i use lubegard platinum (rm98 lol) along with Q8 semi synthetic ATF for my proton iswara 3 speed auto, and after the first time, i will definitely stick to it for the rest of the car's lifetime

the total cost is almost rm300 every ATF replacement (20k km or 6 months for my case) and yes, it is very expensive compared to most products out there (eg: the famous toyota ATF only cost ~rm100 or so per application, although many fakes these days so steered away from that too) however imho it is worth the money spent because gear shifting is so god damn smooth and fast.

not to mention, its been the 2nd or 3rd time i've replaced my ATF fluid, and everytime the old ones drain out, it is almost like new (fluid isn't watery or super thick, basically no signs of degradation/oxidization ) which prompts me to consider extending the intervals to 1 year or 40k km. i mean, another claim of lubegard is extending the ATF's lifespan too, right? ROFL

tldr: expensive, however its worth the money spent if you're willing to fork out

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Added on July 14, 2012, 10:13 pm
btw, izso as in the forumer?

This post has been edited by Quazacolt: Jul 14 2012, 10:13 PM

ATF additive/supplement

i dont think suitable for all vehicle, only suitable for automatic transmission with dextron specifications.

that said, it should be suitable for perdana v6 auto transmission

hmm the workshop i goto only have the red ATF protect and platinum (and the yellow gear oil which i assume for MT's), don't have the black one

what's the major differences anyway?
i thought platinum would be the "be all end all" solution?

i agree with your pointers.

although personally, im on the fence with this. i believe it if it works, disbelieve if it doesn't sorta deal.
and since it works for me, i guess you can call me a believer for lubegard, not so much for other products of the same function i suppose until it is proven to me otherwise

reason being coming from an engine oil point of view, base oil itself won't last as long as what reputable brand/expensive engine oil can. the additives is what prolong the oil's life, prevent it from degradation from carbon/other waste deposits from combustion, and of course enhances its functionality be it less friction, or even better and/or consistent oil viscosity etc

in contrast to ATF additives/oil in line to what i've said earlier, i am a believer of liqui moly and torco semi synthetic oils. the difference is just so huge compared to a "reputable brand" mineral oil (or even semi- synthetics)such as shell, hi-rev and so on.
Granted, those oil are so much cheaper, imo it is a good example of what you pay is what you get

perhaps my wording on "degradation prevention" is of exaggeration. however one thing that is certain is that with the additives, engine oil degradation is slowed down. would that be more acceptable then?


btw this link could give some insight on why a lot of "boutique brand" engine oils are not API certified: http://www.carbibles.com/engineoil_bible_amsoilFAQ.html
as compared to almost all mainstreamed engine oils that are.

and on the same page, if one decides to take the leap of faith, you can immediately discover that despite being API certified, the performance of mainstream engine oil is just sub par compared to the more performing (albeit more expensive) un-certified non mainstream engine oil

info on groups:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_oil
(so yeah group 4 = PAO, 5 are anything that arent covered in 1-4 and ester are the popular base stock for 5)

so from torco's specs (well they aren't certified, so if you don't believe their claims that is fine lol):

SR-1
http://www.torcousa.com/technology/TDS_SR-1%20RacingOil.pdf
group 3
http://www.torcousa.com/technology/TDS_SR-1%20MotorOil.pdf
didnt seem to specify

http://www.torcousa.com/technology/SR-5.pdf
group 4/5 so should be ester based.

the one i used (TR-5, only used/using for the sentra, and my own car once during the track day lol):
http://www.torcousa.com/technology/TR-1.pdf
unspecified, however with

should be group 3 based

still, a bit surprised you used tinting as an example.
merely because our scenario here is exactly like tints, except engine oil has certification bodies, while tints does not. can anyone certify whatever v-kool is claiming? what about other brands?

that's kinda the case with torco (or even liqui moly) is suppose

personally, i dont think lubegard is magic in a bottle thats able to fix mechanical failure. at best it only lessens its affects.

im using it more towards PREVENTION of mechanical failures, and more towards the smoothness and responsiveness of gear shifts be it in the wee morning cold starts, or midnight drives or even very hot afternoon.

i am pretty sure when i (or we) am talking about mainstream, i am referring towards shell/castrol/petronas etc.

the brands like amsoil/redline/motul/lucas you have mentioned are all considered boutique/non-mainstream brand, in which their price clearly reflects btw

And if you've bothered checking out my links earlier (carbibles.com btw, or you can even look up bobistheoilguy forums) you will see that not all amsoil products, especially their top of the line/flagship are API certified, and they have even put out fake certifications

slight note of bobistheoilguy btw: they have many "science/chemist" guys (lol!) that does UOA and results/feedback from torco has been pretty good mind you. else i wouldn't bother pouring something un certified with similar/same concerns as you are having

i mainly use liqui moly and only used torco for my car for that one time track day OCI. if you didn't know, liqui moly is API SL / ACEA certified. so isn't that good enough? or what other kinda certification you're looking at?

atm i am considering changing to liqui moly for the nissan sentra because my mother is the main driver of it and she doesn't high rev/drive fast much, which kinda make torco pointless to be honest. might as well have the extra protection/engine quietness that liqui moly provides.

for my own info's sake though, what kinda certification v kool has? the one they give you when you buy their elite/high end product? or the one from jpj? please elaborate


and lol surprised to see you mentioning track
however my reasons or even justifications as you may call it stands, think logically: why are we buying better engine oil? is it because it offers better protection and provides a smoother engine?

it's pretty much the same deal with lubegard.
the exact same things you said can also be applied to engine oil, why waste money on better engine oil for prevention? why not just change your oil at tighter interval? (4k km? 3k? or even 2k km? from my experience, shell lasts 2.5-4k km) That guarantees engine smoothness and cleanliness too. no point to buy more expensive oils right?

its just the same concept/logic. time to time i'll rev my car to red line just for the sheer fun/exhilaration of it, i don't think having more frequent OCI (be it engine oil/gear oil) would help much. and as i mentioned on my previous post, the gear engagement of my gearbox with and without lubegard is pretty obvious. it could be because of my very old gear box, or its because of my driving style having higher revs on gear shifts, i wouldn't know. however the differences is there, and i'd like to keep it.

hell, even lubegard's own statement claims a 50% increase in gear response which is 0.4 sec to 0.2 sec (lol minor almost unnoticeable difference, but it IS 50% LOL!) which may or may not be true, however for my case, it is even bigger difference especially on cold start putting my very first D or R engage after engine crank.

=edit=
and yes, while i've only been a lubegard user for maybe 1-2 years, definitely not going strong like your 8 years record. 1-2 years without any gearbox issue on my old 3 speed auto proton tranny thats been to track day once downshifting/1-2 speed gear limitation at 5-7k rpm... can consider *a bit* credible, right?

of course, like you said, at the end of the day, my money, my choice. and that's that la.
however we always can have healthy debates (hopefully not arguments) for knowledge sharing right?

This post has been edited by Quazacolt: Jul 17 2012, 08:37 PM

good la then, always welcome a healthy debate/discussion

and i'm giving him the benefit of the doubt and presuming that he is not referring to JPJ hence requested that he clarify/elaborate that to us

This post has been edited by Quazacolt: Jul 18 2012, 05:06 PM

personally, i recommend to flush and/or replace tranny filter FIRST.

if problem still persist, THEN opt to try out lubegard
then you'll know for sure if it really works or not

lol you mentioned you didnt flush hence my recommendation. what about gear box filter though? age of car/tranny?

that said however, if you've flushed 2x in the past and still disappointed in your tranny, then yeah by all means go for it.
for my case i buy/apply lubegard at the workshop near my house, at taman intan baiduri/selayang jaya (near FRIM forest reserve), shop name is torque legend (lol)
googlemap: https://maps.google.com/maps?q=Torque+Legen...ia&z=16&iwloc=A

never said they produced bad oils. but yea, marketing decisions/issues, and/or cost saving etc. it happens to even the highest profile companies/corporations and i guess amsoil isn't excluded.

for ATF fluid, i would recommend your manufacturer's OEM, and/or main stream semi/full synthetic ATF fluid, and if you're not satisfied enough, then can try out lubegard

of course, do proper flushing and/or even replacement of auto tranny filter (usually also involve gasket replacement too, at least for my auto tranny) for accurate/proper results especially for comparisons with/without lubegard

=edit=
aiks edit on typo (didn't removed)

This post has been edited by Quazacolt: Jul 19 2012, 12:23 PM

if amsoil replied recommending against mixing their oil with ceratec, perhaps its best to follow.

can consider other engine oil that is compatible (can confirm via email like you've did, or maybe go with liqui moly as ceratec AFAIK has no compatibility issues with their own engine oil)

personally id recommend sticking to OEM/main stream semi/full synthetic ATF fluids, then add in lubegard additives to protect/enhance the original ATF fluid, so you won't stray too far from manufacturer's specifications as components within ATF tranny are quite sensitive. repairs if shit goes wrong due to wrong application is a hefty price too

personally lubegard atf protection (red one) is a more universal application, while platinum is a better version of it. elton recommended black (HFM, high friction modifier IINM) that's more suitable for japanese/local cars, which is also cheaper than platinum. problem is, can't find anyone that sells black

well for the 7-8+ years or so on ownership of my proton iswara, i believe i've only done flushing maybe 2-3 times? filter replace (including gasket) maybe once, or twice max.

i am only recommending this method because after performing it, you may not even need lubegard which would be nice saving some money, no? if you still feel not satisfied, or just curious on trying out the product, it also serves as a better bench marking as your tranny is confirmed to be clean, and you can understand further on the differences before/after lubegard in a more accurate fashion, then better decide if you still need it or not in the future

as for oil change, every 20k km, or 6 months. however as i have mentioned in this thread, i am seriously considering 40k km or 1 year. because the oil comes out damn clean on previous 1-2 oil changes most likely thanks to lubegard as previously i have never encountered such cases of clean tranny oil lol.

and there was no performance drop (or increase after tranny oil change) prior to tranny oil change at around 20k km, which means the oils and its additives (namely lubegard) maintains its properties and what not well, which should warrant a longer OCI

heh both manufacturers playing it safe/wanting to earn money
use your own judgement/decision then lol

and i've posted few posts ago on where i get my lubegard

personally i dont think it even last beyond 30-40k km haha. my engine isn't as "orangey" as it was when i first put in ceratec 10-15k km ago lol

LM is grey/black ish, ceratec on the other hand, ceramic based additive/compound, yeah orange lol

i can't wait for a proper comparison/UOA

so what are your test cases and pre/post tests? it's going to be a looooooooooonnnnnnnnnnnngggg 1-2 years timespan to test out 2 products + a pre test without neither TBH

then gasket+filter set and flushing every conclusion to make results accurate.

then of course a UOA sponsor heh.

hey depending on the total cost etc, i think i may be able to help out (maybe few people chipping in etc) for the sake of SCIENCE!

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Added on July 23, 2012, 12:21 amFUH straight away do all these 3 things. how much you got quoted for the Q8 and lubegard (including service charge) and where you got it done?

also you got notice the Q8 fluid color? is it red? i wonder if mine is using the exact fluid. my workshop dude just told me it is Q8 semi syn oil without the model/product detail, somemore its taken out from a bigger drum and not individual bottles to save cost

so far so good though, things are a ton smoother as i've tried that Q8 semi syn oil without lubegard, still smoother than shitty "highly appraised (by workshops at least)" toyota ATF lol. then got poisoned to try lubegard and lol even smoother and oil during oil drain is much cleaner compared to without.

This post has been edited by Quazacolt: Jul 23 2012, 12:25 AM

that's the exact bottle when i requested them to show me a bottled version so i can check out the labels/product description way back then.

albeit it did not come with the marker pen "Q8 unitrans JK". just a "blank" Q8 bottle
per bottle should be a liter i assume? if yes then yeah pricing is about the same that i've gotten for my place.

i dont know la, however from the way how smooth my auto shifts are, i am not even sure if one even needs an ATF cooler after you're on good semi syn (the product sheet says synthetic from Q8 site, however my workshop foreman says its semi synthetic only) AND lubegard platinum.

the main reason why one gets an ATF cooler is to cooldown ATF temperature because the higher temperature it goes for the ATF, the viscosity may change and may be off your tranny specifications or at least very near off which may not offer enough protection.

i've never experienced jerks/delays in shifts ever since i'm on Q8 and eventually lubegard, and that totally killed my thoughts of getting an ATF cooler since i probably don't need one.

Alas the above claims are from non-scientific claims/feels/experience, which may or may not be accurate as opposed to having a proper thermostat/device to check your actual ATF temperature/viscosity.
however one thing to note, MAJORITY of stock vehicles DOES NOT have ATF coolers installed in their car, so *maybe* it really isn't needed

haha i was introduced to torco ATF too. price was
and i thought, proton 3 speeder auto only dei, no need so pamper it right? LOL

well if you're not having jerks/delays you didn't really need lubegard right? hows the "feel good factor" going? better shifts? less 0.2 sec that you probably didn't feel? lol

hmm maybe can look into that coolant. reviews from where?