Hi Sifus!

Need your expert opinion on the following quote guys! I would truly appreciate any kind of help.

Long story cut short: My roof has been partially eaten by termites. So basically I would like to replace all the wood trusses to LWS. If possible i would like to reuse my existing roof tiles (Epoxy paint it). This is one of the quote I received.

Area: Approx 1900sqft

Option A

Steel roof truss system(25 degrees) = RM 14,145.00 (Unit price: RM 7.50)
Supply and install cemboard fascia 7.5mm thick. Qty: 156 = RM 1,482.00 (Unit Price: RM 9.50)
Supply and install double sided woven foil = RM 3,394.00 (Unit Price: RM 1.80)
Supply and install standard conc roof tile & ridge tile = RM 7,921.00 (Unit Price RM 4.20)
Supply and install metal flashing 305 x 0.47mm thick. Qty 84 = RM 705.60 (Unit Price RM 8.50)

Main roof truss spacing 1220mm +/-
Roof batten spacing 310mm +/-

Plaster ceiling and additional brick to cover roof space + plaster = RM 10,000.00
Gutter = RM4,000.00

Total: RM 41,648.00


Option B

Steel hallow section roof structure(25 degrees) = RM 26,404.00 (Unit price: RM 14.00)
Supply and install cemboard fascia 7.5mm thick. Qty: 156 = RM 1,482.00 (Unit Price: RM 9.50)
Supply and install double sided woven foil = RM 3,394.00 (Unit Price: RM 1.80)
Supply labour to install existing conc roof tile(Epoxy Paint) = RM 3,017.60 (Unit Price RM 1.60)
Supply and install metal flashing 305 x 0.47mm thick. Qty 84 = RM 705.60 (Unit Price RM 8.50)

Main roof truss spacing 1220mm +/-
Roof batten spacing 310mm +/-

Plaster ceiling and additional brick to cover roof space + plaster = RM 10,000.00
Gutter = RM4,000.00

Total: RM 49,049.00


Any kind of feedback is appreciated sifus!

Thank you

trust me, you wouldnt want to go for option B. your existing house RC roof beam was not design to cater for structural steel works. If you noticed the cost between RHS vs LWS, the cost is double, meaning the weight is double.

concrete or clay roof tiles are designed for life. Those main tiles can be recycle back. But those ridge or hip tiles are unable to recycle due to grouted by cement earlier.

i recommend you to opt of a layer of glass wool 50mm thick to cut down the noise emit from LWS truss when raining or hot day.

wah so expensive nowdays. Last time 2-3 years ago. 1000 sqr ft change roof tiles and zinc foils including wood frame touch up i got quote for RM4 per sqr ft. But depends on your material also

This post has been edited by zk9: Jul 21 2014, 11:25 AM

Peri Peri: My initial plan was to not use plaster ceiling for the roof covering my porch area, hence the reason why the contractor proposed Option B.

Im almost certain with Option A, except that I wont be changing my current roof tiles but to epoxy paint it.

But now that you have highlighted on the noise LWS makes during rain or hot day, what options do I have to counter this issue?

What would the cost be for glass wool 50mm covering 1900sqft?

Thanks a bunch!

Tell me about it la bro... at first i wanted to just replace all the damaged wood but the problem is my roof design is just terrible. The existing gutter runs almost at the center of the house and when it pours cats and dogs, ill get waterfall at various parts of my house!

which of cause led to termite infestation due to dampness.. thats the reason why i choose to go with LWS..

Termite is a whole separate issue i need to deal with as well!

good thread.

By the way, I think I got quoted the same as yours. Around RM50k.

Do you think this will last like forever?

I heard plaster ceiling is not good.

For 1900 sqft as well?

I seriously doubt it will last forever but apparently 15 - 20 years is what we are looking at. Quarterly maintenance is required apparently.

I really wish i could do without plaster ceiling or any, i rather leave it bare but with LWS its going to look like a factory roof without ceiling.

So for this reno, Option A will require me to redo my existing plaster ceiling (3 rooms +1 bathroom + Kitchen) and my entire porch.

Option B, I dont have to do any plaster outside my house.

Actually your per sqft is in include the inclination? More incline will be more sqft right? I was told about 2000sqft but I scared he tipu me. Do you measure again?

I'm still not understand this whole roof thingy.

gogo2:

Ill take some pictures and post it up later, in fact i intend to post a before and after reno as well. Hopefully it helps the some who are facing similar issues.

To answer your question, If the incline is increased then im sure the area increases too but i think thats the least of the problem. Because you need to have the space to make that incline possible in the first place.

Let me explain:

The root cause of my problem is the design of the roof itself. It arcs inward and the gutter runs almost to the centre of my house. Initially it was all fine but in time as the wood started to bend and sag, the gutter itself lost its shape and water was getting clogged at various parts. To make matters worse we didnt get enough incline on the roof when we last renovated.

When it rains heavily, of cause, water overflows from the clogged parts and leaks thru the ceiling. To make matters worse, termite started munching those delicious damp wood and I didnt realize it until it was way too late. Now Ill have to replace almost half of the damaged trusses, which im not happy about because it still does not address the gutter design issues.

So i have decided to change the wood trusses to LWS and change the design of the roof to get rid of the gutter running in the centre. The new design will see a gable that channels the water to the sides of the roof allowing for my side roof gutter to trap water and guide it to the drain.

Yes the gable increases cost but i have no other choice because to make the 25 degree incline ill have to increase the starting point of the roof by almost 3ft which then forces me to tie bricks around my balcony, shut 3 of my windows and still live with the fact that the side gutter may only reach a height of 5ft +/-.

Thanks. I need time to consume it. Picture will be better.

How you gonna fix the termites? If your neighbor got termite, will it go to your house?

I think Ill have a go with the bait system by Rentokil since they guarantee their service. RM 2500.00 And yearly RM700.00.

Oh, you're not going to inject into the floor?

ERM... RM700 yearly is quite expensive.

What's include in the yearly fee of rm700?

I've done my house with rentokil around 3 years back and it cost me about rm2300 for 22x100 single storey terrace. Using bait follow with spray roof and drilling system. Mine have no yearly charge after that.

ooo... 2300 for 2000sqft? how about 4000sqft? double?

Thats a good deal la chief!

This is just baiting and followed by yearly checks.

RM2500 covers baiting and 3 checks RM700 yearly.

Im not sure how the sqft calculates for baiting but my house is about 5000 sqft and thats what he quoted.

Bro do you still have your contact? Maybe i can ask them see what they quote me for the same package?

without going into too much details, i would suggest the following:
1. go for LWS
2. do up an option of using metal roof instead of recycling your existing roof tiles or epoxy painting over it

why?
your big ticket items are mainly the steel roof truss (RM14k) and supply and install of conc roof tiles (RM8k). RM22k/RM42k.
and plaster ceiling @ RM10k for just approx 1,900sf? that's about RM5.25psf!!!
negotiate for lower price of your plaster ceiling. that's a little absurd!

magic of metal deck roofing.
1. less joints as metal deck are large panel and if custom length, means no joint except at apex. less chance of leakages. less joints also mean no chance of thieves entering. do you know some roofing profiles does not even require any nailings? they use clips to interlock!
2. metal is lighter, hence, you would be able to re-space your LWS spacing to be much less. dependent on profile selected, you may be looking at truss spacing of up to 2m. battens can varies up to 1.2m instead. so expect your RM14k to be greatly reduced.
3. bigger roofing piece means less work. hence installation cost would also reduce. RM8k going down.

things to watch out for:
1. some people dont like the metal look
2. you need to add rockwool for thermal resistant and noise resistant
3. select profile to maximise your truss spacing and batten spacing. this would give you huge cost saving.

good luck!

Oh then mine should be cheaper than yours.

Nice details.

u didn't give any size or measurements at all

i hate metal roof decks

1. it looks cheap
2. it's noisy as hell if it rains (even if you put 4" noise insulating layer)
3. did i mention it looks ugly?




but you got it all right. you're quite experienced i see. yes, you can save lots of money for materials since you use less materials for the trussess / purlins

u certainly heard wrong

poor quality plaster ceiling is not good

high quality plaster ceiling is good

likewise, the same can be said for everything in the world

kochin: Fantastic! Thank you chief!

1) Definitely going with LWS.

2) The cement tiles are my concern now. What would my drawback be if I go with epoxy paint the existing cement tiles?

3) Im trying to avoid metal roof purely due to the amount of noise it makes when it rains unless i have been ill advised on some sound proofing that could be done. Could you explain some pro's and cons here compared to epoxy painting current tiles?

4) Agree with you on the Plaster ceiling, ill need to get that clarified myself.

5) Also on the profile to maximize truss spacing and batten spacing. How would I know which would be ideal for my roof design? You lost me here chief!

Lucifah:

I dont have the exact drawings but the area it covers is well within 1900sqft chief.

Yea i just dont want it to be too noise if i go with metal roof. Nevertheless im quite determine to salvage my current cement roof hence im trying to know if this epoxy paint would actually last long.

LWS without plaster ceiling will definitely look like a space station But the Option B given was their solution to my argument on its looks. Which does not require me to Plaster the porch ceiling.

Any thoughts on it?

from my experience, salvaging the concrete roof tiles will cause in breakages. allow for at least 10% breakage

the problem now is to find concrete tiles with the EXACT size & profiles

u can usually find the brand name for the concrete tile maker on the underside. try to find the tiles first before you decide on reusing it

as for option A or Option B, i can't help you decide unless i'm on site.

for the sound n heat insulation you can buy the aluminium foil on your own and ask your contractor to install since they already want to setup your new roof. You can try this. The price is quite cheap for quality product plus got bubble 1 side or 2 sided. Still can nego if you buy more than 2 rolls

http://www.mudah.my/Rock+wool+insulation+d...il-27658123.htm

looks cheap? hahaha. i did caution on acceptance of metal roof by its users. but do you know that most iconic buildings uses metal roof? try sydney opera house.
if you like the conc roof tiles so much, use the next best thing. imitation. lol.
https://www.google.com/search?q=famous+meta...F%3B2743%3B1822
ok jokes aside, do you know that metal roof, if done with proper insulation for noise and thermal, it is actually cooler and more quiet compared to conc roof tiles.
it's a fact.
but i can understand where you coming from. most malaysians have the same stigma.

epoxy is a layer of coating. works very well under normal duress but... a big BUT! when movement occurs, you can kiss your epoxy goodbye. epoxy have a very low tolerance of movement. i forgot whether it's 0.2mm or 2mm. eitherway, once you conc roof tiles starts moving due to heat expansion or simply cracks in your roof tiles, or cats or mice starts taking a stroll on your roof, you might experience problems liao. not trying to scare you but i did say might.
most importantly, concr roof tiles have been around for ages. it's a proven system. it's cheap and durable. but the trick is getting a seasoned and experienced roofer to do the installation.
my aunt renovated her house and omg, leakage like nobody business.
so pls make sure your roofer is experienced, else it doesn't matter what option you take but problems are almost guaranteed.

don't listen to me.
get the experts.
get a monier or la farge sales guy to explain to you the wonders of conc roof tiles.
then get a asim, lysaght or whatever roofing metal deck guy to explain to you wonders of metal deck.

as i have clarified, tests have indeed shown that metal deck (with proper treatment) yields better thermal and noise insulation compared to roof tiles.

lastly, different roofing profiles requires different spacing of both truss and purlins/battens.
for instance, the metal deck comes in a raw form of certain width.
it is 'rolled' or stamped into different profiles.
some profiles are heavier and require closer spacing of truss. some are lighter.
eg. for bhp's product, spandek is good and reliable but fugly. hr29 is a big no no due to it's soft profile and prone to damages by installers. mewah tiles are the exact replica of roof tiles if you still want to look the same. klip lock is good but highly industrial look. if i'm not mistaken, i have trimdek on my extensions. i dont know because it was done by someone else.

good luck boss!

i agree whole hearted with you, provided that the building design is modern type

if it's just the typical house design, metal roof deckings will not make it look any nicer

as for the thermal and acoustic insulation, i also agree with you. but, most of my clients never understand why we quote very high for the insulation layers. they say not necessary.

R50 thermal insulations are expensive, and so does acoustic ones. used properly, they provide superior thermal and acoustic insulations


but for me, i will always prefer the newest material now - recycled vulcanised rubber mats tiles (that looks like roof shingles) and really look nice

Not sure about that, But should not be double up the prize, should be lower then double.

Rm2500 just baiting system only? Not include drilling? I will suggest to do the drilling too as termite normally come from the ground.

Rm700 just for checking is too much for me, I can just check by myself from time to time. Just look at any trace of mud from all the wooden structure and call Rentokil to treat it if found any. Touch wood so far didn't see any sign of termite after the first treatment.

I do keep the contact of Rentokil who done the job for me, pm me if you need it.

Hi sifu,

I was given quotation for a roof tiles job for backyard house where i plan to do cooking. No extension kitchen will be done.

1 Mild Steel Awning with Roof Tiles 176 sf 32.00 5,632.00

Size : 22' x (7' + 1')

2 Mild Steel Awning without Roof Tiles 176 sf 26.00 4,576.00

(workmanship only)

Size : 22' x (7' + 1')

I was advised the roof tiles will be used is GCI Eagle.

Is it worth the money we pay for?

And, any disadvantage from this tiles?

Yea thats what the contractor mentioned as well. Im keeping my fingers cross tat they dont damage much! But ill have to source out additional tiles as backup as well.

Thanks chief!

Goodness me! Brother Kochin im worshipping you from now!

I think as you have mentioned, it all depends how experienced the installer is. Im keeping my fingers cross on it and hope this guy does a good job. Ill post pictures as the work takes place.

As for the metal or concrete roof.. *confused as a duck on which one to settle for..

aiyah... sharing is caring lah.
i only share what my limited knowledge is on the subject.
please ask the experts.

if i were you, i would opt for metal but with proper insulation.
not so much on cost savings but more on safety.
i hate the fact thieves can very easily get into any landed residential via the roof.
good luck!

Two thumbs up!

on the same note, how does clay tiles compare (for tropical weather) to metal and cement tiles yea? Any idea how long would it last?

whoa RM15 per sqft.. is that the standard pricing for vulcanized rubber tiles?

that one is just the rubber tiles

not yet include installation

if you use this, you need a layer of metal sheet to act as water barrier

which explains why you don't see this on many homes - just the high end ones

Plaster ceiling : He charging me RM3.10 /sqft..

this is based on my perception and not knowledge ya!
read with own risk.

clay tiles are more superior to cement tiles.
this is because clay particles are finer thus it's less porous.
i understand clay tiles are supposedly able to handle higher temperature compared to cement tiles.
also less susceptible to cracks/ even if crack on surface, the density of clay tiles might still prevent water through.
better colour retention.

but one drawback is thermal.
with our climate, it will be hot.
while it is better in thermal resistance it also becomes slower in heat dissipation. thus once heat is trapped inside, it takes the equal longer duration to discharges the heat trapped in attic back to the atmosphere. double edge sword.
but again, thermal insulation helps.

again, pls pls pls don't blindly listen to kochin. check with sales executives lah.
RM50k is big money ler...

thats just way beyond my budget la chief..

ok ok.. they guy is actually recommending clay tiles compared to cement.. he will be getting back with me on the thermal insulation.. ill keep you posted chief..

Does anyone know any contractor has good workmanship and can share the contact which located in Klang Valley area?

Hi

So, normally which type of roof tiles is recommended to be used and which brand?

I see, if for clay, there are many brands like?
1) GCI Eagle
2) TBF clay
3) Monier

From my research online,GCI is better among those. Monier the best for concrete tiles,but clay most preferred GCI but TBF got more shape of roof tiles. I'm reproofing my roof,might go with GCI.

from my experience in re-roofing my hse in usj 23, monier is over-price for concrete tile.
better choose from hume. quality almost the same.

but get a good roofer. it's the most important point.

Hei chief,

Make sure you double check on the contractors previous work, ask him before hand what are the jobs that he would sub contract, also remember to draw up a solid contract before agreeing terms.

I can share mine if you need a draft.

All the best.

hi guys need advise,

hello brothers good day.. While i was looking for some tips on renovation i dropped by here and was reading all the posting and quite interesting.

So my main purpose is renovation & little designing

-re-roofing and waterproofing
-concrete leaking waterproofing
-wall crack fixing
-toilets modification and water proofing
-plumbing
-electric rewiring and lighting
-plaster ceiling
-tiling
-window framing
-interior designing rooms, study rooms, living hall, dining, kitchen


Already consulted 3 contractors visited my premise and waiting for quotation from them. All 3 Chinese ( 2 of them contractors 1 is designer who has contractor). 1 already sent quotation just for roofing, the designer fella probably he could have consulted his own contractor.


Current roofing style (timber crossing with tiles) already 20 years old and many leakage issues also from concrete. So i planned to completely change the design and interested on metal/steel truss roofing system with metal roofing/ PU FOAM roofing which good for heat insulation and noise reduction. If i am using tiles on the steel truss then planning to cover with aluminium bubble foil.

Since i am changing the roof design, which is different from original. I think i need engineer drawing for DBKL approval. I also find out some companies offering this metal truss roofing services, also have engineering services to design the truss based on roofing design..


OK, so the designer who gave me quotation just for ROOFING work about 48k total. Not so in detail. No break down on roofing part



For Supply & construct metal roofing & steel support at roof top is 40k, so i throw him some question how he quoted the price, based on what type of roofing, what about design drawing of architect / engineer for approval. i even send him some pics on the type of roofs. Pending his reply.

Other 2 contractors still no quotation yet. I am looking for trustworthy and quality workmanship.
i have sent samples below to all those contractors at least to give them some ideas what i am looking for.Lots of Indonesian and Vietnamese freelance contractors but not very comfortable to handover them the job, fear of quality and cheating.Any brothers, would like to recommend me trustworthy and quality workmanship contractors most welcomed


also heard about the movement of metal truss or metal roofing due to thermal expansion/contraction, how do we address that issue. stretch and shrink of metal truss/ metal roofing due to hot and cold weather. how bad the noise is ? any solution for this.
i am wondering who will be installing this truss, normal contractor workers or the steel supplier's workers.



This post has been edited by GHOSTVIC: Jun 9 2015, 02:22 AM

i didnt know you are also a roofing contractor.. apart from selling undergarments.

anyway looking at low pitch roof solutions now..

woot... 2014 post worh

hahaha


static mechanics are important in determining the proper bra fit

2014 is only last year leh..
maybe you should also contribute on "steps on how to clean septic tank" topic..

What kind of roof is this?if compare with the conventional house roof, which one is better? As attach. Later will add a plaster ceiling

This post has been edited by KCLCCT: Dec 4 2015, 09:23 AM


Attached thumbnail(s)

This is PPGI metal roofing with attached metalized foil

Tq. I have zero knowledge about a roof. Will google about ppgi roof. Hope its not so bising when raining.

This post has been edited by KCLCCT: Dec 5 2015, 02:53 PM

Can someone help me. I think my roof got problem. Everytime rain cats and dogs. The rain water dripping from ceiling. House location ss2 PJ. If you know any good contractor, please call me Derrick 0122196284. Thank you.

This post has been edited by babeconvoy: Dec 7 2015, 12:30 AM

for those who wanted some light from roof, what is the best for cost, cheaper better

skylight which is glass, exp especially those double layer laminated
poly, doesnt last long.

how about traditional roman roof tiles with glass?

If you need a second opinion you can always call my uncle, 012 9133 651 (Mr Wong) he does roofing, and can help you out. : )
A good family friend and reliable.

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