Yeah, just gonna contact banker request for revision of interest rate.
Well, anyway I just check the MBB 2 card T&C, apparently the cash back only on weekends and cap at RM50 per principal card holder per month.
So... Still , how you do it.

MBB most of the bills can be paid using M2U, so I'll pay on weekends

This post has been edited by supersound: Dec 12 2014, 06:07 PM

Noted, and sure, I can help you with that if you want to proceed with the refinancing: I have 5 banks I can be contacted and we could meet up.

---

I got in a little late replying to this thread as I was meeting a client later in the evening. But CFA28 has pretty much covered things up. You can use the table and see how the money is divided up. But keep in mind that the table would be off if you miss a single repayment, or made an advance payment on your installments.

Amortization table, you should use it to get a more thorough understanding of the reducing balance loan... ask about it here if you need more explanation:



---

The differences between the interest add up over the years. A typical difference of 0.1% for every RM100k loan equals to RM100 a year.

So if your loan balance is RM200k, and your current rate is BLR - 1.0%, by refinancing to a -2.4% you could save about 14 * 100 * 2 = RM2800 a year (interest payable) and this adds up going forward. Of course, the loan balance would be reduced as you go along. And by refinancing you would incur costs such as the legal, valuation, and stamp duty that is rated at about 2% of the financing amount.



This post has been edited by wild_card_my: Dec 12 2014, 09:39 PM

http://mega3.com.my/site/index.php?cat=67
I don't know where your table comes from, but I prefer use back Malaysia's calculation to prevent any confusion.

Assuming TS's taking rm200k loan with 5% interest for 30 years, starting from 2005, by now he already paid rm115953.12. Now I assuming 60% from the total amount paid are interest, so rm69571.
Principle only settled rm46382. And TS shall able to settle his loan on 2035. To round it up for refinance, rm150000.

According to above table, no doubt TS do pay lesser at rm751.14, but bare in mind that he only able to settle the loan on 2044, which is 9 years later from his original plan.
Now to calculate total amount paid for both loans(assuming BLR never change), 1st loan, rm386510.4 where rm186510.4 is the interest paid to bank.
On the refinance of rm150000, total 270410.4 where rm120410.4. But wait, TS already paid 9 years on his first loan and ~rm70000 of interest paid, so the total interest paid is rm190410.4. For nothing TS wasted rm3900 and extra 9 years.
Aiyah, forgot that settling the first loan have some extra charges and refinance another charge, how much is that? Just say the total is rm5000, so TS in actual have to fork out rm8900 extra and have to run up and down banks and lawyer firm.

Im way too tired to go through your numbers, but if you had used the same amortization table that I posted, and inputting the same figures as you did, you would get the same results anyway. Amortization calculations are the same across the world, the only differences are if the interests are calculated based on a daily, monthly, bi-monthly, yearly rests etc. I am surprised that someone as experienced as you actually thought that there was a difference between using the malaysian based or foreign based amortization table. It's just a simple formula applied to the principal (outstanding) with interests and tenure as the variables.



Can someone take care of the guy on for me for the time being? I'll be back in the morning to reply his misleading numbers. I'll put it out here as a hint to help those who bother to calculate and present the results here, that there are definitely benefits in reducing the interest by 1.4% even if you need to pay the legal fees, as well keeping the remaining tenure the same as a new refinancing scheme.

Good night everyone.

This post has been edited by wild_card_my: Dec 12 2014, 10:06 PM

Well, even the table you provided are the same, but you never mention to TS that he have to pay extra money to bank and wasting another 9 years.
By looking at your reply, you only trying your best to insult me on my "incompetency" on providing the table but can't prove my facts that extra money and time being wasted were flaw, following your logic.
Is not you tired with me, is your myth being busted nicely.
Refinance only work when the first loan was at >9% which happen on past 20 years.
I hope you can come out with another table stating refinance can save money and time
And by using your link that you provided, you just slapped your face, the refinance value are not rm150000 as I said, it is rm162000. So TS will have to pay extra again despite wasting time.

This post has been edited by supersound: Dec 12 2014, 11:00 PM

Uncle, after I post this I hope you can stand down and accept that you have the wrong idea about refinancing. Im in the middle of filming for my personal financial-management youtube series, but I spent some time in this nice morning (morning sun is good for lighting) just to show you what you missed.

Refinancing is a financial move with a lot of flexibility:

a) you can reduce the installment amount payable by extending the tenure and/or locking-in better interest rates
b) you can borrow from the bank for the cash-out portion at the lowest interest rate possible, no other loans that are available to the general public have lower interest rates than a mortgage. Many people use this money for other business and investments that are yielding higher returns than what the banks are charging as interests. This is called leveraging on your assets instead of sitting on them. Whether or not to do it depends on you, but there shouldn't be 1 true way to go about it.
c. You can shorten the tenure, but still pay the same installment amount
d. You can maintain the tenure while lowering the installment if you could lock-in a better rate (like what I am going to show below)

Keep this in your head: refinancing is flexible, and depending on your situation and the economic conditions, you should take the move (or not) as you see fit. Only a stubborn person would think that there is only 1 true way of doing things without considering the situation of others. My job is to listen to my clients and give them options based on what I know and what is available to them. Your job... apparently is to chatter like a [redacted] about the first thing that appeared in your head without contributing anything to solve these people's financial problems.

My job entails me to provide solutions to my clients and prospects: I get PMs, emails, whatsap, and phone calls everyday asking for my financial consultancy services. I can attribute those to the way I answer the questions posted in this forum to the best of my abilities; for example, when someone is asking for a refinance just like the TS did, just look at the details of my answer - you wont get that from a normal consultant. I refrain from giving unsolicited advice like how you seem to enjoy doing (again, signs of old age, no offense to other lovely elderlies). These forummers don't need over the top loud mouthing by someone who thinks he knows it all because he is either old, or thinks he is smarter than anyone in the room. Sorry for making this rather personal but you never bothered to hide your misguided hatred towards financial consultants either, which in my opinion, is very childish. Don't dish it out if you can't take it.

--- --- ---

I will start with these numbers:

Initial loan RM200k
30 years tenure
Interest at BLR - 1% as per what TS mentioned

*Do note that I work with my clients closely and I would ask them for their loan statements, without which would be difficult for me to know the total installments paid over the years due to the changes in BLR. But for the purpose of our education session today, the BLR in 2005 was 6.00% but increased to 6.75% in 2007, and hovered around that number and ended up as 6.85% today. As such, whatever outstanding balance stated below cannot be accurate altogether. But that is why you need a consultant to go through these numbers for you and present it in the way that you would understand.





Now, let's refinance based on the remaining balance + cost of refinancing





Results, comments, and conclusion:

a. The tenure (in this case, to please the uncle) has not been changed. The loan remains to end after 360months (30 years) on December 2034.
b. The installment has changed from RM1179.88 to RM1086.10 (including the cost of refinancing) from the 121st month onwards till the end of the loan tenure. This move lowers your installment by about RM100 a month, without extending the tenure. Why would you want to pay RM100 a month to the bank? Because uncle said "no need to refinance"?
c. Here is the calculation for total savings:





Or in simple terms, because the client needs to pay off the outstanding balance anyway, ALL you need to do is to SIMPLY differentiate the difference going forward between maintaining the status quu by paying RM1179.88 x 240 months VS refinancing midway and paying RM1086.10x240 months:



The client would save RM22,507.20 in this particular case. Of course, every person would face a number of different situations. To refinance or not depends on their needs, situation, economic climate, and ambition (do they want to be extremely, moderately, or lowly leveraged?). And I work with my clients to find a solution to their needs or problems. In addition, there are many other things that you could do with refinancing: to get a loan from the bank at low interest rate for the purpose of investing in other, better opportunities; to extend the tenure and reduce the installments for better cash flow (who are you to judge whether they should do it or not?), to shorten the tenure but pay same amount (like I have explained above), or to take the advantage of the periodical lower interest rates offered by the banks.

Uncle, maybe due to your age you have become risk aversed and afraid of taking risks, whether or not it is reasonable is debatable because a number of my older clients are still able to stomach some risks due to the fact that they have their retirement nests ready (planned by myself, of course); but just because you are near the end of your line (of career, you know, because of the age) doesn't mean you should stop others from exploring their options and opportunities. You are quite the poison in this subforum as far as I can tell. Other people have opinions and talk about them openly, occasionally arguing by providing citations and or numbers. But you? You chide other people's efforts because you think it's either your way or the highway. I hope this has served as a good lesson to you in terms of sharing opinions and ideas online.

Have a good day. Don't forget the medicine.

This post has been edited by wild_card_my: Dec 13 2014, 04:20 PM

Good job nice effort.thx very much.

Between just leave the sakai alone..dun need feed it as it appear in every thread promoting sakainess expertise.

I know you want to insult me using uncle. But then you are still cheating TS.
He already paid 9 years, and you never include the interest paid from the first loan.
And you only use lesser time once you got kicked by me. Good strategy to use term "tired" to continue cheating people and avoid being held responsible if giving false info.
Also, is good that you use 5.85% which I used 5%, another good way to cheat
With your logic, sure it looks people taking refinance paying lesser interest.

This post has been edited by supersound: Dec 13 2014, 05:51 PM

Uncle, I call you that with the utmost respect, I think your unsolicited advice may have helped some forummers in some unimaginable ways; but if you are so insecure about it maybe it is because you know that people loathe listening to you? I can't help those with insecurity issues, I am not a psychologist.

But I think your issue can be attributed to your prejudice against the financial planners; perhaps you met the wrong ones, or perhaps you were too naive to differentiate between the honest and the dishonest ones: as such, since age has caught up to you, you are unable to change and it is clouding your decision making skills on top of being too stubborn to admit defeat.

I tell you what, I will help you see this through. Going forward without refinancing, the client is poised to pay

RM1,179.88x240month = RM283,171.20 in total

By refinancing today, of the outstanding balance amount plus refinancing cost, the client will pay

RM1,086.10x240month = RM260,664 in total

So by refinancing, the client would save:

RM283,171.20 - RM260,664.00 = RM22,507.2

--- --- ---

Uncle can you see it now? By simply refinancing, the client would have saved RM22,507.20! What else do you want? Medicine?

Thanks for the support. I noticed his behavior in other threads too. But I can't just leave him be especially when he quotes me.

This post has been edited by wild_card_my: Dec 13 2014, 08:46 PM

Suggest you change the 5.85% to 5%, unless you are here to mislead people.
But since your job are to cheat and mislead, I doubt you will change.
Calling a person that don't know the age are more on insulting, rather than respecting.
And for your info, the wrong financial planner are a person that will advise people don't be greedy and to invest on something to make the rich become richer, poor become poorer, in this case, all the "investment" other than ASB, ASW, EPF and FD. I never meet with wrong financial planner, but right financial planner like you that always mislead people.
You see, as a cheater, you still avoiding changing the calculation to 5% but keep on calling me uncle just to hide the fact behind.

Ill let the rest of us decide whether or not I am a cheater or you are just being childish. I presented numbers in its most basic form while you are just chattering like a monkey repeating the same things over and over again.

Ya I agree with you. How come such an easy stuff need to talk so much ? I don't understand why supersound want to make it so complicated

If the refinancing involve lower interest rate, and the total interest saved is less than the cost of refinancing, of course it is beneficial to refinance. Very simple logic.

And if we read TS questions carefully, he is not asking whether it is beneficial to refinance. He has already made up his mind to refinance. What he is asking is which bank has the best package

Thank you, I need all the support I can get to differentiate between truth and lies.

Okay, this is where I have to call you stupid. You know that the TS's interest rate is based on BLR - 1% right (see his post above)? so if I were to put the interest rate as 5%, then that would be wrong because his interest rate from today onwards is already BLR (6.85%) - 1% = 5.85%.

Sure, his interest rate in 2005 when he took the loan was BLR (6%) - 1 % = 5%, HOWEVER BLR has increased from 6% in 2005 to 6.75% in 2007, and now hovering at 6.85%. As such, today and going forward, his interest rate will be calculated at BLR (6.85%) - 1% = 5.85% as I posted above. Wait, unless you actually think that the rates that he took in 2005 would remain as in till today? Then I have an even low opinion of you since you speak as if you know things but couldn't even comprehend how the interest rates are calculated - based on the daily-or-monthly rest, on the outstanding balance of the loan, on a rate calculated as this: BLR (current BLR, not the BLR at the time the loan is taken) adjusted according to the loan agreement. As such, when the BLR changes, so will the effective interest rate. So why would I set the earlier calculation as 5% because that only occurred for the first 2 years and have increased significantly in 2007 till now?

In addition, I have mentioned that when I meet my clients I would need to see their loan statement to know exactly the amount of their paid installments as you do realize that it is impossible to calculate it exactly due to the changes of the BLR over the years right? If you haven't realized this and insist on setting it at 5%, you really really really are dumb, especially for someone who talks so much



Also, the most important thing is going forward, how much the TS will pay in the next 20 years, and if he were to refinance, will the total repayments be lowered due to the lower interest rate? The answer is yes(!!!) as I have shown multiple times, but because you may have lost some marbles up there, I will show it again:



I really don't like to call others stupid, or dumb, I am very open to opinions and discussions; but when they can't see the things that are right in front of them what else can I do? I respect many old people, I learn A LOT from all my clients especially the older ones, and they return that by fully respecting my opinions as a financial planner regardless if they agree with me or otherwise. But you? I don't know what kind of financial planners you have met, but if you got cheated by some of them previously you only have yourself to blame for being too stupid and naive, because the final decision always require your signature. You signed your stupidity by signing contracts with dishonest financial planners.

If were to average out the 10 years interest, it is still lower than what you stated in that table that you used to cheat people.
Average is 5.25% only but you use 2014's interest rate to calculate TS's 2005 interest rate. If this is not cheating then I don't know what is your excuse.
I like to burst a cheater's lie and myth especially that cheater are still trying his very best to cheat.
When a cheater wants to cheat or mislead, for sure he will use harsh words to insult and attack another when he run out of excuse. As cheat is cheat, can be busted at any 1 time.

Bro, why do you refuse to understand what wild_card_my presented ?

Read again what he wrote. It is long, but he is just being patient to explain to you some very simple stuff

Nope, by input 5%, the total interest paid are lower than refinance(as you need to add loan 1's interest rate paid and loan 2's interest). I already read and understand.
But with interest rate are moving up and down almost every year, none of the table works 100%. It will be a guide only.

Ignoring what was paid in the past.

Just compare, existing principal outstanding at BLR less 1% for remaining tenures.

Then refinancing the same principal outstanding with same tenure at say BLR less 2.4%.

What is the interest savings less the refinancing cost.

Of course, we can have secondary argument as to whether you need to present value back the interest savings.

It should be that simple right. Past is past. Just focus on remaining loan amount.

With current 6.85%-2.2(or 2.4%) compare to last time's 6%, the difference after adding legal fees are not much.
And to make it more sour, BNM may increase OPR after April Fool next year to strengthen rm against USD/SGD.
Still remember my friend took a housing loan from insurance company(the agent have business with his family) that with interest rate of 12%(fixed) and he do refinance as the difference are big.

BTW, why want to ignore the paid interest? Because it seems like only I'm the only person adding both interest while others only uses current to compare.