Isn't it obvious that when you extract sample data from UK, you will get FDs with professional qualifications from ICAEW, ACCA, or CIMA?

Sorry, off-topic abit. It is even more interesting that the top 5 earners (Salary) are either not ICAEW & ACCA or they previously were not from any audit firm. Interesting data.

I've extracted the top 5 by just looking at the table. (Hope i do not see wrongly):

1. Royal Bank of Scotland Group - Guy Whittaker (829k)
Institute: N/A
Alumni firms: N/A

2. Royal Dutch Shell - Peter Voser (805k)
Institute: CIMA
Alumni firms: N/A

3. BP - Byron Grote (804k)
Institute: N/A
Alumni firms: N/A

4. Tesco - Andrew Higginson (778k)
Institute: CIMA
Alumni firms: N/A

5. Rio Tinto - Guy Elliott (743k)
Institue: N/A
Alumni firms: N/A

Sounds like something we should ponder about.

Got 3 CIMAs in the top 10.
Maybe this is because of their strategic thinking and their long term perspective.
Should we take CIMA?


1. Royal Bank of Scotland Group - Guy Whittaker (829k)
University of West Georgia (MBA)

3. BP - Byron Grote (804k)
Cornell University (PhD)

5. Rio Tinto - Guy Elliott (743k)
INSEAD (MBA)

This post has been edited by Materazzi: Oct 15 2010, 06:02 PM

Hahaha yeah I think I should go and take CIMA

I thought you have already took ACCA.
do you have malaysia's FDs salary survey?
In malaysian business magazine I thought have the list of the CFOs.

@work didn't go and look for it yet, maybe over the weekends I'll hunt for it lol.

I'm more interested with the Malaysia's data though.
Maybe most of them are MICPA and ACCA?

But then i felt that the theory is true. Hardcore professional qualifications has lost the all important [Business Sense/Acumen]. What they do know are IAS 1 - 41.

so what professional qualification are you holding?
No, they don't know IAS 1-41, it is not important for them, it is just for their middle men to work on it haha..

On average, CIMA members’ annual basic salary is RM123,500.
The average bonus is RM12,600 across all respondents.
The total average package received is RM136,100.

http://www.cimaglobal.com/Documents/Jobs-d...ia_18.08.09.pdf

Is it a low salary or not?

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Added on October 16, 2010, 3:49 pmyour data is not complete ah. even in US co got CIMA qualified holder.

This post has been edited by Materazzi: Oct 16 2010, 03:49 PM

Thanks for the link. I stand corrected about the UK. I really didn't think they would diverge so much as a standalone geography from the US and the majority of the global Fortune companies. (CFO.com is a good place to start reading).

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Added on October 16, 2010, 4:35 pmTiny sample size of 160 respondents (from Malaysia) where 72% were over 36, 40% over 40 and only 7% under 31 plus the very low overall response rate of 14.3%... to me, suggests a situation where older, higher income earners were far more willing to disclose their salaries vs lower income earners who couldn't be bothered.


This post has been edited by seantang: Oct 16 2010, 04:35 PM

Hahaha, did say it isn't complete. Lotta work to pull out their biographies.. and even then we don't know what they don't disclose.

well there is after all an FD with CPA (Aust) qualification!

You are welcome.
so what should I take, ACCA or CIMA qualification?

Please do not take this the wrong way, but believing without seeing the source, "faith", is what you can have for a religion. In the business world, you won't survive on faith alone, otherwise that is known as gambling or a more business-like word, speculation. It's good to have some faith but ultimately you will still rely on facts.

Warren Buffet didn't get rich from having merely faith in his investment. He invested based on historical facts and made "informed decision" through research and all those years of experience that he has. "Knowing that something will happen" & "believing that something would happen" is two totally different thing.

Statistics are merely numbers unless you can prove it. However,we are all entitled to our own opinions, though if that's just what it is, do state so, so you won't be misleading others.

Very off-topic but a very interesting read for all you investor-wannabes: Warren Buffet's 2007 Berkshire Hathaway Shareholder Letter. If you have the time, do go through every year's letter.

‘I’m a Chartered
Accountant and
qualified over ten
years ago but if I
graduated now, I
would be looking at
CIMA. It’s what
businesses look for.’
Keith Munns
Financial Controller
Everest

If you're thinking of working outside an accounting firm or doing something else besides a straight accounting role... do a MBA. It'll take you further.

You can take any prof exams that suits your career aspiration but don't make the same mistake that most aust grads made. That is to take the easy way out by taking the CPA Aus exam that takes you nowhere in your career.

my cousin sis is an assistant manager at one of the big4 in consulting. CPA grad. What more can u say? Countless time being told la, it wholly depends on the person, not whether the qualification produces lauya ppl. Exams or professional designation can be pursued later on in life... nothing is really too late, unless u're 35++

Your cousin's sis is not your cousin? Did you just made this up on Oct 20 2010, 04:57pm?

@Materazzi: As of now, i'm not holding any professional qualification. Like mentioned earlier, i'm looking to take either MICPA or CPA Aus. But i'm not sure whether i'll be staying in pure accounting line for long. LOL! I think i have to postpone and see how it goes first.

He probably means cousin sister (ie. Female cousin) rather than cousin's sister. Literal translation from Chinese.

Anyway, if you can't picture yourself in a lifetime of debits and credits, do an advanced degree. It stays with you for life and you don't get fleeced every year in terms of annual subscription or fees & time to attend useless CPD courses.

This post has been edited by seantang: Oct 20 2010, 09:10 PM

Gloomberg, eh..let me explain and I don't intent to insult your cousin who's a CPA. We all know the Big 4 in M'sia take in all prof grad + local acc grad as long as it's recognised by MIA. We also know those who're holding managerial position + partners in Big 4 are from various prof bodies. The question is how many % of them are CPA Aus? Generally there's less than 5%. The bullk of them are MICPA or ACCA/ICAEW.

I also stated in my last few post, CPA only produce 2 capable persons in its 100 years history....1 guy who's the FD at Disney & 1 lady who's a CFO at Adidas...this is an isolated case for CPA. The bulk of CPAs are struggling in workplace. Generally, they don't need an accountant to sell Disney's mickey mouse and donald duck toys or Adidas shoes to any soccer fan...a person with only a Business degree can also fill that position and do a good job as well. Look at those high end industries like tele-comunication, energy, oil & gas, media, airlines etc, NONE of their top finance people are CPAs.

I know a lady partner in EY M'sia who's a CPA & also former MIA Council member (not to mention the name). She doesn't even know a simple double entry...her double entry is totally screw up.
A new M'sian migrant just joined my firm in Aust couple of months ago. She's a CPA and since the Aust Big 4 don't recognise CPA, she's required to do the ICAA exam and she's only given an intermediate position eventhough her last position was an Audit Manager at EY in KL. Guess what?...as an Audit Manager she doesn't even know the basic consolidated accounts stuff like the treatment of minority interest, unrealised profits, pre/post acquisition profits etc etc. She knows nothing at all about consolidation. I am not surprised because this is a very typical CPA Aus products. Everytime she expresses her frustration not able to cope with the difficulty of the ICAA and she's struggling like mad with her studies. She finally admitted that CPA is nothing and totally rubbish, CA is the real stuff.

A current colleague of mine who's used to work in KPMG KL, told me that a CPA Senior Audit Manager there who's technically very weak & knows nothing. She depends entirely on her subordinates who're MICPA or ACCA to do the work. If her subordinates are not around, she will panick like hell when she meets up with the partner for assignment discussion. In other words, she's hiding behind the shield of her subordinates because she's so incompetent & technically weak. This is also another typical product of CPA.

So given all the weaknesses, they still can climb to become managers or partners, why? This is because they're good in their interpersonal skills (good in sweet talking). My colleague told me as long as they can 'bodek' or 'ampu' the partners, they can climb very fast regardless whether they are good or not. Another tactic is to show you're hardworking & fully committed to your job even if you're not good in your work. Discrimination, favouritism and politicking bound to happen in M'sia Big 4.

It's a different situation in Aust, to climb up a person must be technically sound, highly competent and skillful....whether a person is hardworking or lazy is not an issue.

Hmm, I would agree with this sentence, seriously, the entire process that I've came across in applying Big4 where I consulted many of my friends and cousins, I get to know that inside is kinda politics.

But hey, I am degree holder and gonna decide to choose a professional accounting course, was thinking to get CPA but until I read all the debates at here made CPA sounds like a piece of crap? Besides, I am still gemini which gonna kill me to decide....hahaha. May be I should just take CPA first and see whether if possible then get ICAA or something?