it's the job of the boss to recruit and provide secondary assistance or any part time workers . A boss should have this contingency plan or else why is he up there milking few thousand dollars ? this is the first time i heard leadership don't need to have Plan B or work out a contingency plan for staff absence. Is it for the sake of saying something that didn't cross your mind at all.

some companies do recruit apprentice or new recruits . A constant training and so on. anyway, the subject is too general, we may be arguing about MNC vs countryman management here. Maybe u were right in some companies and i may be wrong. Some companies don't thought of funding a research dept so i believe it's a case of not going to happen soon in making a leap. And since his taking leaves in nov, i don't see any problem why his superior should reject his application since most employees goes on holiday in Dec. I told him that's your advantage to this application and it shouldn't be a problem .

Yours is purely theoretical off the books. In reality, every business will employ cost cutting measures. If you talking about these plans of yours, you are talking about costs. I have never encountered any business irrespective of size who actually does such contingency plans of yours just so you can go on a long vacation.

Sure, they employ secondary assistance for the particular employer but that is because it is only due to heavy workload not your kind of contingency plans.

When you started this topic, you asked two things:
1) Will 2weeks of leave be rejected with a valid reason by the superior? [No indication of timing]
2) Legality issue

Please be mindful that you only mentioned in later posts that he was applying in November. Now is still early July. Nobody would say that there is a problem if you had mentioned these information first. You can possibly misled forumers to think it was a last minute leave application considering you are afraid it is rejected.

Hence, I had mentioned that there shouldn't be a problem in my aforementioned post but you need to take into account the size of the company which you had not made any indication.

Small companies may still reject if you're the only guy in the accounting department. It is different with bigger companies as bigger companies has more than one staff and they would reshuffle temporarily. Those bigger companies would reshuffle only if its funeral or maternity cases only. And bigger companies only approve (in your case) the vacation leave if it is during the off peak period and not during closing.

Legality issue, there's no indication of the size of the company but irrespective of it, that friend of yours would know the HR policy of applying long leave (e.g. In advance of how many days/months for applying long leave)

Ultimately, just apply for the long vacation, if rejected then just resign if that is how you feel. Irrespective where you go, you need to know your place. You are an employee not an employer.

You seem so defensive that I would have thought it was you and not your friend instead.

Cheers.

well explained.
the same thing i told my friend about this. If his supervisor still rejected his early application than he should find new work place instead. no point staying.

labor law did not say you can't take 2 weeks or 1 month leaves. you can apply your leave a week before. But then, when you come back to work there is another person sitting on your place jor.

Ur friend has to inform early to the boss. No issue for that.

Usually such long leave is best to be months beforehand. So long if her friend follow the company's policy when applying leave and any other related company's policy or the employment contract.

The company can bring in a new person but highly doubt they would if she followed the company's protocols. They will terminate (depending on contract, you need to pay compensation to the company) her friend first and then employ a new one.

However, it wont be ideal because the friend can sue for compensation as you had followed the policy and contract. It will take some time because most likely the company will debate in the tribunal that her friend did not report for work or without notice going on leave. As her friend would most likely keep evidences of her application, her friend would most likely receive compensation.

The company would most likely keep her friend on the job but her friend would suffer maybe in terms of incentives (bonus, salary increment, etc).

In all companies (that I know of), annual leave is an entitlement that you accrue over time as you work.

However, the taking of that annual leave is at the discretion of the company. Hence if the company thinks that it's not convenient for you to go on leave, you can't. It's as simple as that, legally. And that principle applies for 'forced leave' as well, where the company can compel employees to take annual leave eg. when the production line is shut down for maintenance, the company want to shut down for a full week during Raya or CNY but there's not enough public holidays etc.

Therefore, if a company rejects ALL of your annual leave applications during the ENTIRE year, it is obligated to offer you a choice at the end of the year (assuming you have 10 days annual leave per annum):

(a) You will go on annual leave during the last 10 working days of the year, OR

(b) You will be paid an extra 10 working days in addition to your December payroll.

In practice however, I've never seen any company reject ALL leave applications of ALL employees. In my experience, the company will normally not reject leave applications of 1, 2 or 3 days - PROVIDED that the leave is not taken during PEAK periods (for example, month end closing if you're in accounting).

For long leave like a full working week or more, it really needs to be a negotiation between the employee and the company. The employee needs to apply early in order to give the company time to plan for his absence. And the company wants to keep the employee happy by allowing him to take his leave entitlement at a meaningful time... like a holiday trip overseas. But both have to compromise. The employee needs to plan and confirm early, and the employer needs to re-assign some work to other employees or temp staff, or re-schedule the deadlines a week later until the employee returns.

In my company, our headcount is quite tight. When we go on leave, we have no backups. We don't throw all our work to our boss and assume he'll figure things out. So it's basically a compromise. We get to go on our one week or two week long holidays, but have to compromise, for example, by logging in one or two mornings/evenings per week to clear the really urgent stuff, and when we return to office, put in some OT (Own Time) the next few nights to clear the remaining backlog. Or do what I do... take one or two Fridays a month to get long weekends (easy to clear a Friday backlog the next Monday) and then clear the remainder of my leave during the Christmas and New Year period when most people in US and Europe go on leave and the entire MNC goes into unofficial hibernation.

This post has been edited by seantang: Jul 9 2014, 04:57 PM

Try to plan vacation leave in advance. Normally i'll submit leave in Dec for next year plan vacation leave, normally taken in a block ( >5 days). So my boss know in advance when I'm going on leave and can easily work out an alternative if he/she not too comfortable with that date. It's easier to plan for holiday this way.

But why should he get an extra headcount and incur cost so that your friend can take leave? If he is aligned to the company's goal to save cost why should he? You mean you expect the superior to take over his job ... LOL.
Please la are you a freshie? First time in the real world. Your friend should have been smart enough to expect this from a small company especially accounting/auditing during the peak period.
Why isn't your friend preparing for the worst case scenario of the leave being rejected and why isn't your friend working in a better place? Dont you know anything about this at atll??

This post has been edited by Drian: Jul 9 2014, 10:39 PM

if u own business, would you hire redundant staffs just to make the life of our existing staffs easier? will you hire a few extra people 'just in case some of your staffs wants to take longer leaves'?

of course not. a business wants to minimize cost and maximize profit - always been and always will

Hey please lah... read what i have wrote in other statement before lah. don't be a jack ass . Big , small company doesnt make the culture any same or different. your arguement is flaw. Do you mean if Big means everything is perfect and have the same culture? there were some company in sdn bhd have 15 company cars and 20 lorries . Is that big for you?
or it's too small for u. no logic at all.

This post has been edited by missysleepy: Jul 10 2014, 08:32 AM

yes i will, u wanna think like old skool. go ahead.
im closing this thread bcos too many jack ass just wanted to say something for the sake of it.

This post has been edited by missysleepy: Jul 10 2014, 08:51 AM

i'd like to see u go 'new school' open up a company and hire 3 people for 1 person's work.

good luck

Your other statement? Like this:-



Seriously don't be a smart ass.
Also company cultures differ whether it's a fortune 500 company , MNC or a small local company. Like it or not, it does differ. Even within MNCs, there are differences in culture.

Go ahead, have the mindset that bosses should hire redundant workers so that staff can take leave. Lets see how many companies buy your idea. LOL.

Also it also shows that your friend (or you for that matter, judging by the way you react) have not been proactively building relationship and trust with the superiors. It also shows that your friend have not shown any plan on how to get the things done when he's gone.

This post has been edited by Drian: Jul 10 2014, 10:20 AM

this is not even about redundant worker , because your perception was so weak and you starts to think this way, u know what, basically you are talking about your own self or inner part of yourself. And the denial kept you so long that you starts to see others behave like you .

my friend is new to work and im giving him the support all i can just like providing the homeless support. As for you,if you run a company , your staff turnover will be high and you will just a small company all the time because of your marginalised perception all the time.

Go and read biography of Formula 1 drivers before you talk about business management with me.

in case u never gone outside of this country, go visit Jakarta and see how many workers working in one dept .