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 INSURANCE TALK, ok let start

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roystevenung
post Jun 7 2012, 03:11 PM

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QUOTE(Pink Spider @ Jun 7 2012, 11:52 AM)
so in cases of claim, the co will adjust the payout, or totally refuse to pay? unsure.gif
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If there is evidence of clear mis interpretation of the smoking status, then the insurer is non-obligated to pay the claim. Most likely a court settlement is needed.

If the policy is within 2 years, the insurer may opt to refund the premium paid minus any claims.

It is best is to declare to ensure smooth claim process.
roystevenung
post Jun 7 2012, 07:11 PM

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QUOTE(rekamaju @ Jun 7 2012, 06:09 PM)
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «


Eg If you bought an insurance policy and you were not a smoker at that time, then you will be
charged non-smoker rates. However if later you picked up smoking, then the insurance company
cannot do anything about it because, at the time of application, you were a non-smoker

» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

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Reka, please clarify the above statement. Suppose today I'm non-smoker, take up a life policy with RM1M CI and the policy got approved.

After 1 1/2 years down the road I smoke heavily, developed cancer (stage 1 malignant) and doctor's report shows that cancer was due to smoking.

Per what you said the insurer must pay RM1 M because they can't do anything about it? Sorry but I'm confuse. No offense ya.
roystevenung
post Jun 19 2012, 04:01 PM

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QUOTE(Davez89 @ Jun 19 2012, 03:57 PM)
Guys, can recommend me the a plan out there which is the best and value for money? 23,male, non smoker.
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Hi Dave, what's your occupation and email (for me to send in the quote). Thanks
roystevenung
post Jun 19 2012, 04:59 PM

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QUOTE(davidlow7 @ Jun 19 2012, 04:30 PM)
Hi All,

My sister has been approached by an Prudential Insurance Advisor and she has taken up a plan for the entire family - Investment Linked - Medical

I am rather concern the plan for my niece/nephews which is at RM 110.

As I know a lot of things are pretty little
Basic Sum assured - RM 10,000
Medical Limit - RM50,000/P.A - RM1,000,000 lifetime
36CI
Accident Coverage

No any extra rider seems and I wonder why does 3 kids aged 4, 10, 16 are being insured so little?

I asked for the quotation/proposal to be sent to me to understand but it seems so hard for her to do it.

I just want to enquire what is the best adjustment should be done for kids at these ages base on your experience.

Will there be any hassle to increase the coverage?

What are the riders that in your experience is best to include in for kids at this age?

Thanks
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Hi David, how young is your sister?
roystevenung
post Jun 19 2012, 09:57 PM

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QUOTE(davidlow7 @ Jun 19 2012, 08:35 PM)
Age next birthday shall be 38 smile.gif


Added on June 19, 2012, 8:49 pmHi .. Forgot to add on... that the premium is to be the most minimum for them since they are young and my sister must be fogging out a lot for the entire family...

Of course I understand each cent will mean each extra protection.. but due to some financial constrain.. it may not be really possible..

So I just want to find what is the best and important thing to add on with the money paid and if there's any hassle if we were to add on in future once the kid is big enough to pay for themselves etc.
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It's an investment linked plan, hence it can be upgraded (provided the claims records are clean as a whistle). Colaboy has mentioned several good points, accidental medical reimbursement (AMR) & most importantly payor.
roystevenung
post Jun 20 2012, 06:58 AM

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QUOTE(davidlow7 @ Jun 20 2012, 02:05 AM)
Thank you.

I have personally called the insurance agent and on hold it until I am back this weekend to sort it out.

I wonder what will happen if they have filed this in.

My sister paid her money and in case if we do not want, will I be able to get any refund?

Seriously my sister has no idea about this insurance and while I do not deny the plan may not necessarily be that unsuitable. I believe I should make her really understand before confirming.

She is buying for 5 people which is a lot... which is a long term commitment so I wouldn't want to take chance.
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Once the agent delivers to you the policy, there is a 15 day cooling off period. Your premium will be refunded if you chose not to proceed.

Life insurance is a long term commitment, hence understanding the policy content is important.
roystevenung
post Jun 27 2012, 11:34 AM

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QUOTE(MaxWealth @ Jun 27 2012, 10:58 AM)
Your whole life plan is participating or non participating plan?

If your terminate and get a new 1, most of your premium paid will be burned. Furthermore, the waiting period will start over. Or else you can ask them to fully paid up plan and convert in to term. How long and how much they can cover is based on branch/HQ calculation.

Btw, term only covers up to age 70. Unless you are very confidence in accumulating few hundred thousand just for "insurance" purpose after age 70.
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notworthy.gif

Good answer bro
roystevenung
post Jul 7 2012, 10:30 AM

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QUOTE(silversuave @ Jul 7 2012, 09:14 AM)
Anyone know which medical card should I take with a pre-existing illness (asthma). Most coverage excludes pre-existing illness. If I have to pay higher premium, which medical card will be the most reasonable?
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Medical card is for standby and in most cases we do not even need to use it until there is an emergency. Take a look at our PRUhealth (with 10% co-insurance) & PRUflexi med (without co-insurance).
roystevenung
post Jul 7 2012, 07:44 PM

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QUOTE(1282009 @ Jul 7 2012, 06:54 PM)
I heard from my agent before that there's this so-called yearly no claim bonus on medical card but I don't see it credited to my a/c. How it works?  hmm.gif
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The No Claim Bonus (NCB) is credited in the form of additional units into the Investment Unit Account (IUA) and it is a 100% allocation. The NCB is reflected in the Investment Link annual statement.

The amount of NCB is according with the room & board selected

1. PRUhealth 100 = RM 100 NCB per annum
2. PRUhealth 150 = RM 150 NCB per annum
3. PRUhealth 200 = RM 300 NCB per annum
4. PRUhealth 300 = RM 400 NCB per annum
5. PRUhealth 400 = RM 500 NCB per annum

The NCB will be credited if there is no claim for a policy year, for example a plan with PRUhealth 200

1st year, NCB = RM 0, No claim
2nd year, NCB = RM 300, Got claim
3rd year, NCB = RM 0, No claim
4th year, NCB = RM 300, No Claim
5th year, NCB = RM 300, Got Claim
6th year, NCB = RM 0, No Claim

This post has been edited by roystevenung: Jul 7 2012, 07:51 PM
roystevenung
post Jul 7 2012, 08:41 PM

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QUOTE(1282009 @ Jul 7 2012, 08:34 PM)
Ok thanks but I don't see this in my statement. Does it implicitly stated NCB credited or it will just be the normal allocated units? I believe its the latter in my case.
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It is the latter. If you do PRUsaver or do top-ups into the IUA account, then it is not that obvious.
roystevenung
post Jul 7 2012, 08:48 PM

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QUOTE(1282009 @ Jul 7 2012, 08:42 PM)
Thanks, got it now.
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You're most welcome. Should you need further clarifications on the PRUhealth card, do post. smile.gif
roystevenung
post Jul 9 2012, 08:27 AM

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QUOTE(klnaj @ Jul 9 2012, 06:51 AM)
I agree with you. My friend's mom got an insurance from MAA, after claim from the medical card, they said their policy isn't renewable.
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I'm sorry to hear that. For her to get another medical from another insurer may not be as easy now.

FYI Prudential contract is non-cancellable, no matter how much you claim subject to the annual / lifetime limit of course and the premiums are duly paid.

A full disclosure on health/hospitalization history is important at inception.
roystevenung
post Jul 18 2012, 07:26 AM

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QUOTE(merchant9 @ Jul 18 2012, 01:13 AM)
I met a fellow insurance agent today who talked to me about a few things which I would like to clarify.

1. Private retirement scheme - I was told that if I sign up a policy, I can get tax relief of up to 6k when we do our e-Filing next year.

Quite interesting but would like to know how much to buy? 6k premium per annum? Please share with me some information (as I'm still skeptical) and as to whether or not I should buy / avoid this.

2. EPF and Life Insurance tax relief is currently at 6k - I was told that the government is splitting this up. I have not seen / not aware of such announcement in Malaysia. Can someone please share any information on this?

Sorry, I'm new to all this. I just met this insurance lady based on friend's recommendation but is quite doubtful. Please help.
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1. Last year it was announce that one is able to get tax relief up to RM 3K (up RM 2K from year 2011) for retirement plans which are approved as annuity product. However, the insurance product and the tax relief amount of RM 3K needs to be approved by Bank Negara Malaysia.

If you don't know how to calculate IRR for the retirement fund, then I suggest you ask someone who can before you jump into this bandwagon.

FYI, for Prudential, as of to date we are still waiting for the approval for RM3K. Do note that RM 1K was already approved in 2011.

2. No idea on point no 2 but I do agree that RM 6K for both EPF & life / medical insurance is too little. The premium for a decent medical coverage is now at RM 200-250/mth due to the medical inflation.

Having said that, if your priority to get insurance is because you want to enjoy tax relief, I'd say your priorities needs to be re-look at. Insurance is about protection, being there when you need it the most, in terms of crisis, emergency when everyone is asking for money, insurance pays you.

QUOTE(leonard73 @ Jul 18 2012, 02:19 AM)
If they wanta close your sales, then you simply ask them to show you b&W prove.
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True, also do calculate the IRR whenever it comes to investments/savings plans. It helps to understand the risk/cover/returns ratio before you put ink on that dotted line.

This post has been edited by roystevenung: Jul 18 2012, 07:28 AM
roystevenung
post Jul 18 2012, 07:34 PM

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QUOTE(zaFrOoNaLdO @ Jul 18 2012, 01:47 PM)
what 3 policies do u have?
ANYWAY, I wanna get insurance soon. I've got a quote from the same insurance agent that my mom has been dealing with through out these years.. she's from Great Eastern.

I believe its life insurance (I forgot the exact name of the plan bcos it was 1.5 mths ago), I have to pay RM200 per month. I'm 24 y.o., non smoker, no previous illness.

may i know what everyone thinks of Great eastern insurance?

My mom has been with the agent for like almost 15 years or more, and my mom said she's good (wont runaway bcos if shes been doing it for the past 15 years or more, unlikely she will suddenly runaway when we need them). But it also means that the agent is nearing 50 years old or so (based on my mom's guess of d agent's age)..

If she is gonna be my agent, and hopefully I will live long, dont think the agent will still be an agent when she is 70 y.o rite? so isit better to get younger agents? haha
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She won't run away, but life on earth is fragile. We could walk down the street, get rob and the next thing we knew it our name is in the newspaper.

So what do you do if your agent kicks the bucket earlier than you? Or maybe later you found your love in Facebuku and she happens to be a foreigner, you get married and decided to move to Holland?

Jokes aside. So what do you do if you're faced with that scenario? Do you cancel the policy? No, right? Your cover is with the insurance company and not with the agent. Even though the agent is six feet under, your contract is with the insurance company. The claims, if full fill all the criteria will be payable by the insurer, not the agent.

Worst case scenario, just file the claims yourself thru the counter (if your agent does not service you or had left the business), but I'm sure there are many other helpful agents is able to take over the case, even without commission.

The most important part is to understand what you had bought and knowing whether what you had bought 10 years ago is still able to do the job today (review the policy every 5 years).

HTH

This post has been edited by roystevenung: Jul 18 2012, 08:19 PM
roystevenung
post Jul 19 2012, 07:17 AM

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QUOTE(advanced @ Jul 19 2012, 12:05 AM)
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

pls let me know if you need more info,tq
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Based on what you've paid for ~19 years (1993-2012), Total paid = RM 11,968.10, Cash Value now RM 5,600.

If you stop payment now, the policy is only able to auto run for RM 8-9 years only.

And with a coverage of RM 100k in 1993, its geared more towards protection, not savings or even endowment plan. Hence even with the cash bonus at maturity (which is 100 years old), do not expect the returns to be extravagant.

If you're looking for savings plans from insurance always look at the premium allocation rate, the plan coverage (the higher the cover, the lesser premium will be used for the savings/investment portion), and most importantly the stability of the company as investment in insurance is a long term > 20 years to yield returns.

For children's education, we would normally put a basic cover+medical, and if the parent's intention is to have a savings for children education, we'd put it to saver which provides allocation rate of 95% starting from year 1. The cover+medical riders premium allocation rates are 40% for the 1st year and gradually increases to 100% after the 6th year.
roystevenung
post Jul 21 2012, 10:09 AM

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QUOTE(merchant9 @ Jul 20 2012, 09:41 PM)
Hi, you seem like a very experienced Prudential agent...

Usually, I only claim the KWSP + Life Insurance portion. How do one classify education insurance? My husband bought a saving plan (need to check which co.) for our child of 1.5 years but does that cover education insurance?

For tax deductions, best you read the T&C from LHDN directly. http://www.hasil.org.my/pdf/pdfam/FAQBEENG..._01042011_1.pdf


If you don't mind me, I'd like a little comparison. If we pay RM6k per year, for 10 years with Prudential - any plans that can money roll money for child education that by 20 years, it gives us an amount of X? How much can max X get to?

Like I've mentioned earlier, the projected cash value will largely depends on how the RM 500/mth premium is being allocated by the agent when he/she designed the plan with your husband. If he/she puts in more towards protection, then the savings portion will be compromised. It all depends on whether the agent puts your priority before his/hers, if you know what I mean.

For Prudential - The Investment Linked Policy (ILP) comprises of 3 sections:-

1. The Basic Unit Account (BUA)
This is where the Life/Critical illness cover will falls into. Premiums allocation for BUA starts from 40% 1st year and the 6th year onward, 100% allocation to buy you units

2. The Protection Unit Account (PUA)
This is where the riders for the medical, accident, waiver of premiums will falls into. If you do IUA, it is also important that you include waiver of premium for the IUA. This means that if (touch wood), if the parent is down with Critical illness, kicks the bucket, permanent disabled the IUA will also be paid by the insurer, hence the plan still continues (until the kid is 25 years of old) to ensure that there is at least funds to see to his education no matter what happens to us.

Premiums allocation for PUA starts from 40% 1st year and the 6th year onward, 100% allocation to buy you units.

3. The Investment Unit Account (IUA)
This is where the investment/savings falls into. Premiums allocation is 95% from 1st year onward to buy you units.

Example, for the RM 500 premium, if the plan is designed in such a way RM 300 is used for BUA & PUA, only RM 200 is used for IUA. Do check it against your plan.

As you can see from the above 3 sections, the premium allocation rates for BUA & PUA starts from 40% 1st year. If the agent puts too much of the RM 500 premium into BUA & PUA, then the cash value will definitely be affected.

If you want, you can scan the coverage portion and email it to me for me to follow up with you on the comparison. No charge (and don't worry, we are trained not to cancel policies) :-)

The annual statement (from Prudential) if you buy insurance for your child will read "Education/Life Plan". You can use this amount to deduct from your income tax, up to RM 3K tax relief for children. (still too little, if 3 children, maximum allowed for income tax relief is also RM 3K)


I thought tax relief for annuity scheme is always limited to 1k? Referring to: http://www.hasil.org.my/goindex.php?kump=5...3&unit=1&sequ=1. Is it up to 2k now? Sorry, am not aware. For this PRS, does Prudential have any approved product yet? I don't quite get this part, so need to ask more. What's annuity, btw?

The annuity plan was only introduced in 2011, and was limited to RM 1K. However, under the budget 2012, the RM 1K annuity has been increased to RM 3K as announced by Najib in Sep/Oct 2011.

Yes Prudential does have an approved annuity scheme called PRUretirement reward but as of to date, the approved amount for annuity plan for Prudential PRUretirement reward is still RM1K. Once we have approval from BNM to increase this to RM 3K, we will inform our clients.

http://www2.prudential.com.my/corp/prudent...mentreward.html

Annuity means savings towards your retirement (which means paying the premium until your retirement age) and when retired, the plan will pay you a stream of monthly income till the end of the term.


What is IRR and how to calculate?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internal_rate_of_return
http://www.ehow.com/how_7493222_calculate-iir.html

You can google for more, how to calculate IIR


My priorities to get insurance is for protection. At the same time, many said insurance is not the right place to invest, for child education -yet many buy them. One spend one's money to their liking or their needs (even their wants) sometimes. Hope you don't mind the difference in opinion. I'm quite aware of what basic insurance is about - pool the money of many and compensate those unfortunate. I've read before many years back, just didn't get into the line.

Definitely, insurance is for Protection, you can look back at some of my posts on my views on insurance. If you do notice, even for the IUA there is an element called Protection. Let's assume that a parent sets aside RM 200/mth for savings to the bank or even some other forms of investment. Should the parent is down with critical illness (example stroke), unable to work due to an accident that caused him/her to be disabled for life, the savings will stop.

However if we were to set that to the IUA (with waiver of premiums), the insurer will take over the parent's job and pays not only for the life+medical cover, but also for the money that is set aside for education purpose.

Do note that once you've taken care of the protection part, you may also want to split the savings to other forms of investments and not only rely on the insurer. Putting it into various baskets, high risk, moderate, low risk gives you at least some surety of some form of returns.

Many said insurance is not the right place to invest is because people thought they can live forever, can never fall sick, and accidents only happened because they are not careful on the road. In our line of work, we speak to many people. If you've spoken to a wife with a 40 year old husband bed ridden due to stroke, with 3 dependents, you'd know exactly what I mean.

Pool of the money of the many to compensate those unfortunate few is a thing of the past, as medical bills is something of a reverse.

Yes, I do admit that sometimes we are seems pushy when it comes to giving you the solution, but we know the importance as we are dealing with time sensitive product. If we submit the proposal late, and the life assured met accident on the way to work, we are definitely going to have endless sleepless nights.

If I do say anything wrong, please do forgive me because I tend to be a little blunt (not a very good salesman)  whistling.gif




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This post has been edited by roystevenung: Jul 21 2012, 10:27 AM
roystevenung
post Jul 21 2012, 10:56 AM

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QUOTE(raul @ Jul 21 2012, 10:16 AM)
need some advise...

age 29 coming 30, businessman, single, medium risk taker, vested in property, share market.

life assured: 650k
CI: 550k
accident: 360k
medicard: pruhealth/400/150k/1.5mil

do you think this need to top up on trad life+CI before age 30 to enjoy better premium? or any other advise?
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Raul, it all boils down to your expenses. For example, the CI of RM 550K, with your current expenses and if (touch wood) down with Critical Illness, how long do you think it can last with your current lifestyle?

Do note that we may need extra money when we are CI, for supplements, consultations, long term medications etc.

If you want to top up for life/CI/accident, I'd suggest that you top up on the existing policy (unless there is pre-existing illness see below) as to avoid paying for another policy fee, admin charges, but of course agent commission is unavoidable (for the top up portion only) biggrin.gif :-)

However, do be careful whenever you do upgrading on the existing policy. Pre-existing illnesses clause may be added to a policy that prior to the upgrade is without any pre-existing illness (example before upgrading there is no hypertension but along the years developed hypertension and wants to do upgrading). In this case, it is better to get another policy. At least if there is any illness that is related to the hypertension it can be fully claimed from the 1st policy that is without the pre-existing illness clause.

"do you think this need to top up on trad life+CI before age 30 to enjoy better premium? or any other advise?"

Insurance charges will go up by age, irrespective of when you get it. However, the earlier you get it you pay less premium but longer term (ie the frequency is more) and gives you more time to generate the cash value so as to pay for the insurance charges at later years. Example now at 30 your insurance charges (for medical card only, expiring age 80) is at RM 2,505 per annum. Assuming that you're paying RM 500~600 (mth or more?) now, that is enough to cover for the insurance charges.

However at age 70, the insurance charge will be RM 14,034 per annum. The premium paid is not enough to cover for the insurance charge, so the question is how can the insurance company sustain the policy at later years? The variance of premium will be deducted from your cash value. This means that if you were to withdraw from your cash value, the policy may be in jeopardy of lapsing at later years, losing all the coverage.

If you get the insurance/upgrade later, you'd be paying more premium but in shorter years. If the coverage is not enough for your current lifestyle, you may want to upgrade it soon because unlike property investments we can't predict how our health will be tomorrow.

This post has been edited by roystevenung: Jul 21 2012, 11:00 AM
roystevenung
post Jul 21 2012, 11:29 AM

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QUOTE(raul @ Jul 21 2012, 11:10 AM)
Thanks for the advise.

logically what is the safe period(years) do you think that the sum assurance should be rational coverage for the expenses?

Will check with my agent sooner about on the top up or to get a new policy. It's a traditional policy. Still undecide yet.

Current profolio now is 2:1 ratio on ILP:Traditional insurance... thinking of add/top up on the latter one.
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The general rule of the thumb is 10 times your annual income.

If you need a quote for comparison, do PM me the following details:-

1. Date of birth (dd/mm/yy)
2. Smoking status
3. Your email address as we can't attach files in LYN.


Added on July 21, 2012, 11:33 am
QUOTE(advanced @ Jul 19 2012, 12:05 AM)
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

pls let me know if you need more info,tq
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Hi advanced. I noticed that the payment is by cash. Why would you want to do that? There's options for auto debit and credit card nowadays.

Never give agent cash. Period.

This post has been edited by roystevenung: Jul 21 2012, 11:33 AM
roystevenung
post Jul 23 2012, 09:02 PM

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QUOTE(twjian @ Jul 23 2012, 08:47 PM)
3 where got enough...
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Nowadays with the flexible ILP plan, one is enough, as you can add on the riders/increase the plan accordingly.... provided one is still insurable...
roystevenung
post Jul 23 2012, 09:40 PM

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QUOTE(twjian @ Jul 23 2012, 09:12 PM)
My father just forwarded this Mutual Life Plus 2 for me to look into its critical illness.

http://www.publicmutual.com.my/OurProducts...lLifePlus2.aspx

I plan to buy a CI for myself and parents after seeing so many cases of "Cancer here cancer there" problem. My hand also started shaking when I heard about the sky-high daily expenses like eat la, mortgage la, car loan la, business mortgage la, and many many more after treatment (not the expenses of medical as my family already had a medical card covered since long long time ago).

My father recommended to buy this for him (to cover his business). However, when I look at the section " RISK EXCLUDED FOR CI"...

it says like that,


Risk Excluded for CI

Critical illness - no critical illness benefit is payable if

c. With reference to Table 1 below, the company shall not be liable for any covered event benefit in List A if the assured member had been previously diagnosed either
i) as having suffered or undergone surgery for a covered event specified in List B; or
ii) as having suffered an illness specified in List C, prior to the date of this policy or this rider or effective date of rider coverage, whichever is the latest.

d. any injury or illness caused directly or indirectly, wholly or partly, by self inflicted injury while sane or insane, willful misuse of alcohol and/or the taking of drugs otherwise than under the direction of a registered medical practitioner.
user posted image


My question,

1.)Could it claim multiple times or one shot like lottery?
2.)I not really understand what it says about List A, List B, and List C...

[cool.gifAnyone could help to enlighten me?



Added on July 23, 2012, 9:16 pm

Yah, I started looking into this ILP and actually there are some beauties within the ILP. But company got some restrictions in buying this for me.

For personal, the ROI for the first few years are very slow... and slow...

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It means pre-existing illnesses. Insurance cover is something one will have to prepare before the event happens.

For example, last week I met a prospect who was so eager to get the medical card for her son. However, I told her that proper declarations on the health is required so as to enable no hassle when it comes to future claims. The son had an accident last year and had metal implant on his right hand and she wanted to get the medical card to remove the metal implant.

Of course it'll not be covered.

Sorry but comparing the ROI for PM and insurance is like comparing apple to orange. Insurance is never meant for the ROI unless one "hit the jackpot" early and person whom he had nominated would definitely say the "ROI" is definitely worth every penny.

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