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 Stock Market V49, MARKET REBORN LIKE A TIGER ROAR !!!

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cherroy
post Feb 11 2010, 05:39 PM

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QUOTE(kochin @ Feb 11 2010, 05:25 PM)
still a lil confused but thanks for explaining.
i got MAS share. yesterday my broker called me asking whether i want to accept the rights which i told them yes. this morning, i notice i oledi got the same amount of shares in MAS-OR (of which I was informed that I need to only pay the RM1.60).
does that mean by 22/2/2010, irrespective of what happen, i will automatically have the OR no. of shares converted to the mothershare, thus doubling my quantity for the mother share? does that also mean i need not purchase any OR now since it's already in my account and thus saving me a further 0.14 or whatever price it drop to?
if that is the cse, then it's mighty stupid of me to reject them to have more rights application since she quoted that if under subscript i have the right to purchase more at rm1.60 (i'm literally expecting that i need not purchase anymore OR in the market)
but having said so, isn't it still attractive to buy the OR at such low price? or is it come 22/02/2010, after conversion, the mothershare is expected to drop drastically again?
thanks again and sorry for repeating my question. still new and still learning albeit a very expensive lesson!
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Wrong liao, you are confused already. No offence.

OR is given free to you as existing MAS shareholder.
But OR's life-time is as good before 22/2, if you are not subscribing the right issue at RM1.60, OR will cease and expired, worth zero.

You need to buy a banker cheque of Rm1.60 aka you need to fork out Rm1.60 to own another MAS shares and send the cheque together with the OR (it is actually a form only).

You have 2 choice right now

1. Dispose the OR in the market, get Rm0.14 (today price)
2. Buy the right aka fork out Rm1.60 to own another MAS
3. Being mentioned before, so don't want to confuse further, so just consider 1&2 first.


Added on February 11, 2010, 5:46 pm
QUOTE(mopster @ Feb 11 2010, 05:12 PM)
thank you~~ u r da sifu  notworthy.gif

~the exercise of rights doesnt happen instantly right ? by the time Rights trading is over and payment settled MAS share could be 1.50 or lower.. still a risky business imo..  sweat.gif
~also, since the ratio is 1:1 .. if someone bought 50,000 OR, but can only afford to buy 10,000 MAS... means the remaining 40,000 OR becomes toilet paper after OR trading period is over
-----
~last is to just trade the OR before expiry.. buy 0.130 and sell 0.140 etc...

plz corrent me if i'm wrong..
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Yes, become toilet paper, so please don't overbuy the OR, as time is against you, it has barely a week or so lifetime.

Take about a few week before the right issue completed. So risk is always there. That's why some OR holders don't want to take up and dispose the OR.

That's why we often see near last day, OR normally being sold down at discount.

This post has been edited by cherroy: Feb 11 2010, 05:46 PM
cherroy
post Feb 11 2010, 11:22 PM

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QUOTE(kanelkc @ Feb 11 2010, 09:29 PM)
MAS use method 2  to ask people buy it right issue share. people thought  can earn money then will buy the OR + right issue share at 1.6 K. MAS need money, but their business look no good. so how to ask people buy their right share? method 2 as mentioned above. They purposely push down the OR price to 0.14 , so the cost of buying OR with right share is 1600 + 140 = 1740 compare with 1920 mother share, people think can earn the diff then will buy their right share lol  ... just my opinion.
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Err... this is more about conspiracy theory, yes in theory could do.

But you shoot your own foot with this kind of tactic, as in the end of day, mothershare price will be pressured to lower due to plunging of OR because as I said earlier, anyone with MAS now (which don't intend to sell or buy in the first place) will sell MAS share to fund the Rm1.60 right issue, so you bring down the mothershare in the process of doing it. That's why we see MAS mothershare plunge as well.

It is shooting your own foot and like playing with fire to purposely push down OR, as if mothershare drop below Rm1.60, there won't be anyone to subscribe the right issue. They suffer even more by doing this.


cherroy
post Feb 12 2010, 10:25 AM

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QUOTE(SeanST @ Feb 12 2010, 01:04 AM)
Regarding the MAS-OR. Currently i hold 80 lot MAS share bought before ex-date.
If i sold my MAS share at RM1.92, my OR still valid?
What i mean is, i decided not to exercise the OR. I sell my MAS share tomorrow, i get RM1.92 + RM0.135(latest MAS-OR price), or solely RM1.92 only? The last day of entitlement is 22nd FEB.
I am confused, and at total lost. Urgent advice needed.
sad.gif
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Yes, the OR still valid.

OR and mothershare is already separated entity now after ex-date of right issue.

You must sell the OR individually if not intended to get the right issue


QUOTE(! Love Money @ Feb 12 2010, 01:12 AM)
i dun know whether u can sell the mother share during this rights issue... coz my remisier told me that i cannot sell the mother share and told me to wait until the exercise end then only can sell it...
but if u opt not to exercise the OR just sell it on open market following its moving price... u can still retain the mother share... dun worry
*
Yes, you can sell now if wish to
Bullshit advice, no offence. smile.gif

This post has been edited by cherroy: Feb 12 2010, 10:26 AM
cherroy
post Feb 12 2010, 02:16 PM

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QUOTE(StupidGuyPlayComp @ Feb 12 2010, 11:01 AM)
rclxms.gif All waiting for balik kampung, market and forum in queit..........
i gave some noob calculation for the Genting (if wrong dont scold me)
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

This price is not include others Genting's properties
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Count like that, then others stock may even more valuable. Like BKawan, Daiman (NTA at Rm4.xx but share price Rm1.50) and alot of more.

Share price generally track earning ability, not asset. Although high asset worth is good, but primary concern of market is always earning, asset is secondary. As those asset is not something company going to dispose in near future and dsitributed to shareholders one.
cherroy
post Feb 12 2010, 03:12 PM

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QUOTE(StupidGuyPlayComp @ Feb 12 2010, 02:25 PM)
GENM, GENS, GENP is majar earning source for Genting.............it cant consider as assets
Like you are shareholder of certain counter, you make profit while your counter earn as well
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Genting's book already include 3 (GenM,S,P) of the earning inside through as associated company aka current Genting EPS number already take in the 3.

The current Genting's EPS is not Genting profit alone.
cherroy
post Feb 12 2010, 03:23 PM

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QUOTE(StupidGuyPlayComp @ Feb 12 2010, 03:14 PM)
smile.gif Something like that.........I mean Genting's price is undervalue at this moment if base of his anak price.
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Yes, I am not disagree this if look from this perspective.

But as I said before, share market primary concern is about company earning ability, asset is secondary. Asset only become primary when those asset is going to be liquidated and distributed to the shareholders.

You buy a company share and become a shareholder, the primary objective is the company can earn profit which you can have a share of it.


Added on February 12, 2010, 3:25 pm
QUOTE(StupidGuyPlayComp @ Feb 12 2010, 03:16 PM)
tongue.gif I not too understand......
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Let say for eg. Genting EPS is 50 cents.

Out of 50 cents,
20 cents is actually contributed by GenM,
10 cents from GenP
5 cents from GenS

Genting alone 15 cents.

So Genting financial book will report as 50 cents EPS.

This post has been edited by cherroy: Feb 12 2010, 03:25 PM
cherroy
post Feb 12 2010, 03:46 PM

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QUOTE(StupidGuyPlayComp @ Feb 12 2010, 03:28 PM)
But currently the palm oil's price is going up by this year, while the crude oil price will maintain at USD70-80 according to US. It should benefit the power generation business..........anyway according to previous quarter report, plantation and power generation are making profit


Added on February 12, 2010, 3:32 pm

tongue.gif Actually I dont understand what is "Book"
Eventually Genting EPS is 50cents right?
those 35cents contribute by GENM/S/P still consider as profit, so we can buy these company with cheaper price right?
or genting's price should adjust back to RM7.14 above? blush.gif
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Palm oil business is more like as same as last year with a little bit increment.

Actually, as minoirty shareholders, we can or should only look solely on profit made which as shareholder can get piece of it, while Genting own how much GenM and how much GenM is, minority shareholder cannot do anything about it.

Just ask a question, do you as Genting shareholder gain any money, or enable Genting pay special dividen if GenM share price shoot to RM10?
The answer is no, although Genting valuation based on GenM also goes up, until you unlock or liquidating it, there is no actual profit or money being made.


Technically, yes, you can buy Genting indirectly own GenM at cheaper price, but in real term market only concern about how much Genting's profit is, as Genting is not going to liquidate GenM anytime soon, while Genting as a group still have other commitment and debt to be servicing as well.

So that's why it is not recommend to buy Genting if you wish to own GenM. Although technically, yes, buy 10 shares equally own 5 share of GentingM, but this is all on paper term only. In real sense, not so easy or directly.

This post has been edited by cherroy: Feb 12 2010, 03:51 PM
cherroy
post Feb 12 2010, 05:10 PM

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Gong Xi Fa Chai
cherroy
post Feb 17 2010, 09:40 PM

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Market is always very strange one.

Prior one week worry this worry that, Europe crisis, blar blar

Then after another week with prolonged holiday, everything forgotten liao.

I am still quite skeptic about today greenish market.
Feel not quite right with the market movement.

Hope I am wrong.
cherroy
post Feb 18 2010, 01:38 PM

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QUOTE(lklatmy @ Feb 18 2010, 11:56 AM)
PBB foreign traded 8.40!!!!Big water fish.....
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QUOTE(lklatmy @ Feb 18 2010, 01:29 PM)
Seller must have made a mistake,either key in wrong counter or wrong price.Could also  be buy key in as sell too.
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Where got people key in buy 8.40 when the price is 11.10? Doesn't make sense, so can rule out the key in wrongly buy to sell.

Forgot to key in price may be, as no price, automatically go to the available buyer.
Mostly probably is key in wrong counter or wrong price.

Somemore total transaction is 653 lot, total about Rm180K differentiate.


cherroy
post Feb 18 2010, 02:02 PM

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QUOTE(mememe12 @ Feb 18 2010, 01:58 PM)
if key in as sell at 8.40 when the price is 11.10.. it will not automatically sell at 11.00(let say 11.00 is the best buy price)?

if no price.. then go to available buyer.. is it possible that ppl will Q buy at 8.40 when the price is 11.10?

i still dont understand..  sweat.gif
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If there is nobody queue at 11.10 after the buyer has 'finished' then yes, somebody always try to 'fish' something by queueing super low price.

This is the case here, there is little buyer between the price.
As if there is buyer between 11.10 to 8.40 eg. like 10.00, even you key in sell order at 8.40, it will be matched at 10.00, not 8.40 unless the selling order overwhelming the buyer quantity.



This post has been edited by cherroy: Feb 18 2010, 02:21 PM
cherroy
post Feb 18 2010, 02:21 PM

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Added on February 18, 2010, 2:20 pm
QUOTE(lklatmy @ Feb 18 2010, 02:00 PM)
Aiya,lots of buaya around one,they key low low to buy and high high to sell one,don't believe look at the quote for those quiet untraded counters.Trying their luck ma,who knows!

If forgot to key in price,the system (I am referring to the Broker front end  system)will reject the order one.(Except if it's a market sell order where we use the shift F4 key instead of the usual F4 key,then no price is key in)

Wrong counter  or price outside the preset  threshold also system will prompt,so another possibility  is  could be a sabotage by a disgruntled employee.
*
You are one of the buaya? brows.gif laugh.gif

One of my remisier actually did the shift F4 as your said, when want to be fast to capture when something is fiercely being goreng time, he did not key in any price, just meet the seller/buyer, because market transaction is so fast, just want to done the transaction as fast as possible.


Added on February 18, 2010, 2:10 pm
QUOTE(lklatmy @ Feb 18 2010, 12:22 PM)
I wish I am,then can go home for the day liao. biggrin.gif
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You go home with RM180K with that. drool.gif


Added on February 18, 2010, 2:19 pmJust check the PBB-O1 transaction, it appeared it was done at seller price aka the 8.40 is seller!!! It was not thrown to the buyer but Q as seller!

There was 14 seconds time difference between the first 8.40 and last 8.40 done transaction.

We have chance to scoop up if fast enough within the 14 seconds.

This post has been edited by cherroy: Feb 18 2010, 02:24 PM
cherroy
post Feb 18 2010, 02:25 PM

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QUOTE(GregPG01 @ Feb 18 2010, 02:23 PM)
Can we make a market buy / sell without keying in the price ?
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Most cannot on ordinary retailer online portal, they will pre-set the price based on available buyer/seller price, as far as I experience.
cherroy
post Feb 18 2010, 02:27 PM

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QUOTE(skiddtrader @ Feb 18 2010, 02:23 PM)
Edited : OMG Seller queue at Rm8.40?? But then it'll still sell to the highest bidder in the buying queue unless it totally wiped out the queues.


*
It wiped out the buyer Q based on the data or transaction tracker showed, and there was 14 seconds time frame for you to scoop up the 8.40!
cherroy
post Feb 18 2010, 03:27 PM

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I am a bit worry by the trend on MAS-OR.

Something is really not right for the high volume on OR.
cherroy
post Feb 18 2010, 03:33 PM

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QUOTE(GregPG01 @ Feb 18 2010, 03:29 PM)
I wonder what will happen on the last day of trading of the OR . Do you think it close the gap with the mother share?
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Based on the recent few days trend and activity, I don't think so (I might be wrong).

Instead MAS mothershare may close the gap with OR. biggrin.gif

Actually the OR and right issue as well as IPO (not limit to MAS, but as general point) is very important as gauge the market sentiment. If majority OR being disposed and trade on distress price or significant discount price and low take up rate, it just means the market confidence is not there.

My view only.
cherroy
post Feb 18 2010, 03:45 PM

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QUOTE(SKY 1809 @ Feb 18 2010, 03:42 PM)
I think the local funds would share share to subscribe all the rights.

Possibly goreng up the mother share later and dispose some  to get additional funds.

The mother share is kinda  thinly traded, meaning no sell downs from Corporates  ( or sold off much  earlier )

Another guess only.
*
There are underwriters already so company actually no fear about right issue take up rate.

But if retailer and existing shareholders don't want to subscribe the right issue (as shown by high volume disposing recent few days), it means market run low on cash, or no confidence about the market.
cherroy
post Feb 18 2010, 03:54 PM

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QUOTE(mopster @ Feb 18 2010, 03:49 PM)
errr need advice from sifus here...
if SMA-30,50,100,200 all broken then how ? look at SMA 300 ??  blink.gif  sweat.gif  hmm.gif
I usually see up to SMA 200 only... seldom see SMA-300 ... laugh.gif
*
SMA 200 is already long enough, somemore 300??

How? All broken, means brearish nia loh. tongue.gif
cherroy
post Feb 18 2010, 04:59 PM

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QUOTE(mopster @ Feb 18 2010, 04:48 PM)
ohh u foresee it will jump further from here ?
u didnt buy when it was 17 just few days ago ?

i didnt buy...  tongue.gif  but no regret coz it can come down pretty fast also...  laugh.gif

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I don't think 18+ is sustaintable in near term, could fall back easily to 17.50 region, as there is no convincing trade that indicate it crossed 18.00 resistance line with solid move.
cherroy
post Feb 19 2010, 05:16 PM

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QUOTE(ExpZero @ Feb 19 2010, 04:51 PM)
Guys, what is MP?
and see the total selling..121billion? WTF?!
user posted image
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Match Pending.

121 million, not billion.

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