Hi forumers,

I hope the question fits here.

Most of you might be aware that many martial arts have somehow involve breaking very hard materials like wood board, brick, slab, ice block, marble, etc...to test the practitoners limit.

And I also believe the martial artist able to do so due to hard training over the years (plus 'chi' inside their body).

Martial artists are also human, I just always get amazed by how the body structure can withstand such a blow?

Any explaination behind?

they find the most vulnerable point to break.

to withstand the blow, one must have enough strength on their bone and knuckle / fist / wrist...

so hypothetically, the body needs a period of training to strengthen the arms / wrist / fist / palm. and the accuracy for them to hit the weak point.... that's the way to test whether they got enough training / to test their ability.

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Added on February 25, 2010, 11:55 pmunder the "techniques"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breaking_%28martial_arts%29

This post has been edited by 9876789: Feb 25 2010, 11:55 PM

even that it's almost unbelievable!

imagine a human breaking several blocks of ice! and materials that you could never imagine!

the human body is stronger than what you think. human bone is strong, yet flexible. with repeated stressing and healing, a bone can be very strong.
the human brain got the ability which can function to block off pain - analgesia .
the human muscle can produce so much that can break off from it's attachment to the bones.

so far, this "chi" is unproven. but the techniques to harness chi seems to be sort of preparing the mind and body by breathing and focusing which can reduce pain and increase force. this has been used in many types of sports.

so it's actually a hard-to-hard technique over many years?

pst. those thick wood/bricks/ice is not any plain wood/bricks/ice. they are specially made to be weaker. not to say they are fake, but consider plywood vs teak (mostly they break plywood or rubber tree wood) even bricks come in several type.

dont expect them to perform as marvelously with random material picked up from street.

Dont forget impulse principle. When force is transferred in a very short time, the impulse is large and the damage is greater. If you realize, they hit the board at an extremely high velocity and pull back almost instantly, creating a large impulse on the board that splits it at its weakest point

i think they always hit brittle object so it will be break when subjected to great force at a single point, try replacing ten concrete block with one that have steel reinforcement i dont think anyone can break it by hand.

Basic physics mate. Material strength, weak points and so forth. Yeah linn00b mentioned it, they won't do it with random materials because it most likely will not work.

and i know of several taekwando blackbelt who admit to observing/participating in demonstration where the board holder will flex the board inward at kick to help break the board (sometimes without the kick landing)

though, having said that, you do not want to be at the receiving end of a taekwando kick with or without board breaking abilities.

"wood/block/ice do not hit back" - Lee Jun-Fan .

Xuzen

This post has been edited by xuzen: Feb 27 2010, 10:49 AM

impact force = mass x acceleration

whack hard hard then can liao, no need "chi" powah

that's my humble opinion as a taekwondo student.

F=ma. Impact's a different matter involving the factor of time. This is important to break something- the impact force which is basically the change in momentum per time. The shorter the impact time the larger the force, which is why martial artists often retract their limbs after a strike when breaking something.

i doubt thats the reason for limb withdrawal.
the change of momentum is already achieved when fist meet obstacle.
limb withdrawal is to prevent overextension which would leave you vulnerable to the next attack/opponent in a fight.

and the chi/kiai yell thing is more of a psychology factor. you yell to focus your concentration and to push away your instinctive fear.

oh ya, also depends on the structure being broken.

we use roof top tiles which is dome shaped, and the plank wood is solid, but rather light can use forehead and pecah also AHHAHAHAH

They say the more you bones experience pain/pressure. the more dense it will be. There's a video on this.

that i'm not so sure...how would one make the ice weaker?

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Added on March 4, 2010, 10:14 pmthe martial artists do not seem to pull back after they hit the material (check out some videos in youtube)

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Added on March 4, 2010, 10:16 pmthat i agree!

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Added on March 4, 2010, 10:19 pmmaybe can apply this on those taekwondo plank, but dont think can apply (whack hard hard) on blocks of ice!:)

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Added on March 4, 2010, 10:26 pmi always got fascinated when they break bricks, ice blocks or concrete slab.

yes, stuff like tiles and plank wood are less hard

This post has been edited by frankzane: Mar 4 2010, 10:26 PM

Some are true some are fake.
Harvesting chi in ur body isn't just by discussion or a few seminars/lecturing could describe.
Westerners enjoys picking on chinese traditions and tries to make findings to prove it's fake.
When they are unable to proof it or give a result, they simply snap it with their theory and some flashy words.
Modern folks like us wont be able to do that.
It take years of hardship and must be practise at very young age.

yes, you're right!

all it takes is 1 master volunteering to donate his time for a series of tests... so far non has step forward

well, there are some possible answers to the question at the comment section.
i can stand on ostrich egg without breaking them
well if you want to post proof, post more reliable source.

the link got problem...

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Added on March 18, 2010, 11:07 pmsomehow i still believe in chi...

This post has been edited by frankzane: Mar 18 2010, 11:07 PM

I've seen a person who break "batang pisang" with just a punch.. And its the real "batang pisang" of course.. Try la tumbuk batang pisang with your bare knuckles.. you'll know if your punch is strong enuff.. These true martial artists can be really scary sometime.. They seem to have some kind of "internal energy" which is invisible to us..

But I also seen in front of my eyes, a Taekwondo instructor with black belt got beaten badly by a bunch of teenagers.. I actually know that guy.. Yes, it wasn't a fair fight, but it reminds me that no matter how strong you are, if you are against a number of people, you better back off.. That Taekwondo instructor was rude that time, dia ingat dia kuat, that's why he kena belasah..

I watch something in discoery where human brain would force body to perform super human act... and martial artist just mastered this and could force their brain to trigger their body to perdorm on their will

oh, yes i totally agree with you. no matter how strong you are, you may be easily 'tame' by a number of untrained people.

muay thai train with batang pisang, yeah tat's something i had missed out....how they do it huh? din they feel pain at all?

Epinephrine can trigger that sort of miracle. Triggered in real danger you get superhuman strenght and stamina . Another thing is epinephrine shots are taken as a last resort to revive someone from the dead.

Its impossible to master this unless he takes everything as a threat or is in medication.

i believe it's the chi. can see videos by this guy, alot of them amazingly works on me.

This post has been edited by cottonkandy: Mar 29 2010, 10:48 PM

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This post has been edited by marsalee: Nov 14 2010, 12:36 AM

Lol chi is pure bs,



This old guy supposedly can throw people around with his fingertips, dont know why many people believe in this stuff, one things for sure a lot of people are making money out of it.

There was a case however failed to be mythbusted by the myth buster team, the guy who made heat out of the towel and foils.

This post has been edited by ate: Mar 30 2010, 08:37 AM

As in how it works on you?

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Added on April 4, 2010, 10:46 pmHuh? Why suddenly he can be defeated so easily?

This post has been edited by frankzane: Apr 4 2010, 10:46 PM

well, for starters, they do feel pain.

one of my close friend attend the Muay Thai training. for the first week he had to train his fist by pumping on the ground/gravel/whatsoeversurfaceidunno until his knuckle bleed. after some time, he said his knuckle can withstand pain already.

there's a story from his Muay Thai teacher that one of his students are too obsessed with training and fighting that the teacher couldn't put him into competition, scaring that he might kill his opponents accidentally this is somewhat true because one of my friend's training senior saw that student fall into a small drain and his leg, when in contact with the edge of the drain, the edge breaks and he felt no pain at all and said "oops, i broke the drain~"

bones can be really strong if u train them hard over the years

This post has been edited by cloudstrife07: Apr 5 2010, 01:20 AM

Although i believe that martial arts "Techniques" can be used to break many strong things and make our bones hard.. .But i dont think that the drain is in 100% condition.. maybe there are already some crack... So when he fell into it... it eventually breaks..

ooo...tat's impressive!

next time you see someone demo board breaking with wood, try turn the board 90 degree and remove the gap between the board, see how well he do.

The great Bruce did this. He allowed everyone to question and study his 1-inch punch technique.

As to other master volunteering their time, I think it is obvious. As a master I dont have to prove anything to skeptics. Being their guenie pig can be humiliating. It is best to focus on thier students.

loh..
u all normal mortal dun suka2 say those martial art just tipu2 only, use custom 'modified-to-be -weaker' stuff..

i've live in the era ( hostel in those 90an )that some martial arts fanatics live..
even one of my school mate kinda strong oso..
he can break very hard 2" timber wood with his " betis " without problem.
and many more of our hostel mate so crazy bout this superior strength...

MORAL OF THE STORY..
NEVER SAY SOMETHING THAT WIL BREAK THEIR HEART.. COZ THEY CAN BREAK URS IN A BLINK OF EYES..

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Added on June 28, 2010, 9:36 amNever see before, do u...?

This post has been edited by salimbest83: Jun 28 2010, 09:36 AM

yeah, i do believe in human power!

Except for lin00b's reply, there's not enough emphasis on materials science in this thread.

The harder a material is, the more brittle it is. Once a brittle material has a slight defect, the crack propagates itself. Sure, they still need that certain amount of force to make that crack, but after that it's smooth sailin. What they say, 'a chink in the armour'

For all we know some quacks may have actually make that small notch in the block of materials....

The materials listed that do sound impressive (marble) are classified as brittle, try breaking a piece of ductile metal

still dun understand, even if the materials are brittle, wouldnt the hands/legs feel pain?

Actually this guy did.


and failed miserably at that. It's a fraud.

In Chinese equation, the art of force by power combine with chi has serve the basic for martial artists. The shao lin monk uses technique of breathing and the red army also applies this technique