Good report.

Swiftlets can hear in total darkness and can fly safely but not freely and as they cannot see. Mind you that SWIFTLETS have very good other senses. They can see very sharply and senses of smell is as good and so, obviously swiftlets would't venture into the darkness before ensuring that it's totally safe to do so as they can't see in the darkness. Then, Darkness is where the swiftlets have the advantages over predators so they prefer to build nest in darkness where most predators cannot see.

That's why many new BHs, swiftlets tend to stay at the upper floor initially and as swiftlets' confidence gather, more birds will move to the lower floor where the conditions normally better controlled than the top floor which in most cases is rather too hot during the day and too cold during the night.

Infact, I believe that it's their sense of smell that determine where their chicks are after zooming the echolocation of the position in total darkness. They hit hard on the plank to get the grip and jump off the plank when flying off. That's what I find, any comments?

Occasionally, some BHs don't follow these rules.

If I am a bird, I would surely prefer a wooden plank to a cement wall and even wooden plank, one must hsvr groove on the plank for the new birds to have a good hold of the plank to start building nest. Otherwise, once try, twice try fail! better try next door.

Bigger is never better but taller do have its advantage. My birds do build nests on cement wall but that doesn't make it better and just that space is so limitted in prime location in the BH and some even build their nests on or between electrical wires......

When your BH is old, anything can happened but we are discussing on best way for new BH. Am I right? Old experienced BH owners are all SIFU already and they already know what to do.

Below is only what I have experienced with aroma that I bought for a friend (contractor) doing BH renovation from HK.

The friend ordered thru me a bottle of aroma and he told me that it's good and proceed to order afew bottles and alas, the new shipment bring so much problems for me as I needed to explained to him that I am just a middleman helping him to buy and I wasn't responsible for any result in the aroma.

Although, I must admit that Mr. HK gave a Rm25 ringgit as commission after the first purchase but my friend told me that the solutions are not te same as the first bottle he bought as all the new ones don't bring in any result at all. I personally use only my own mixture of aroma or smell so I cannot give much comment on aroma but only my experience with it.

I can only comment that it's too expensive for such solution and each purchase maybe different from the other: no QC at all. Smell or aroma if you prefer to call it do work but not magical spray. It's only make your BH smell like what an old BH should smell if it's done correctly. If it's animal magnetism or some sort like it, than I will apply to my body and all my birds and yours will follow me to my new BH @ agriland like the pipe piper of Hamelin.

Anyone who has used the solution may want to help him on the matter but be a gentleman and not helping your friend selling the product as we are all friends here and hope others to be successful and well. At least, that my reason for posting.

This post has been edited by West Wing: Jun 6 2011, 04:45 PM

Have some common sense and you will see through, I dare him to prove to me to use his Love portion in a BH having 30 nests (4 months) and if he can do the magic of 1200 nests after 2 years, half of the nests sales belong to him but if failed, he should paid me the value of 600 nests which is half of what I should get. By the way, getting 600 nests in 2 years isn't very difficult.

To be fair, I admit that although very seldom but some BHs can and do achieve such feat and some don't even used the aroma. It's a matter of getting there at the right time, right place, right building and right way. Just like striking "7777" at the slot machine at the casino..you didn't but someone did.

You really can't blame the advertisement as the article is an advertisement of some sort and like all advertisements, they work wonder in the adv. until you use it and prove it wrong but then, some do seem to see results.

Again as always, my personal comments on the matter to share.

As to my experience, Plastering is a must to protect the external wall for natural elements and also from the predators from easy climbing and as to the internal, it is to prevent the pests from hiding and you will have difficult time to remove them and also preventing rats from climbing up.

As for painting your wall, I have found that water paint of lime is OK with BH but I would prefer the paint on the outside of the BH to further prevent water from seeping into the wall causing damages to the wood plank and also dirty nests.

Oil based Paint should never be use in BH and if you did. you will regret as you will need to wait many months for the paint to clear as experienced by a friend many years ago.

This post has been edited by West Wing: Jun 11 2011, 12:41 PM

Yes, so my new BH @ AGRILAND wiil have 3 cheap marble tiles wide all round for predators prevention as lizards cannot climb slippery tiles. Aluminum or zinc sheet are prone to wear and rust and thieves may go for your aluminum sheets when they cannot get to your nests.

Plastering the wall is to ensure that the BH last, dry and for predators prevention also.

As for our brother BC advice on KK paint, why not if you can afford. Here, we all give sincere suggestions only and friendly discussion over all matter but in the end, to do or not to do, that's entirely up to you, my friends.

We care so we advice and it's good for everyone to join in to give their own views on all matter discussed concerning all of us...... this way, it bring us closer as a family of good buddies. Although, we do have our own disagreement over some matters but that don't mean we are not friends, right?

I believe this is the best forum in anywhere for the discussion on SWIFTLETS HOME providers services.

It's sooo good that so many fellows participate and I even hate to comment now but knowing me, I just keep my big mouth on anything concerning swiftlts.

To me, initially, all matter as you are trying hard to please the birds and make your BH as close to the natural home of the swiftlets. By when your BH has thousands, then the V holes are more for human being than the birds. Birds can stand it but very difficult for human being.
In town, coldness isn't a problem but at Agriland, it's a serious problem as night temperature can go very low and chicks and even birds may die if wind are allow to flow thru your BH so I would like BH@agriland has lesser V holes or none at all if the entrance is big enough. This way, at least, the temperature during the night will not drop drastically. Proper insulation of the roof should be sufficient to ensure that the day don't over overheat and without the free flow of air, the temperature inside should be able to maintain at a resonable level.
Fine tuning or perfecting of the conditions in BHs will encourage faster nests building as like all animals, when the good time come, all activities stop and baby making begin.....so better concentration on producing nests for eggs.

Presently, the heat during the day is unbearable but then, many Bhs @ agriland don't even have humidifiers or water at all and their BHs having thousands of birds......so, I also wonder how. Sometime, something sometime don't make sense but then, if your BH is one of those lucky ones and agirland BH not as hot as town's.

Well, talking about growth, I just have this coffee talk with some new BH owners on it. They were complaining about slow growth in their area in Kuantan and I told them that I wasn't surprised as the area is just coming up. more than 10 years ago afew guys started their BHs at the location and after 2 years of nothing, they offer their BHs for sale at cost price.

Now, I told them that they are lucky cos they are having nests to tell but only not good as expected like other places. I told them to go back to encourage all at the location to breed birds to ensure birds growth in the area and not expecting others to contribute to their growth. If only every of the 40 BHs in the area contribute their share toward the birds growth, then 40BH x 600 birdsX 3 times and you do a substantial increment and in no time, birds from other places will soon follow these home birds back to the area and you will see a hugh increment of nests. Only time will tell but if you are just myopic and see near profit instate of years later, then all those in the area deserve it. If you are just one of the few that breed swiftlets, then it shall be difficult to get good growth as whatever come from your BH will be share by all......if so, I surely pity you.

Here, we are lucky as even our place isn't classified as swiftlets flying path so they said but we do have good growth in BHs that follow my practice of BH management. Although my method may not see good return now but the growth is steady and will pick up very fast after the first thousand nests.

Sabah is not a very good area but with good management, it will soon be heaven as there are vast feeding area and good environment to keep the birds in good shape and spirit in reproducing.

It's a sad case as most of BH owners are takers and not contributors and only if all contribute toward a brighter future, then we all can relax and enjoy our golden years.

Case history, there is one BH owner who told me that his BH practically remain at about 200 nests for the past one years and his BH is in a OK location where one of mine is also there and I got 2 hundreds after 2 years. Only that after one day that he asked if there is any buyer coming and he bought his nests to my place to sell and only then that I know the reason why as his nest is pratically 1 inche or less and all pure white. How do you expect any growth if you don't breed the birds. He told me that his birds still return and only no new birds but I told him if he is so sure that the returning birds are the same ones that make the nests and possibility maybe, they are a new batch of birds and the last ones that make the harvested nests migrated to my BH. Just by looking at the nests you can tell if those nests are from newly fledged birds or old ones.

He protested that his consultant told him that it is OK to harvest nest without egg but never told him not to harvest nests before birds fledgling. Well, I told him to do as he think is right because he has a consultant to refer to anyway. I just give him free suggestion as if he allow his birds to breed and fledged; it shall be better for all of us cos common senses tell us that more successful breedings produce more birds.

My 5 sen mathematics
If 10 BHs produce 2000 birds then 50BHs shall produce 100,000 birds and there shall be enough to go around but if only 10 breeders, then if equally share among all 50Bhs, each shall get 40 birds only but realistically speaking, the better BH may get many times more and the less fortunate ones may end up with a growth rate of less than 5%.

Try to check out your own problem yourself as you are the only one who know all there. It's funny that only unsuccessful BH or newly build BH owners invite experienced BH owners like us to visit their BHs and if they don't return, we know that they are already OK lah.......but only few call back to say TQ. So, as I said, we are doing GOD's work and for for the raayat and the country but mostly for the birds. Hopefully, those who have become successful do share their experiences with us all and help make every ones here prosperous and healthy eating birdnests. Gong Xi Fa Cai

This post has been edited by West Wing: Jun 15 2011, 04:30 PM

What in the sky are not your birds and only those which have already make nests in your BH can only be consider yours. Using bird sound like Duress or similar sounds can get you alot of birds around your BH if you are a good area but they are not there to stay. It only tell you that there is potential in the area as there are alot of birds and once they get bored with your sound, it's time to change new one. Sometime, it;s dangerous to use bird testing sound as external sound as the few birds that may wish to stay will fly away.

Choose some tested sound initially if you are not used to listening and be safe. Use another sound and maybe this time you will draw birds returning to your BH and hopefully some will stay overnight and slowly, remain there and make a new family.

How do you know you may ask.......SHIT!!!! Yes, shit will tell, shit will tell, my friend.

Now, taking about sound? Do you think that you got the right sound or should I said, copy correctly as everytime you copy a sound, the resultant sound maybe a little different. Like we mentioned before on CD sound and then copy on mp3 and the resultant is different. But we are not birds but wish to mimic the true sound of birds and something 2 wrongs make one right so don't worry too much but just be concerned with the outcome or the result of the sound that you have. All you need is a good ear to ensure that you have the correct sound for pulling in the birds. Everything doesn't grow overnight and give some time for the result.

Or you keep changing and changing and in the end, you end up frustrated and confused and that's the worst thing you want. Have some confidence in yourself and positive thinking as with a clear mind, you may see what went wrong an you may say"How stupid I didn't think of it" Sometime it take much longer than your neighbour's BH but never two BHs are the same. His gain is your loss and don't think that you can win over his birds by playing louder and louder and it only end up that you get worst and worst until what you have all disappear and maybe join your neighbour's gang!!!

Loud isn't everything but the right volume and sound is important and the loudness. So, be contended with what you have even though that it's slower than your friend but is your friend telling the truth anyway or just pulling your legs. By the way, how many BH owners are honest with their number of nests....not even 5%, I think so don't believe all that you have heard.

If your BH has positive gain; be grateful and don't destroy the good thing cos you never know that it maybe the start of a mass influx of birds next season to your BH but if you are not careful, then you may have destroy your rare chances of going into the super BH group. I have seen it in BH which double in six months time like 2 thousands to 4 thousands so be patient and be happy for at least, you stay healthy and may seen the full moon appearing.

Good luck to all new breeders and if you didn't strike gold this time, there are always next season and many times more......like 4D which many never give up hope even failing to strike once in years. Here, you don't lose cos the worst is that you only don't gain as you can practically get back all your investment if you want to sell off. Only if you are not silly to buy very high.

But the truth as in my area, there isn't a BH without nests. just slow starters maybe and many are due to their own makings or mistakes.

This post has been edited by West Wing: Jun 18 2011, 08:54 PM

This morning, a friend asked me out for BF and then invite me to visit his BH and at the BH, he asked for my comment on the BH and I told him it's too low at 6 feet high and if he is going to do a 3S BH,why not do it at least 10 feet.

Immediately, he chipped in to say that if birds are going to build nests, even at 2 feets, well, he is right there but then, if he is such an expert, then why bother to get me there and asked for my comment at all.

Here, we are not discussing on if or whether the birds will build nest or not but to give the best available option to be successful. We only offer our view and knowledge on the matter and to listen or to follow is entirely up to you cos we are not oblige to teach and you are not oblige to follow so it's a expressing our way to successful BH experience to share freely to those who want to know but not to prove other wrong.

So, to this friend of mine, I wish him well and hopefully, that he will become successful and it's not that the birds will not do the nests @ 6feets which to him is for easy harvesting of nests...a rather very good point. And I have seen 100 nests in a 5 by 5 toilet of a BH and even one foot hole wasn't spare with a few nests inside....What I emphasis is to give us better chances of becoming successful.

Once there, anything doesn't matter.

This post has been edited by West Wing: Jun 19 2011, 04:03 PM

Still with the topic on height and BH construction.

Why do we choose a certain height if we have the chance to do so unlike town building, there is no way but to do it at the height and try to renovate with lest destruction to the building.

But to do a BH @ agriland, let imagination go wild so why restrict yourself to the basic design of BHs. We do know the requirements of doing BH but we can do better by improving the design from the eye of the bird.

Now, coming to the height and why do we choose a certain height?? Consideration from the points of the birds and human being to be taken into account but then, whose comes first.....BIRDS of course and if no birds then why bother to build a BH better build a nice palace. Other considerations will only be consider if such action allowable for the birds.

Human factors come second but if possible, then win, win method should apply. Building a BH high is to give freedom of flight and comfort for the birds and also less stress. A man is about 6feets and the bird need 3 feets, so a BH should be at least 9 feets and not less. Here, we are taking about new fledged birds which will definately find difficulties to fly in restricted and too small the space and so why not give them the comfort and space. Birds happy, we happy, birds make nests, we sell nests.

But then, when we take consideration on dust and polution from the floor (we are not going to sweep the floor every month, are we), we build it higher the better so we add a few feet to it and make it 12 feets.

But then, those human predators!!! We add much much more height and if possible and from what I understand, pole higher than 12 feets is impossible to control well so I will build my Agriland BH at 15 feets (taking consideration that ladder higher than 12 feets is risky) to be safe from human predators in case they succeed in tearing down my 2 metal doors. hopefully, the height will prevent them or at least slower them for totally destroying my nests. My prime concerns are for the chicks and eggs but surely, if by doing so, I can make my money, that's an additional bonus for being such a nice and concerned guy.

So, have a nice day

I am not building a platform to harvest my BH as it's haven't been completed yet and I won't be making or
buying one in near future as I need to wait for the nests to be satisfactory before I decide to build one anyway. Once everything is complete, I will leave it to the birds with regular touch up without any use of high ladder.

I already have an idea of how to do one but must wait until the nests appear...hahaha. taking about BH security, one friend took me to a workshop making metal door esp. for BH and each costing more than Rm 4000 and I think Jail door look more like toy door compare to these doors that my friend ordered...and and a friend order 7 of such doors for his BHs excluding the birds entrance doors costing more than above amount using 3ins round bars at 4ins wide. I think each door need 8 people just to lift it and to open the door will take the owner more than 30 minutes. The workshop manager told me that the doors are make to the owner's measurement like arm length. Each door uses 6 locks each costing over Rm350 not included in the cost but do come with a secret additional lock for free.

It will take a James Bond to break in thru the doors, I think and why bother with such dramatic preventive security things; giant metal doors and electronics alarms and what have you but the wall is still a wall. all they need is to break in thru the wall and thus bypass all your efforts.

Sometime, you wonder to what extend can a BH owner gone to prevent nets stealing.... crazy but it's isn't for me, that's I am sure. Any comment on the matter?

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Added on June 21, 2011, 7:16 pmWhy is the PSF which I think should be per BH or worst per floor inrespecting of the size and will consider 2 buildings connected as 2 to be fair...........is Majlis renting out the premise or issuing license...... I hope that Trg will be much better and I will talk to Dato to convince him to see the authorities to enforce the per BH instead of psf which I think is absurb.

If PSF, then pay only the area that the birds make nests and KIV the payment of empty space without nests in the BH as unoccupied until occupancy.



This post has been edited by West Wing: Jun 21 2011, 07:16 PM

Yes, buy and keep until price increase and normally one or two month before 15th. day of 8th. Month.

Yesterday night. a buyer came to buy nests. I asked for the price and he wanted to see the nests first but I refused and want him to quote and he gave Rm4100/Kg but I wasn't interested and insisted for Rm4400/kg at least before I phone up friends to sell otherwise, I told him next time when the price is right.

He must be seriously hunting for nests as he came to my place at 8 pm seeking nests, possible unable to fulfill his quota. He is willing to go higher but must see the nests first but I still refused cos' many BH owners may fall into his trap convincing them that the sky (price) is falling and soon will be Rm3000/Kg.

We have friends here having a total of 20Kgs left and anyone wishing to offer higher may phone me up to set up the deal; no problem as no commission will go into my pocket.........serious buyers only....remember stock is limited and running low.

Rightfully said, my friend. The more you do the more you need to wait and this just like my deceased friend who did his BH and repairs after repairs, redo and redo and still no nests after 2 years and 6 months after he died, the birds built alot of nests. Alas, he didn't live to see the nests but if he didn't get cancer, there will still no nest now.

Another advice is that swiflets are free birds and do not need VIP treatment but only basic requirements. Fulfilled all requirements, then wait for the results patiently......and pray if you are pious and believe in GOD. Otherwise, each time you renovate, you waste at least 2 months in waiting and the only guy gain is your contractor.

I agreed.....The intention of CAP is good but sometime what written are absurd and rubbish. That's why like suggestions and advices given here are mostly good intentions, take only what you think is right and ignore the rest...

To control the export, the reasons provided maybe of our own interest but then, are the authority really interest in ensuring the quality of nests exported or have their own people given the right to export. If so, we shall be at the mercy of those few selected guys who have the influence.

In the end, we shall be the ones that will suffer.....but some of us did give them the reasons for doing so. Why we need to send our nests to Indo to have them turn Red. Can't we say "NO" to Red nests demand from China even if the chinese pay good money for the Red ones. Can't we be the good guys to convince the chinese that Red nests aren't good for health and even if they don't accept our reasons now, we still protect our Malaysian Bird Nests as pure nests. At least, we will be safe and the Chinese Authorities will not ban our nests and the Malaysia Authorities will have no reason to prevent us from exporting nests individually.

Like when I posted that we should let the birds make corner nests as the birds prefer so but then money talk better and most of the new and old BHs now rounded the corners just because the round nests fetch higher price. W should have let the birds preference come first but alas, all end in dollars and cents.

Another thing is that most government department also don't know what to do or don't care to know as Gaji sama kerja atau tak kerja dan tak kerja pun tak pecat kerja...........so, why kerja kuat kuat.

Only my opinion to share.

This is the way I do with my new BH using a centre large void area to place my stairs so that you can see where you are going and better be safe that be sorry.

To understand why, you may need to do Research on it but I don't have the time but beware of it as many failed BHs are at these areas. Something that I observe that on one side of the road, those BHs in palm oil trees have nests while the other roadside , all BHs failed and all planting rubber trees. So, you have rubber trees plantation and wish to build one in it, remember my saying " Beware the rubber trees" and clear a larger area in the plantation to be safer........ but why do it as rubber fetch a very good price and I rather tap my rubber than to invest into something you can't see.

No intention of cursing anyone's BH@ rubber land but my observation on the matter.