Bro, no one asked u to build a cold room but if you need, buy a chiller instead but that will drain you about Rm1500, I think. Chiller use very little electricity as the cold air remain inside as cold air is heavier than hot air unless you open it very regularly.

Without any chiller or freezer, If you keep it dry and pack well so that no air will cause discoloration, you nests will still be great after many years as I did have some 26 years ago and it was alittle brownish. I kept them for remembrance of my first harvesting at the BH but only those very white ones and the last time I saw it about two years ago, they were very good, brittle and alittle light brown only. So, if keep well and your nest will be OK for many years to come...that's my experience with it anyway.

One reminder, never keep/sealed your nests immediately after harvest unless you intend to sell it fast otherwise, it will discolor . Dry it properly and keep them and they will remain well for years and do separate the whites from the brownish as the dirty ones will affect the quality of the white nests and shits is another matter when storing BN as these shits tend to discolor the nests when not dry properly.

This post has been edited by West Wing: Sep 28 2011, 10:08 AM

I agree with you that we already have sufficient laws to cover all but whether anyone to enforce them or that money can and I know that money do talk and they really well can as we all know too well.
talk
So, be creating a new Law will only put more opportunities and cash into the people who are going to enforce the Law. As usual, new Laws will only create havoc and money missing from our pocket into someone else pockets.......like my son once said about my Rm50 note.....Dad, your Rm50 just flow out of the window with the P******.

So, be prepare for more burden and cost if you intend to start new BH cos your present budget didn't include the extra cost.

As far as I see, if the GOV is sincere in wanting to solve the problem, control the export of nests from the country in any ways possible and allowable.
Heavy penalties and even jail sentences to those involved in shipping fake or adulterated nests.

When they control the export, the buyers, sellers, exporters and manufacturers will abide by the regulations and they will only buy real nests to process without using chemical or breaching agents. So, without needing to control too much and cause hardship to the providers of swiftlets sanctuaries which many are poor kampung raayat. Having too many restrictions at the BHs will only hamper the development of the industry.
I can foresee that the control of BH will be a failure cos there are really too many thousands to control and many hundreds are going to start soon or in the process of wanting to do one. I hope that I am wrong but will bet on it anytime that I am right. Control the buyers and processing plants will be the better option to take at the moment.

If the buyers and processing plants insist on certain standards otherwise they will need to pay heavy fines or banned from dealing in EBN , the BH owners will automatically need to toe the line and ensure that their nests pass the requirements of the buyers.

Just like recently, the oil palms hit high and alots of Oil Palm owners harvested the fruits before they are ripe to make fast money and therefore the factories make losses in processing the fruits. As we know that green oil palm bunches are useless and have no oil so the the factory insist on ripe fruits or else they will be rejects unlike previously, discount which doesn't serve any purpose. The planters need to be teach a lesson not to try to cheat and got caught, all will be lost. Control at the buying station and all will be well and by the way, it wasn't our nests having problem in China in the first place, right??????

Like other departments, it about time that departments concerned in this industry help to develop better quality nests, better yield and safer method of ranching. Just my talk talk as usual.

This post has been edited by West Wing: Sep 29 2011, 07:03 PM

[quote=kohloh,Sep 30 2011, 12:54 PM]
[quote=Cergau,Sep 29 2011, 06:06 PM]
Just back from PutraJaya..left early before the end to avoid the commuter rush hour.

1)My observation...MOH seem sincere in wanting to resolve the issue with China
2)They claim to be in touch with their Chinese counterparts...and are enforcing our existing food safety regulations to comply with the Chinese requirement of 0 PPM for the stuff. The Fed Assoc have reiterated that that stuff occur naturally in raw EBN (this require you guys to verify) and 0ppm is not achievable. MOH claim that they have indicative positive response with their Chinese counterpart for 1 ppm....yet to be confirmed.
MANY CLAIM HERE THEY KNOW THE RIGHT WAY TO PROCESS NEST N KNOW ALL BOUT IT
simple ,bring some of yr raw n cleaned n run a lab test that is cheap n they have branch every state

http://www.bphealthcare.com/BPLab/contactus.asp

to get the nitrite ppm/Kg then only talk weather yr nest is qualify fr export then only talk bout wat kind of box should use n wat kind of tracking they wanna post
= DROP AGAIN

[/quote]

Hope the next time there is meeting or dialog or any such matter, I can be there to learn and to voice my opinion. If less than I % nitrate is only allowed, then the only way to pass is to process the nests here into nest cake form by dilution the content of the nitrated by filtration. Then if required as half cup nests, reassemble the nests back into half cups of any size required. This way, there will be no feather either also standard pricing for all type of nests. This It is my guessing only as I am not an expert in the field.

Maybe, some experts in the field can give advice on how to achieve less than1% nitrate bird nests. Otherwise, all in the buz, pls pray to GOD for answer.

This post has been edited by West Wing: Oct 1 2011, 02:28 PM

TQ for the info and sorry for 1ppm and OMan know only old things and even aroma and perfume also seem strange to OM as I understand Shit and Nesting smell. TQ very much.

The truth is that there is no news that is good news but only news that will not put you in hospital for heart attack.

The problems with the China issue and V-Dept haven't been resolved and also the falling price of our nests, now news of the health Dept want a share in the Buz and wanted all owners to register with the Health Dept.

The health dept doesn't understand that raw birdnests do not come under their jurisdiction and their argument is that food is under them and come on... Why cows and other animals not under them but only the meat.....so, it's only if processed nests like bottled nest ready for immediate consumption should only come under their jurisdiction and not our raw nests..

I heard that the health dept has given a 30/09/2011 deadline to the Fed. swiftlets Asso. on this matter but the Fed Asso. refer them to the V Dept if they want to be involved in the lucrative trade. I think our PM need to make a "STOP" to all other GOV. Depts and that only the Vet. Dept is concerned with the industry.

One trouble has solved, next one started and still more to come and now, here the MPK issue a notice to some BHs @ town to demolish all work illegally done on the buildings (BHs).....or will bring the owners to court if fail to comply. Now, we need to seek the help of the MB and YBs and seek their help in the matter above.

Also, HK suppliers are said to have tons of Red nests at hand and so guess what they are going to do with it and HKian are the kingmaker of the trade and they don't go down easily.

Sekian, Berita Hari Ini

This post has been edited by West Wing: Oct 3 2011, 12:32 PM

Good Morning, my friend.

Partition is required when your birds refuse to stay due to disturbances of the natural kind or that a certain area has no EBN due to infighting among the ketua burung. To fasten birds growth, some form of partition maybe require to allow other gang of birds to start a new settlement in your BH.

Hinder of bird path, no unless you purposely done a nasty U turn or Z path that may not be problem with old birds but certainly will be with inexperienced new birds which are the ones you want.

Normally, new BHs started without partitions but gradually will if situation require it. If all go well, why partition cos you have the 1Malaysia group of birds there and if they aren't the harmony types, then partition out and you now have 2 or more new rooms; like human being, if all can stay together, all is well, otherwise, partition out and there will be less infighting and more toward making new babies.

Hope that I answered you well.




This post has been edited by West Wing: Oct 4 2011, 08:58 AM

From my findings, birds feeding from nearby river usually are bigger in size as they feed well and as such have bigger nests. Birds feeding at barren land usually are leaner as they feed on insect that are also smaller and thinner in size. From my experience, River gang will chase out hill gang so here is where partition play a role by allowing the smaller species to survive in your BH or otherwise they may need to move out. All Experts tell you that your birds will remain faithful to your BH but I believe differently as the birds will remain if the situation allow them.....my theory is that the bigger birds do displace small birds if the location is good and the poor smaller ones will find another location in your BH to build their nests. Like all animal, there are the bullies and the weaklings, the leaders and the followers......but we welcome them all.......don't be selfish only to allow the big nest builders to stay and force out the small nest builders and the dirty nests builders, too when you have no room to spare. Remember, these small and dirty/feathered nests builders maybe the pioneers and the ones that lead the rest over to your BH in the early days of your BH.

Also, my finding in the BH tell me that there are many more sub species of swiftlets that produce slightly different type of nests but I am getting too weak after a leg operation to observe the birds these years and I shall leave these works to younger men to find out.

On Nitrite, I have read that nitrite will be much lesser after soaking and draining with water and will disappear "0%" after cooking and wonder if it's true.

A few days ago, I met a buyer from Selangor and he told me that he is owner of a processing plant here in Selangor and he was here to buy if we want to sell. he quoted Rm2850 for half cup but I asked for at least Rm3400 but were turn down cos he said that he can buy any amount at lower price from Indo to process here and if this is true, then what exported from Malaysia are not Malaysian Nest either. So, the authorities concerned should take step to protect our local industry from being damage by these illegal importing of nests which maybe contaminated. I learned from him is that the Chinese people are still buying and eating. He has no problem of getting buyers from China but the difficulties are on how to get the nests there as the authorities are hard on the import of nests as we all know that most of the nests are illegally imported into China. Here, the authorities do not make export of nests easier and infact too complicated and so most will use the easier way and that's to bypass the Law.

As I did mentioned that the authority should only need to make the exporters accountable for the nests exported from Malaysia and if so, there shouldn't be any future problem with nitrite or color nests. If Malaysian BH did have Red nests naturally (which I will be surprised), then let them export but they must take the blamed if these nests are found to be contaminated with impurities or others.

Most Red nests producers in our country state that their Red nests are natural nests harvested from the BH but I believe that they add and help alittle in the making of the Red nest by spraying chemical or fungus (or maybe special planks/metal ceiling) before harvesting. Their argument is that cave red nests are also cause by fungus or metals in the cave and so by adding such oxide or fungus on to the unharvested nests shouldn't be a reason at all. What in nature can be accepted but what added to shouldn't be allowed.

It just like wild and domesticated pigs; the wild pigs do come with natural parasites and diseases but we never allow on domesticated pigs.

Just my views on the matter to share.

Once you got nests, even at Rm1K, you still make money but then we want is a fair price and not to be taken advantage off and that's the reason that I am still holding on to my nests as I believe that the nest deserve a better price.

Poor thing is that for new BH owners yet to have any harvesting, the downgrading of the price surely cause pain and sorrow. Many worry and must have be thinking of selling off the BHs while they still can.

Don't worry, I would advice these people cos the moon maybe small today but certain you will see the full reappearing again not very soon and will certainly be by the time you start harvesting.........be patient. Your money is well invested. My super size BH is still under construction and yet I am happy and not afraid like nobody is gonna buy the nests as I don't have any from this BH to sell.....Do have faith in yourself.

Remember that the bird nests have thousand years historic record to prove its usage and usefulness. Then, only Emperor and royal family can had them then so now to be able to eat it is already a royal gift. So, tell me how low can health food for the Emperor of China be price low and it should be priceless but then priceless must have a price tag ..hahahaha Have a good day, my friend and don't think about the EBN for a week or so.

See, we do have many good guys around helping to solve the present problem.....one thing we must consider is that Malaysia is a small country which China doesn't look up to...meaning that if we are America, then this situation is long aver.

If only the Chinese authorities listen to our reasoning; give Malaysia GOM the chance to explain, all will be well. The chinese have been eating the good thing, birdnest for many generations and remain healthy so this should be just a hiccup and over in no time.

So, be strong and confidence as this isn't the first time we encounter problem with low price and we shall see the sun again.

Bro, I understand you well as I am also there but be positive and there is always a way out of every situation.

Facts remain that birdnests are very good for health and it's only those bastards creating a storm by creating bad bird nests that give the end users less confidence in eating bird nests.

Likewise meats are healthy only if those animals slaughtered are healthy and clean. If the rich people taking birdnests understand these reasoning and will only buy from reliable sources, then they shall have no worry and full of benefits to them. What's good with money if you cannot eat well. We, Malaysian may go into retails outlets buz in China to ensure end users get the real thing just like when pork is too expensive due to hugh profit taking by the middlemen , the farmers sell directly to the end users bypassing the middle men which make pork very expensive. We can create Malaysian Brand in China and build up a trusted Brand only available from our outlets in China to safeguard the Malaysian pure nests market in China. Rich people want to eat but don't know the real from the fake....no thanks to our fellow exporters and China retailers who are only interested in making fast cash without considering long term gains........typical of Chinese men, many are myopic by nature.

If we give up already, we must as well sell off our BHs and put the cash into the bank. Be brave and strong; don't sell low and try hard to push price up and ensure that our products remain pure. Malaysian GOM may even can stock pile bird nests so ensure that the market doesn't fall below a certain price guideline.

It's my view on the matter if you agree.

On someone's pm to me on the matter concerning opening.

Let me just say, all entrances are infact similar but just modifications on the basic form i.e open window type of entrance if you serious examine it.

All type do have their advantages and disadvantages and which one to use all depend on the area and the best form and only form that should be use for town is only open air well or open roof if your prefer to call it. Many consultants refuse to see to it sadly brought with it the present sound pollution and many complaints and because this reason, the future of the towns' BHs are at stake.

If only all BHs @ towns did listen to my reasoning to have open air well, we will be at a better position to negotiate with the local authorities. If we didn't cause the local authorities pain in the A** hole, they wouldn't wanna give the many close shop notices or tear down orders. You think the enforcers @ local authorities have nothing to do....if they have time, better go for teh tarik or read newspaper than to go round issuing notices and take actions.

Here, we have many BHs @ towns being issued tear down notices and all handed the notices to our local swiftlets Association to solve the matter with the authority concerned.

1. All these BHs are shoplets near residential areas which are not allow under the 1GP.
2. Most of these BHs owners were not members of the local Association and now are because of the notices received. I wonder why the association wanna to take in problematic members just to help them solve their problems which these affected owners should have join the association long ago and abide by the guildlines provided by the association.
3. Association reasoning is that the more members to better position and stronger will be the Association. Rightly said if they have join the Association before getting into trouble.
4. Because they are not association members, they tend to turn on the sound full day and night and the Association then cannot control them as they are not members and refused to listen to advices before.
5. Having said so, the Association maybe seem to have solve the problem by seeking help from a Fed Association Dato concerned unless something new pop up as it will certainly do as most of these BHs were build at no BH zone.

My posting of the case is to seek all non members to join your Association to give them strength and for your BHs' future. If suppose your BHs have similar problems and no Association will come forward to help as you are a non member, so what????? Getting YB ? Without combined strength, yours alone isn't sufficient to even get a horse to move.

Refrain from building one in problematic area as even as members, the Association may not be able to pull you out although the Association will certainly put an effoct to help you.

Always follow the guidelines and refrain from disturbing the peace of your neighbours and never think that the calm now may not become a storm tomorrow.

Just my opinion on the matter to share as someone did pm me on the subject on the best entrance for BH. So, wait no longer, join today for a better tomorrow for yourself, families and friends.

Hi,

As we have discuss before and that the knob doesn't make the difference as all depend on what Amp you are using and many others factors like the number of tweeters, type of wire, length of wires and all will make the differences in the output of the tweeters sound.

Even when the AMP are the same made and everything the same, the facts still remain that everyone of the AMP will produce slightly different in output as nothing in the world can be produce the identical even in identical twin cos there will certainly be a difference in output so let your ears to hear and your brain to decide whether you got the right pitch and the resultant view of swiftlets @ BH will be your final goal and achievement.

As for coil or piezo type, and this one, I leave it to the expert to comment.

Hope that I am of help.

TQ for the info, bro

This is something that we all know and if you have been to Guangzhou, there is an area where the whole floor supposedly be selling Malaysia nests as the whole area is called " Ta Ma Yen Wao centre" but if you are there and you will notice that all nests display there are mostly that of Indonesia but the owners of the lots are mostly Malaysian. Pretty salesgirls there representing Malaysian owners informed me that they are selling Indonesia nests as I told them that I knew those nests weren't Malaysian but Indonesian...........all because they are cheaper and easier to sell than that of Malaysian and if I want Malaysian nests, they can get it for me. Why called Malaysian Nests if you are selling Indonesia nests so don't blame the Chinese boycotting Malaysian nests as those nests @ place are supposedly Malaysian nests but selling Indonesia nests to gain more profit and no wonder that the Chinese there think Malaysian nests are inferior and Indonesian nests are the best cos the Indonesia are buying our nests to sell as theirs while we, Malaysian were stupidly selling Indonesia nests in China as our Malaysian nests.

We all need to look far and in order to ensure that we do have a better future, best ensure that we do sell Malaysian as Malaysian nests and even thought our nests cost higher than that of Indonesia's, there will be buyers who want the better nests and we need not go down to trick Chinese of the truth Malaysian nests. Like Vietnam nest, their nests demand better price so be it and we have own value for our nests and the end users will slowly understand and accept our nests as Malaysian nests.

Like the case with nitrites in EBN, the Chinese need to understand that nitrites do appear in the nests naturally and so they need to take the nests as they are otherwise, the chinese will be encouraging the sellers to magically if possible to reduce the nitrites to ZERO %...that won't be fair to the chnese eating the EBN as pure as posible.........so far, for thousand of years, chinese have been eating EBN and so far, all are very healthy and very well, too. Just afew bad guys around doing dirty work, put them in jail I would say and let them suffer alittle bit for hurting and endanger public health.

Dear TinkleBell,

If what you post is the truth, then the market isn't as bad as it seem. If someone is buying 300-500 Kgs of Grade A nests, then it must be for China market as others are just doing EBN drink and not much of Grade A nests.

Secondly, a buyer came last week and offer Rm2400/Kg and yesterday, offered Rm2600/Kg meaning that he must has buyers for the nests and is offer a slightly higher price for the nests as he must has experienced difficulty in getting his supply for nest @ Rm2400 otherwise, smart thinking will tell you by now he must be offering even lower price for the nests. He is deperate and in need of nests or otherwise, he wouldn't be here just after a week time only.

Good job, everyone for not selling low and holding to the nests for a better tomorrow. But to hold or not, is up to you but don't blame me if the price drop but then by holding on to your nests, you help to a better chances for the nests to gain better hike on the price. Just think and act accordingly using the brain and not the heart. Hopefully, this time, I won't see a Rm1800/kg on the menu..........going up is difficult but dropping is easy so beware of this....and for those in Share Market will understand me as panic selling will cause the price to drop dramatically and fast....

Even at the Rm26000/kg, I still refused to sell and hopefully, by next week, he will come back to quote me a better quote which I call it reasonable price for my nests. Isha Allah, we will survive this storm in one piece.

Lastly, our local newspaper isn't helping either by publishing all negative views and report about the birdnests. The newspapers should help by keeping their mouth shut and let the whole incident die down and let our GOM department solve the issue with the Chinese Authorities. How are the public going to forget the incident if they keep remind them of it. If needed to publish, do something positive about the whole matter like publish V. report on our EBN and convince the public that our EBN are safe to consume and that we are making progress to ensure food safety in EBN. Also, that action has been taken against the culprits involved in the scandal and they shall be brought to justice soon. These, if I am a end user, I will feel safe to resume eating birdnests and enjoy healthy living.

This post has been edited by West Wing: Oct 12 2011, 11:09 AM

Just my way of doing EBN stock market strategy...drawing our own defence line like stock market preventing a free for all.

1. When market drop from RM4800 to Rm4200, we try to sell above Rm4400 and if possible negotiate a more suitable price at the moment.
2. When the price drop at Rm3800, we manage to secure at Rm4100......more or less Rm100.
3. When the price is at Rm3400, we refused to sell.
4. When price drop to Rm2600 AB mixed, we ask for more or less Rm3400 which formally we refused to sell. Hopefully, we can manage to get the price up again....selling lesser but getting higher price is better than selling more and getting less. We are doing our little part to ensure a better tomorrow for all if possible.

Our intention is to force the market price up and in forward gear instead of reverse gear now and even if we suffer alittle losses now, hopefully, in the near future, we will be able to gain more if we play our games well. Otherwise, the ball will be at the other side, and we are always on defensive and at their mercy which they will determine how and when to strike..

People generally will forget as usual do and pls don't remind them of the RED matter which is past and should be gone and those dealing with it deserve all they get and should be more........playing with public's health. A crime I must add.

Remember experts saying that the price may drop alittle after a few weeks due to present New Year orders which I think isn't because all said that the factories are having tons of nests on hand and why and who's buying now; it must because that it's cheap,eh? Or otherwise, there are many orders which we weren't informed and knew.

Have anyone being to Guangzhou lately and all Red Nests must be removed or taken off the shelves but are our nests selling OK still??? Those pure nests that neither pure white or reddish in color......alittle like we chinese, a little brownish and yellowish which are good for health....hahahaha. My friend who has outlets in China said that the present problem is getting the nests there but there are orders. Who's right and who's lying, that I don't know and maybe, you can.

My view and opinion on the matter to share.

Sorry, Kohloh,

I forget that your Big Boss is Chinaman......or should say HongKong Tai Kor. You know China market well as you have been there very often and was there for so many years, I guess. Maybe, we shall all go to China for fun and fellowship only and leave the export to the experts and concentrate our effect to produce more nests.

A thousand apologies, again......and the cause for the problem also include your BOSS. No wonder those who take the nests into China find it so difficult to make a stand in China as Malaysian are only small deers trying to match big Lions in China and HK. Malay Proverb "Tak Mati pun sudah Nasib, Lagi Mau Bising Bising" ...Sorry Boss............... better keep myself in swiftlets breeding only!!!!!! nanti mati pun tak tau machang mana mati.

Possibilities are that the present situation is purposely created to ensure that we die first for trying to meddle into their market. SO, better keep your feets close to your body or else...chop chop chop.

Above are only for your reading pleasure only.......... Good Day, Everyone

[quote=TinkleBell,Oct 12 2011, 05:32 PM]
Hi Guys

Isn't this forum a democratic forum. I thought at least in here we are free to voice and share our opinion. Feedback from others might lead us to learn new things, knowledge and even learn our mistake.

I hope that the forum here is free for all to talk. Like not the other side of the world (outside) where 'We have the freedom to talk. Only after the talk that we do not have the freedom' quote RPK

This forum is free for all. Readers are free to take it or leave it or leave your comment.

TOMORROW WILL BE A BETTER DAY

PEAVEE & CHEERS to all

---

Added on October 12, 2011, 5:33 pmOopss..... I mean PEACE & CHEERS

Hey, this forum is for all to share on swiftlets matter so no problem at all. No problem and be Happy. We have our differences and we argue but we stop at there. After the postings, we will meet and have our coffee talk, right KLoh?

KL is a friend but sometime really do hard boxing with his unkind words and I believe and all here believe that in this forum is free for all to talk. My last posting was as I said for reading pleasure only.

Thanks Seeseng for starting this wonderful forum to share.

This post has been edited by West Wing: Oct 12 2011, 08:12 PM