like that just make the picture unnecessarily bright??
JustCheeze
post Jul 7 2020, 07:14 PM

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QUOTE(kkthen @ Jul 7 2020, 04:20 PM)
Standard sdr  peak brightness for dark room  only need 100nits. From bright room, you can increase the brightness suit your environment.  I  use auto brightness setting to let tv automatic  adjust  brightness .
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How will I know what OLED light value to put in to get 100 nits for dark room?
JustCheeze
post Jul 8 2020, 03:12 PM

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QUOTE(Convael @ Jul 8 2020, 05:17 AM)
Use OFF , scale down OLED LIGHT to around 40 for SDR .
Peak luminance controls the amount of light from the white-boosting subpixel .

Typically with peak brightness ON , you should get a range of 0 to 330~400 nits from 0-100 [OLED LIGHT] in SDR .
OFF , you still get  around 0- 250 nits  , more than enough for everything in SDR .
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Will try 40 OLED light in bright room preset setting.

I did read on AVSforum C9 calibration thread that most people get 100cd/m2 at around 19-23 OLED light though depending on panel variance? Isn't 100 cd/m2 the reference for SDR movies?

JustCheeze
post Jul 8 2020, 07:48 PM

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QUOTE(Convael @ Jul 8 2020, 04:27 PM)
If the peak brightness setting is on , it will typically hit 100 nits at 20-30 .

If you leave the peak brightness setting off , the range of luminance will be decreased so 100 nits will likely land at around 40-50.

100 cd/m2 is what the typical SDR TV shows are mastered at , 120 cd/m2 if you want a little bit more highlights and pops .
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I am getting conflicting info seems like. Almost everyone in the calibration thread says to turn off peak brightness and set OLED light value to 20 - this gives them 100 cd/m2.

But you are saying you can only hit 100 cd/m2 at that OLED light value IF peak brightness is set to ON? but if it's ON, then what setting should that be at? Low or High?
JustCheeze
post Jul 9 2020, 10:08 AM

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QUOTE(Convael @ Jul 9 2020, 05:46 AM)
On = max of around 400 cd/m2
Off = max of around 250 cd/m2

Low / High = somewhere between 250-400.
Who is this " everyone " you speak of ? And how do you know which TV model they are using ?  B9 ? C8 ? C9 or CX ?

I am not saying you should definitely be using the exact same setting . Obviously you also have to consider the factor of panel variance here .
The C8 used to be able to hit 400 cd/m2 in SDR mode but a patch landed last year cutting down the peak brightness in SDR to around 300 cd/m2 .
B9 is quite a bit dimmer than C9 and CX as well. 

My C8 is calibrated to 100 cd/m2 at 32 OLED lights , I don't have a C9 but I have calibrated one at around the same number too [Peak off].
It is what it is , I don't measure peak brightness in SDR mode either .
If you are that obsessed with hitting the exact number you should be getting a colorimeter then .
Without that , the best you can do is only from estimation . Else , the range of 20-40 should be working fine for most people .
The peak brightness setting is unnecessary for SDR mode anyway , since SDR content is only using the colors within the rec.709.
The OLEDs should be more than capable of covering the color space of rec.709.
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The C9 calibration thread at avsforum. So they are all talking about C9 model. I am aware there are variance in panel, that's what I wrote few post ago.
You are the first person that is saying OLED light between 40-50 only give 100 cd/m2 if peak brightness is set to OFF. But now you conflicting yourself again saying your own C8 which is not C9, you have it set at 32 and is already at 100 cd/m2. You did not mention you are using C8, so all the settings you said is pointless for me then.

I want to ask what colorimeter you use? I want to buy one.
JustCheeze
post Jul 22 2020, 05:40 PM

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QUOTE(Andrewtst @ Jul 20 2020, 09:25 PM)
Not sure for C8, but C9 definitely on. LG had did a great job on Dynamic Tone Mapping for HDR.

I believe C8 also did great on that, it is just 2 years ago product which still pretty new.
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hmm.gif

I experiment with DTM for a whole week everyday, with different movies and games, I think DTM off is more correct. DTM on seem like it over expose the mid highlight of the image, like dark scene look unnaturally bright. Asked sifu ssjben, he say better to turn off too.
JustCheeze
post Jul 23 2020, 01:18 AM

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QUOTE(Andrewtst @ Jul 22 2020, 05:48 PM)
They is two thing, one is Dynamic Contrast where i am off.
For Dynamic Tone Mapping setting I will re-check again but I am pretty sure I never face over expose the mid highlight of the image before.
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Not sure why you bring up dynamic contrast. I'm specifically speaking about DTM. It definitely crush mid range highlight, this also confirmed by Vincent teoh at HDTVtest.

I test the setting for 1 whole week everyday, almost 3-4 hours each time going through different movies and games. Most of the time the effect is either too bright or is unnatural. Only few show I remember where DTM make it look better is Daredevil and Stranger thing netflix.


QUOTE(Andrewtst @ Jul 22 2020, 10:40 PM)
So no need care on the DTM as it is disable in preset we choose. smile.gif

Maybe disable is OFF,  maybe is ON, maybe is N/A. Haha!
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Are you sure? On my B9 here DTM can disable or enable in Cinema or Cinema Home preset when TV is in HDR mode. Very weird you say C9 cannot. I thought they same OS?
JustCheeze
post Jul 23 2020, 09:00 PM

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QUOTE(Andrewtst @ Jul 23 2020, 03:26 AM)
I just check now it can, probably some changes is make after firmware update.

But in Dolby Vision mode, Dynamic Tone Mapping setting is not there.

Just use the thing best suite you, they is nothing correct or wrong, it is user preference.

I don't see any crush mid range highlight, it was the best setting for me and I already watch like that few months.

B9 had inaccurate setting by default, probably it impact the output which probably not only did by DTM but others setting as well.

From this article now I know why this feature is not there for Dolby Vision because Dolby Vision already have it owned Dynamic Tone Mapping.

I find it work perfectly, so I am going to stick to On in HDR10.
It make the HDR10 very closed to what Dolby Vision did which is much better. So far I had no complain on all movies I see.

https://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/lg/cx-oled/settings
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One thing I forget mention. I read before someone on this thread say DTM best used if your room is bright. My room is bedroom, so I control the light to be quite dark most of the time. This certainly make DTM to show the over exposure issue more noticeable if compare to bright room.

Ya I know DTM is no right or wrong. But I think I rather prefer watching the movie as was intended.


QUOTE(fentanyl @ Jul 23 2020, 10:41 AM)
I read somewhere that DTM in HDR10 is equivalent to Dolby Vision. I think I just let it ON.
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That's not true. DTM only pretend to be like DV, but certainly is not equal to it.
JustCheeze
post Jul 24 2020, 06:37 PM

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QUOTE(Andrewtst @ Jul 23 2020, 09:43 PM)
Most the time I watch in normal lighting condition room, but sometimes I watch in total dark room also.

I never ever facing over exposure issue at all. smile.gif

Did you make some changes on the setting? suggest you reset back all to original and check again by turning on the DTM only.

Last time, someone here told me OLED Light, Contrast and Brightness cannot simply touch as this will impact the output.
I let all this in default setting and it looks just nice in Cinema Mode for all except Home Cinema Mode for Dolby Vision to me.
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When I first tested DTM with just normal content like movies, ya it looks very impressive. Makes HDR highlights "pop" which is very pleasing to the eye. But then I learnt from few people to use some test patterns like the one from Spears Munsil 4k disc to at least adjust contrast and brightness to prevent clipping. Since those test pattern does not require a meter, I tried it. I'm surprised when I enable DTM it CLIPS a lot of the test pattern. You may not notice it because maybe you not sure what it is clipping?
JustCheeze
post Jul 24 2020, 08:30 PM

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QUOTE(fentanyl @ Jul 24 2020, 06:55 PM)
What does that mean? Overblown images?
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If there is scene where there is very bright object, example like a sun showing through the cloud, clipping the highlight detail means suddenly the cloud look like just 1 white blob instead of looking like a cloud.

Example what I mean:
user posted image

Left is DTM, right is no DTM.


QUOTE(madballs @ Jul 24 2020, 08:12 PM)
This is also true. But not all models have hgig. Only 9 series and X series.

There was a time when the 7 or 8 series GAME HDR mode was so dim its unplayable on dark scenes. DTM helps to elevate this issue abit. Some even resort to dynamic contrast.

It also depends on game, as some game doesn't have control for white point, hgig can't help without it. But most of the newer games has it so its a moot point. The game on my head right is God of War and HZD, hgig might clip details on this 2 games.
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Actually to be honest, a lot of PS4 games HDR sucks. The God of War and HZD you mention is quite bad, either is too dark or too bright clipping the image.

Recently I play Ghost Tsushima, at first it look too dark too. Then I read from reddit, some guy recommend to do the PS4 HDR calibration option and then enable HGIG. Turn out the game use the PS4 HDR calibration values, I think is the first game to do this.
JustCheeze
post Jul 25 2020, 04:30 PM

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QUOTE(madballs @ Jul 25 2020, 12:09 AM)
I think the first game to implement this was COD modern warfare.
I haven't try ghost yet, but I'm glad they are implementing hgig.
And yes, alot of ps4 games didnt implement HDR correctly. Think alot of dev is still experimenting on HDR since it still quite new and haven't reach mainstream yet.
The worst I came across was monster hunter world before expansion.

Let's hope HGIG or HDR gaming as a whole mature in coming time for Ps5
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Doesn't COD have in-game HDR controls? HGIG supported on that game as I read the HDR tone mapping is done on the engine level. GoT doesn't have it but it relies on system level HDR value. GoT doesn't use HGIG at all.

Ya sure hoping next gen games HDR can reach a proper standard. I think that was the reason for HGIG to exist right?
JustCheeze
post Jul 26 2020, 05:03 PM

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QUOTE(Andrewtst @ Jul 26 2020, 04:18 AM)
Ok, I had listen to you guy and did some changes to my LG C9 setting with some reference from rtings.com Haha!

Actually previously I on the Dynamic Tone Mapping due to I find HDR is too dark.

Now I did some changes and yes it is better than before. biggrin.gif

  • Color Temperature - Warm 2
  • Dynamic Contrast - Medium (this is recommended setting by rtings if you find HDR too dark), for SDR, this setting remain off.
  • Dynamic Tone Mapping - Off

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I agree that dynamic contrast @ medium is good trade off. High is very bad as it crush shadow details a lot.

I think if you can ask someone to calibrate white point for you, the warm 2 setting will be very nice because I read before you say is too yellow. Honestly I think is too yellow because we human eyes are too used to blue whits now a days because of all the LED LCD screen around us. Apparently most screens we see in our day to day life is beyond 7000k that's why we suddenly think that warm 2 is too yellow which according to rting and flatpanelshd say they are around 6000k out of the box.


QUOTE(ben3003 @ Jul 26 2020, 04:06 PM)
So actually Dynamic contrast is better than DTM?
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They are different thing. But dynamic contrast is less "destructive" to the source material in how it should look, as long as you don't put it on "high".

JustCheeze
post Jul 27 2020, 04:58 PM

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QUOTE(Andrewtst @ Jul 26 2020, 11:48 PM)

I read comment from Internet, the auto was actually call Normal previously, LG should not change to call auto as it is misleading, it won't change the color gamut even different source of BT. 709 or BT. 2020 is detect, it remain same. For wide one is using back the native panel color gamut and ignore the preset. As for extended, I find the output a bit like increasing color.

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I PM'd sifu ssjben about this part. Waiting for his reply.

What I observe is that my B9 does change color gamut automatically depending it is SDR or HDR content. I double confirm this because when I bring up the on-screen menu of my receiver, the screen will flash black for a second to change back to BT709 because the receiver's menu is SDR.
JustCheeze
post Jul 28 2020, 12:01 AM

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QUOTE(Andrewtst @ Jul 27 2020, 05:37 PM)
I believe this is due to changing format in between SDR and HDR,  it had nothing to do with color gamut setting.

You put auto, extended or wide will give you same result also.
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hmm.gif

If that's the case, then why test pattern shows correct DCIP3 coverage (98-100%) when Auto is selected but when force to Extended/Wide it goes above 130%? Can't be colorimeter is lying?
JustCheeze
post Jul 28 2020, 03:09 PM

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QUOTE(Andrewtst @ Jul 28 2020, 12:10 AM)
I think you misunderstand me. I never said Extended or Wide is correct color gamut but goes above is correct as this two color gamut had much wider color coverage.

I mean the Auto Color Gamut label is misleading as it didn't auto switch to different color gamut, it remain the same normal color gamut nonmatter what format it detect, either SDR or HDR.
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I understood what you mean. I think I didn't word my post properly, my mistake. What I meant to say was if I change the color gamut option when a test pattern is on screen, it clearly shows a change in color value immediately. This is for SDR only. In HDR, this doesn't happen because I think the content is already using WCG so TV is locked to "Wide" either way, even if you select Auto or Extended.


QUOTE(ben3003 @ Jul 28 2020, 06:38 AM)
sifu ssjben kena banned 30days i think
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Oh no wonder don't see him post anymore. Wonder why he get ban.
JustCheeze
post Jul 30 2020, 02:12 AM

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QUOTE(Andrewtst @ Jul 29 2020, 03:27 AM)
I already found what I want for HDR but the SDR still very wrong.
I find the SDR - isf Expert (Bright Room) is very wrong, the color is totally over blown.

So I decide to experiment again. Haha!

This time I also tune down a bit of sharpness from 25 to 22 as I am over did last time. Also De-Judder reduce to 3.
Finally I am sticking to Warm2, Color Gamut as Auto for SDR, HDR10 & HLG HDR. For Dolby Vision the value is Wide and cannot be change.

Dynamic Tone Mapping wise I decide left default On for HDR and Default Off for Dynamic Contrast as this give me black crush issue. 
Dynamic Tone Mapping make HDR brighter and frank speak I keep comparing On and Off, this value On never have over exposure issue at all.

Now I believe this is my Final Setting, I am complete experiment and decide on what SDR and HDR setting on my LG C9.

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Sharpness at 22? Wow. I find anything beyond 15 I can see ringing on edge of skin or object already. I keep mine default at 10.
JustCheeze
post Jul 30 2020, 03:36 PM

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QUOTE(Andrewtst @ Jul 30 2020, 10:25 AM)
Hi,  To me 10 is way too soft in my distance viewing.
I don't find any issue as you mentioned in value 22 but it do happened after 22 especially on the value 25 I set previously.

They is two default value. 20 is default value for Cinema Home and Standard.

I don't insist of default value? Just getting the one suite. smile.gif

I am testing the value one by one last few days until I satisfied, that why you see my color for SDR is 57, not 55, 60 and so on.

Also my Sharpness is 22 not 20, 25 and so on.
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You used sharpness test pattern to decide on the value?
I sit quite close to the screen, I think around 2 meters only. So everything is really very sharp already as long as the source is good.
JustCheeze
post Aug 3 2020, 04:22 PM

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QUOTE(madballs @ Aug 3 2020, 01:57 AM)
If you can find it alot cheaper than c9 then yes. But if diff is around 1k I would go for c9.

I have a b6, tried a b9 before changing it to c9.

I can tell that the b9 has been cut down alot compare to my old b6. The brightness is lower than my b6 by a margin. The color accuracy by default is way off too.

The older B series doesn't feel like it's a water down oled, in fact it feel premium, but b9 felt to me like more of a mid range TV.

Still it's an oled and it's good. Just that the pricing is too near to c9 now. It use to have a big gap on the price thou.
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Bought B9 65" "open box" condition at harvey norman for RM7k. Apparently they used for road show before MCO, only for 3 days. I check the screen usage time is only 18 hours and before I paid, I also request to check with those burn in test pattern and they happily obliged. I think that is considered an ok purchase right?
JustCheeze
post Aug 17 2020, 04:09 PM

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Can anyone suggest a good TV wall mount for the 65" b9/c9?
JustCheeze
post Dec 15 2020, 01:02 AM

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QUOTE(mois @ Dec 14 2020, 02:44 PM)
Just want to update. Im getting proper signal using ugreen 8k cable.
This is C9 + ugreen 2.1 cable ya.
@SSJBen
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May I ask which specific ugreen HDMI 2.1 cable you use?

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