Hi bro, I found the deal at Facebook Marketplace.
He is actually a normal car workshop in PJS 1, Old Klang Road, selling Recond (refurbished) battery but refurbished by another company. So I traded my old Incoe which I traded in, presumably will be also refurbished.

Not that I wanted Amaron but because this is the only he have that suits my car.



BTw I found another one doing refurbished battery. Based in Melaka but claimed can serve nationwide.

Hi bro, let me share with you something I found. I *think* this is how batteries *may* be refurbished in Malaysia.
In summary they are replacing the battery plates & battery acid inside. Only the battery casing is reused.

Do note that these video are from Pakistan. Knowing Pakistan has less regards for safety.


https://youtu.be/i0n9S2v22F4

Found this thread while trying to search about incoe batteries, i can say they aren't cheap annoyingly. More annoyingly are lack of spec as well.
When i bought my car 2nd hand, it was sitting on the lot for 6 months and it had a much better bigger panasonic battery, but dealer replaced it with incoe, then after the battery moved and shorted against the hood, mechanic also replaced it with the same battery. However mine is transparent and from the looks of it seems like it has a lot of life. Its also the wet kind.

I can see the individual plates but surprisingly even when my alternator went out, it had plenty of power that i didn't notice it until the battery indicator flashed and the car was acting sluggish.

From what i can say, its not a high capacity battery despite being along the size of NS60 by looking at the size of the plates, and the amount of battery fluids it has, however the thickness of the plates lead me to think that the battery has a lot of life.

The 2 things that kill a lead acid battery (irregardless of type) are the plates dissolving away, and crystalisation. Crystals can be removed using a lead acid repair charger (i have one), which blasts the battery with 24V pulses. If your battery is dead, but the plates look to be in good condition, or if its not cranking fully, this can help. As long as you don't pour out the insides you should be good for a long time. thick battery plates actually are good for higher drain batteries (how much you can drain a battery before you permanently damage it).

The other thing recondition batteries are only worth it if they cost half the price. This is because the reconditioning process involves replacing the internal fluids entirely, using a special chemical, and reapplying charge to rebuild the lead and also the fluids (acids) as well. So a reconditioned battery is only between 50-80% as good as a new battery.

In the US, new batteries are made from old batteries for lead acid. Everything from the casing to the lead, its a dangerous and toxic process that doesn't involve people, rather people control machines for it. The process used here makes an entirely new battery from the old materials, meaning pure lead plates, pure electrolytes, etc. Compared with reconditioning which i'll admit is something you should do for the environment, should not cost close to new. For instance my mum's honda city, changing with another dry century battery was rm 180 including trade in for NS40L. I should've gone with wet though knowing what i do now as for rm 20 less, battery water for the entire life of the battery will be like rm 5, and if you have a used car like i do, you can do the checks at the same time with monthly refills. The issue is just parking to be able to do regular checks safely without worry of being hit on the road (heavy vehicle drivers are more likely to hit and injure you than cars). I'd change my own oil if i had access to flat ground in a safe covered area.

Before you replace battery fluids, always make sure the battery is fully charged. Before you try to repair a battery by refilling it, blast it with 24V first to reverse the crystalisation. When a battery is below 100% capacity, it forms hydrogen gases which if you open the cap will escape. Batter water is pure H20, but it may not replace the gases that escape, this is why you should always make sure the battery is fully charged before adding fluids, as when the battery is close to empty, it may seem to lack fluids, but when it is full the fluids will form back.

I tried to repair a generic AGM battery. It didnt go well since at least 2 cells were shorted together so i couldn't get it above 8V.

In a lead acid battery, i think 10.6V is the cut off before damage is done. I don't have enough batteries to try and repair so if anyone has dead lead acid batteries, feel free to give me to try. The only battery you cannot repair is gel, which are not used for cars. Sealed batteries for cars are AGM, as the price is cheap and gel cannot provide the required cranking amps. Gel is even more sealed than sealed AGM batteries.

However i do not recondition batteries, i simply use a special charger and add fluids to restore it rather than drain out anything. It won't restore fully but as long as its usable for UPS or as an emergency use to start the car then thats enough. Reconditioning goes as far as to empty the contents of the battery, clean the insides, reinsert metals if you took them out (usually not needed), add new chemicals, and performing the charging needed to prime them.

Currently i've got a design for a salt water battery that i will put together and try out later, as most of the materials will be reused instead, only thing i'd have to buy new is a terminal metal, but i'm gonna need to double check the voltage separation between the metals since i want the salt to be the defining voltage not the metals as this will allow the battery to be rechargeable and last a long time. I also need to figure out a suitable filter, DIYs recommend paper but paper does not last long in water, same for things like wood. Plastic is good but finding suitable plastic is hard but the initial testing will just be open testing so no filter in between and far distance between terminals. Hopefully this'll work well to get a lot of battery storage by reusing and thus saving the environment, not to mention a suitable use for cars so you can not only sit in traffic without the engine and power everything, but this is far more robust for deep drain batteries unlike lead acid.

datacenters use mid cycle AGM lead acid batteries as they have a requirement for dry stuff, so salt water batteries will never work there. Lead acid batteries work well for UPS and cars because they like to be charged and rarely discharged.

I dont have enough years to tell how long a battery last. All i can say is that most brands on the market that have names last 2+ years for modern cars for AGM. incoe seems interesting due to the transparency so you can inspect the battery yourself and see if its well made. All i can say is that the thicker the plates, the longer the battery will last, so its not impossible to have a single battery last 8 years if the plates are thick and you repair the battery against crystalisation every year or 2 aside from adding fluids every month.

1) about 10 years old. Was used for battery backup for alarm. restored up to 8V meaning that some cells were shorted. Inside was already corroded.
2) around damansara/PJ area, not far from MRT.
3) the jumper battery only needs CCA or cold cranking amps, the ability to supply loads of amps initially. Hence actual capacity doesn't matter. Car's battery must run the electricals for a set amount of time in the event of an alternator failure or act as a capacitor for the times when the alternator can't fully supply all the amps. This is why LED headlamps and brakelights make a whole lot of difference if you sit at night idle with the lights on. I myself have a powerbank jumper but a 50% usable capacity is still decent for backup power. So a repaired lead acid battery may not be suited for a car if it was brought to life from dead.
4) theres plenty, some use a couple of chemicals to add in, i prefer the simpler one that uses battery water + special charger. Some do an entire battery disassembly, clean and add chemicals.
5) I'm doing this for fun, yes i have a design, i'm about to purchase the missing parts needed to test. Its not table salt though as those are not rechargeable. I'm actually a CS guy rather than a chemist or an inventory but i am pissed at the industry taking a bad turn in software and devops. Later on if you read my blog you will understand my hate towards certain languages and frameworks.
6)The thicker the plates the longer they last, because the plates slowly dissolve away. The capacity is determined by the amount of usable metal in the reaction and the electrolytic amount. Its all about being able to store those ions, hence some idiot i read a useful technical article about thinks that lithium is the only high density metal around you can use, but that is simply not true. My design would theoratically do 4V per cell based on the unpure anode (most scientists only go from pure material lists when figuring out voltage and design, but mixed materials can actually produce even more volts or charge). Whenever sulphur or similar is involved, crystalisation can form on the plates which can also "end" their life. pulsing can decrystalise and break the crystal away. The reason why you need a high voltage for that is that the crystals are the electrolyte which actually have a much higher voltage range apart (in a table salt water, this will be sodium on one end, chlorine on the other). However high voltages on any water based electrolyte including lead acid batteries (the acid have water, hence battery water being pure h2o) do electrolyse into gas in high voltage. This its difficult to repair a battery where the plates have dissolved, but you can decrystalise a battery battery easily. Some i've seen show crystalisation on their custom batteries at 0V, like with aluminium where you can physically see the crystals in their transparent plastic packs.
7) long ago back when cars only used the battery to start and barely had any electrics, the life of a typical wet lead acid battery was 6 years. This was before we even knew about the decrystalisation process either, and the metal plates used were also thicker. So with a yearly decrystalisation (repair) charge and maintenance, including good practices, it is possible. Double check the specs of the battery in your friend's car that it is AGM. if it is located in the boot, and you repair that battery every year, avoid using gadgets with the engine off, it could last to 6 years before needing to open the battery and refill battery water. As long as you do not damage/short the cells it will do fine. However more realistically you can expect 3-4 years with yearly repair before having to open and add battery water. Make sure to check the specs as for my alarm battery were impossible to find despite it being GP branded with a modal number, the type of battery was not listed anywhere and i had to learn the whole lead acid stuff to figure out it was AGM.

Repaired batteries will never be as good as new capacity wise, but doesn't mean they are useless. Reconditioned batteries, you can expect at most 80% lifespan of a new, this is because the battery electrodes are not new metal, its the same metal with chemicals used to clean and recreate whats possible.
Repaired - gone through decrystalisation and electrolyte added
Reconditioned - insides cleaned and replaced, chemicals used but metals are not replaced.
new - old battery taken apart fully, recycled and processed into new raw materials which are used to make a new battery.
Terminology only applies to lead acid. All lead acid batteries new today are made from old ones.

Note: if you repair your battery well and it lasts for 10 years, you will not be able to recondition it as by then the metals would be dissolved. Reconditioning is environmentally hazardous, so you save the environment by repairing your batteries then exchanging them when buying new for them to be recycled. Since most car owners replace their batteries every 2 years, those batteries are reconditioned to provide like new performance, but if you can use a battery till it dies through no more metal, then it cannot be reconditioned. Both the reconditioning or recycling process is toxic and dangerous, so better to choose the recycling only by repair.
Yes, sealed batteries are a general term. If a battery is sealed and cheap, then it is definitely AGM if the price is close to flooded lead acid. This leads me to believe that if the difference between a wet car battery and sealed one is rm 20 (10%), then it is most likely AGM. Infact the small sealed lead acid batteries used for toys, alarms, etc are also AGM. Its so difficult to find the specs that i had to learn out a lot about lead acid just to figure out the type.

The more expensive sealed batteries you buy for cars that are like RM 400 are most likely VRLA where sealed and wet are around rm 200. Most common are wet and AGM due to pricing being very close together. To me i don't see much benefit in going for very expensive if you understand the battery and can treat it well. Some people hack their own dual batteries, small lead acid battery just to start the car, and use lithium battery if the current pull is less than certain amount allowing the car to be kept parked for long periods of time or lets you sit in traffic with the engine off and AC on. Some just do supercaps + lithium. mercedes uses a flat motor at the end of the engine as the starter, alternator and supercharger (electrical) with a lithium battery pack for the supercharger (its not a hybrid). This mercedes is not sold in malaysia and is only 1 model as a proof of concept.

1)you can make your own lead acid battery. If a battery is totally dead you can reuse the case and terminals, but you have to fully take it apart and insert the items required.
2) thats fine, ofcourse if anyone is near me either via public transport or location and want to donate their dead batteries feel free. I'll also be taking some materials for recycling for my battery project as well.
3) Dead batteries cant, but repaired dead batteries can. you can use them for jump start if you get the CCA right but capacity wise nope.
4) Simply that some of the thickness of the metal anode/cathode will be gone. Since you can scrape some of the material away and some material is lost to the whole reactions over time, this is why the lifespan will be a lot less and why the performance will only be a bit less. remember the CCA testing tool is your friend here in checking if its ok to buy and irregardless recond or new, price is the main factor. To me the risk of recond batteries makes them only worth half of a new battery. If the metals are too thin and you discharge the battery too much at one time, could be permanently dead. Also rust is a factor here.
5) Yes but its mostly computing, i do intend to update the information layout and add more content soon but my next few articles are going to be on IT related stuff as thats the most recent stuff i'm writing. I'll definitely do a youtube on the battery and write up but theres a queue. Just search for my forum name, its a well known alias in some places.
For instance system-error-message.com . I'm still working on my site as i migrated it out of shared hosting (being broke) and onto my own clustered low powered hardware. Still got a few things to work out for the site to be working well other than just working.
6). as long as theres metal and electrolytes, the battery lives. The thicker the metal, the longer before the metal disappears or becomes completely unusable. You can replenish the electrolyte easy but the metals require full disassembly. The thinner the metal, the faster it dissolves, the faster battery dies.
7) battery being in the boot, away from heat does help its lifespan. Lead acid is acid, it dissolves metal slowly, heat helps speed up the process.
8) They do, heck even i did manage to repair the old AGM battery, but because of corrosion and shorted cells it achieved 8V which is its new fully charged state due to it now being 4 cells only (4x2V is 8V), 6x2v is 12V. I do not intend to create a business of repairing batteries, the charger is cheap enough that you can do it yourself. foxsfur (not sure of exact spelling) is one inexpensive brand that you can buy that supports charging different 12v/24v batteries and repairing lead acid ones as well. If the pulsing doesn't work, after the process finishes, you proceed to replenish electrolyte then charge. Many youtuber testing did find repairing to work half the time. Good quality batteries work well with this because all it does is clear the metal plates from the crystalisation from the sulphur bonding to the plates and covering them, breaking the circuit. But sulphur does have its place in the voltage chart so the right voltage does cause it to become an ion again.

That seller is unscrupulous. A recond/repaired battery will never be as good as new. My car has space for 2 batteries and new batteries can be cheap as well. It was never the intended purpose but the metal you put the battery on is big, only the side metal holding the battery broke away. Duct tape does a good job here though. you can use recond battery as backup batteries, UPS, emergencies, etc. For instance theres a lead acid based starter instead of the lithium ones. Those are bulky and what breakdown services use when you're stranded because you left the lights on and use lead acid batteries. Recond/repaired batteries fit fine here, or in your boot as an emergency, or even as a UPS battery if your old one dies. Thats why i said their value is half, They're no good anymore for use in the  car because even with the CCA rating the capacity isn't there for the design of the car to operate a certain amount of time if the alternator fails. Battery size choice for cars is based on the engine CCA needed, starter motor used and how long to run the car in event of alt fail. If alt fail + battery fail, then car dies which is why the accident is due to both battery run out of juice and alternator fail first. A lot of times an alternator failure is not shown on the car (battery light doesn't turn on). Also a rush job and not properly connecting terminals and isolating them can cause said accident where car dies. Happened to me after a bad pot hole, some streets later the battery slit forward and shorted against the hood. Car totally died but it was some inroad and i stopped just right infront of a TNB substation. Ironic to stop infront of TNB for an electrical issue. There was an explosion at the battery terminal, the battery still had some juice but it was completely useless in starting the car. I had a powerbank starter so after i got the connector off the hood, i started the car and drove off, went to mechanic next day and got another incoe battery. These incoe batteries are tough but only for the see through ones, they can con you with the non see through ones.

If you wanna downsize your lead acid battery to start the car you can, but make sure you have another power pack to help run the accessories. starting the engine needs current, and CCA rating doesnt care about capacity, so you can make a battery with capacitor design for that current, but have little to no capacity to run stuff.  In my opinion a dual battery design would be a lot better, mixing a lead acid battery with another battery (not lithium) could pretty much do a lot of good for start stop engine feature and not having to keep the engine idling. Pulsing the battery restores the CCA rating, and maybe some of the capacity, and this is one way to keep your battery long lived if you do it every year while its still kicking. Pulsing is no myth, it does work but it can't do miracles. If a battery is fully dead, voltage won't help. If the metal plates are covered which does happen after enough usage, this helps. If you take care of your battery from things like heat, maintaining it and keeping it fully charged, pulsing it every year, it will last long. Not much you can do with maintenance on a sealed battery other than charging and pulsing. Pulsing too much is bad for the battery too as it does not like overcharging (or for lead acid, the electrolyte doesn't like high voltages). Once a year is the max i would do to keep it strong. Thats why its important to turn on your car engine every week at least to operating temperature for the engine, and for battery to fully charge. You can also get voltmeters to stick into your car's electrical sockets. If it can't go up to 14.2-14.5V you should check your alternator (it takes time to charge the battery but at full charge you should see said voltages).
As long as the electrolyte doesn't electrolyse away at 4V then it should work as intended, to have a battery that can be both safe and abused with half the materials reused.

Just out of curiousity where are you located if it is very far?
1) when i say make a new battery i mean using newly refined materials even if they are recycled. That means new lead, pure water, acid, etc. When you make your own battery the quality depends on the materials and process, and the only flaw a self made battery has is sealing it. The one thing that water based electrolytes are known for are electrolysis at 2V, so slowly the the electrolyte can turn into a gas. If it is air tight then this happens very slowly with very little gas escaping. Also many batteries no are made with vents so in the case of such a thing instead of bulging it will just vent the gasses. This is why you need to replenish the water in lead acid batteries. Also if you do not seal the battery, acid can spit out around. Really the major thing when making a lead acid battery is the lead, so good batteries have thicker lead used and car batteries care about CCA most which is surface area of the lead.

8) Desulphate, this is what i mean by repair and yes i've tried it and it works. Given that the battery was at 4V and already shorted i got it up to 8V which is its supposed voltage (2V per cell). Since some cells shorted it became a 4 cell battery. It was a failure due to the short. The battery was physically damaged. Desulphation actually works. So we have batteries where it performs poorly because the surface is covered by sulpher crystals which reduces the capacity and CCA rating and this happens over time. A dead batter you can't repair/desulphate is one where the metal plates are already gone, if you want to see said effect, try the copper zinc salt water batter. The zinc disappears so it cannot be recharged and the copper is fully covered. Even if unused they will corrode away that even trying to recharge will barely work and you can't even charge at a high voltage. The distance between lead and lead oxide in a lead acid battery is > 2.1V. When you put 2 leads, add a charge 1 becomes oxidised. When you use the battery one terminal sulphates and thats why the cut off voltage is like 10.7V before charging gets difficult. You can provide a voltage but it won't accept any current, and this is where desulphation helps. I did test this as well with a bench PSU, i could see the amps it pulled. At high volts it started small then increased as the crystals broke free. Once the crystals broke free though then it decreased and you would be overvolting it. Desulphation should be left to computerised chargers than manually trying to do it (i tried a bit of manual to understand the volts and the rest i let the charger do it). The charger is cheap and has a desulphation mode but only works on 12V/24V batteries.

My car is old, it never had any terminal plastic cover. I bought it used. It did explode and i could see the insides. I'll post a picture later but it didn't catch fire. You see, electricity isn't fire, fire starts if you have something that can burn at the temperature produced by the short. Since its just metal thats not gonna burn and it throw the battery connector into the hood. My alternator was fine at the time, now dead (13 years old already so its right).

Much older cars had voltmeters so you could tell from there if your alternator fails. There are many signs as well so fool on you to ignore them and you can buy USB/extensions for your car sockets that show the voltage.

Wet cell, approx 6 months old. Been fully discharged twice at least from new and even after it blew it was still able to turn the lights on but not start the car. Terminals are all pure metal so there are no plastics that will burn from that. As i said, the incoe batteries that are transparent seem well made, because you can actually see into them. It was not serviced for 6 months because i didn't really know much about the battery at that point as there was no info available. It was only after the incident that i asked my mechanic the details of the battery that he was able to give a few, however i find that these batteries lack specs because i suspect that there are many manufacturers/factories that make these batteries, so like any 3rd world factory, the transparent ones are good because you can see it directly, so the metal plates look small, same for the amount of fluids (giving them their lower CCA and capacity), but they seem sufficiently thick to last. However the non transparent incoe batteries have bad reviews because you cannot see into them. Incoe being indonesian as they were they cause behind the perodua and mercedes fuel pump issues (the indonesian factories were pumping out defective pumps).

Upon checking photos it seems that all that happened was that the terminal had melted itself. and could no longer be properly connected.

Overcharging is different from an external short. if you want to try repairing your batteries through desulphation sure, just get the charger with that mode, then after its been repaired add fluids then charge. The lifespan of a battery depends on its metal plate thickness. Most batteries for cars nowadays only need CCA (surface area) so use thin but large sheets. Batteries that deep cycle prefer smaller surface area but thicker plates.