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 Bodybuilding Thread v8, Bodybuilding diskussion

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ken86
post Oct 12 2010, 09:19 AM

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QUOTE(MelForC3 @ Oct 12 2010, 12:24 AM)
hi... i see iamyuanwu saying about protein rice. Is it something can get from the store?

i mean food section store. It's the first time i come to the protein rice.

Sorry if asking for some real noobie question.
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there are a few protein powders to cater to non-lacto-ovo vegetarians/vegan (they don't eat eggs and dairy which is sad sad.gif)

1. Hemp Protein
2. Gemma Pea Protein
3. Rice Protein - http://www.sunwarrior.com/store/protein-ra...-chocolate.html (I tried a few samples of these, they are really expensive and the protein per scoop ratio is low and they don't mix well and they taste really funny, sort of like Carnivor - beef protein isolate)
4. Soy Protein - sad.gif

seriously stick with dead animal flesh, eggs and whey.

This post has been edited by ken86: Oct 12 2010, 09:19 AM
ken86
post Oct 16 2010, 11:02 PM

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user posted image

totally carbless crust mmmmm just made a batch for party

2 cups low fat mozzarella cheese, shredded
2 large omega-3 eggs
2 tablespoons flax seed milled
2 tablespoons unflavored whey protein powder or coconut flour (optional) - just for binding and coconut flour is awesome at sucking moisture, I heard it's used to clear the oil spill that happened recently
1/2 teaspoon baking powder

This post has been edited by ken86: Oct 16 2010, 11:02 PM
ken86
post Nov 11 2010, 09:13 AM

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power balance wrist bands = some really dumb stuff and huge ass scam, apparently it can resonate with your natural energy field to increase strength , balance and power?!?!?! coupled with advertising with a few world class athletes and it's selling like hot cakes. I have a few friends that bought it and I threatened them to return that bull crap at knife point, which luckily they did before blood was shed.

seriously what has gotten into mankind, have we turn into mindless lazy slobs thinking that a freaking band with some reflective hologram is going to improve your strength levels ?!!!?!!?!!?!!?

This post has been edited by ken86: Nov 11 2010, 09:16 AM
ken86
post Nov 22 2010, 09:56 PM

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QUOTE(mikehuan @ Nov 22 2010, 05:18 PM)
leg presses. one guy in my gym swears by them. though i dont do them cos it hurts my knees somehow  unsure.gif

p/s: my girl did tell me my ass looks better now, zz  doh.gif


Added on November 22, 2010, 5:41 pm

T Nation

whoosh, t nation really has some high standards. pretty close to the BW Bench press though lol. No where close at the DL area though. I wonder if this means 1 reppers?
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I think that's a pretty good benchmark and is a BW bench press a lofty goal ? Unless u r overweight in a bad way, i don';t see BW bench being a lofty goal plus the cleans plus the front squats ?!?

take a look around the gym

the guys that focus on the hard and heavy basics (meat and potatoes), the one that uses the house analogy. A basic routine focusing on the big barbell exercises: your squat, deadlift, bench press, overhead press, barbell row, weighted chin-up/dips, and all the numerous variations on those exercises. and then they toss in some “pumping” for individual muscles after that. They keep the big lifts somewhat heavy, and then use a higher rep range for the bodybuilding stuff.

then look at the other corner, the person that uses baby weights for high reps to isolate their puny frame and probably looks the same year in year out. I am not saying lighter weights high reps for hypertrophy have zero value but I strongly think what most needs to do in the gym is get moderately strong, and that means progressive resistance with significant poundages until a decent base level of strength is reached. It's only at that point that specializing with comparatively light loads and higher reps might actually accomplish something.

I m willing to bet the former guy WILL LOOK jacked.

Again I m not saying high reps hypertrophy is bad, but if u can;t achieve a basic decent level of strength .. hmmm .. using the average malaysian as benchmark is bad, the average malaysian is scrawny and look malnourished. Look around here anyone here with respectable physique with appreciable mass (darklight + angrydog .. ok I know they get over-referenced biggrin.gif) has definitely achieved and built that strong foundation. and no this is not a leg press vs squat argument, training muscles in various ranges of motion, providing for unique positions, isolating various joints and muscles, and/or providing constant tension throughout full ranges of motion is encouraged but please at least achieve the basic yardstick before arguing the minutia.
ken86
post Jan 5 2011, 02:59 PM

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QUOTE(shiloong7081 @ Jan 5 2011, 12:45 PM)
'However, this does not apply to the general population, where no study has ever found an association between low-sodium diets and a reduced incidence of cardiovascular or other diseases. Average results from large study groups are not a useful guide to determine optimal treatment for a particular patient. A low fat diet can elevate cholesterol in some even though a mean decrease may occur in a population. An eight-year study of New York hypertensives found that those on low-salt diets had more than four times as many heart attacks as controls with normal sodium intake.'

One of the extracts.

This is exactly same as the cholesterol in eggs myth. Some of them are still perpetuating the myth that fact that too much eggs can harm you while most of us here still pop 10-20 eggs and believe that it isn't harmful. You CHOOSE what you want to BELIEVE and that closes your mind and makes you refuse to accept any other fact besides your own.
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this is very true

I think Beliefs are not facts. They’re only interpretations of value judgments you make about yourself, your experiences, and the world around you. Think of beliefs as mental software installed in your brain that takes in raw data through your senses and then applies meaning to it

For instance, say low-carb diets, for example, have legitimate fat-loss benefits such as decreasing appetite and controlling insulin. Unfortunately, when someone is successful with a low-carb diet, they often take on dogmatic and inaccurate beliefs. For the rest of their lives, they might look at almost all carbohydrates as fattening and since they counted carbs, not calories, they often think that calories don’t count, a dangerous and false belief. But try convincing a formerly obese low-carb dieter of that (it’s about as easy as getting them to change their religion).

I think Kasey made some solid points and some well debatable points as well. What strikes me the most is he actually has his own certification program ? and SPECIALIZATION in myriad of things (including bodybuilding science and powerlifting science) sure the amount of online literature avaiable is not hard to learn the science, what about actually wearing them posing trunks or actually prep someone for a real powerlifting meet ?

Popular names like charles poliquin, eric cressey, christian thibaudeau etc spend years honing their craft and actually have some sort of unreal feats or physique

let's look at some individuals with popular CERTIFICATION programs and tons of real life result. Of course many will spend much internet time to refute some of their claims to grow a longer e-penis

Poliquin Certification - gets result train tons of PROFESSIONAL Athletes , Bodybuilders, etc
user posted image

Paul Chek - He has many insane concepts (spritual and body) but guess what there are tons of real world results he is getting, do I agree with everything he says .. HELL NO
user posted image

John Berardi of Precision Nutrition Certification - the amount of successful b4 and afters
user posted imageuser posted image


and well

Kasey Brown of KB fitness certification ?
user posted image

besides that I don;t blog but I m sure increasing blog traffic by clicking on your blog link helps u in some ways and don't forget the donation button guys. Like everything in this world. Pick a topic, and you’ll inevitably find those on the far left of any topic, as well as those on the far right.

- Steady State Cardio: it will either make you look like an emaciated runway model or get you shredded.
- Organic vs. Conventional: you either hate Earth, or you don’t.

I am glad u are divulging good info, kasey but acting like every of your replies is the standard and referencing your BOOK whenever possible is not. I am sure a few here that are frustrated or some newbies 'looking' to build chest and bicep will message u...
ken86
post Jan 6 2011, 12:27 AM

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QUOTE(Kasey Brown @ Jan 5 2011, 06:14 PM)
Let me see if I got this straight.

My certification course isn't worth it...

.... because ....

My biceps aren't big enough.

......................... and you want to talk about e-penis?
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Lol @ your nitpicking skills. Let’s rehash a little, I said many will spend time refuting popular fitness professional claims (for instance mike boyle claim of single leg work > bilateral leg work) and defending what they believe vehemently, it was directed to the platoon of so called internet gurus that spends much time to garner attention and increasing blog visit count ?

Let’s be frank only the biceps part are lacking ? I let everyone else be the judge

I am big fan of the old adage – walking the walk, talking the talk. Look at the few fitness professionals I mentioned with credible CERTIFICATION programs – they sure as hell applied what they preached, and look the part. Sure I agree with fitting fast food meals and binge a lil into a balanced diet theory. The law of thermodynamics energy in = energy out? surplus/deficit?

but well the ultimate question, is it working for you ? what are the results with real clients (considering 8 years of experience u do establish quite a large clientèle) ?

I am big fan of scientific evidence and anecdotal evidence as well. If u ever read about Mc D burgers, those stuff never decay. Sure the meat is heavily processed and high in sodium (awesome preservative), the bun ? let’s dissect the ingredients

Here's what McDonald's own website says you'll find in their buns:

Enriched flour (bleached wheat flour, malted barley flour, niacin, reduced iron, thiamin mononitrate, riboflavin, folic acid,enzymes), water, high fructose corn syrup, sugar, yeast,soybean oiland/or partially hydrogenated soybeanoil, contains 2% or less of the following: salt,calciumsulfate, calcium carbonate, wheat gluten, ammonium sulfate, ammonium chloride, dough conditioners (sodium stearoyl lactylate, datem, ascorbic acid, azodicarbonamide, mono- and diglycerides, ethoxylated monoglycerides, monocalcium phosphate, enzymes, guar gum, calcium peroxide,soyflour), calcium propionate and sodium propionate (preservatives), soy lecithin.

Hydrogenated oils ? HFCS ( the stuff they use in your soft drinks as well) ? and the long ass list of chemicals ?

In your upcoming nutrition talk post (yes i read it)

- They provide lots of carbohydrates for energy and replenishment, and plenty of B vitamins for when you've got a hard day ahead of you. There's countless other benefits, and contrary to popular belief, there's nothing in McDonalds food that will hurt you
-Lets take a trip back in time. It's the 1820s, America, the wild wild west. A farm hand wakes up at 5 AM and gets his work boots on, and ready's himself for the day ahead. He sits down to breakfast. What does he have? Bacon and eggs covered in grease, cream milk, a side of juicy red meat, pan cakes with loads of syrup, fried potatoes and some other slop. He eats this way three times a day.


U totally miss the part of including fitting mac donald food into a BALANCED diet and mac donalds not a end all ,by all solution , really good sales pitch btw - totally getting that sedentary fat blob attention

Back then bacon was actually real meat (i love real bacon made of real pork - butcher do sell them and eat it in morning with scrambled eggs), cream milk (came for cow that was not tortured to produce milk (no stress), juicy red meat (beef i presume and definitely grass fed back then – rich in good fats = awesome stuff – definitely not the same thing in a mc donalds patty), pan cakes with loads of syrup (back then syrup was the real thang not flavoured with maple flavoured and sweetened with HFCS), fried potatoes (great stuff). Of course they were healthier back then.

And now look what happend with evolution of food - diabetes, obesity etc ? causation ? correlation ?

I m sure we all know how terrible this HFCS is

Scientific evidence
1. Abraha, A., et al. Acute effect of fructose on postprandial lipaemia in diabetic and non-diabetic subjects. British Journal of Nutrition (1998), 80, 169—175.
2. Acheson, K., et al. Glycogen storage capacity and de novo lipogenesis during massive carbohydrate overfeeding in man. Am J Clin Nutr 1988 Aug;48(2):240-7
3. Anderson, H. Much ado about high-fructose corn syrup in beverages: the meat of the matter. Am J Clin Nutr 2007;86:1577— 8.
4. Bantle, J., et al. Effects of dietary fructose on plasma lipids in healthy subjects. Am J Clin Nutr 2000 Nov; 72(5): 1128-34.
5. Bray, G., et al. Consumption of high-fructose corn syrup in beverages may play a role in the epidemic of obesity. Am J Clin Nutr. 2004 Apr;79(4):537-43.
6. Buchholz AC, Schoeller DA. Is a calorie a calorie? Am J Clin Nutr. 2004 May;79(5):899S-906S.
7. Clarkston, W., et al. Evidence for the anorexia of aging: gastrointestinal transit and hunger in healthy elderly vs. young adults. Am J Physiol. 1997 Jan;272(1 Pt 2):R243-8.
8. DellaValle, D., et al. Does the consumption of caloric and non-caloric beverages with a meal affect energy intake? Appetite. 2005 Apr;44(2):187-93
9. Edelbroek M., et al. Gastric emptying and intragastric distribution of oil in the presence of a liquid or a solid meal. J Nucl Med 33(7): 1283-90.
10. Fried S, Rao S. Sugars, hypertriglyceridemia, and cardiovascular disease. Am J Clin Nutr 2003 78(4): 873S-880S
11. Gaby, A., Adverse effects of dietary fructose. Alt Med Rev. 2005 10(4): 294-306.

Source - http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_articl...ling_corn_syrup

HFCS is that stuff found in most your fast food meals

guess what is this
user posted image

While the above photo looks like yummy strawberry soft-serve ice cream, it is actually mechanically separated chicken. After the primary cuts of meat are taken from the chicken the carcass is passed through a high pressure sieve to recover the lovely substance you see above. This is what is often used to make chicken nuggets, hot dogs, and pressed into those little blocks behind the deli counter from which we slice off cold cuts.

Sure fitting in fast food meals in a BALANCED DIET is definitely not an issue. But think about the normal sedentary individual, given the leeway, they tend to fall off the bandwagon quickly with the usual self rationalization (oh hey another extra fast food won’t hurt since I m in a pinch!). I call this the slippery slope theory.

btw attaching image into a post is (IMG)http://(/IMG) i see you linking ur pics, just helping out. replacing ( ) with [ ]

concise version : Sure fitting fast food into a balanced diet theory sounds good, but is it working ?

This post has been edited by ken86: Jan 6 2011, 12:35 AM
ken86
post Jan 6 2011, 01:41 AM

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QUOTE(Kasey Brown @ Jan 6 2011, 01:21 AM)
>> Let’s be frank only the biceps part are lacking ? I let everyone else be the judge

>> I am big fan of the old adage – walking the walk, talking the talk. Look at the few fitness professionals I mentioned with credible CERTIFICATION programs

◘ Are you implying that the only thing that makes a certification program credible is how big your biceps are or how much you can bench?

>> they sure as hell applied what they preached, and look the part.

◘ So you're saying I dont practice what I preach?  You don't even know me, or what I do in the gym.

Besides, how much could this this guy bench?  http://www.verkhoshansky.com/

Or this guy?  http://www.melsiff.net/

All you've got is a single picture of me, and with that you're making an awful lot of assumptions.

>> U totally miss the part of including fitting mac donald food into a BALANCED diet and mac donalds not a end all ,by all solution , really good sales pitch btw - totally getting that sedentary fat blob attention

◘ You answered that one yourself.  It was a sales pitch, yes, meant to grab attention.

>> Hydrogenated oils ? HFCS ( the stuff they use in your soft drinks as well) ? and the long ass list of chemicals ?

◘ Burden of proof.  You have to provide evidence that any of the ingredients listed is damaging to one's health.

Since you've provided studies on the HFCS, I'll need at least 2 or 3 days to scrutinize them and either debunk them or amend some of my earlier recommendations.
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If your notion of a physique encompasses a big bicep and how much one can bench, then well I am lost for words.

Verkhoshansky and mel siff are both sports scientist (both spend their life time) and their research benefited many athletes and they actually have a school of successful athletes under their wings. What's next charlie francis ? Vladimir Issurin's block periodization ? Zatsiorsky ? Charlie francis has ben johnson, both verkhoshansky and mel siff (both no longer around) contributed much literature that help REINVENT THE WHEEL of athletic training . I bet they don't claim to have SPECIALIZATION in a myriad of things. oH yea charlie francis - not around anymore as well sad

Well that single picture speaks volume, if u are in a dire need to prove me wrong ? why not post a recent pic and not spend days to debunk the long list of studies ?
user posted image

my copy of programming and organization of training by verkhoshansky



ken86
post Jan 6 2011, 05:52 PM

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QUOTE(Kasey Brown @ Jan 6 2011, 04:08 PM)
user posted image

Give me a few days.
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you seem to avoid the fundamental questions I have been enquiring which doesn't take days to answer. You can sieve through the long list of scientific studies , do u need access to some of those pubmed articles? I still have access to the pubmed database (perks of being a student studying masters)

the ultimate question, is it working for you (your theory on McDonalds)? what are the results with real clients (considering 8 years of experience u do establish quite a large clientèle) ?

further probing on this post http://kaseybrownfitness.blogspot.com/2010...er-size-me.html

There is absolutely nothing wrong with McDonalds food, and I enjoyed getting my fries SuperSized when I went there. Especially on a leg day where I was about to squat 5 sets of 10, then deadlift another 5 sets of 10, and needed that many carbs. On these days I'd normally have 2 super sized fries, 2 double cheese burgers, and a large sprite. This would come to around 2,500 calories, which was perfect for getting me through the workout and keeping me anabolic before, during, and after. My 16 inch biceps, 32 inch waist, and 6 pack abs on a 168 cm (5 foot 6 inches) frame spoke volumes on how perfect it was. I'd often recommend my clients to stop by McDonalds and "tank up" a good 2 hours before they came to see me. The results for them were similar: faster, harder, more accelerating workouts with extreme results in strength, muscle mass, and fat loss.

really ? Extreme results ? 6 pack abs ?


Saturated fat and cholesterol not the culprit of heart diseases etc ? I think this has been beaten to death , and the fear of yolks and REAL dairy butter not hydrogenated variant is unfounded. Same goes for sodium

I would take 6 people. Place 3 on diets that frequently included McDonalds food, and 3 that were strictly vegetarian (since everyone think that's healthy). All would be placed on an exercise program, and cameras would follow them around in their everyday lives. We'd turn this into a documentary. At the end of 12 weeks we'd see just how weak, frail, and nutritionally drained the vegetarian group is, and how fit and muscular the McDonalds group is.

U didn't include the frequency of Mc Donalds food (how many?) and note DIETS that frequently included mcdonalds food (cheat meal anyone?) and you are comparing it to a vegetarian group (I hope they are of the lacto-ovo kind - eat eggs and milk).
ken86
post Jan 10 2011, 03:35 PM

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QUOTE(mannquin @ Jan 10 2011, 02:21 PM)
I consuming to much of calories? I calculated the amount of calories I need per day and it was around 2670 and to gain weight some say I just need to exceed it by no more than 500 to gain lean mass and now my diet is almost 4.5k calories. Can someone please clarify me on this? I'd classify myself a hard gainer btw
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There are no magical formula to determine the exact calories one needs.

The best approach is pick one and start from there. for e.g. u calculated 2670 + 500 = 3170 as baseline, start from here, monitor weekly and monthly (if u intend to stay relatively lean, I'd aim for 1 - 3lbs weight increase per month). If the scale is not moving and you are stalling for more than 2 weeks then increase the calories further by 200 - 500 (or more , depending on body type). Starting at 4k calories is a little too high and too soon, start from a lower number and work your way up.

user posted image 175 lbs
user posted image 192 lbs

being natural (I am not saying this is an disadvantage but if you are like me, we just wanna look good nekkid and not step onto the stage or compete or whatever, I see no point at all), the progress is going to be slow(ER) if you opt for the more lean mass and minimal fat gain process.

a good tip to consume the creatine, just measure 5g in a shot glass, fill it with water/whatever liquid your heart desire and wash it down quickly.

This post has been edited by ken86: Jan 10 2011, 03:38 PM
ken86
post Feb 25 2011, 10:29 AM

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QUOTE(TrutHatHand @ Feb 24 2011, 10:45 PM)
questions:

squat: its my 1st day of doing squats with a barbell and with back is straight the whole time... but after each set i feel my lower back worked as well, is this normal or i've did it with bad  form?

clean: 1st day doing this also, i felt my wrist is being stressed when the bar is on my shoulder. Sumtimes after the pull i will loose balance forcing me to take a step forward. Ways to avoid this?
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poor wrist flexibility and not used to the racking position. Watch some instructional videos on cleans and racking (regardless of squat cleans or power clean you are referring to) and losing balance is probably loose form or most likely performing the clean on some foam laden sports shoe

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