Don’t ask about money or benefits. Wait until you’ve got the job

1) It is a common mistake by graduates where they try to do more, i.e. things not related to their work. This is not a good idea, just do what the company pays you to do.

Whilst it may be great to try and be helpful, being too helpful will send signals to people to dump things onto you. Also, you may be able to do A, B and C perfectly. However, if you have to do A, B and C simultaneously, can you still do a good job with all three? Else, if you do a bad job, it may backfire on you.

AGREE! i waited for 3 months after interview b4 they finally confirm to me that they'll take me.  i called couple of times to follow up previously and it seems that MD is always overseas or not around (but after i joined only i got to know they previously already offered some1 else, but dat fella didn't last long so they call me back). i got my offer letter only after i've worked there for 2 months...hell of a HR dept in some companies...

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Added on January 11, 2011, 11:08 pm
and so true...they will surely ask IF you didn't state it in your resume.  if you've stated your expected salary, they'd most probably NEGOTIATE with you instead.  so be prepared.  i'd normally ask them how much they're looking to offer for this position.  some companies fix a range for certain position.  well, some of them will say something like depends on qualifications, experience etc.  and i will normally ask them "based on my qualification and experience, how much do you think the company would offer me?" hear what they say.

btw, would anyone really go for a job with sal way below their expectation? maybe i should ask, would they be happy with the job considering the salary is way below the expected?

Sorry if I am posting on wrong threads...

but I would like to ask, is SPM certificate needed IF I am applying a job at OVERSEAS???

I haven't take my SPM cert and it's already three years since I graduate..

2) Learn how to say no.  This sort of relate to Item 1 above as I personally find saying no to be rather difficult at first, especially when people start complaining or have a go at you.  For example, if someone ask you to do something outside your job scope, you can say No and give them a reason such as you are busy or you don’t know.  If you are in a situation where you can only say yes, then make sure the person knows that you are doing them a favour. 

I was curious how to let them know that I am doing them a favour?

to all frenz..i wanna ask all of u something about the position for fresh graduates...I already finish my studies in degree of accounting..is it the qualify position for me is for account assistant only or i can be an executive..please..hope someone can explain to me about my situation because sometimes the position wants someone with 1,2,3,4,5 years experience...any tip for me?

People normally refer executive as the ones with working experience (as the salary is much higher than assistant). Fresh graduates mostly go for account assistant to gain experience...

Good guide.. should be pinned up instead..

This is a simple guide aimed at fresh graduates and also would be fresh graduates.  It is divided into three sections: pre graduates, graduates and post graduates. 

Obviously the guide in here is not exhaustive, and also some of these are already discussed in various other topics, so do check there.  Please feel free to contribute your thoughts in here. 

Also, it is worth noting these are based on my experience in the UK so it may not be directly applicable, but should still be useful. 

Simple Guide for Pre Graduates
Should I start looking for jobs even before I graduate?
Major companies tend to start their graduate recruitment even before the actual graduation date.  Also, they tend to do more than one recruitment rounds, so if you missed the 1st one, you can still wait for the second one.

For July graduates, some recruitment process starts around November/December time. 

Why should I start looking for jobs so early?
You don’t have to if you prefer to take a few months off after you graduated.  However, graduate scheme in companies tend to fill in quite quickly so if you missed one window, you’ll need to wait for another.

Also, by starting early, you get more opportunities to experience the selection process thereby helping you to build up your skills. 

What else can I do?
For final year students, the university or companies would usually run career fairs and exhibitions.  Visit these to find out what are the options available out there.

Also, speak to your seniors and your lecturers and think about what you want to do.  They can usually recommend a few good companies for you to join.  Whilst this is debatable, my opinion is that your first job matters so think hard about that.  We’ll come back to this shortly. 

Also, you university should be able to help you brush up your interview skills, and to give you a feel for what to expect in an interview, carry out mock interviews, preparing your CV etc.  Speak to them. 

What do I need to do in an interview?
This has been discussed in great length in the pinned topic.  However for a short summary:

- Make sure you know your company, do some research, understand where they operate in etc. 
- Prior to the interview, prepare a list of questions interviewers would most likely ask. 
- Dress smartly, but don’t overdress and nothing fancy.  Chose dark coloured or white/blue (traditional colour shirt).  Obviously this may not be applicable to all circumstances, so adapt as you see fit. 
- Arrive 10 minutes earlier prior to your interview, if you’re running late, call up the company and let them know you’re running late. 
- Don’t ask about money or benefits.  Wait until you’ve got the job. 

There is still a lot to talk about in this list but that’s not the point for this topic.  So do check out the pinned topic. 

Simple Guide for Graduates
I’ve got more than one offer which job should I pick?
This is one of the most commonly asked question, and also one of the more debateable ones.  Obviously there is no one size fit all answer to this question, but you should consider the following:

Your first job is not to make money, as you would be joining a company with 0 experience.  The company will be paying you to learn.  So don’t expect or pick a job just because they pay more than the other. 

You should think about what you can learn in your first job.  The key point is what you can learn now to enable you to progress further in the future.  Think about how you can develop yourself in the company you work. 

Be a bit careful about joining a field that is too specialised as a fresh graduate.  It is not bad, but think about how easy it would be for you to move around in the future, and whether is there a market even in other countries.  For fresh graduate, it would be better to try and gain experience which is as diversified as possible. 

After graduating, does it mean I don’t need to learn anymore?
Even after graduating, your learning process will not stop.  You will learn in your work and you will gain experience.  You may not need to take formal learning such as those in the university, but you certainly should continue to learn and develop yourself. 

Think about taking evening classes, part time studies to Masters level, a second qualification, language etc.  Continuous improvement is the key here. 

Also, you could also think about taking none work related courses, such as art, music or something that interests you.  This would help break you away from your daily routine and should also help you meet new people, and experience new things.  Work is not your only life, you need life outside work too. 

Simple Guide for Post Graduates
The following are stuff that I have discovered and learnt over the past 4.5 years from working.  These are based on my experience, advice from others and from reading books.  I find them particularly useful as these are considered as ‘soft skills’. 

1) It is a common mistake by graduates where they try to do more, i.e. things not related to their work.  This is not a good idea, just do what the company pays you to do. 

Whilst it may be great to try and be helpful, being too helpful will send signals to people to dump things onto you.  Also, you may be able to do A, B and C perfectly.  However, if you have to do A, B and C simultaneously, can you still do a good job with all three?  Else, if you do a bad job, it may backfire on you. 

2) Learn how to say no.  This sort of relate to Item 1 above as I personally find saying no to be rather difficult at first, especially when people start complaining or have a go at you.  For example, if someone ask you to do something outside your job scope, you can say No and give them a reason such as you are busy or you don’t know.  If you are in a situation where you can only say yes, then make sure the person knows that you are doing them a favour. 

3) If something doesn’t work, don’t just say it doesn’t work.  Always offer alternative solution or idea and always show that you have tried finding out why it doesn’t work. 

4) The glass is half full or half empty.  There are two ways for you to talk to people:

a) No, you cannot do this.  To do this, you will need to do A, B and C.
b) Yes you can do this by doing A, B and C. 

The key point here is to be positive and show a realistic can do attitude.  It doesn’t mean saying yes to everything when you can’t deliver. 

5) If it’s worth doing, it’s worth overdoing.  This is a quote from Mythbusters but one I find applicable to my work.  If you are asked to do something, don’t do a half-hearted job.  Give it your best + extra to try and match + exceed the person’s expectation.  This is how you can get noticed. 

6) Be nice to everyone, and also be nice to the receptionist or admin.  A smile is free, so don’t be afraid of giving them out. 

When someone is behaving unprofessionally towards you, the last thing you want to do is to respond in the same way.  Remember the inverse rule, the more unprofessional someone is, the more professional you should be and the ruder the person is, the more polite you should be. 

7) A wall is there to let you show how much you want something. 

8) Be open to criticism.  People criticise you because they care.  You should be worried when people stop criticising you as this means have given up on you. 

Even when faced with unconstructive criticism or people bent on putting you down, just smile and go away or ignore it if you can.  Don’t engage in a prolonged argument as it is a waste of your time and often, it does not reflect well on you. 

9) Remember please and thank you, they go a long way. 

10) Always carry a mini notebook with you, when people teach you something, write it down. 

11) Avoid making mistakes but understand that mistakes cannot be avoided.  What you need to do is learn and make sure you don’t make the same mistake twice.  This is tough, but when you make a mistake, be sure to own up to it as soon as you can as there might still be ways to contain the damage.  Keeping quiet will help no one. 

12) Don’t be lazy, always do your homework before asking a question.

I agree that the first job isn't about money. I know people who will say otherwise but in essence, I feel that the first job should be selected based on how much you think you can reap from your employers in terms of knowledge and experience.

Sorry if I am posting on wrong threads...

but I would like to ask, is SPM certificate needed IF I am applying a job at OVERSEAS???

I haven't take my SPM cert and it's already three years since I graduate..