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 All about ETFs / Foreign Brokers, Exchange traded funds

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TSrjb123
post Nov 1 2014, 08:49 PM, updated 6y ago

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What are ETFs?


DEFINITION OF 'EXCHANGE-TRADED FUND - ETF' Source
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Benefits of ETFs Source

The Benefits of Trading Like a Stock
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Low Expense Ratios
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Diversification
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How to buy ETFs?

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Taxation
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Funding
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Useful Links
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This post has been edited by rjb123: Jun 28 2016, 06:07 PM
TSrjb123
post Nov 2 2014, 05:19 PM

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QUOTE(MNet @ Nov 2 2014, 11:46 AM)
60% on healthcare etf now
*
XLV?

Why so healthy on Healthcare, due to Ebola scare?

QUOTE(guy3288 @ Nov 2 2014, 11:53 AM)
thanks for sharing, a good summary on ETFs.

I am keen to start investing but had problem opening account.
Anyone in malaysia recently managed to open new account using home email/address?
"First you need a broker, I personally use TD Ameritrade as well as Interactive Brokers. Both allow account openings of non US residents with a Malaysian address . There's others too of course which I won't mention now as I've only used these two."

i received email telling me otherwise.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
TD Ameritrade Client Services  Aug 5 2014
To
me
Mr.

TD Ameritrade is currently unable to open new accounts for clients with mailing and/or physical addresses in Malaysia and Singapore.  We appreciate your interest in opening an account and wish you the best in your investment needs.

Sincerely,

Rachael Peacock
Client Services, TD Ameritrade
TD Ameritrade, Inc.
*
Hmm this must be something fairly recent? When I applied, just proceeded online then sent them the documents - never contacted them beforehand.

QUOTE(ChAOoz @ Nov 2 2014, 12:59 PM)
Im using cimb as they are able to trade on nysearca. The problem is im not sure what to do on the taxation side.

Im assuming that dividend gain is 30% while capital gain is not taxable right ? What pitfall in taxation should i look into ? Is the tax avoidable ?
*
As long as you supplied W8-BEN you won't get taxed on capital gains, but the withholding tax of 30% on dividends will still apply. On ETFs the only way around this is to buy ETFs from other countries (Ie SG, HK, UK (not UK domiciled though - they charge stamp duty!))


QUOTE(oneeleven @ Nov 2 2014, 01:54 PM)
Will foreign exchange expenses greatly affect viability?

Are there any Malaysian equivalents?

What about dealing through Vanguard SG?
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Well if you're transferring from RM to USD of course you have some cost on exchange rate and transfer costs - this comes down to the amount you're depositing. But in the long run, your savings on sales charges and annual fees should outweigh the initial exchange rate / transfer charge loss.

Vanguard SG doesn't seem to list any SG based ETFs at all? I just only checked their website so I may be wrong, haven't looked into this in the past.
TSrjb123
post Nov 2 2014, 07:59 PM

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QUOTE(jutamind @ Nov 2 2014, 07:46 PM)
rjb123, thanks for the good work. i suggest you include the topic on how to fund/withdraw from the trading account as i believe most of us are not aware of...
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Added smile.gif
TSrjb123
post Nov 2 2014, 11:25 PM

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QUOTE(ChAOoz @ Nov 2 2014, 08:44 PM)
If im not wrong, i trade under CIMB they serve as intermediary as well as act as broker for us to trade in US exchange. In this case should i still need the W8-BEN ?

So far my withdrawal of ETF with them, they did not required me to provide any tax filling, however im not sure on the charges incur during the withdrawal process, might need to re-look into that.
*
CIMB website mentions having to complete a W8-BEN at sign up, maybe they provided this at the time?

I know when I opened OCBC securities in SG the W8-BEN was part of the application form
TSrjb123
post Nov 2 2014, 11:36 PM

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QUOTE(MNet @ Nov 2 2014, 10:12 PM)
Pls share ur latest etf holding portfolio
*
My long term portfolio isn't very exciting :

25% Bonds (BND/WIP)
35% US
20% Europe Developed (VGK)
10% Emerging Markets (VWO)
5% each Gold / REITS

Have some other temporary positions outside of that, but not long term or part of above allocation : EWZ, RSX, SPY, VGK, XLV

UK listed : UKDV, IUKD for some dividend income and as I have spare GBP earning 0% interest (no withholding tax smile.gif)
TSrjb123
post Nov 3 2014, 08:19 PM

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QUOTE(chicargo @ Nov 3 2014, 01:21 AM)
Let's say I put 10k into Vanguard 500 Index Fund and another 10k into SPDR 500 ETF.

Will they both get the same returns minus the different fund admin cost?
*
Pretty much, yes. Although small differences in the way dividends are handled between them so it won't be 100% the same.

http://financialindependence.org/sp-500-et...-vs-vii-vs-voo/
TSrjb123
post Nov 3 2014, 09:32 PM

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QUOTE(oneeleven @ Nov 3 2014, 09:20 PM)
Still in the long term a small difference , over 10 years

QUOTE
The end result of these small return differences is a 0.5% higher return for IVV vs. SPY portfolio over the 10 years listed here with a 97.2% vs. a 96.7% gain respectively, compared with 98.5% for the S&P 500 index. Though VOO is relatively new, its results so far are a positive indicator of its future.

TSrjb123
post Nov 3 2014, 09:47 PM

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Diverse, low fees

Actually $25 per trade if you buy in big chunks here and there it isn't really that much in the long term
TSrjb123
post Nov 3 2014, 11:01 PM

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QUOTE(oneeleven @ Nov 3 2014, 10:47 PM)
Would you say ETFs are for trader investors, not long term?

For long term why not just get no-load funds from Vanguard SG like VFINX VTSMX?

PS: Again, are there no ETFs composed of Malaysian stocks, only front load UTs ?
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ETFs can be used for long term, short term, intra day trading , short selling, options

Can you buy them directly in SG from Vanguard? Doesn't give any information on their SG website at all.

There's a Malaysia ETF, IWM by iShares : http://www.ishares.com/us/products/239669/...ci-malaysia-etf

QUOTE(MNet @ Nov 3 2014, 10:53 PM)
USD25/trade min?

Let take malaysia mutual fund commission for example 2%

u need to trade at least USD1250/trade.....
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I did say big chunks .. if you bought $5k, that $25 is only 0.5%
TSrjb123
post Nov 4 2014, 12:17 AM

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QUOTE(oneeleven @ Nov 3 2014, 11:17 PM)
Isn't iShares EWM still a US$ product? I'm hoping for a Rm$ one sold on local bourse. ETF concept too advanced for here?

What is Vanguard doing in SG if not selling anything?!?!
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Ah, I've never looked at any ETFs listed on Bursa

I don't think Vanguard funds are available directly in SG - FSM there for example sells "INFINITY US 500 STOCK INDEX" as a feeder fund

QUOTE(MNet @ Nov 3 2014, 11:19 PM)
1 shoot 5k?
why not 50k? so commission only 0.05%?

Better diversify it..

1k in 1 time.
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Sure, I was just saying $25 isn't too bad IF you only buy large chunks here and there. If you're topping up +/- $1k each time then yeah, paying $25 each time is a bit too much.

QUOTE(wodenus @ Nov 3 2014, 11:31 PM)
This one really hujan emas lol, why would you not buy the ETF directly from bursa, it's only 0.005%  (Malacca Securities I think smile.gif )
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This one?

FTSE Bursa Malaysia KLCI ETF 0820EA
http://www.ambankgroup.com/sites/fbmklciet...es/default.aspx

Anyway here's a list of ETFs listed on Bursa :

http://www.bursamalaysia.com/market/securi...aded-funds-etfs

TSrjb123
post Nov 4 2014, 07:59 PM

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QUOTE(ChAOoz @ Nov 4 2014, 03:01 AM)
One thing i like about etfs is that it allow you to bet on certain macro trend without too high of an exposure to certain stock and also of its low fees of course.

One thing to be careful about etfs is that always choose those that has high activity / volume else they might just close the fund halfway through
*
Yep, although with most US ETFs they're quite active / liquid unless you're looking at really specific stuff

Certainly sector / country ETFs there's no worries about liquidity - even the 2/3x Bull/Bear leveraged ones have quite decent volume.

QUOTE(ronho @ Nov 4 2014, 08:06 AM)
any gold/silver or commodities etf in malatsia
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Bursa only has limited ETFs listed, no commodity ones.

http://www.bursamalaysia.com/market/securi...aded-funds-etfs

You can buy some UTs through FSM - AmPrecious Metals / RHB-OSK Gold And General Fund

QUOTE(oneeleven @ Nov 4 2014, 05:40 PM)
So buying UTs and ETFs with similar holdings from discount brokers not much difference except for NAV pricing and flexible trading hours?
*
Well if you have a UT with the same fees as an ETF , tracking the same index your return would be pretty much the same.
TSrjb123
post Nov 5 2014, 12:22 AM

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QUOTE(ronho @ Nov 4 2014, 11:43 PM)
mind telling how to buy via FSM bro ? ....on line or from the bank ?
AmPrecious Metals --from ambank
RHB-OSK Gold And General Fund --from rhb ?
tx...noob here
*
There's a thread dedicated to FSM : https://forum.lowyat.net/topic/3334901


TSrjb123
post Nov 5 2014, 12:23 AM

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QUOTE(MNet @ Nov 4 2014, 11:46 PM)
market down down..
*
Yeah, everything red today - not enough to tempt to top up though.
TSrjb123
post Nov 5 2014, 04:56 PM

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QUOTE(jasonkwk @ Nov 5 2014, 02:41 PM)
Most ETF in KLSE and SGX suffer liquidity issue, not suitable for trading.
*
Yeah, volume is very low compared to US listed

What's the bid / ask spread like on the ETFs listed on Bursa? I don't have access to Malaysia broker acc.
TSrjb123
post Nov 16 2014, 06:10 AM

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QUOTE(MNet @ Nov 15 2014, 10:36 PM)
the cash dividend payment will go into the trading account?
*
Yep.

Just download your broker statements and have a look through

In TDAM I'm enrolled in DRIP (Dividend Reinvestment Plan) so all dividends automatically get reinvested.

IB doesn't offer DRIP and just gets added to the cash balance in the respective currency.


TSrjb123
post Nov 16 2014, 07:37 PM

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QUOTE(MNet @ Nov 16 2014, 11:45 AM)
the dividend credit into brokerage account is after 30% deduction for tax?
*
Check your broker activity statements - you can see details of dividend payments and withholding taxes there.

user posted image

TSrjb123
post Nov 28 2014, 10:44 PM

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QUOTE(Selectt @ Nov 28 2014, 08:19 PM)
park
*
Parking in all ETF related threads? biggrin.gif
TSrjb123
post Nov 29 2014, 08:55 PM

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QUOTE(MNet @ Nov 29 2014, 06:27 PM)
u buying HACK?
*
This?

http://www.pureetfs.com/etfs/hack.html

Nope
TSrjb123
post Jan 2 2015, 10:39 AM

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QUOTE(AVFAN @ Jan 1 2015, 10:30 PM)
hi guys, i just noticed this thread. good that ts started this as i was looking for something to begin with, found nothing then. found this only:
usa stocks thread:
https://forum.lowyat.net/topic/3397675/+380
i recently put some money in us etf's via cimb's itrade which is already mentioned - fees, etc...

in my search for info, i found a few things before i jumped in:

.. us etf's listed on bursa n sgx seem unpopular. - Indeed, volume on SGX / Bursa ETFs is very low
.. buying direct into us via local platforms like itrade may cost a bit more but is viable - real time data is available n reliable. Can't comment, never used any of the local platforms
.. if one is paying 0.42 or 0.35% at bursa, 0.4% for us equities is bearable, provided each transaction is >usd6250, i.e. >usd25 min brokerage. TDAM has lots of commission free ETFs, IB charges 0.005 USD per share, 1 USD minimum
.. local platforms also offer t+3 for us and sgx like bursa, so u can manage the trades among the bourses.
.. exchange rates - i find itrade's rates reasonable, the spread is about 0.37% e.g. last trading session 3.5035/3.4905.
.. us etf's appear tradeable - the popular ones are always among the highest, spy being the top one almost everyday.

.. yahoo finance offers good info n data, real time. just use email acc, create own portfolio.
http://finance.yahoo.com/
.. etf links:
http://www.barchart.com/etf/vleaders.php
http://money.usnews.com/funds/etfs

i got into spy (s&p500), xle (energy), oih (oilfield services) and qqq (nasdaq/tech).

being new in this, i do not really know what surprises may come except the volatility i noticed. i just thought at this time with rm looking to get weaker and local economy being stressed and tested seriously; us economy looking strong, usd getting stronger; oil prices "near bottom" - ingredients are there to put some money. i may get a rude shock, of course.

to others who have been in it longer, i like to ask:

.. to get lower brokerage fees, are there reputable local outfits dealing in rm-usd? or must go overseas to set up usd acc.? Not much competition like overseas, so foreign brokerages (ie US) are far cheaper in fees. But you need to bear costs of transferring funds overseas
.. dividends - understand there is 30% tax; for etfs, do they always offer reinvestment for every dividend payout? Depends on broker, TDAM offers DRIPS (dividend reinvestment program) which automatically reinvests all dividends. IB doesn't offer this, dividends just get credited into your brokerage account in the respective currency. FYI, you can reduce the 30% withholding to 15% by for example buying LSE listed ETFs (also USD denominated) which are domiciled in Ireland, I believe the same also applies to Luxembourg domiciled ETFs.
.. in the event gomen put capital controls like in 1998, what happens to these etfs held in trust by by local ib nominee? Can't advise on this, I'm not Malaysian so likely wouldn't affect me either way

thanks for sharing. i m sure many more are keen on us etf's at this time.
*
TSrjb123
post Jan 2 2015, 11:28 AM

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QUOTE(AVFAN @ Jan 2 2015, 11:03 AM)
thanks for response.

tdam or foreign ibs... i suppose one will need to register with them, open trading acc, plus have a usd bank acc ready, right?
do they offer any leverage with cash available or paid up stocks?
where would the nearest popular ib be? in sg, hk?

it is obvious the brokerage is far far less, but how are the exchange rates for tdam and those ib's?
do they use special rates or the common rates used by normal banks? roughly, the spread = 0.1%, 0.5%, 1%?
i suspect the spread may be ok but the bank fund transfer fees may be the killer - can u comment?

as i write, usd= rm3.51... again....

thanks much!
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1. Correct - you open the US account with them and then transfer in. I personally have Maybank USD account already but you could transfer direct from RM account at bank's rates if you wish.
2. IB does offer leverage, TDAM doesn't as far as I know - I don't know to what extent IB gives leverage as I don't use this at all.
3. You open an account with IB which then allows you to deposit in various ways, SGD into Citibank SG account, GBP into UK Citibank account and then convert currency using FXTrader in IB - I have various accounts in different currencies so this way you could avoid fees (although not if funds are coming from RM)
4. IBs rates for FX are very competitive - very close to spot rates, I'll log in shortly and send you a screenshot if you wish, don't have my security card to hand right now. All in all, a transfer will cost you about $45-50 USD if transferring from Maybank USD account to IB or TDAM.

RM isn't openly traded overseas, so there's no option to convert to or from RM within IB.



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