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 4 Critical Signs of a Bubble Market V5, Are the signs already there in Malaysia?

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TScybermaster98
post Apr 4 2014, 10:27 AM, updated 12y ago

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This is a continuation from V4:
https://forum.lowyat.net/topic/3156300

The collapse of the US housing market bubble emphasizes how important it is to figure out what property is really worth, from a fundamental perspective. Make sure you’re not over-paying!

There are 4 yardsticks of bubble markets:

•Price to Rent Ratio (or Yield)
•Relative Prices
•Affordability
•Price of new builds


VALUATION TOOL 1: THE PRICE TO RENT RATIO

The gross rental yield) is the housing parallel to the price/earnings ratio. Here is a set of rules of thumb for the housing market:

VALUATION YARDSTICKS FOR THE HOUSING MARKET

PRICE/RENT RATIO GROSS RENTAL YIELD (%)

5 20 Very undervalued
6.7 15 Very undervalued
8.3 12 Undervalued
10 10 Undervalued
12.5 8 Borderline undervalued
14.2 7 Fairly priced
16.7 6 Fairly priced
20 5 Borderline overvalued
25 4 Overvalued
33.3 3 Overvalued
40 2.5 Very overvalued
50 2 Very overvalued

But there are exceptions to this. When strong future growth in value is expected e.g in areas where transport infrastructure is being upgraded then relatively weak present earnings can be acceptable.

There are several good reasons why people should pay attention to the 'valuation parameters':

Higher rental yields push the housing market higher

If rental yield levels are high, this will tend to mean that the interest cost of buying a house is low, compared to the cost of renting a house:

•Potential buyers will pay less to borrow from the bank (in order to buy) than they pay when renting a house. Many will move from being renters to buyers.
•Entrepreneurs will find it makes sense to buy houses to make money, i.e., buy in order to rent them out.

Both these factors put upward pressure on house prices.

Lower rental yields put downward pressure house prices

If rental yield levels are low, this will tend to mean that the interest cost of buying a house is high, compared to the cost of renting a house:

•Potential buyers will find that to buy a house involves paying much more to the bank, than it costs to rent a house. Buyers, especially first-time buyers, may have difficulty financing housing. Banks will be worried about over-lending at loan-to-income ratios which mean that a slight increase in interest rates will mean financial crisis for the borrower.
•Entrepreneurs will find that buying-to-let won't pay.

The house price can be viewed as a kind of circle, with houses prices moving from yields of (say) 4% to 11%

•Yields shifting down to 4% would represent danger.
•Yields rising to 11% would signal opportunity.


VALUATION TOOL 2: RELATIVE PRICES


People tend to actively look for cheaper and better alternatives. Where houses are very highly priced, people will seek more affordable alternatives. So if you’re buying property that’s amazingly expensive on a sqaure foot basis compared to its surrounding developments – BEWARE!


VALUATION TOOL 3: AFFORDABILITY

If house prices are so high that few people can actually afford to buy them, then their value will likely fall in future. A reasonable measure of value is a country’s GDP per capita. In a country where the ratio of house prices to GDP/capita is high, it’s a fair bet that houses are overvalued.

Relative to GDP/Capita levels:
•House prices in Luxembourg, Belgium, Norway, Denmark and Austria seem cheap.
•House prices in the UK, Italy, France and the Netherlands seem comparatively expensive.


VALUATION TOOL 4: PRICE OF NEW BUILDS

If house prices are much higher than the cost of building (construction costs), developers are motivated to put up buildings. So when you see a rush by developers to build, that’s a danger sign. As new supply comes into the housing market, that tends to put pressure on prices. So when house prices are far greater than new-build costs, it's a very clear signal that prices are likely to come down.

TScybermaster98
post Apr 4 2014, 10:32 AM

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QUOTE(TheRoadRunner @ Apr 4 2014, 10:29 AM)
1st to check in?
Wow! That was fast! Congrats!
TScybermaster98
post Apr 7 2014, 05:45 PM

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Lets keep the discussions factual please. This thread has been banned before so lets not have a repeat.
TScybermaster98
post Apr 8 2014, 09:38 AM

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I remember asking this question before but dont remember getting a response. So here it goes again. Does anybody know if banks are recording lesser home loan applications this year or is it still the sameas previous years?
TScybermaster98
post Apr 8 2014, 10:26 AM

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QUOTE(MishimaZ @ Apr 8 2014, 10:21 AM)
Only know from a valuer friend of mine that she is so much free now.]
Hmm...not good i guess. Which area does she specialise in?
TScybermaster98
post Apr 8 2014, 11:23 AM

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QUOTE(cfa28 @ Apr 8 2014, 10:50 AM)
I don't think that Banks are getting less applications but perhaps Banks are rejecting more applications.

I was at the Tropicana Heights Launching.  Was told that all the intermediate Units were sold out during the Launch but since I registered, 1-week later, I received an e-mail to say that 4-units released cos Loan rejected.

Few weeks later,  Tropicana did a showcase of all their properties and said that 15-more units released cos of loan rejected.  Just last week, a friend of mine inquired and was told another 5-units released so all in all, about 24 units released cos of loan rejected.
Yes i tend to agree with you. Banks have been getting more stringent with their loan approvals from early 2013 already. Also heard valuations for subsales are lower than before? Any confirmation?
TScybermaster98
post Apr 8 2014, 11:31 AM

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http://www.businesscircle.com.my/the-impac...igh-speed-rail/

TScybermaster98
post Apr 10 2014, 09:47 AM

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This will be my final reminder. To those who insist on flaming each other, you will be reported. If you have issues with each other then please take them to PM or another thread. This thread was thrashed before and i wont allow it to happen again. Please respect the topic of the thread and others here who wish to gain some valuable insight on the property market. If you have something related to the topic then please share it, If not please refrain from commenting. I dont want 100 pages of flaming rubbish. Dont turn this thread into some crap market place.
TScybermaster98
post Apr 11 2014, 08:50 AM

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Is something happening in Bukit Jalil, the area nearest to Kesas coming from OUG? From all the development thats taking place or will take place there, is there some master plan in the making?

Berjaya is heavily invested there through a number of their high end condos near the golf course. Gov has located 2 new LRT stations here. Plus Paradigm 2, Pavillion 2 & Jusco shopping malls are due to begin construction end 2014-2015.

Anybody with any view?
TScybermaster98
post Apr 11 2014, 09:42 AM

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QUOTE(icemanfx @ Apr 11 2014, 09:37 AM)
Only people with vested interest and rarely travel outside claim things in Malaysia are more affordable.
Exactly. Anybody who has spent some time overseas would know that Malaysia is actually quite an expensive place to live in when you take in the income to spending ratio into consideration. But you gotta thank the Gov for that. Their brainwashing and indoctrination over the years has worked quite well especially with the Gov servants.
TScybermaster98
post Apr 11 2014, 10:30 AM

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QUOTE(MishimaZ @ Apr 11 2014, 09:56 AM)
I will have to agree too. Tapi takpe lah, syukur negara kita aman dan makmur dan masih murah petrol dan rumahnya dari negara jiran. Hehehehehehe....
Sorry i dont quite agree about the fuel.

In Germany, all their fuel will be Euro 6 standard effective 2014 while Malaysia is still stuck with low quality Euro 2 standard fuel which has a much higher sulphur & carbon content which is really bad for health.

But Germans pay about E$ 1.587 per litre for RON98 petrol while Malaysians pay RM 2.10 per litre for RON95 Euro 2 petrol.

If ure living in Germany and earning E$ 5,000 per month, don’t you think it be cheaper to pay E$ 1.587 for RON 98 Euro 6 petrol compared to a Malaysian earning RM5K per month and paying RM 2.10 for RON95 Euro 2 fuel?

TScybermaster98
post Apr 11 2014, 11:54 AM

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QUOTE(kochin @ Apr 11 2014, 10:47 AM)
found a good site after your post.

http://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/compa...ntry2=Australia

important to note, to do a fair comparison, may i suggest taking the ratio of average monthly disposable salary (in this example is 293%) and compared back against the table.

anything higher than 293%, indeed the other country is more expensive, anything lower, it's cheaper (due to currency exchange factor).

and i'm guessing, chances are, rent per month or buy apartment price section of most countries would consistently yield other countries % higher than ours.
so far india and indonesia yields different results.
Yes i think this table is inaccurate because it does a currency conversion. I still dont understand why ppl still insist on doing currency conversions when comparing cost of living with another country.
TScybermaster98
post Apr 11 2014, 11:55 AM

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QUOTE(Flybirdtalkbird @ Apr 11 2014, 10:45 AM)
To get RM5k job, you need to be at least at manager position. How about Germany?
Not sure i agree with this. RM5K must be an Manager level? Even normal engineers with 3-4 yrs experience earn this much.
TScybermaster98
post Apr 11 2014, 02:45 PM

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QUOTE(Flybirdtalkbird @ Apr 11 2014, 12:24 PM)
then how much a 3-4 years exp eng earn in Germany? you compare 1 side but hide the other side, its call fair?
U on drugs or something? Nobody is talking bout Germany here la. I just havent heard of managers with RM5K salary. I only became a manager after i crossed the 16K mark myself.
TScybermaster98
post Apr 14 2014, 11:00 AM

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Is it possible for a credit check to be done on someone with just the person's IC and name?
TScybermaster98
post Apr 15 2014, 08:27 AM

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I think it would be good to find out the actual transacted subsale prices of condos which got VP from 2013. Does anybody have any info?
TScybermaster98
post Apr 15 2014, 08:54 AM

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QUOTE(gspirit01 @ Apr 15 2014, 08:51 AM)
One condo (high end) i m tracking drops a small amount in terms of psf and total price.
Do provide name and actual price, psf
TScybermaster98
post Apr 15 2014, 08:59 AM

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QUOTE(bcpbeancounter @ Apr 15 2014, 08:57 AM)
I had a condo vp aug 2013. Bought at 400k. Sold after vp at 650k. Now still agent call me for 730k. Not sure how true the call from agent as some said this is thier dirty tactic.
Can we have the condo name, size of unit, price? General info doesnt help.

I know for sure that Kiara Residence 1, Bukit Jalil just got VP and current subsale transacted prices are around RM525psf for a 1050sf unit. The launch prices were about RM350psf.
TScybermaster98
post Apr 15 2014, 09:17 AM

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QUOTE(gspirit01 @ Apr 15 2014, 09:07 AM)
I think giving name and locations might b a bit sensitive.
Why should it be sensitive? Are you revealing info which is considered secret? Is it untrue? If not then whats there to fear or be worried about? Last i checked, sale prices of a VP condo are NOT secret or sensitive.
TScybermaster98
post Apr 15 2014, 10:13 AM

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QUOTE(bcpbeancounter @ Apr 15 2014, 10:10 AM)
okok...here you go. G residence at Kuchai lama. 1168sqf.
So bought at 342psf and sold for 556psf in Aug 2013.

This post has been edited by cybermaster98: Apr 15 2014, 10:15 AM

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