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TSdariofoo
post Nov 18 2011, 10:20 AM

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QUOTE(lyt25_1234 @ Nov 17 2011, 10:10 AM)
Hi Dario,

Do you know of any template document for tenant agreement for renting out my house that I can use?
*
You'd better appoint a lawyer to do it. Anyway, the tenant always bear the legal fees and stamp duty, so why worry? smile.gif
TSdariofoo
post Nov 18 2011, 10:25 AM

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QUOTE(kathlynn @ Nov 17 2011, 04:20 PM)
Hi, just wanted to check. My vendor's lawyer wants a clause in a std SPA to be revised, which is proceeds upon signing SPA (i.e. 10% of SP) to be paid direct to vendor (i.e. vendors lawyers does not want to hold the $). i was advise by my lawyer that tho it is not common, there are some who agree to this clause. i was wondering

1) what are the potential implications should i agree to this clause?

2) and if I do not agree & the vendors lawyer insist, we will be in a deadlock situations. in that case, i suppose i will be able to insist on for specific performance? or if not, what are my chances of recovering the 3% earnest $ i have already put in?

thanks in advance
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How the 7% or 8% balance deposit is to be paid is at the choice of the vendor.

So if the vendor instructs his lawyers to demand for it to be paid to the vendor directly, you have to agree with it. Don't have to worry as it makes no difference if the cheque is paid out directly to vendor or to vendor's solicitors. Most important is that the SPA is executed and the ball starts rolling. It's really no big deal. smile.gif

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TSdariofoo
post Nov 18 2011, 10:29 AM

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asfa1975:

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Clauses 7 until 10 are important to note. So now you're bound by the contract until the end of the tenure. Bear in mind that once it ends, you need to send in a letter of termination, as clause 9 clearly states that renewal is automatic.

This post has been edited by dariofoo: Nov 18 2011, 10:30 AM
TSdariofoo
post Nov 19 2011, 05:46 PM

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QUOTE(leechers @ Nov 18 2011, 04:34 PM)
need advice on this. My s&p already signed and when i collected the s&p from lawyer office yesterday i realized the make mistake on parking lot no. the developer consent stated different number but s&p stated different. I asked about this and just now the lawyer office called and said that it is in the s&p that is wrong and they will make amendment and lawyer will initial the amendment. is that the correct way to do?
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Small matter only as it is merely a clerical error and does not vary any of the major terms in the SPA.

Yes the lawyer can initial the amendment but if you want to be entirely sure, you can insist that you want to initial it as well. nod.gif

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TSdariofoo
post Nov 20 2011, 01:47 AM

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Joannie T:
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Document (1) is not a surprise and only some firms actually practise the issuance of such letters. In actual fact, the lawyer is acting on behalf of the bank, and not you. Despite the fact that you are actually paying all the fees. Weird and somewhat unfair, but that is how the system is in our country. As such, if there is ever a dispute between you and the bank in the future, do not expect this lawyer to assist you. It would be a conflict of interest. You would need to seek out another lawyer to assert your rights against the bank.

Document (2) would not have much of an implication. In most scenarios where there is a Master Title (MT), the financier can elect to waive the right to lodge a private caveat upon the MT. More so in your case where the developer has gone bankrupt and the affairs of the developer has been taken over by a liquidator.
There is nothing to be worried as the bank would've been issued with the necessary disclaimers and undertakings by the liquidator to protect its interests before agreeing to disburse the loan to you.

Safe is the sense that you won't find someone knocking at the door to chase you out of your property - of course. No worries there.
Not so secured in the sense that there is no strata title - but there are a lot of properties without strata titles for over 20-30 years and people still transact, buying and selling, leaving a long trail and continuous Deed of Assigments along the way. So, do not worry about it. As long as you get your keys and all security documents are in order with the bank.

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TSdariofoo
post Nov 20 2011, 01:54 AM

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QUOTE(yothim @ Nov 20 2011, 01:05 AM)
hi, my friend just paid the 3% downpayment for a subsale apartment. she got the loan, lawyer and also withdraw her fix deposits for the 7%. but when the S&P was prepared, the owner was found to be a bankrupt as he did not clear up some loans. Question is:-

1- what can my friend do to compensate her losses? Time, leave and also the FD interest?
2- we're suspecting that the agent might be creating all these lies as one of her colleague friends are interested in this unit but we had booked this unit first.
3- can we lodge a police report on this on the suspect that the owner is trying to cheat as he knew that he is a bankrupt?

This would be quite unfair if there is nothing that we cant do about it, thanks.
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To be honest, I'd say your friend is quite lucky that the bankruptcy search was done in advance. I know certain firms who do it at the last minute, especially when they also act for the purchaser's financier, and they do one search perhaps a month after the SPA has been executed and before the loan documents are executed. Lucky that it did not go all the way to that stage yet.

Yes, the owner can be faulted for not representing himself to be an unadjudicated bankrupt to you at the earliest stage. But what's the point of suing a bankrupt for misrepresentation? You'll waste good money chasing bad money. A police report would do you no good.

With regard to the agent, best not to jump to conclusions. In most, if not all scenarios, the agent would not know that the vendor is a bankrupt. There is no duty upon the agent to do the necessary searches. It would be hard to pinpoint the blame on the agent.

Now, you need to get back your 3% deposit paid and just cut your losses. A bitter pill indeed, but do be thankful that a deeper hole could've been dug if things went on all the way - and end up digging a bigger hole in your wallet as well.

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TSdariofoo
post Nov 21 2011, 10:58 AM

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ienkcc:
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First things first, it is important for you to understand that whatever process flow and chain of events must follow what is stipulated in the SPA. I do not have the benefit of perusing through your SPA. However, your lawyer would've followed what was stated in the SPA when dealing with the balance purchase price at the end of the transaction.

The normal practice is that the balance purchase price must be forwarded to the vendor together with payment of late penalty interest (LPI) and payment of apportioned outgoings. Once payment of the above is made to the vendor, the vendor may hand over vacant posession (VP) of the premises within 3 working days [some SPAs stipulate 5 days] to the purchaser, failing which the vendor has to pay late penalty interest to the purchaser.

So do read up your SPA again and see if the clauses to deal with the above mirrors the example I've stated. If it does, then you have no choice but to pay up LPI before you get your keys. Period.

You need to ask for a copy of all correspondence between the parties to determine the calculation of the LPI from you to the vendor and find out how it came to be. From what you said, the delay was from the vendor. In such case, the completion date ought to be extended in your favour to allow you more time to complete the SPA.

If the delay is from your side and it extends after the normal 3 months completion date into the additional 1 month period where LPI is due, then you have to pay the LPI.

It is highly unlikely that your lawyer would pay on your behalf and claim from you. If you want to terminate your lawyer and deal with the vendor's lawyer directly, you can do so, but what difference does it make? The vendor's lawyer would demand the LPI from you as well. So it is pointless to terminate your lawyer at this stage which is the tail-end of the transaction.

What you need to do now is to find out the source of the delay. Even if the delay is from your lawyer or your bank, you would still need to cough it up first. Whether you want to pursue a separate claim for reimbursement from the lawyer or the bank (whom you think is the negligent party) - is an entirely different issue altogether.

Good luck icon_rolleyes.gif

TSdariofoo
post Nov 21 2011, 10:59 AM

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QUOTE(lyt25_1234 @ Nov 21 2011, 08:09 AM)
Thanks Dario!
This is something new to me, as I have not done any rental before!
Now that you mention it's all bear by the tenant, I am happy now biggrin.gif
*
No worries. There's always a first time for everything icon_rolleyes.gif
TSdariofoo
post Nov 22 2011, 02:07 AM

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QUOTE(k3v1n @ Nov 21 2011, 04:53 PM)
Hi Dario, wanna ask you something...I have sign the snp and paid 10% downpayment for the lawyer on 7 Nov, normally it take how long for me to get the stampling snp and sign the loan agreement? thanks!
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Stamped SPA - around a week.
Sign loan docs - check with the lawyer. It differs from firm to firm. Most would wait for letter of instruction first despite being verbally informed that they can start preparing the loan docs while waiting for letter of instruction to arrive from the bank.'

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TSdariofoo
post Nov 22 2011, 02:08 AM

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QUOTE(ahnyen @ Nov 21 2011, 10:53 PM)
Good day to all!

I have just booked my first property, completed studio unit at ritze perdana 1 with offer price RM260k. I plan to take up the loan upto RM220k. The studio unit is leasehold and still under master title.

My friend had recommended me a lawyer who can handle both S&P and Loan agreement at the same time in which I hope to get some rebate from the lawyer. The lawyer charge me, including stamp duty, totaled of RM7.9k (RM3.9k for S&P and RM4k for loan agreement) + another RM200 for income tax filling.

As this is my first property, appreciate if you can kindly give me some advise whether this quoted fee is reasonable or not.

Thanks in advance for your time and kind help.
*
Feel free to compare your quotation with the previous quotations in this thread. There's quite a number of them together with comments and suggestions so do take a look. icon_rolleyes.gif
TSdariofoo
post Nov 22 2011, 01:55 PM

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QUOTE(ahnyen @ Nov 22 2011, 09:48 AM)
there is really plenty of useful thread and comments about the legal fee. thank you very much.
*
Good of you to actually take the time to browse through. I know it's a lot of pages to go through but the information is very useful! icon_rolleyes.gif
TSdariofoo
post Nov 22 2011, 01:57 PM

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QUOTE(lyt25_1234 @ Nov 22 2011, 10:26 AM)
Hi Dario,

Question: If the 3 months is up and in the SPA it is stated 3 + 1, then is the purchaser held the LPI if it goes into the additional 1 month period? Is that what the additional 1 month means?
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It means the purc has to pay interest (normally it is 8%) upon the balance purchase price due to the vendor. The extra 1 month is like 'extra time' for the purc to complete the transaction, subject to payment of the said interest, which is calculated daily until the day the balance purchase price is paid to the vendor.

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TSdariofoo
post Nov 22 2011, 02:03 PM

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QUOTE(mycko7 @ Nov 22 2011, 01:07 PM)
Hi,

I'm a liitle bit confuse and need some guidance.

I'm selling my apartment by myself for the first time, and without any agent involve.

The buyer already paid me 3%, and the remaining 7% by right, which i read before, 30-90 days after signing the SNP.

My question is, am i the one(seller) who have to engage lawyer to prepare SNP, or the buyer have to find his lawyer to prepare SNP.

Who bear the cost ? Seller or Buyer ?

Thanks in advance.  smile.gif
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The remaining 7% is upon signing of the SPA. The balance 90% will be at the end of the transaction - normally it is 90 days from date of SPA (if freehold and no consent from State Authority is needed).

The purchaser has to appoint a lawyer and pay full scale fees.

You have the option of either appointing a lawyer of your own (another firm) whereby you have to pay full scaled fees, OR you can 'tumpang' the purc's lawyer to do the redemption, filing CKHT, deed of receipt & reassignment (or discharge of charge, as the case may be), etc.

If you tumpang, the fees will not be full scaled, but will be much less. However, you will be deemed to be unrepresented. So don't expect the purchaser's lawyer to do anything in your favour to speeden things up for you.

For more info, especially the pros and cons of tumpang lawyer or appointing your own lawyer, feel free to read up the first few pages of this thread as it has been discussed at length among us when this thread first kicked off. If you have any further enquiries do feel free to ask. Am sure you'll understand the procedure more once you read up a bit of this thread and learn from others' experience smile.gif

Cheers icon_rolleyes.gif
TSdariofoo
post Nov 22 2011, 02:06 PM

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LAWYER'S CORNER WILL BE TAKING A BREAK

Dear all,

Am off for an outstation trip now and would thus be unavailable until tomorrow night, 23rd November 2011.

Humble apologies.

Do seek advice from those in the open forum if it is urgent.

For those who can wait, do post it here and I'll get back to you tomorrow night when I get back or on the 24th.

Cheerios



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TSdariofoo
post Nov 24 2011, 10:23 AM

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QUOTE(ezonemy @ Nov 22 2011, 07:21 PM)
my question is when the letter such but the account was closed earlier and there is charges for it (rm 200) to apply new account. can i ask the vendor to share the charges?
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No, you can't.
TSdariofoo
post Nov 25 2011, 11:38 AM

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QUOTE(ezonemy @ Nov 24 2011, 02:08 PM)
sorry, the RM 200 is extra charges for the SYABAS contractor to inspect and verify there is no leakage / problem apart from SYABAS deposit (RM 130). This SYABAS contractor charges can be avoided if the vendor informed earlier prior closing the account in January 2011 whereby i would immediately open an new account.
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In a customary standard SPA, there would not be a clause whereby the vendor has a duty to inform the purchaser of any termination of utility accounts. The duty is only imposed upon the vendor to ensure that all dues are paid and the receipts for same are forwarded to the purchaser's lawyer.

Unless you can find a clause in your SPA which imposes a duty upon the vendor to inform you, I don't see how the law can assist you to put the blame on the vendor and claim for reimbursement from him.

Yes, it is unethical and unprofessional of the vendor, but it all boils down to whether he broke any terms of the SPA by omitting to inform you.

Hope that clarifies things accordingly. icon_rolleyes.gif
TSdariofoo
post Nov 25 2011, 11:40 AM

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QUOTE(home-buyer @ Nov 24 2011, 05:09 PM)
Hi Dariofoo,

I've got a quotation from a lawyer firm for my subsale landed house for 730K.

Is this quotation (SPA and Loan Agreement) reasonable?
This quotation is on the assumption that the proposed purchase price is RM730,000.00
 
Sale and Purchase Agreement
Legal Fees - RM5,560;
Expected disbursement such as  searches, registration of the transfer, photocopying, transport - RM1,000
Stamp duty on the Memorandum of Transfer (subject to adjudication) - RM15,900.
 
Financing (RM657,000.00)
Legal Fees (principal) - RM5,049.00
Each Subsidiary instrument - RM300.00
Expected disbursement such as  searches, registration of the transfer, photocopying, transport, caveat - RM1,500
Stamp duty (ad valorem) on the Facility Agreement - RM3,285.00.
Thank you very much!
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Feel free to compare your quotation with the previous quotations in this thread. There's quite a number of them together with comments and suggestions so do take a look.

You can also download the SRO and use the legal fees calculator to assist you.

Come back and ask if there's anything you need clarification with.

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TSdariofoo
post Nov 25 2011, 12:34 PM

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QUOTE(leechers @ Nov 24 2011, 11:19 PM)
Dario,

I think i made a mistake in purchasing my apartment. This is the scenario and hope that you can read and give comments/suggestions

First of all i bought the apartment through agent where i need to pay 1% out of selling price to that agent. Next is the s&p lawyer. At first i thought the lawyer represent me, when i received the s&p (which had been signed and stamped) to my horror it stated that the lawyer actually represent the vendor, not me and i have to pay for their services!

Then it comes to state consent. I really dont know about this. How many of state consent that they need to apply? The s&p lawyer said that they received the state consent already and the bank lawyer said that they still didnt receive it. Does that mean it will be two state consent?

Then about developer consent, it stated there that the seller need to pay six months maintenance fee before they release the consent. However i notice the receipt paid only for five months. When i asked the agent she said that is normal where i will need to pay back to previous owner 3months of maintenance fee after everything completed. How is that possible?

What should i do next? I notice something is not right somewhere.
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Raise the issue of appointment of solicitor with your lawyer. I seriously hope that it is a typo. The one who pays full fees is the one who appoints the lawyer.

With regard to consent,normally a blanket consent will be made in the application, i.e. to cover transfer and subsequent charge. As such, the application would be supported by a letter of offer from your financier. Check with your lawyer if same has been done.

With regard to maintenance fees, I suspect that the 6 months' payment upfront is like a deposit which is paid by the vendor on behalf of the purchaser, and the purchaser has to reimburse the vendor later. Some management offices in condos practise this method. Be prudent - call up the management office directly to find out what is the exact procedure and process. They will have their own regulations.

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This post has been edited by dariofoo: Nov 25 2011, 01:26 PM
TSdariofoo
post Nov 25 2011, 12:44 PM

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QUOTE(synkronize @ Nov 24 2011, 11:43 PM)
Hi Dario, hope you can help us with our problem:

We bought a freehold landed property from the resale market. The S&P was signed on 22/08/2011 with a 3+1 month completion date and both sides are using the same lawyer. It's Effectively 3 months now and to date we have not received any redemption letter from the Vendor's bank despite repeated letters/reminders. We have no idea what's taking the bank so long to release such a letter. Does the bank need consent of the Vendor in this case prior to releasing such info to our lawyers?

Despite what we read about 'potential' complications on this matter, we feel really unease about this since we have slightly less than a month left to 'complete' the sale. However my question is: in the S&P it states that if we do not complete within the completion period of 3+1, there is a penalty of 8% on a day to day basis. The clause did not state specifically that this penalty does not apply in events where the vendor fails to deliver redemption sum letter. Wuld we be penalized in this case even tho we technically  and logically speaking, we can't settle the balance sum without knowing what's the redemption amount.

Lastly what happens if 3+1 lapses and redemption statement is still not sent out? Do we have recourse? There is a default by vendor clause but isn't that only applicable if the vendor decides to back out the sale?

Sigh it's so frustrating and I hope I can get some answers.  Thanks so much in advance!
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I do not know what exactly the terms are in your SPA but what I can tell you is that in normal practice, the vendor is given 14 days from the date of request for same by the purchaser's financier's solicitors to procure the redemption statement. The period exceeding 14 days until the date of receipt of the redemption statement shall not be considered as part of the completion date. As such, the completion date would be extended automatically.

Example:

Date of request by purc's financier's sol - 1/11/2011
Last day for vendor to procure from his financier - 15/11/2011
Date of receipt of redemption statement - 30/11/2011.

Delay 16/11-30/11 - 15 days

Completion date (example) - 12/12/11
By virtue of the delay from the vendor's side - the completion date would be extended by 15 days - 27/12/2011
(assuming that there are no other delays from either side)

Look for such a clause in your SPA. There has to be such a clause as it would count as a delay on the part of the vendor, and as such, it would be wrong to punish you for such delay. Sometimes it may be 14 working days, sometimes 21 days. It differs. But a timeframe must be given to the vendor to obtain the redemption statement.

The vendor's financier only needs a letter of autorisation from the vendor but that is always provided to the financier at the same time when requesting for the redemption statement - so in essence, all the bank needs to do is to print out the redemption statement. No further check or consent of the vendor is needed anymore.

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This post has been edited by dariofoo: Nov 25 2011, 01:25 PM
TSdariofoo
post Nov 25 2011, 01:05 PM

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QUOTE(mecn04 @ Nov 25 2011, 12:37 AM)
Hi, I am purchasing a subsale property and now my lawyer still processing it & try to get the bank to release loan. S&P is ready and I already paid them partial of the legal fees agreed. Now the lawyer want me to pay in full of legal fees. May I know do I have the right not to pay them in full until the all the legal process completed? I am worry because even now I need to keep chase after them for update & they dont take my case seriously.
*
Normally, full payment is made upon signing of SPA. Whether the firm allows you extra time to pay up or any other arrangement is up to the firm at their own discretion. There's no law or regulation to control such arrangements. As such, you do not have the right to not pay them in full until the end of the process.

Wouldn't you be in a better position of you had paid in full ? Then, you can insist that priority be given to your file as you have paid in full and there's no reason for them to dilly dally over it. Of course, the other perspective you can take is that - "do your work properly and then, i'll pay the balance".

So at the end of the day, it depends on which way works. As long as the file keeps moving along,as time is of the essence in SPAs.

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