Thanks seantang and St. Petersburg.

With the previous ruling, PR with overseas properties and HDB can't move to another HDB. They can only buy private and move out from HDB for good.

The papers reported about 45k PR own HDB in SG and only 1200 of them have another private properties in SG. IMO these ruling affecting PR is not really aim to cool the market as the number are small. This look more like candy for the comming punggol by election.

Majority of those who own both HDB and private are not PR. Rich Singaporean will be richer.

For those who are considering PR application for yourself of your child, better think twice. Considering all the restriction for PR, CPF and the NS duty, it is getting "cheaper" to be permit/pass holder than a PR who always get the blame.

Rich overseas speculator can keep buying the private housing here. These measure is "peanuts" to them.

On the HDB, these rules does help Singaporean to own their home at affortable price.

You still can top-up your CPF account (to earn the 4% interest while you save enough to buy a HDB). If both couple are PR then you can split the downpayment to two CPF account.

Under Public Scheme, there is no income limit to purchase a resale flat. You still can try to buy your first house (HDB) at "resonable" price before the GOV take further action on the income limit.
http://www.hdb.gov.sg/fi10/fi10321p.nsf/w/...latPublicScheme

Agree that GOV plan for luxury project such as Sentosa Cove, the Sail to cater the rich investor. They also look after their people in buying their HDB.

one need strong discipline to save up and spend within means when it come to housing.

say a PR to buy a small 3rm HDB for start, (ref: ~$300k Yishun, ~$350k bukit Panjang)
Total Price: $330k
Down payment (20%): $66k
First part of down payment (5%)Cash: $16.5k
Second part of down payment (15%)CPF: $49.5k
Stamp Duty (7%)Cash: $23.1k
Legal Fees (by Cash or factor in bank Loan): Approx $3k

Total Amount Needed to Pay in Cash: $16.5k + $23.1k + $3k = $42.6k

assumed 3k starting salary, work for 3 years with some increment/promotion and has the following saving target after 3 years = $40k cash ( 10k first year + 14k + 16k). Couple will be $80k cash

2 persons * 36 months * 23% of 3k fix (CPF OR account rate) = 2* $24,840 = $49,680 CPF

Now let’s look at non PR pass holder (assumed he will get PR 3 years latter)
The main different is the 16% CPF contribution from employer. If the PR have work and save hard for 3 years, the Foreigner will need to do the same for 3.5 year to achieve the same goal. Actual figure is even lesser when you consider the CPF allocation rate.

CPF contribution for 35yo and below is 36% (20% self + 16% company). 23% goes to OR (Ordinary) account which you can use for HDB purchase and the rest go to Special account and Medisave account. While PR contribute 20% of their pay for CPF, the foreigner just have to save extra 23% on top of his cash saving goal.

Currently, it is not easy but the dream of starting a young family is still achievable for PR.

Very soon GOV will lower the entry for Single Singaporean buying HDB. Other than many rich old single who have not buy their first HDB, some cash rich parent will help their young single child to “chop” a HDB and use it (or the parent house) as rental unit. Will price dorp? Good luck.

This post has been edited by r1v3r: Jan 15 2013, 03:28 PM

I did look at past 4 months HDB data, Yishun 3rm is below 300k so I put 330 as target price to factor in the rest. If you can save more, then you can chose more location else pick the cheapest of all.

Reno, is it a must to spend a big fornute on it for the house warming party or can you do it step by step as you have more cash in hand? It is individual choise.

legal Fee: I did state cash or bank loan. Also include the legal fee as part of the cash amount.

I had explain one possible way to settle the housing problem here. You may freely give your solution if any.

Our combine pay was 5k after working for some years, then we start our family in our 20s. We ask our agent to look for a unit wihtin 30min bus ride from our workplace and filter off all "premium" such as high floor, 5 min walks to kopitiam, MRT,Market,Top school etc. We are willing to walk/cycle another 15 mins to save paying the premium. We were young and we are more willing to take harpship as compare to sanwich-class.

We took our own sweet time to view almost every corner around our workplace. If the agent try to paster us to confirm the deal within 3 viewing, we just replace the agent as they are not acting with our interest in mind. We look for a unit with decent move in condition(some renovation) and it MUST be lift level plus untility room. This is to avoid a heafty penalty for PR when your block is selected for upgrading. We were young, our expectation is not as high so we DIY the painting, plumbing etc. I dont recall we were "miserable", we are happy to receive our first born 2 years later.


Agent fee is 1% and my unit also under 300k. We were lucky to have a motherly agent who helps us alot, we gave her a big ang pow ontop of her agent fees.

We have very little cash when we move in, but recoup fast due to the fact that all our subsequence monthly installment (~$800, $400 each) were deducted from our CPF. We end up with more cash flow every month after we move in.

Do I feel miserable or disturbing looking at our $800 CPF deduction as compare to many people who pay over 2k cash for renting similar housing for the next 20 over years?

My points for housing in SG:
1) Start young when you still can take hardship and have lower expectation.

2) Rental is a big killer if you are paying it.

3) when you earn more, you will have the option of selling your small unit (which has better yield in market price) to buy a bigger unit.

4) Unless you are high earner, if you are PR and you dont use the CPF for HDB, you are not taking the advantage you have. factoring your monthly rental, the 4% CPF rate and the current market price on your HDB.

I didn't mislead anyone.

I am not sure about you. I came to SG due to the "PUSH" factor.

Is it any better to work in MY?
We can still live moderaly with financial freedom when we move back. I don't see a better chance of doing so for current fresh grad in MY.



This post has been edited by r1v3r: Jan 16 2013, 11:37 AM

many place like McD have wifi. Bring your charger and Wifi device.

5%? take short term loan from relative and pay them monthly installment with interest slighly higher than their FD.

Some credit card now offer you low % credit loan for 6 months before higher rate kick in. You can take it at your own risk.

Just dont try your luck in sentosa. AND MBS and other gambling places.

This post has been edited by r1v3r: Jan 16 2013, 03:26 PM

What do you suggest for a young Malaysian who get offer in SG?

What is your housing solution for those of us who work here and still renting?

There is cost for PR, you balance it by using your CPF starting at young age to pay off your housing and protect you from rental speculation. Better to let your CPF money work for you now before the gov introduce more CPF rulling.

When your wife is expecting and your kids are young, they need a secure and permanent home. If the couple work in SG, they either leave their kids in Malaysia (a very painful endurance) or do their best to buy a housing here. They have to do this while the wife is still young if they want kids. You can wait longer to buy a condo as your first house but the biological clock wait for no one.

Way before this, it is common that one of the parents converted to SG (their child is SG) to get better access to branded school. Then, more couples around me had converted ever since the the Umno Kris speach, SG baby bonus, SG primary school entry retriction, rounds of housing measure. Another couple just indicate he had queue up for the form for convertion right after this recent round of HDB rulling.

There are also people who are not moved at all. There is no way you can stop people to convert while MY gov still sleeping. Is it better to move to AUS or NZ?

I wrote all these comment for those who are still young and plan to have kids because I saw some couples had gone through the career climb and they have a few proproties but they try in vein to add some noice and fun in the house by having their own child. As many of us focus closely on our career, it is easy to miss the right timing to start family planing from young age.

Gelang Patah? Bus from jurong east.

Can state total annual package for your MY jobs and the SG offer? Salary is not the only income.

So you are married, will you come alone or your wife will work in SG too. I will look at combined income if both move to sg. Else you really have to think hard is it worth it to stay apart from your wife.

Even if your wife is in JB, your daily custom crossing will cost you family time and money.

This post has been edited by r1v3r: Jan 17 2013, 11:40 PM

It is hard but I am puzzled too. Two of my Malaysian couple friends got their 4rm for 400~500k range in the past 2 years, to me they are cash rich people.

I am more worry for the coming rulling regarding single singaporean scheme. These new group of buyer will create a huge demand. I hope more of these unit will be sublet eventually and the competition will lower the rental for awhile.

Save up while renting a smaller room, "suffer" for the first few years before you unlocked yourself with your own unit/condo.

I am clear than I came to SG for education and work. I still want to retire at places like Ipoh, Melaka or other small quite town in Malaysia with low profile. I dont think I will get "mental freedom" if I were to retire in SG. Do you still want COE/EPR problem when you retired? When I am old, I will make sure I own the mean to move around freely at will simply because I am not as fit to cramp into bus and MRT. I will drive slower too, too many Turbo Charge car drive by young people around me will not be a pleasant daily experience.

If it is due to $$, I wount convert. You just need to think of how to solve the housing problem with financial solution, not by changing passport. Set the Priority right for the following item: House, car, port folio, family, DSLR, Vacation, Bags, Watches etc you will find saving money is not that difficult.

I am not high income people and I have kids. I just hope I can work till 60+ with a humane jobs.

I spend alot on family matter so I hope to save more after 50.

My goal is to master a particular nich skill in my line of work then set up a small company when I retire in MY. I will pick client by looking at their face. That will help me to kill time and earn some pocket money. when no client then surf Lowyat lor.

I saved 35% of my first pay (some as force saving insurance) since my first jobs. I live with what ever I have. Once you get used to it as salary increase your % of saving can remain the same or more but your quality of live become better. Thats what I mean suffer for the beginning and things will get better.

How long does it take? Yesterday paper reported 4 out of 10 young couple asked their parents for helps to buy their first house, it features a 23 +27 yo couple buying a 5rm flat with their saving of just 15k, his dad force out 144000 for them. If we think like this young singaporean, you are right that we need to save for decades and we not even sure you still can afford a 5rm at the end of it.

My calculation (for PR path) is based on the smallest, cheapest 3rm flat in SG as staring point for young average couple. ~300k unit. Say in total you need 30% cash of the 300k which is 90k. two person share so it is 45k/person. Even if you can only save 9k a year ($750/m) thats only 5 years to save up. The fresh grad still can own a flat and start family planing before 30yo.

For non PR, they can only buy private condo/apartment. Say 800k small unit, 30%cash is 240k . If the couple can save 5k/m then it takes 4 years else will be longer.

I try to bring my kids back every month so that they are used to the other family members and the Malaysian living standard.

Invest in Johor then vote in Johor?

My kids all born in SG. I will keep their option open and they will decide when they grow up. I just want them to be together before they have their own family.

Friendships with local can't be bad right? Unless you never spend quality time with your kids since young, else they pick up from their family members more than their teacher and freinds at school. Lingo and school are just small part of it. Upbringing is right at home.

Kids have to learn useful stuff, I don't think learning math and science in BM will do any good. I prefer to retire in MY but kids should freely go to any place that provide the best oppurtunity to them. They have to decide which IC they want to keep by then.

MY education is not the worst yet and SG is not the best. That's not the point. The question is which is better for your kids.

On languages, you need the environment to master one particular language and my priority is english. Many good SG student learn foreign language as their 3rd Language in school.

I dont recall there was a class to teach you soft skills in MY class room. Rather it is the environment and interaction with people that horn your soft skills. In Malaysia, you have at least 3 races in a class, while in SG you have at least 3 nationalies in class. Both student will mingle with different type of people thus gaining different type of skills.

There are really good students with good character here, I am not worried.

If kids are very smart or above average type can benefit more if they study in SG else it is better to study in AUS or MY as the SG system was not design for below average student but things are improving. The most important things for below average kids are self confident and self esteem , hard to get that if they compete in SG school.

Forget it.

If your son is PR and you are just ordinary person you have almost 0% for phase 2 registration. One of the school above is just 300m away from my unit and we dont even bother to try as we know thery will not have enough place for all SG kids before they consider PR's application. In a way, it is also better to enrol kids in other school as there will be less KS style people. Let the good school takes all SG for a few years then we see how the school perform. For this year, I see more foreign kids enter neighbourhood school. My kids will have to compete with China kids in Chinese lesson and Ang Mo kids in English lesson.


Chances are you hope your son will do well in other school then apply for transfer a few years later. Still, PSLE will provide equal ground for all kids to enter good secondary school.

other than suryer from private company, take a look at the followingGov Data.

Must have vision to progress. This pay should be a short term income while you horn your skill to move up, else gain your skills and exp in MY before coming to SG with a higher starting pay. The key is which side offer your better opportunity to grow.

Fresh Accountant, I think you will work long hours, Eat take away food in office, sleep long hours during weekend etc. So not much time for shopping and dining, should be able to save some money with that salary. I am not in finance, just my observation of my accountant friends.