but there are different ways of achieveing ur goals...

cheap ways..and expensive ways..

in the end..u will still reach ur final destination if u r good and the chance arises....

A person without dream is like a body without soul.A corpse.Read through your blog and knew how hard is it for you to get accepted into UCL but I hope the rational side of you put the most important things ahead of just fantasy and dream.Wishing you all the best and may the miracle you are hoping on, happens

Hey TS,

Just wondering. If you spent all that money and be stuck with a job that you hate in Malaysia for 10-15 years just because u need to pay back your loan, would you still do it?

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Added on May 25, 2010, 12:14 pmI think it's easier to get into UCL for postgrad. azarimy got into UCL's Bartlett with 3.0 CGPA degree from UTM only
http://forum.lowyat.net/index.php?showtopi...&#entry30380700


This post has been edited by Syd G: May 25 2010, 12:15 PM

Hello ccm123,

I have been following your post with great interest and came to realize that most replies offered were given by people of older ages (one even from an spm-freshie!). For a change, I am here as a person who is in the same situation as yourself.

Similarly, I have been offered a conditional place by UCL for it's Engineering course along by a university in the United States with a ranking of Top 5 for that particular Engineering course. Our similarities do not end there, for I have fared slightly above average in my academic results (10A1 in SPM) and was denied of every scholarship application, although I have nothing positive or negative to comment about that. We live in a country where academic excellence accompanied with satisfying co-curricular records are blurred by the colour of our skins. I do not have to mention that an overseas education experience has been stuck in my mind for as long as I could remember.

Finance is and will always be my greatest worry. I am more than inclined for a United States education which would require a little more than RM450,000. My parents are able to cover approximately half of that amount, and I have thought about covering the other half with the JPA loan of a maximum RM200,000. I would then apply for a job in the US to repay back my parents and the loan. As easy as it sounds, these are all based on assumptions. IF JPA would be able to offer me the loan, IF I would be able to get a job there upon graduation, IF..

I have had people telling me that I only live once, so take the chance for a good quality education and who knows what I might find on my way there. I have had people telling me that it is a ridiculous amount for an undergraduate degree, and that I should just study in Monash Malaysia (KL) and consider migration after that.

Believe me when I say I understand how you feel, our decisions are swaying every time we consider different advice given by different people, especially those that make perfect sense. I cannot tell you what to do, but I can tell you to consider the bank loan you are planning to apply for. 7.5% is a hefty amount of interest to repay, along with the JPA loan although I do realize that for the first 40 months (3 years 4 months) you need only to repay Rm400 per month. I believe also that you are awaiting the results of Shell Scholarship 2010. Who knows, it might just work out for you.

Just remember that your decision should be what you consider best for yourself, and I wish you all the best. Please do keep us updated on your next course of actions

then unorthodox91, u r a little different. unlike economics or finance papers where ppl can opt for globally recognised professional papers in any part of the world. I am a finance ppl and we can study, earn and improve as long as there are internet connection, phone, laptop and calculator. where our country simply dunhv tht resources for best engineering education. for top science ppl to stuck in less-developed country engineering is rather wasted. educational qualities directly impacted ur future, not only life experience or dream. u hv a harder dilemma i would say.

This post has been edited by Aster66: May 25 2010, 03:45 PM

i agree with some of the people here.
its not worth spending that amount of money just for a degree.
after all NUS is not that bad of a choice right?
you should work your socks off in NUS and then you might grab a change to enter UCL/ Oxford/ Cambridge or whatever prestigious school for your postgrad.

Thanks

No, because I know if I were to get myself involved in such a loan, I wont come back Malaysia to work for sure. If its lowest I had to go, take washing the dish in UK for example, I'll do it because I picked that decision and I am liable to it. After all, I was the one who dug that hole is the first place, I might fell on it, or I might just crossed that hole successfully.

Hei, we're in the same boat! I agree the part where most replies were given by people of older ages, after all they were the people who have seen the world enough to make such remarks, which I do appreciate very much. But young people like us just have a burning spirit to achieve the dreams that motivates us huh.

Btw, did u apply to NUS as well? Or HKUST for that matter?

Since you're saying that, have you decided to go US? I really wish you can go there, since like you said, your parents could afford half the fees. The land of US has more to offer, if compared to Malaysia I'd say, and trust me you'll do very well there. While I was working two weeks back, a random uncle approached me and asked me about some questions related to the product he purchased, then he complimented me for the advice I gave him, which he proceeded with talking to me about education stuffs. He even told me this, if you have to wash the dish there, even if that's the lowest you have to go, trust me, just go, you'll do far better than being in this land. I have no idea why he made such a remark, but out of no where he just told me these, the moment before that I was still confused and baffling between the choice of furthering my studies. It served not only as an inspiration from no where, but a force of motivation that told me to pursue my dreams.

Of course that happened before the thread was even created, after reading more and more of the negative replies, I finally figured it was a very naive/silly/absurd/ridiculous and whatever words that people have used to tell me about this dream I had. Heck I was even accused of things that I've never mentioned simply because most people perceived the idea in a different manner, i.e to invest so much on nothing but a piece of degree, but it was okay, some hold great true in it. Then, after considering the big picture, the rational in me finally manifested into a wake up call which tells me to let that decision to go, although it was devastating move but LOGICAL nonetheless.

I am not saying NUS is not a good uni, and I know a lot of people are dying to get there. It is just the fact that I'm more inclined towards heading somewhere further, like UK for instances, not only for the education itself, but the environment and life there. But in this position where I'm a self funded students, I guess it just made things more complicated. Long story short, I shall concentrate more on NUS for now, if and only if there's some miracle which happened somewhere in between.

p/s: I just got a email for interview for EPF scholarship next week, and it could be my last shot, and I pray I could do my very best.

I think may be it is even harder to get into NUS than UCL.

good luck in the EPF scholarship!

just so you know, a lot of my friends who did get jobs in the UK aren't planning to stay long for reasons such as incredibly high tax AND cost of living as well as lower chance of progression due to the competition. Most of them are just staying until they complete their certification papers (ICAEW and CFA) and are then planning to apply to Singapore or HK.

So technically, as a Singapore grad you're already ahead of the game.

Personally, since I'm not in finance, I decided to come back because I believe the opportunities in Malaysia are better.

Lower initial salary? yes.
Better chance of progression? Definite.

Of course, I may be wrong and get stuck in a dead end job but I'll deal with that should the need arise.

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Added on May 25, 2010, 7:06 pmdepends on what course. Anyone who goes to Bartlett will basically not have a life until they graduate. the econs program is one of the top 3 in the country and the Biochem Eng department is ranked second in the world.

then again, I dont know what NUS acceptance requires but Im pretty sure that depends on the course as well.

This post has been edited by 0mars: May 25 2010, 07:06 PM

Omars,

How do you define progression and what do you mean by lower chance of progression?

getting straight A is not a big deal.
securing a job, climb the ranks, perform well with some thinking is a BIG DEAL.
many people out there (nerds) who burn midnight oil, emphasizing on paper result end up being what? slaves to cooperate when they couldnt even express themselves in work environment. Eg, an engineer who found out a way to reduce cost for a machine but lack of confidence,shy, or whatever individual skills to make a presentation to the board will forever only stuck in his office chair being instructed what to do.

anyway that is an off topic. In my opinion, dont pursue things that you cant afford. It might sounds good for your future receiving a paper from UCL. It may help you to obtain some impression from your employer initially but in the end of the day, the best worker outperforms. If you have the capabilities, settle down on NUS (which is already reputable) , get a job and do well. that 7% interest per annum is abit high. Even i dont even feel like paying my 1% PTPTN loan lol.

As some ppl mentioned, you can always do masters during ur final year. I believe with ur persistance, you will obtain some scholarship in no time. However, foreign influence is undoubtly useful. You could use that chance to communicate more with foreigners and abolish chinese-sticking-groups that gets you no where.

Sir, that statement is true even if you're in the UK and only stick to Msians/Singaporeans. You can have friends outside your own race in Malaysia too

totally agree. ppl at different age see different things want different things (feels Im really getting old now >_<). I wanted too to study in somewhere lovely for my life experience no matter wht price to pay. but now, Im so glad I did not, at least not for my degree. studying is not everything in life, there are so many more to achieve. seriously, I only realised what I really wan in life after I graduted from university. and after I came out to work only I realised how different is reality vs actuality. how ugly can human be.

if you're talented and so intelligence, u can make it out anywhere, would u stil willing to wash plate behind dirty street with a uk degree for higher $$? isnt it wasted ur intelligence? when u say better life experience studying abroad then how bout the life experience after gruaduated? sometimes ppl will only feel it when paying few thousands to bank and not buying a favourite toy for ur kids in christmas. for tht amount of money to spend on my abroad degree, it would be able to rebuild 20 or more schools in Haiti or Sichuan, benefiting few hundreds of students, unless I am sure I would be another world price winner for economist or so, creating theories that benefit few thousands of students in future, else my parents gonna be damn loaded nowhere else to spend the money.

I dunno, I only learned how to appreciate life when Im off from glucose and gas, when I buried my beloved one, realising it's not a nighmare that will just puuf and disappear when I wake up. al these money cant buy, success cant buy.

This post has been edited by Aster66: May 26 2010, 10:17 AM

So True.

Totally agree!!
It's a kinda big amount for me.
Somemore NUS is quite well-known, not a bad choice.
You should really think about it properly.

400k is alot of money. You could've gotten yourself a brand new two-storey terrace with that money at the end of 15years, instead of repaying loans like a bankrupt.

A cert from UCl is definitely a passport to your first job but then on its you who pave the path.

But it's really up to you to decide. It's your choice. Just don't put the blame on anyone should you not reach your goals in the future.

Unfortunately, not much practice it nowadays.Sad but true.

career progression in terms of say, promotions or being chosen for further training i.e. MBA's or in a technical career, specialist training.
What I mean by having a lower chance of progression (at least in my opinion) is that, from my experience, although I'm a first class honours student, I'm still simply on par with the top of my class. The bar is set quite high and as each of us reaches it, someone pushes it higher. The general culture within my course is too perform and continuously grow and improve. However, when I then carried out an internship in Malaysia, I found that the general mentality was not to compete and be the best, but simply to "do enough" to get by.

Now, keeping in mind that I do not believe the whole workforce can be generalized like that, the simple fact that this culture exists allows the high performers to really stand out (with less competitors than you would have in the UK) which in itself should lead to more opportunities to progress.

I do hope I have not insulted anyone with the opinions above. It was not my intention in any way.

whats the hype about UCL? how is it ranked? sorry for my ignorance.

since you are going to study econs then think like an economist. think of the costs (yeah you know, trade offs, opportunity those things you learn in your text). where would you be better off? take utility into consideration as well. CALCULATE and choose the one which yields highest TU.

good luck!

http://www.topuniversities.com/university-...gs/2009/results