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 Lawyer's Corner v2, One-stop centre for any legal queries

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amway for life
post Dec 2 2012, 12:24 PM

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Nye I just buy a new house...now in process..however there is problem with valuation by land office as the valuation price is lower than the market price.is it going to effect my buying process?
TSdariofoo
post Dec 2 2012, 01:18 PM

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QUOTE(amway for life @ Dec 2 2012, 12:24 PM)
Nye I just buy a new house...now in process..however there is problem with valuation by land office as the valuation price is lower than the market price.is it going to effect my buying process?
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Valuation by LHDN (not land office) is small matter. They will take the highest sum between the SPA price n valuation price so in your case, they would pick the SPA price.
amway for life
post Dec 2 2012, 01:40 PM

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QUOTE(dariofoo @ Dec 2 2012, 01:18 PM)
Valuation by LHDN (not land office) is small matter. They will take the highest sum between the SPA price n valuation price so in your case, they would pick the SPA price.
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my prop is freehold with strata title.how long this process going to take until I can get the unit?
Mlchoo
post Dec 2 2012, 02:16 PM

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its without title although the management says they are in the process of obtaining this.

what do you mean encumbered? the unit still has some bank loan.

tks.


QUOTE(dariofoo @ Dec 1 2012, 11:24 PM)
With or without title? Encumbered or not?
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TSdariofoo
post Dec 2 2012, 11:30 PM

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QUOTE(amway for life @ Dec 2 2012, 01:40 PM)
my prop is freehold with strata title.how long this process going to take until I can get the unit?
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Best person to ask is your lawyer as he would know the exact stage of the progress.
TSdariofoo
post Dec 2 2012, 11:38 PM

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QUOTE(Mlchoo @ Dec 2 2012, 02:16 PM)
its without title although the management says they are in the process of obtaining this.

what do you mean encumbered? the unit still has some bank loan.

tks.
*
Encumbered means there is a charge/assignment over the property as security for a loan. Essentially, it means ther eis an existing loan which is not redeemed.

Well, if there is no title and if property encumbered, then there would have been a PA executed in favour of the bank, so the bank gets first priority. So, the father can't insist on another PA from his son to him now as it cannot supercede the PA in favour of the bank.

As such, I can't see any other way. If he didn't trust his son then he ought to have just kept it in his name and then execute a deed of trust in favour of his son. That would maintain his intention while keeping it out of the reach of his son at present.
beauwlf
post Dec 3 2012, 12:13 PM

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Good day Dario,

i(vendor) have signed the s&p already last week with 10% depo, and the purchaser lawyer updated me that they have stamped the Sale & Purchase Agreement. They are now asking me to execute Vendors' Undertaking Letter and the Memorandum of Transfer. I should wait for the remaining (90% - loan balance) before doing this ? . Because on that day of signing they also brought few more documents for me to sign such as land title transfer . But i insisted on signing of the s&p only .

treyston
post Dec 3 2012, 02:36 PM

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Good day everyone, need your advice here.

I just bought a service apartment few months ago. Last month when I went to the management office to pay the maintenance fee, i found that the prior owner still have 1.8k outstanding balance and now this amount is under my statement.

I went to question my lawyer and she said based on the consent letter from developer (or management office), they confirmed the vendor already settled this amount.

So I went to the management office, showed them the letter and ask for resolution. They informed me this amount not yet settled by vendor, the reason why they issued the consent letter was to fasten the process. And asked me to check with my lawyer to chase back the money from vendor. now my lawyer said the consent letter explained everything and asked me inform the management accordingly. and the management said they need the recepit...

my question is ... the consent letter, can this be used to prove that i have no responsibility to pay that O/S? what should i do now?

Thanks.
TSdariofoo
post Dec 3 2012, 03:18 PM

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QUOTE(beauwlf @ Dec 3 2012, 12:13 PM)
Good day Dario,

i(vendor) have signed the s&p already last week with 10% depo, and the purchaser lawyer updated me that they have stamped the Sale & Purchase Agreement. They are now asking me to execute Vendors' Undertaking Letter and the Memorandum of Transfer. I should wait for the remaining (90% - loan balance) before doing this ? . Because on that day of signing they also brought few more documents for me to sign such as land title transfer . But i insisted on signing of the s&p only .
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Why are you refusing to execute the letter of undertaking and MOT (which I assume is that you meant by 'land title transfer')?

Are you even aware of the contents of the SPA which would stipulate the docs which you have to execute? Any delay from your side will extend the completion date for the purchaser.

Don't simply refuse to sign documents. Find out what it is first.

If you're so unsure of the procedure and don't trust the purc's lawyer, why didn't you get your own lawyer?
TSdariofoo
post Dec 3 2012, 03:24 PM

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QUOTE(treyston @ Dec 3 2012, 02:36 PM)
Good day everyone, need your advice here.

I just bought a service apartment few months ago. Last month when I went to the management office to pay the maintenance fee, i found that the prior owner still have 1.8k outstanding balance and now this amount is under my statement.

I went to question my lawyer and she said based on the consent letter from developer (or management office), they confirmed the vendor already settled this amount.

So I went to the management office, showed them the letter and ask for resolution. They informed me this amount not yet settled by vendor, the reason why they issued the consent letter was to fasten the process. And  asked me to check with my lawyer to chase back the money from vendor. now my lawyer said the consent letter explained everything and asked me inform the management accordingly. and the management said they need the recepit...

my question is ... the consent letter, can this be used to prove that i have no responsibility to pay that O/S? what should i do now?

Thanks.
*
It is not your lawyer's duty to chase the payment from the vendor, not is it yours. It is for the developer to do so. They can't confirm one day that all dues have been cleared and then state that it has not.

The excuse by management that "this amount not yet settled by vendor, the reason why they issued the consent letter was to fasten the process" is ridiculous and cannot be accepted.

However, you have to consider if they terminate your utilities or block your access card (if applicable). You can stand by the letter of confirmation but at the end of the day, if they terminate/block, you have to go to Court to enforce your rights. Are you willing to cough up more money for that?

It is a matter of convenience vs principle. For convenience and to put things to a close (between you and m'ment), pay the sum and then claim from the vendor (or ask him for proof of payment). As a matter of principle, then you don't pay and stick to your guns.

It's up to you, ultimately. What does your lawyer have to say about it?
Mlchoo
post Dec 3 2012, 03:29 PM

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1st scenario: When title is release, can my friend then execute a PA even if loan not fully paid up?

2nd scenario: If my friend pays up the loan, I assume he can then execute a PA. With this PA can his son still have the power to sell?

Just for my info, how does this deed of trust work (assume in the context of my friend's case before he even bought the unit). The real owner is who? Loan under whose name (my friend too old to take a loan)? When my friend passes away, will the ownership be automatically transferred to the son and if yes, any tax need to be paid?

Thanks.

QUOTE(dariofoo @ Dec 2 2012, 11:38 PM)
Encumbered means there is a charge/assignment over the property as security for a loan. Essentially, it means ther eis an existing loan which is not redeemed.

Well, if there is no title and if property encumbered, then there would have been a PA executed in favour of the bank, so the bank gets first priority. So, the father can't insist on another PA from his son to him now as it cannot supercede the PA in favour of the bank.

As such, I can't see any other way. If he didn't trust his son then he ought to have just kept it in his name and then execute a deed of trust in favour of his son.  That would maintain his intention while keeping it out of the reach of his son at present.
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treyston
post Dec 3 2012, 03:50 PM

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QUOTE(dariofoo @ Dec 3 2012, 03:24 PM)
It is not your lawyer's duty to chase the payment from the vendor, not is it yours. It is for the developer to do so. They can't confirm one day that all dues have been cleared and then state that it has not.

The excuse by management that "this amount not yet settled by vendor, the reason why they issued the consent letter was to fasten the process" is ridiculous and cannot be accepted.

However, you have to consider if they terminate your utilities or block your access card (if applicable). You can stand by the letter of confirmation but at the end of the day, if they terminate/block, you have to go to Court to enforce your rights. Are you willing to cough up more money for that?

It is a matter of convenience vs principle. For convenience and to put things to a close (between you and m'ment), pay the sum and then claim from the vendor (or ask him for proof of payment). As a matter of principle, then you don't pay and stick to your guns.

It's up to you, ultimately. What does your lawyer have to say about it?
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Thanks, Dario. My lawyer told me the same - the consent letter explained everything. Since she was the lawyer for both vendor and purchaser, I bet she knew all these ...
For now I'll keep pushing the management to write off this O/S from my account as I have no responsibility to pay for vendor.
jackychuah
post Dec 3 2012, 04:07 PM

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QUOTE(dariofoo @ Nov 30 2012, 04:03 PM)
With regard to your SPA, it should follow the Schedule H template in the HD Act.

The relevant section is as follows.

Position and area of Parcel
13. (1) No error or misstatement as to the description of the area of the said
Parcel shall annul the sale of the said Parcel or entitle the Purchaser to be discharged
from the purchase.
(2) Any error or misstatement as to the description of the area of the said
Parcel shall give the Purchaser an entitlement to an adjustment of the purchase price
in accordanc e with the provisions of this clause.
(3) If the area of the said Parcel as shown in the strata title when issued is
less than the area shown in the Building Plan, there shall be an adjustment of the
purchase price for the difference (if any) in excess of three (3) per centum of the area as
shown in the Building Plan calculated at the rate of Ringgit Malaysia
…………………………………… (RM………………..) only per square metre shall
be adjusted accordingly.
(4) The Vendor shall not be entitled to any adjustment of the purchase
price if the area of the said Parcel as shown in the strata title exceeds the area shown
in the Building Plan.
(5) Any payment resulting from the adjustment and required to be paid by
the Vendor shall be so paid within fourteen (14) days of the issue of the strata title.


If you look at subclause 4, it does say that the Vendor is not entitled to request from the Purchaser the excess, if the area in the strata title exceeds the area shown in the plan.

So, your argument would be that the provision in your SPA is in contravention of the template in Schedule H, and it thus void.

The developer's argument would be that you had signed the SPA with that clause in it, so you would be bound by it.

I think, bearing in mind the provisions of Schedule H - the law would be in favour of the Purchaser.

If you can rally all the purchasers together, perhaps via the JMB, then a collective voice against the developer would have a better effect.

Sorry for the conflicting advise with my previous post. I should've checked the Schedule H template before advising you further.
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Thanks for your precious opinion, I will try to solve the problem based on your advice. Will update if any progress, thank Dariofoo

This post has been edited by jackychuah: Dec 3 2012, 04:08 PM
itanium2
post Dec 4 2012, 04:34 PM

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Hi Dario,

Appreciate your reply regarding below query:

1. For a subsale leasehold condo with Master title, the S&P lawyer has included the stamp duty for Transfer or Deed of Assignment.
Isn't the stamp duty payable only when the strata title is out?
If I pay now, what happens if I sell the condo later when the strata title is still not out yet?
Does it mean the money I've paid for the stamp duty is wasted?

2. For a subsale leasehold condo with Master title, who pays for the application for state consent?
Buyer or Vendor? Vendor did not appoint any lawyer.

Thank you!
chongmelvin2238
post Dec 4 2012, 08:59 PM

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If buy a condo ( residential ) under a commercial title, CAN I rent out my unit like service apartment? Lie short term, weekly? Monthly or daily..

cwjmorpheus
post Dec 5 2012, 09:42 AM

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This post has been edited by cwjmorpheus: Dec 6 2012, 08:24 AM
fakhree
post Dec 5 2012, 01:34 PM

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where can i look for if my developer is over scheduled and what is our rights as buyer?
TSdariofoo
post Dec 5 2012, 11:47 PM

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QUOTE(itanium2 @ Dec 4 2012, 04:34 PM)
Hi Dario,

Appreciate your reply regarding below query:

1. For a subsale leasehold condo with Master title, the S&P lawyer has included the stamp duty for Transfer or Deed of Assignment.
Isn't the stamp duty payable only when the strata title is out?
If I pay now, what happens if I sell the condo later when the strata title is still not out yet?
Does it mean the money I've paid for the stamp duty is wasted?

2. For a subsale leasehold condo with Master title, who pays for the application for state consent?
Buyer or Vendor? Vendor did not appoint any lawyer.

Thank you!
*
1.you pay full stamp duty now for the deed of assignment. When the title is out, you only pay nominal sum of RM10 upon the MOT. There is no double stamp duty.

2.vendor bears the cost.

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TSdariofoo
post Dec 5 2012, 11:50 PM

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QUOTE(chongmelvin2238 @ Dec 4 2012, 08:59 PM)
If buy a condo ( residential ) under a commercial title, CAN I rent out my unit like service apartment? Lie short term, weekly? Monthly or daily..
*
Legally, you can even rent it daily or weekly or for any duration, but you would need a proper tenancy agreement to show that the relationship is a genuine landlord-tenant one and not where you're running an unlicensed budget hotel. Check your deed of mutual covenants as well which you have agreed. See if it prohibits such arrangements.
Ziv
post Dec 6 2012, 09:25 AM

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Hi Dariofoo,

I bought a property on year 2009. Bad vendor refuse to sell / disappear after received 10%, refuse to receive any letter that send by my lawyer by hand.
Due to both of us appointed same lawyer because that time i thought same lawyer wil more easier and faster. But my lawyer said very hard to sue the seller because seller don't answer call and don't want acknowledge receive letter, my lawyer ask me look for another lawyer if i wan to put tis to court, he can't help. Sigh~

I tried to look many other lawyers, but none of them want to accept my case, because it was messed up by previous lawyer, they need study the matter, and i wil blame them if they failed to fight for me.
So the case pending about a year.. even i also went to MCA about this, MCA said just think positive money can earn back as long i healthy should thanks god ady.

After a year...
I managed found a good lawyer, after he viewed my case he very confidence he accepted the case and fight for me. We summon the seller ask him attend court...end up seller turned up and agreed ti sell. The property price increased ady but ofcuz we stil follow the S&P price which is signed on one year ago.
So everything start over again, inform bank lawyer that this case reopen and continue. My lawyer on hand got other many cases and his staff resigned..so my case pending and delayed but he did request seller to extend the complete time. Seller lawyer extended once to me ady, so is excited 3+1 mths ady.
On mth 4 nearly mth 5, bank panel lawyer oni infromed me tat she found my loan oni valid for one year frm te day i purchase the property (one year ago) now no longer valid, need to reapply/resubmit again!! But this time seller rejected to sell, he said follow S&P i can't complete the transaction on time n he gt right to forfeit my 10%..:'( sob sob.

One month later...
my lawyer start chase me lawyer fees 10k, he said he done his job ady, juz the bank panel lawyer found my loan expired too late…

Hope u can advise me n sorry on my poor english n grammer.

This post has been edited by Ziv: Dec 6 2012, 09:28 AM

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