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 How easy is it for condo committee to cheat money?

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aurora97
post Jul 7 2015, 10:21 AM

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QUOTE(ic no 851025071234 @ Jul 7 2015, 08:57 AM)
My condo there seem to have very heated competition by few to take up committee and alot drama la last year. Finally with the current chairman kick out previous chairman and the apparently current chairman is related the treasurer or something.

If this the case is it very easy for the chairman to just pocket the maintenance fund and all into own account or is it very well regulated?

Seem like very long time already and they should have called for agm few months ago but conveniently forgot. Even people complain the committee just ignore and all. Do you think there is personal gain?
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How to be a Chairman 101.

Rule 1: Never pocket maintenance fund into your own account.
Rule 2: inflate prices of service.
Rule 3: always take indirect money from vendor.
Rule 4: if you need to (in contravention of rule 1), you can buy using your credit card and tell the committee that you wanted to collect points (make sure it is in minute). Use the reward points convert into shopping voucher.
Rule 5: make sure bank statement and cheque book is kept in your house.
Rule 6: hire your own ma chai (crony) to become your accounts and auditor.
Rule 7: request mini-mart/restaurant to share half of their profits with you or get kicked out and then you can set up your own business.
Rule 8: you can buy and make claim from JMB/MC at “inflated price of course”.
Rule9 : make sure you pay your staff fat increment and bonus to shut them up.
Rule 10: repeat 1 to 9.

aurora97
post Jul 7 2015, 10:24 AM

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QUOTE(alucard_my @ Jul 7 2015, 09:06 AM)
Very easy. The chairman has two votes. So if he gets any members or especially office bearers to side him, he could put in all his contacts for the various jobs required in the condo. Some of the sure things that will happen when a change of committee occurs, for bad, new management company, new security, new landscaping, new janitor etc, each one collect a few % commission. If the committee is honest one, they'll so the same, but only to flush out old 'koncos' of the previous 'bad' committee. But they are answerable if they were to utilise the sinking funds. If I'm you, I'll propose myself as a committee member to safeguard the condo.
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When there is equal votes in the committee, the chairman gets one additional vote to break the deadlock.

The standard modus operandi is always got a few supporters (or yes man).
aurora97
post Jul 7 2015, 10:31 AM

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QUOTE(jinsailoo @ Jul 7 2015, 10:30 AM)
notworthy.gif  notworthy.gif  notworthy.gif  notworthy.gif

wow pro chairman, sure fat fat
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unfortunately i am still poor like shet. cry.gif
aurora97
post Jul 7 2015, 10:36 AM

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QUOTE(Kevin Chan @ Jul 7 2015, 10:28 AM)
Kochin brother have "potential", this loophole is totally allowed.

for those case where resident "sendiri cari pasai" lazy, its their own fault for not running it properly. come vote also lazy.
tongue.gif
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Actually all this problem arise because of the indifference of owners, AGM/EGM also don’t attend and leave it to “certain people” to run the management. The rot normally starts slowly with minor inflated claims, after that the amount gets bigger and bigger. Since no one query, the opportunity for wrong doing grows bigger day by day.

This is proven, as our auditor went into investigate item by item (not forensic type of audit), the claims get bigger and bigger, the reason for the claim also get more and more ridiculous. (example: night club expenses in Penang, kononya have to entertain some bomba people cause they creating some problem, when condo is in KL).

Also, another account normally will be affected is the sinking fund.

aurora97
post Jul 7 2015, 10:50 AM

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QUOTE(kochin @ Jul 7 2015, 10:14 AM)
can president step down after 2 years and become treasurer and vice versa treasurer become new president? keep on repeating?

or what about if residents likes the management and decided to continue with them for more than 2 years?
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See 2(5)/(6) of Schedule 2 SMA.

Actually that is the right way of getting around the problem.

The law is quite clear. Cannot 2 years consecutively become Chairman, Treasurer or Secretary.

So this year Chairman, next year Treasurer, year after become Secretary and rotate around like musical chair, shouldn’t be a problem. Worse become committee. Committee can sit up to 3 years.

aurora97
post Jul 7 2015, 11:01 AM

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QUOTE(kochin @ Jul 7 2015, 10:57 AM)
i actually have a plan on how to develop a maintenance free development.
meaning once you buy into the development, it is perpetually self generating income and need not have any service charge.
will built one if i ever have the fund to do so.
kakakaka.
no more hanky panky then.
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Sounds great, but things that sound too good to be true normally smell like a Ponzi scheme.
aurora97
post Jul 7 2015, 11:10 AM

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QUOTE(HELLO HELLO @ Jul 7 2015, 11:06 AM)
condo side income.. carpark rental, venue/function room rental, shop rental, bbq area rental, car wash fee...ada apa lagi?
provide unit cleaning service? rent and sale service? or macam japan punya robot hotel. use robot to manage.
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From experience, actually all you mentioned contribute very little to management income. Almost negligible, either because rental very low or usage is infrequent. To make matters worse, such income subject to income tax and GST.

The best money maker is maintenance followed by interest income (FD or normal savings).

aurora97
post Jul 7 2015, 11:11 AM

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QUOTE(kochin @ Jul 7 2015, 11:07 AM)
if it's so simple, people would have done it long ago lah.
trust me, i just revisited my model. it looks solid.
definitely doable.
but don't think it would ever see the light of days. cry.gif
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share pls. thumbup.gif
aurora97
post Jul 7 2015, 11:12 AM

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QUOTE(djboycalvin @ Jul 7 2015, 11:10 AM)
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «


woooo .... save first .. maybe future got use ...  rclxms.gif  rclxms.gif
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you know where to find me brows.gif

i am con-sultant ready and at your service cool2.gif
aurora97
post Jul 7 2015, 11:19 AM

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QUOTE(kochin @ Jul 7 2015, 11:14 AM)
aiyah, once shared then i can never built dy.
people steal my idea.
better not say so much.

fyi, my ideas is applicable to both new development and existing highrises as well.
so it's not confined to only new builts.
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Knowledge is like a candle, it can light up a dark room. If you put a tea cup over the candle...

Lel... Why u pancing me like this.

QUOTE(HELLO HELLO @ Jul 7 2015, 11:14 AM)
use fund to buy share buy unitrust buy gold buy antique buy land buy house? high risk high gain.
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After considering the risk of 10 yrs and 10m fine that can be imposed by bnm or sc, I take my chances with CoB (often than not toothless and balless).
aurora97
post Jul 7 2015, 11:58 AM

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kokchin

No money, no problem. Who knows, we might become promoters of your fund also brows.gif

If Greek bailout can raise Eur 1.8 mil in 8 days, it's possible your idea can fly also.
https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/greek-ba...ut-fund?#/story
aurora97
post Jul 7 2015, 06:05 PM

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QUOTE(peri peri @ Jul 7 2015, 04:22 PM)
unless you are immune to jail, you can go ahead to cheat those funds.
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the last chairman, we try to initiate criminal case against him... took us 2 years until we pressure the branch IO from bukit aman.

QUOTE(jinsailoo @ Jul 7 2015, 04:27 PM)
in malaysia every one can immune to jail, as long as you have enoght kopi
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I second the kopi o part cause the X person was rumoured to make a funny request, which led to delay in investigation.

QUOTE(peri peri @ Jul 7 2015, 04:37 PM)
i dont dare to try.
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never try never know but than again better don't try. people actually went after the chairman, his house kena painted red. one committee member's car got extra special treatment (all cermin pecah and door kemek).

QUOTE(cherroy @ Jul 7 2015, 04:37 PM)
Account needs to audited every year, you can't just take the money out without any reason, or transfer to any individual account.
It is a CBT offence if simply take a public money (management fund) into personal use.

Auditor will easily find out when audit the account time.

But only buying engage with a specific contractor/company or cronyism, buying expensive etc is the grey area which should be aware of.
Adopting open tender process, openness during committee meeting etc are several good way to reduce such a grey area.
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The modus operandi, both account and auditor are in the pocket of the chairman.

If the item of contention is agreed upon by all committee members and recorded in the minutes, the contention no longer exist and becomes legitimate.

open tender is the best but the tender committee must have technical experience. I was part of a pre-liminary interviewing team, was quoted Rm 1m for repainting job, my colleague did some rough calculation and knocked it down to RM 700K. All of the contractors quoted more or less 1M +. So careful with open tender as well and best do itemized tendering.

QUOTE(ic no 851025071234 @ Jul 7 2015, 04:41 PM)
Who will be the responsible to audit the condo account? The is committee liable to some regulation? Cos from current situation the committee can just ignore and not do any audit
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It's the duty of Dev, JMB and MC to have the accounts audited and have a copy of the audited account file with COB.

See:
section 14 (Developer), 26 (JMB) and 62 (MC) of the Strata Title Management Act

Failure:
Maybe liable up to 3 years imprisonment or fine of up to 250K or both.

QUOTE(cherroy @ Jul 7 2015, 05:02 PM)
Normally it is external auditor, just like ordinary company.

MC is liable to any sue if there is any misbehave.

If current MC is not doing a proper job and convey an AGM due, owner can complain to COB and COB can empower other owner to convey an AGM.
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to add:

If condition is serious enough, ask COB to instruct JMB/MC to hold EGM.




 

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